Autopsy Rd 5 Blues go down to Saints by 3 goals

[blue healer]

Because Teague either reacted too late or inappropriately to combat the situation

First time I could say Teague was soundly outcoached, but better to learn early rather than in a critical year

How did I ever forget...it's always the coaches fault.

So Teague was soundly outcoached by a guy who, to put it simply, decided to put his best two taggers on Carltons best two players.

OMG the man must be a genius!

Never mind the fact that the coach has every right to expect that his two best players, co-captains, would have the skill and want to bust those tags. Saints led by a tad over 3 goals at quarter time, our history shows that we have been able to come back from bigger leads than that and we've done it much more regularly than Cripps has been beaten all day by a tag. Should he have moved them then?

What impact does it have on a players pride to be as good as told by their coach that their not up to it in the early stages of a match, particularly when you are as good as these two?

Be nice if the coach had the wisdom of retrospect as well, like all of us keyboard critics.

But no...it's the coach, never the players. This is the attitude that has seen us go through coaches with the regularity of a fat man on laxettes and keep players on our list way longer than their ability warrants..

 

[The Blue Weirdo]

Massive tick on Martian as a recruit. Mcgovern massive dud.

Martian's my favourite.

 

[Arr0w]

How did I ever forget...it's always the coaches fault.

So Teague was soundly outcoached by a guy who, to put it simply, decided to put his best two taggers on Carltons best two players.

OMG the man must be a genius!

Never mind the fact that the coach has every right to expect that his two best players, co-captains, would have the skill and want to bust those tags. Saints led by a tad over 3 goals at quarter time, our history shows that we have been able to come back from bigger leads than that and we've done it much more regularly than Cripps has been beaten all day by a tag. Should he have moved them then?

What impact does it have on a players pride to be as good as told by their coach that their not up to it in the early stages of a match, particularly when you are as good as these two?

Be nice if the coach had the wisdom of retrospect as well, like all of us keyboard critics.

But no...it's the coach, never the players. This is the attitude that has seen us go through coaches with the regularity of a fat man on laxettes and keep players on our list way longer than their ability warrants..

I addressed your post regarding Doc and Cripps, specifically what Teague could have done with taggers. If you want to discuss other aspects, perhaps you can read my other thoughts which also address player outputs

One of your lines is the exact reason why you just don't get, regarding pride, which is flawed. Pride should never be a consideration, it is about how to get the best out of a player/team in any given game.

Teague reacted, unusually, too slow to combat the situation or players weren't adhering to instruction, whichever it was, it is on Teague to manage that situation

Cripps wasn't on the move, could have gone to another opponent at stoppages creating a free teammate, any teammate should have provided multiple blocks, gone forward earlier, etc

Doc, could have respected his direct opponent, or been moved earlier to provide more drive rather than still trying to say off trying to play his sweeper role

What have you got to offer as a keyboard critic on the game, rather than on my direct response to your post regarding Teague and his decision making around Doc and Doc, which you turned into some non existent agenda of me solely blaming the coach?

Try adding something without your condescending bullshit

If you want to discuss players, let's have it, I will be brutally realist as always

 

[blue healer]

I addressed your post regarding Doc and Cripps, specifically what Teague could have done with taggers. If you want to discuss other aspects, perhaps you can read my other thoughts which also address player outputs

One of your lines is the exact reason why you just don't get, regarding pride, which is flawed. Pride should never be a consideration, it is about how to get the best out of a player/team in any given game.

Teague reacted, unusually, too slow to combat the situation or players weren't adhering to instruction, whichever it was, it is on Teague to manage that situation

Cripps wasn't on the move, could have gone to another opponent at stoppages creating a free teammate, any teammate should have provided multiple blocks, gone forward earlier, etc

Doc, could have respected his direct opponent, or been moved earlier to provide more drive rather than still trying to say off trying to play his sweeper role

What have you got to offer as a keyboard critic on the game, rather than on my direct response to your post regarding Teague and his decision making around Doc and Doc, which you turned into some non existent agenda of me solely blaming the coach?

Try adding something without your condescending bullshit

If you want to discuss players, let's have it, I will be brutally realist as always

You have the gall to talk about condescending bullshit. It's no surprise that you find yourself in more circular arguments than any 5 posters on this board.

I haven't read all your posts but I'll tell you what I've never read in any.....a concession that other poster might, just might have a point contrary to yours worthy of discussion.

I did it before and I'm now doing it again. I will no longer interact with you, it just isn't worth it. From here on in I will watch, with interest, the inevitable s**t fights you enter into.

 

[Arr0w]

You have the gall to talk about condescending bullshit. It's no surprise that you find yourself in more circular arguments than any 5 posters on this board.

I haven't read all your posts but I'll tell you what I've never read in any.....a concession that other poster might, just might have a point contrary to yours worthy of discussion.

I did it before and I'm now doing it again. I will no longer interact with you, it just isn't worth it. From here on in I will watch, with interest, the inevitable sh*t fights you enter into.

So you throw the first shot, then cry foul? Told you a while ago i will respond in kind

if you want to discuss things respectfully, let's do it

 

[Funk]

Gotta love the mouthy aints fans on here. More irrelevant than the Gold Coast Suns and they harp on like they’re a successful club

Aints only $20 million in debt.

good thing Gillon is a Saints fan to help prop them up........

 

[Michael Jezz]

That's interesting, I would be absolutely amazed if any player thinks about the prez when their playing, definitely believe it is a poor mindset from the players but I believe this more about game preparation. We are not switched on from the first bounce, this has to come back on the coaches not from someone sitting at a desk.

You are probably right and I am influenced by 1968- 1999 when the admin did not tolerate losing that translated to strength & hardness on the field. Yes we had champions but when I watch this group, I don't see the mentality of even Aaron Hamill or Adrian Hickmott. Not A graders but we knew what we were going to get each week. I don't know who is going to turn up to play when I watch Cunningham, Mcgovern, murphy, Mckay, Setterfield and Plowman There is a culture of softness beyond the head coach that I think could be changed by a ruthless football person at the head, setting standards throughout the organisation. The ideal candidate is Mike Fitzpatrick

 

[AB_Blue]

I’d love Cripps to have the confidence in his midfield to say “boys I’ve got a hard tag here, I’m off to the goal square”

Do it from the first bounce and turn it right around on the opponent


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Michael Jezz]

Martian's my favourite.

I am a bit balanced on Mcgovern. I totally agree you can't make finals with players that go missing in action but he kicks difficult goals often from 45 to 50m. We would not have beaten Geelong and Essendon without himHe made our forwardline multi dimensional and he attracts a good backman. His output is not worth 700k but that is not relevant when we have to spend the cap, regardless, and our admin can not attract players

 

[agro]

His output is not worth 700k but that is not relevant when we have to spend the cap, regardless, and our admin can not attract players

It is relevant when it sends a message to the rest of the playing group that conditional effort will be rewarded.

Also reinforces the belief in a playing group that “success equals getting a 3 year deal” rather than “success equals a game winning culture”.

 

[Arr0w]

Amazing how the subject of culture is mentioned after a loss, but not a word after a win

 

[agro]

When our wins outweigh losses then that discussion will take care of itself - then it won’t be amazing anymore

 

[Arr0w]

Let's ignore progression until then

 

[agro]

I’ll run out and buy the two DVD boxed set of our “streak” then.

 

[Michael Jezz]

Amazing how the subject of culture is mentioned after a loss, but not a word after a win

Yes it was. There were people on here who posted endlessly that Carlton will always get an upset win with no expectations (Geelong) and Essendon(1 point) and that we need to keep a lid on it because 3 in a row against good opposition (Saints) was the true test. When that view is expressed after a win, it gets howled down. For the record and for the 6th time, call it culture, call it whatever you want, Carlton is soft

 

[Arr0w]

Yes it was. There were people on here who posted endlessly that Carlton will always get an upset win with no expectations (Geelong) and Essendon(1 point) and that we need to keep a lid on it because 3 in a row against good opposition (Saints) was the true test. When that view is expressed after a win, it gets howled down. For the record and for the 6th time, call it culture, call it whatever you want, Carlton is soft

Soft because we lost, but still soft after a win?

Sure

 

[agro]

Soft until our win loss ratio is well above 50%.

if you want to celebrate one or two wins in a row then sure.

 

[Arr0w]

Just to put your previous statement into contest, about wins outweighing losses, Teague is 6 and 5 yeah?

 

[agro]

Just to put your previous statements in perspective Carlton’s is well below 50% since 2002.

When Teague’s career average is maintained at his current level or above I’ll join you in cracking open a bottle

 

[Michael Jezz]

Soft because we lost, but still soft after a win?

Mate-We are 18th in the league in tackles. (wins & losses) that is one indicator, what does it tell you?

 

[Arr0w]

2002? Haha, didn't take long to shift the goal posts did it, falling back to a time when none of these players were around

Keep looking in that rear vision mirror to justify an argument

 

[Arr0w]

That's it, just tackles?

You realise Bombers and Swans are 1 and 2 in that facet yeah?

 

[Brackets]

SPS in defence reminds me of Gibbs in defence. Sure, he can kind of do it, but is that really where he's going to play for his whole career? And if not, when does he move to a role he's better suited for?

With his mindset at the moment it won't matter where he plays.

On one hand, he gets it moving on quickly which is what we want, but in doing so it's always a handball or 20m chip to a player that is less skilled.

Look at his metres gained - consistently in the bottom of our group for this very reason.

He needs to start taking responsibility to set up play wherever he gets the ball or be dropped so he is forced to take on extra responsibility in the practice matches.

 

[agro]

Send me the link and I’ll order the two DVD Boxed set of our streak.

As per usual you are not getting it.

 

[AndyLucimitis]

Can I raise a topic. It's clear as day we play better at the MCG than at Marvel.

The reason is our kicking skills - whilst getting better - are still sub-par. We can get away with at the MCG because there is more room to spread whereas at Marvel (and smaller grounds) sides can cramp us and guys like Jones, Plowman and Casboult don't have the skill to 'thread the needle' to a target like the better sides.

It's obviously better with Doc there now and perhaps a reason to keep SPS down there.