Autopsy Swans wings clipped by the Lions: 97 to 81

[caesar88]

Lots of stats please Caesar

 

[ErrolisGoldun]

I thought Wicks has been ok since coming back into team. I think he has kicked 4 goals in 3 games.

I would rather see him be overaggressive than the players non competitiveness in the Geelong game in round 6. I hope Wicks comes back and gets games later in the season.

100% Sean, he was affected after the hit. Lost his head within the game and wasn’t able to make the same impact.

Up until then and the Carlton game he has been very good and exactly the spark we need.

Could have done with a few Wicks for that Geelong game, was a shocking performance.

 

[The King!]

Wicks is in now give him some time to get going imo

 

[ErrolisGoldun]

The actors guild are looking for Lester’s subs, he is overdue. Even the Wicks “hit”, which is worth a week once the 50 was paid he got up pretty quick and unaffected. He was the same player who performed in the Parker 50 I think ? If so, should be at least fined for staging.

Spot on, drew 50’s twice, should be cited for staging for the Parker one, but won’t be. Have no faith in AFL to do the right thing.

 

[The King!]

Decided to watch the replay until the umps pissed me off

Good 2 minutes

 

[Dubai Quacker]

Get off wicks case. He made a slight error, give me a spell.

2wks is crazy, should be a week. At least the fella flies the flag, a lot of you lot have forgotten what it means to play for the guernsey.

If it was a once-off brain fade, I’d be more forgiving.

But it was a really poor act that cost the team dearly. And he has form for doing that kind of thing.

“Playing for the guernsey” means hard but fair. Not cheap late hits.

He needs to be better than that.

 

[ErrolisGoldun]

If it was a once-off brain fade, I’d be more forgiving.

But it was a really poor act that cost the team dearly. And he has form for doing that kind of thing.

“Playing for the guernsey” means hard but fair. Not cheap late hits.

He needs to be better than that.

He could have easily made that a lot worse if it was actually a cheap shot.

Part of it was gamesmanship by Lester with the hit also. There was no concussion or injury and Lester played on with the game.

He gave away 50, I think we are putting to much emphasis on one act which was careless and awkward rather than malicious around being the game changing moment. It clearly didn’t help but Brisbane still had work to do to score. He gave a 50 away in the back half.

Almost no one has spoken about any other 50’s that lead to goals, eg Papley. Just think like a Lloyd and Cunningham, Wicks is an easy target.

I don’t think he was planning on a cheap shot. He plays with aggression, he is young and he will learn how to use that.

As SeanM said above, would have been handy to have Wicks versus Geelong in Rd6 when we’re uncompetitive and embarrassing with our efforts.

 

[ShireSwan]

Wicks is terrible and unsportsmanlike. Would happily see him never play for the club again.

My point was about a statement selection. Dropping Wicks is a no brainer even though the suspension makes the decision for us.

Dropping Warner, on the other hand, is a statement that no matter how good you are on the attack, if you don't run both ways you don't get a game. Now like I said, this won't happen because those kind of decisions aren't made any more because a player can get annoyed and force a trade whenever they like.

I'd be very happy to see the club drop Warner for Stephens this week.
Warner has been playing the 'stand off the contest and hope the ball spills to me' game for a few weeks now, positively Chad Wingard like. While we DO need a player to do that IMO, it shouldn't be a guy who got in the team for his uncompromising attack on the footy. And it should be someone like Campbell that has a weapon of a kick, not Warner's awful pitching wedge like action.

Will we be better off making the change? Not for this game, no. But for keeping selection policy honest and holding players accountable I think it's a change absolutely worth making with the longer view in mind. I really don't care if we win or lose this week tbh. Setting up the culture far more important than these points. But the way Warner has played lately he's not going to win or lose us the game either way. Make him the sub might be the rocket he clearly needs IMHO.

 

[bloodsbigot]

Get off wicks case. He made a slight error, give me a spell.

2wks is crazy, should be a week. At least the fella flies the flag, a lot of you lot have forgotten what it means to play for the guernsey.

Well said.

 

[bloodsbigot]

Dont think anyone would of imagined a drop this far

With our injuries I sure did.

 

[caesar88]

Preview for the West Coast game is now up.

Preview - Round 15, Swans vs West Coast @ SCG, 4.35pm AEST

It's time for jury duty for AFL fans. AKA, watching a West Coast game. Hey, does everyone remember the Sydney Swans vs West Coast rivalry of the mid-2000s? What a time it was. Close games, awesome match-ups all over the field, plenty of respect between the two teams, benders on the weekend...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[caesar88]

I'd be very happy to see the club drop Warner for Stephens this week.
Warner has been playing the 'stand off the contest and hope the ball spills to me' game for a few weeks now, positively Chad Wingard like. While we DO need a player to do that IMO, it shouldn't be a guy who got in the team for his uncompromising attack on the footy. And it should be someone like Campbell that has a weapon of a kick, not Warner's awful pitching wedge like action.

Will we be better off making the change? Not for this game, no. But for keeping selection policy honest and holding players accountable I think it's a change absolutely worth making with the longer view in mind. I really don't care if we win or lose this week tbh. Setting up the culture far more important than these points. But the way Warner has played lately he's not going to win or lose us the game either way. Make him the sub might be the rocket he clearly needs IMHO.

You seem to be recognising that Warner's simply playing the role asked and expected of him, while simultaneously dragging him for doing that role but not having an impact in it.

 

[ShireSwan]

You seem to be recognising that Warner's simply playing the role asked and expected of him, while simultaneously dragging him for doing that role but not having an impact in it.

Maybe you are right. With Shcldrick and Parker being the dogs in the midfeld maybe that was asked of him. If so I hate how he is going about it.
To be playing that role he needs to be on the move a at speed more, like a Walsh from Carlton. As it is he just hovers about with a guy draped over him ready to tackle him the second he gets the ball. So he's not really succeeding at anything. Maybe it's just a player learning (and so far failing) to deal with a half-tag?

 

[caesar88]

Maybe you are right. With Shcldrick and Parker being the dogs in the midfeld maybe that was asked of him. If so I hate how he is going about it.
To be playing that role he needs to be on the move a at speed more, like a Walsh from Carlton. As it is he just hovers about with a guy draped over him ready to tackle him the second he gets the ball. So he's not really succeeding at anything. Maybe it's just a player learning (and so far failing) to deal with a half-tag?

I don't know if he's being tagged so much as just having a style of play that the entire competition is now very much awake to.

I've said it all year that the way to stop Warner is simply close off the space for him to break into. He's a lot easier to stop than some of our other mids who actually thrive on being in tight and working in traffic. Every chance Horse has realised this and are happy with him being something of a decoy.

It worked very well for us late last year. In the qualifying final Warner started watching Brayshaw around stoppages. Melbourne's mids lost one of their cogs who usually help Oliver and Petracca because he and Warner were taking each other out of it. Our mids then ran rampant because of it.

So you may think he's playing selfish footy but it's very possible he's actually doing the total opposite.

 

[kickthething]

You seem to be recognising that Warner's simply playing the role asked and expected of him, while simultaneously dragging him for doing that role but not having an impact in it.

Warners lack of chase is a big concern for mine…..was trotting aroundd a number of times not seeming to be going full speed in defence.

 

[ShireSwan]

I don't know if he's being tagged so much as just having a style of play that the entire competition is now very much awake to.

I've said it all year that the way to stop Warner is simply close off the space for him to break into. He's a lot easier to stop than some of our other mids who actually thrive on being in tight and working in traffic. Every chance Horse has realised this and are happy with him being something of a decoy.

It worked very well for us late last year. In the qualifying final Warner started watching Brayshaw around stoppages. Melbourne's mids lost one of their cogs who usually help Oliver and Petracca because he and Warner were taking each other out of it. Our mids then ran rampant because of it.

So you may think he's playing selfish footy but it's very possible he's actually doing the total opposite.

The game he was playing previously (and from the second he got to the club, the very first training session apparently) was "I'm getting the F***ing ball, and nobody is stopping me". The style of play now , no strength, speed, nor agression, is easily shut down by an opponent just shadowing him on the fringes as he hovers about so when it does come out to him from someone he is immediately set upon. It's cack.

Another masterclass in coaching from horse?

 

[ShireSwan]

Warners lack of chase is a big concern for mine…..was trotting aroundd a number of times not seeming to be going full speed in defence.

What was his TOG? Maybe he has to put in an extra 9% or so to cover for Sheldrick's low TOG.
As much as he does look abysmal at times with his jogging along, doing SFA SURELY some of that has to be down to him being at the end of his stint on ground, and perhaps they are playing him too long.....

 

[Dubai Quacker]

I don't know if he's being tagged so much as just having a style of play that the entire competition is now very much awake to.

I've said it all year that the way to stop Warner is simply close off the space for him to break into. He's a lot easier to stop than some of our other mids who actually thrive on being in tight and working in traffic. Every chance Horse has realised this and are happy with him being something of a decoy.

It worked very well for us late last year. In the qualifying final Warner started watching Brayshaw around stoppages. Melbourne's mids lost one of their cogs who usually help Oliver and Petracca because he and Warner were taking each other out of it. Our mids then ran rampant because of it.

So you may think he's playing selfish footy but it's very possible he's actually doing the total opposite.

I think you’re right … and wrong.

I believe he IS playing tighter on his direct opponent from stoppages.

However, he is also playing somewhat selfish footy by trying to do something individually brilliant with each possession, when sometimes the simple handball is the best option.

 

[kickthething]

What was his TOG? Maybe he has to put in an extra 9% or so to cover for Sheldrick's low TOG.
As much as he does look abysmal at times with his jogging along, doing SFA SURELY some of that has to be down to him being at the end of his stint on ground, and perhaps they are playing him too long.....

Maybe, but you can still chase w intent and be knackered, it just doesn’t seem to be there at times

 

[Dubsforsam1]

Happy if the rest of this year we don't pick injured players (let them get ready for next pre-season), give young guys like Sheldrick plenty of experience, experiment with guys in different positions (for next year's benefit) and if we get a top 5 pick out of it in the draft that's fair enough.

Noting that we are only 1 game behind Geelong

 

[caesar88]

The game he was playing previously (and from the second he got to the club, the very first training session apparently) was "I'm getting the F***ing ball, and nobody is stopping me". The style of play now , no strength, speed, nor agression, is easily shut down by an opponent just shadowing him on the fringes as he hovers about so when it does come out to him from someone he is immediately set upon. It's cack.

Another masterclass in coaching from horse?

Again though, you're wanting two things from Warner that aren't symbiotic.

You're wanting us to embrace his aggressive, ball-hunting bull ways that he came to the club with, while also lamenting that he's not showing the kind of speed and excitement that he currently is capable of. He can't do the latter if he is doing the former. That's not a knock on Warner. It's just the reality of being at the coalface getting first hands on it. You're working in a telephone box. You can't sprint through it.

IMO Horse is using him fine. It's just common sense to have a player with his speed waiting for the receive and the quick get away.

 

[caesar88]

I think you’re right … and wrong.

I believe he IS playing tighter on his direct opponent from stoppages.

However, he is also playing somewhat selfish footy by trying to do something individually brilliant with each possession, when sometimes the simple handball is the best option.

No doubt, I'm not saying he's nailing it at the moment. I think he's trying to figure out what the team needs from him. He's such a talented player but sometimes we've been better off with him being an icing player in the midfield, rather than a 'cake' player. Part of that means just accepting that you don't need to be the matchwinner, just play your supporting role.

So to assume it's selfishness I think is unfair. It's possible it's more overcompensating in thinking he's not doing enough to help the team if he's not being brilliant.

 

[scaryness]

Wicks is in now give him some time to get going imo

Given that this season is dead, his spot in the team should go to someone who probably has more upside like Konstanty or Hugo regardless.

The only reason to play Wicks is if you're planning on re-signing him.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Given that this season is dead, his spot in the team should go to someone who probably has more upside like Konstanty or Hugo regardless.

The only reason to play Wicks is if you're planning on re-signing him.

Hugo will be a regular senior player at the Swans but more likely elsewhere.. why would we want a medium forward who kicks straight ? We already have Heeney and Wayward.

Konstanty looks only an outside chance of playing 20 games as a senior. Has some tricks but???

 

[The King!]

Given that this season is dead, his spot in the team should go to someone who probably has more upside like Konstanty or Hugo regardless.

The only reason to play Wicks is if you're planning on re-signing him.

That was all true two weeks ago when he was picked,

Given he is out now anyway it doesn't matter