Autopsy Round 10 - West Coast v St Kilda

[Bill Crouse]

Attendance doesn't mean anything.

If the AFL weren't going to force North to merge/relocate over the last few years then we will be fine.

Part of the deal with Collingwood/Carlton/Essendon/Hawthorn getting all the prime time games is that clubs like ours get kept on life support by the AFL, regardless of performance.

As for attracting players:

I've spoken about it before but we are NEVER going to get a fair crack at FA or trade moves for players wanting to play in Vic.

We will always have to pay well overs in terms of salary cap.

Otherwise the only players we are poaching from other clubs are guys that were borderline best 23 (Wood, Butler, Stocker, Dow) or B/C Graders (Howard, Jones, Cordy) or young blokes looking for opportunities (Steele, Carroll) or older guys getting paid overs to pick us (Macrae, Hill)

I'd argue that the only value we've had in terms of recent trades was Paddy Ryder & Liam Henry.

Everyone else was either untried, unproven or bought with cash rather than a desire to play for the Saints and make us better.

If we pick up TDK this year it's not because he loves the idea of playing for Ross Lyon on Sunday arvos at Marvel.

It's because we are going to pay him millions of dollars more than anyone else is willing to offer. And he still might turn us down!!

For as long as the big Vic clubs keep selling out the MCG on Thursday and Friday nights, we will NEVER be getting free agents at fair market value, regardless of our performances on field.

Butler was good for a few years for only pick 56 and Higgins was a great trade, now that he is one of our best players.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Still paying for our past **** ups.

 

[Mr Clunk]

The reaction after this game is laughable and pathetic.

Fact is, we're the younger team. And playing in Perth in front of 50k.

The only reason we were favourites is WC's been underachieving and we've been better than expected.

If this game had been played in round 1 West Coast would've been favourites. They gained confidence from last week, and were due a win. 0-10 starts rarely happen in modern AFL.

I was almost 50/50 on tipping West Coast. Stuck with Saints but the result is unsurprising.

We've had a solid opening 9 games, better than most people expected. So seeing this level of self flaggelation after a loss in Perth just shows how over-reactive people are. Short-term bias.

I'm still getting the emergency stash of weed oil out of the shed and watching Airplane 2 with cold pizza

 

[moirae42]

This loss is despicable.

 

[topbillings]

Is this supposed to be fun? Being a footy fan? I think I accidentally skipped the part where any of this was fun.

 

[Banger9798]

NAS is a gun in a shit team.

Will be running around for the Crows next year , after that sort of performance.
We continue to be shit after 15 years.
Totally over it.

 

[EddieMurphy]

Richmond were shit for ages then won 3, North didn’t win a flag until the 70s. Cats were also rans until something clicked.

How are we going to do it, will take a while after todays limp effort.

 

[PJays]

Underachieving? They've won 10 of the last 77 games and have probably won a single game in the last 12 months lol.

It's like losing a race against the kid with a broken leg. They've barely won a quarter for 2 years.

They've got Harley Reid- one of the most highly rated youngsters to enter the AFL system in decades. Now in year 2

This year they added Graham and Baker- 2-time premiership players with close to 150 games experience.

They've got Oscar Allen who managed to kick 53 goals in 2023 in a team that won 3 games. He's played about 50% of games over the past 18 months but played today.

Last season they were 4-8 in 12 games in Perth, with 3 of those wins by 35 points or more. That's not an embarrassing record at all. Coming into this season, there was reason to think they might exceed that in 2025. Maybe they still do.

 

[Teflon]

Actually pretty accurate as much as it hurts he does know what's up at least.

He does and I’m a Lyon fan but geez… getting a bit tired of the same same
To admit they threw Pou to the wolves after 20 week lay off ….nkt really what you want to hear
To admit they were short but “didn’t have much else” - just tell Max Heath he’s fcked now ….but to not even try him …why ?
Watching VFl last week McLennen has much more work to do…..so they bring him in???? Bizarre selections …
I’m starting to question if we also need to turn over some assistants etc - I like Rob Harvey but coaching career is hardly crowned in glory …Goddard….??
Owens in guts Pou forward was obvious mid way through second …no change till late
Why we as this team so flat ? And what’s the go with our fitness and conditioning cause I too am sick of seeing spaghetti arm saints run out against a hulking opposition…fevk me

 

[L_W_P]

Butler was good for a few years for only pick 56 and Higgins was a great trade, now that he is one of our best players.

Of course, they've been great. Both were borderline starting players for the Tigers at the time.

But we aren't getting ready made stars coming to the club unless we are paying them well over market value.

If Finn Callaghan wanted to come back home he'd have his pick of clubs.

He might well have taken $1.7 million from the Saints but he would be weighing that up against playing in prime time games at the MCG for the bigger clubs and the 'lifestyle' at Geelong.

North and the Bulldogs are in the same boat. It's far harder for us to recruit gun players vs teams like Collingwood, Carlton, Hawthorn & even Essendon!

 

[Teflon]

Steele had it 16 times. He's done.

No one in presser asks this ??? Why ??

 

[EddieMurphy]

I'm still getting the emergency stash of weed oil out of the shed and watching Airplane 2 with cold pizza

Appropriately for you called flying high in Aus

 

[Sarcoidevo]

No one in presser asks this ??? Why ??

He nearly had more tackles than disposals

That would be OK if he got the ball 25+ times

 

[PJays]

He might well have taken $1.7 million from the Saints but he would be weighing that up against playing in prime time games at the MCG

This is why Saints fans should be up in arms at the AFL's refusal to give St Kilda more MCG games.

We've played in front of 65-70k at Saints home games 4 times over the last 3 years (including the final).

If we could offer that 3 times a year, it bridges that gap somewhat for potential recruits.

 

[Premium]

I have just about given up on this club.

We just go up and down in one spot year in year out.

I really feel with the amount of experience we have in this team there was no excuses for losing this game.
Players of the caliber of Steele , Hill , Marshall , Macrae , Wilkie , Sinclair , Owens , Nas should of been enough to beat the worst team in the AFL.

This to me has everything to do with preparation and the coaching of the team.

You don't go beating a team like the Cats and then get flogged by the Eagles.

This game sealed our season and Bassit who said Ratten couldn't get the best out of the team 2 odd years ago to me has a lot to answer too.
Ratten might not of been the answer for sure but Ross Lyon surely is not either.

Time to ring up Longmire or the likes.

 

[BrutThough]

Obviously there's no need to play them all at once BUT why would we play Brad Hill for the 2nd half of the year? Why not give those games to Arie or Hastie or Trav?

If Steele is hurt, why keep pushing him? Get Box and Windy and Owens and Pou and Jack Carroll in for a few games each.

Why play a half fit King? Give Keeler and Dodson and Boyd a look at FF. Rotate them ruck with Roma as it's probably what we plan to do with him at TDK anyway.

Would you bring Howard back or give Barrat and Taurus half a dozen games each?

We've seen enough from Collard and Hall to know they are worth keeping on. So why not rest them for a couple of games each and give Patrick Said a month to see what the level is like?

We might get pumped by 100 in a few games. We might shock a few teams and snag some upset wins. We might also find a couple of solid players, ala Garcia.

One thing is for sure though: There's no point rolling out this team week after week for games to be essentially decided on 'effort'.

We need to find players with skill, ASAP, because it's going to take a few years at least to build the bodies needed to play this way week after week after week.

Because pretty much all those players you are naming are not any good at VFL level. That's why we dont play them.

 

[littlecreatures]

Steele had it 16 times. He's done.

Looks like someone who’s lost any belief whatsoever that he can impact a game of footy.

And, this was one of his games this year where I thought he actually had a crack, with 14 tackles, he just doesn’t seem to have it anymore to hold any impact in the cole face and can’t cover ground like he used to

 

[Saints4ever]

In his presser Ross mentioned Macrae getting a knee in the back and needing scans.

I didn’t notice anything.

Hopefully he’s ok.

 

[littlecreatures]

We cut hard and played kids and have run out of talls. List management chose to make us a very young side and have left a lot of list holes.

Couldn’t agree more, our issues in a nutshell right now, and seems like we’ve hit a halt with expecting our senior core to pull us over the line. They look exhausted

 

[PJays]

Players of the caliber of Steele , Hill , Marshall , Macrae , Wilkie , Sinclair , Owens , Nas should of been enough to beat the worst team in the AFL.

Macrae, as good as he's been at times, is a Dogs reject who couldn't get a game in their midfield last year.

Unfortunately Steele's been declining for years. Looks well into his twilight despite being 29.

Hill's not done much all year. If I was coach he would've been dropped after last week.

Nas and Owens are still kids, and you expect inconsistency there.

Agree Marshall, Sinclair and Wilkie are genuinely good players. But they're playing against a crowd of 50,000 and the likes of Harley Reid, Oscar Allen etc. West Coast aren't pushovers, this is modern AFL.

 

[Premium]

No one in presser asks this ??? Why ??

If he doesn't perform he needs to be dropped - anyone in the middle needs to be constantly be getting 25plus disposals a game - and if they are not getting that try someone new.
Tackling is great but you need to be winning the footy

 

[littlecreatures]

It was pretty obvious after Eagles 4th goal at an inside 50 stoppage we just weren’t in it. We had Darcy spare man to the right hand side of Roma, so was basically redundant unless he wins a left handed hit out, then we get the repeat stoppage and they finally send him over the other side of the stoppage. Just not AFL level stuff

 

[Diehard Saint]

On about the only positive note for the day…
Higgins, as usual, was great. 5.1

Well, done Higgo, you even managed a couple after your head was decapitated.

On ya Snags. ️

 

[Broski]

I think today’s poor result provided a clear indication where our list is at. We are a really young side that has no key position depth at the moment. We’ve outperformed expectations in the first month and I think that distorts our perception of reality. I do believe the young kids will make it, but too many of them playing at once, like they did today, is a recipe for disaster. Like Ross mentioned in his presser, we need all of our top players to have great games to be competitive or win games. If Steele, Hill, Macrae etc stink it up, the youth struggle to move the needle. That’s fine, it takes time to develop into a consistent player at the level, but that means we will have losses like this. idk who said it in here, but I reckon the club expected to grind out a win and then welcome back some senior players against the Suns, like Clark, Jones Butler etc, but it didn’t go to plan. Going to try and steer clear of the media this week.

 

[Linton Street Saint]

Give it a rest. It's over we got Travaglia and Tauru, build a bridge FFS

Yet half this forum throws the toys out of the cot because we get pantsed at the coal face yet again. Can't have it both ways.

Don't want to tank, but pump games into the kids, but what a huge mistake not giving Membrey a contract so he could take their spot, piss and moan about consistency, but one of the youngest lists in the league, 10+ years of mediocrity, dogwater drafting/recruitment and Lethleans uber ego and gigabrain decisions, but Ross can't coach and hasn't been able to instantly turn around a list/performance of a club in 3 years in a compromised competition when half the expansion clubs lists are made up of top 10 picks and the premiers get arguably the top rated talent for peanuts.

On and on ad nauseum.