The 2015 Attendance Thread

[Teagueeee15]

Another reason I've found for low turnout of reserve seat holders/members is that they still attend, but with friends/colleagues on an MCC or AFL member guest pass. You would be surprised how many MCC guest passes are sold. Although this doesn't really apply at Etihad.

 

[dave10]

I was interested to learn recently that Essendon's intention is to move the majority of it's home games back to the G which is great. 7/4 split in the G's favor. Just waiting for the stadium to be negotiated into AFL hands in near future and things will start to happen.

It's interesting the topic of big Vic clubs playing at the G. Essendon has a huge MCC memberdhip who don't go to Ethihad. They only go to the MCG matches. There is almost always an Essendon dominance in this reserve when they play at the G. You will see this again on Sunday with a very strong Essendon share in the reserve. I would suggest playing at Ethihad meabs as many as many as 3-4,000 Essendon supporters stay away at every match.

Also, Its popular to talk about the Tigers 30 years of woe and the effect on attendances. And this is fair and very reasonable. But Essendon has basically been a bottom 8 team for 10+ years, played the majority of home games at Ethihad since 2000 (many V Hawks and Cats in blockbusters) and done almost everything in it's power to implode the last 2 years. Yet over the last 15 years it has been no lower than 3rd, abd on most occasions finished 2nd in attendances with 1M+ through the gates. In addition, most of it's attendances against interstate clubs have surpassed 30,000 abd I believe their worst attendance in the last 15 years has been around 27,000 on only 1-2 occasions. These are the figures of a pretty big resting A380!

I expect in the next 5 years Essendon will be back playing most home games at the G, it will have repaired it's relationship with it's fans and will be back on track. Essendon are in relative terms underperforming in many areas, however they will be back in in time with a vengeance and Stuart Fox will have another club to watch out for

 

[The_Wookie]

I was interested to learn recently that Essendon's intention is to move the majority of it's home games back to the G which is great. 7/4 split in the G's favor. Just waiting for the stadium to be negotiated into AFL hands in near future and things will start to happen.

It's interesting the topic of big Vic clubs playing at the G. Essendon has a huge MCC memberdhip who don't go to Ethihad. They only go to the MCG matches. There is almost always an Essendon dominance in this reserve when they play at the G. You will see this again on Sunday with a very strong Essendon share in the reserve. I would suggest playing at Ethihad meabs as many as many as 3-4,000 Essendon supporters stay away at every match.

Also, Its popular to talk about the Tigers 30 years of woe and the effect on attendances. And this is fair and very reasonable. But Essendon has basically been a bottom 8 team for 10+ years, played the majority of home games at Ethihad since 2000 (many V Hawks and Cats in blockbusters) and done almost everything in it's power to implode the last 2 years. Yet over the last 15 years it has been no lower than 3rd, abd on most occasions finished 2nd in attendances with 1M+ through the gates. In addition, most of it's attendances against interstate clubs have surpassed 30,000 abd I believe their worst attendance in the last 15 years has been around 27,000 on only 1-2 occasions. These are the figures of a pretty big resting A380!

I expect in the next 5 years Essendon will be back playing most home games at the G, it will have repaired it's relationship with it's fans and will be back on track. Essendon are in relative terms underperforming in many areas, however they will be back in in time with a vengeance and Stuart Fox will have another club to watch out for

Id expect Essendon to be stuck at Etihad until 2025 personally. Since its what they contracted for.

 

[Hawkk]

I was interested to learn recently that Essendon's intention is to move the majority of it's home games back to the G which is great. 7/4 split in the G's favor. Just waiting for the stadium to be negotiated into AFL hands in near future and things will start to happen.

It's interesting the topic of big Vic clubs playing at the G. Essendon has a huge MCC memberdhip who don't go to Ethihad. They only go to the MCG matches. There is almost always an Essendon dominance in this reserve when they play at the G. You will see this again on Sunday with a very strong Essendon share in the reserve. I would suggest playing at Ethihad meabs as many as many as 3-4,000 Essendon supporters stay away at every match.

Also, Its popular to talk about the Tigers 30 years of woe and the effect on attendances. And this is fair and very reasonable. But Essendon has basically been a bottom 8 team for 10+ years, played the majority of home games at Ethihad since 2000 (many V Hawks and Cats in blockbusters) and done almost everything in it's power to implode the last 2 years. Yet over the last 15 years it has been no lower than 3rd, abd on most occasions finished 2nd in attendances with 1M+ through the gates. In addition, most of it's attendances against interstate clubs have surpassed 30,000 abd I believe their worst attendance in the last 15 years has been around 27,000 on only 1-2 occasions. These are the figures of a pretty big resting A380!

I expect in the next 5 years Essendon will be back playing most home games at the G, it will have repaired it's relationship with it's fans and will be back on track. Essendon are in relative terms underperforming in many areas, however they will be back in in time with a vengeance and Stuart Fox will have another club to watch out for

Essendon are locked into a contract until 2025. On top of that the following clubs are locked into paying the majority of home games at the MCG

Collingwood
Melbourne
Richmond
Hawthorn
Carlton

On top of this Geelong (2), North, the Dogs and the Saints are all prone to host a game or 2 at the MCag (I guess they could take 2-3 games from this bundle)

Given what Essendon has put the competition through over the last 3 years why should they be allowed to renege on a contract they wrote for themselves. Who will pick up their slack?

 

[Hawkk]

Also with respect to support in the MCC reserve:

http://www.worldofwookie.com/footywiki/index.php/Memberships#MCC_Member_Survey_Results_-_AFL_Support

MCC Member Survey Results - AFL Support
AFL Support amongst MCC Members
Year 2008 ' 2010 '
MCC Members 99,932 101,509
2008% 2008 EST 2010% 2010 Est
Brisbane 2 1,999 1.7 1,726
Carlton 9 8,994 10.2 10,354
Collingwood 11 10,993 11.2 11,369
Essendon 13 12,991 12.5 12,689
Geelong 7 6,995 7.5 7,613
Hawthorn 8 7,995 7.6 7,715
Melbourne 21 20,986 18.9 19,185
North Melbourne 3 2,998 2.9 2,944
Richmond 7 6,995 7.4 7,512
St Kilda 5 4,997 5.2 5,278
Sydney 2 1,999 2.1 2,132
Western Bulldogs 2 1,999 2.2 2,233
WA/SA teams 1 999 1.0 1,015
No team 8 7,995 9.6 9,745
Total 99.0 98,933 100.0 101,509

The MCC no longer release this data but MCC membership would clearly have a 15-20 year delay in support

 

[dave10]

Essendon are locked into a contract until 2025. On top of that the following clubs are locked into paying the majority of home games at the MCG

Collingwood
Melbourne
Richmond
Hawthorn
Carlton

On top of this Geelong (2), North, the Dogs and the Saints are all prone to host a game or 2 at the MCag (I guess they could take 2-3 games from this bundle)

Given what Essendon has put the competition through over the last 3 years why should they be allowed to renege on a contract they wrote for themselves. Who will pick up their slack?

I'm just telling you what's likely to happen based on what I have heard. Whether it's a populist view in the football world I don't think thus is relevant. And it's likely to be be sooner rather than later. The MCG wants Essendon, it's drawing power is almost unmatched (so does Ethihad) and Essendon (it has listened to its fans abd wants to be based where the biggest games are) wants the MCG. It's only 3 games more so not a logistical nightmare.

As is common place in football, contracts are not watertight and are always subject to complex multi tiered negotiations. As to who picks up the slack, that's not as much Essendons problem abd I have no idea. All I'm doing is indicating the Essendon view which is quite definitive now.

Essendon knows it has some work to do with it's brand, if nothing else, the last 2 years has given the club a crystalized understanding of the nees to open itself up and reconnect with it's fan base. The MCG I think is one small aspect of this realisation and how it will address it in the next 3 years against it's new strategic plan.

We are seeing signs of this work starting to take place now: Sheedy returns and stating goals of 100,000 members / return to G, new big MCG fixture (National Farmers Game), Dreamtime expanded, open training sessions, subsidised bus trips for fans traveling to interstate games etc. Much work ahead but I think the club realises its mistakes.

 

[The_Wookie]

I'm just telling you what's likely to happen. Like it or not. And it's likely to be be sooner rather than later. The MCG wants Essendon, it's drawing power is almost unmatched (so does Ethihad) and Essendon (it has listened to its fans abd wants to be based where the biggest games are) wants the MCG. It's only 3 games more so not a logistical nightmare.

As is common place in football, contracts are not watertight and are always subject to complex multi tiered negotiations. As to who picks up the slack, that's not as much Essendons problem. All I'm doing is indicating the Essendon view which is quite definitive.

As opposed to Etihads contract with Essendon which would be quite definitive. They arent getting out of it.

 

[dave10]

As opposed to Etihads contract with Essendon which would be quite definitive. They arent getting out of it.

I will keep that in mind

 

[Air_Chester]

As opposed to Etihads contract with Essendon which would be quite definitive. They arent getting out of it.

I think he means if the AFL buy out early.

If they don't we're stuck until 2025. Sad, but that's the deal that was made.

 

[The_Wookie]

Im not certain the AFL will let you out of the contract either. Its not in the leagues interest, and they control the fixture. The tendency is going to be to give the MCG less games, not more when the AFL takes over the stadium.

 

[gaelictiogar]

I was interested to learn recently that Essendon's intention is to move the majority of it's home games back to the G which is great. 7/4 split in the G's favor. Just waiting for the stadium to be negotiated into AFL hands in near future and things will start to happen.

It's interesting the topic of big Vic clubs playing at the G. Essendon has a huge MCC memberdhip who don't go to Ethihad. They only go to the MCG matches. There is almost always an Essendon dominance in this reserve when they play at the G. You will see this again on Sunday with a very strong Essendon share in the reserve. I would suggest playing at Ethihad meabs as many as many as 3-4,000 Essendon supporters stay away at every match.

Also, Its popular to talk about the Tigers 30 years of woe and the effect on attendances. And this is fair and very reasonable. But Essendon has basically been a bottom 8 team for 10+ years, played the majority of home games at Ethihad since 2000 (many V Hawks and Cats in blockbusters) and done almost everything in it's power to implode the last 2 years. Yet over the last 15 years it has been no lower than 3rd, abd on most occasions finished 2nd in attendances with 1M+ through the gates. In addition, most of it's attendances against interstate clubs have surpassed 30,000 abd I believe their worst attendance in the last 15 years has been around 27,000 on only 1-2 occasions. These are the figures of a pretty big resting A380!

I expect in the next 5 years Essendon will be back playing most home games at the G, it will have repaired it's relationship with it's fans and will be back on track. Essendon are in relative terms underperforming in many areas, however they will be back in in time with a vengeance and Stuart Fox will have another club to watch out for

The simple truth of he matter is they shot themselves in the foot big time when they opted for Docklands. At times your club makes mine in the times of Sir Terrance Tan and prior to that look well run !!!!

Back at the turn of the century Essendon were flying whilst coincidentally Richmond ( as usual ) and Collingwood were bouncing along doing nothing. an open door for the Bombers to steal a march. What did the Bumbling Essendonians do? opt out of the MCG.

Hawkk is quite right when he points to the importance of the G in building a match going base. The club has managed to hide its light by some truly spectacular blundering. The drug issue obviously but opting out of the G not far behind.

Essendon V hawthorn this week is in ways the delinquent VS the star pupil. Essendon the wastrel giant frittering away natural advantage against a club which has none of the natural advantages Essendon had in terms of traditional base but has been getting it right in so many ways.

Essendon has been a shambles. It is high time they sought to reconnect.

 

[gaelictiogar]

I know that both sides lost in Round 1 and expectation is limited but a little disappointing that WCE couldn't get 35,000 to a fixture that was a regular 40,000 in the decade from 2000 to 2010.

 

[Hawkk]

The simple truth of he matter is they shot themselves in the foot big time when they opted for Docklands. At times your club makes mine in the times of Sir Terrance Tan and prior to that look well run !!!!

Back at the turn of the century Essendon were flying whilst coincidentally Richmond ( as usual ) and Collingwood were bouncing along doing nothing. an open door for the Bombers to steal a march. What did the Bumbling Essendonians do? opt out of the MCG.

Hawkk is quite right when he points to the importance of the G in building a match going base. The club has managed to hide its light by some truly spectacular blundering. The drug issue obviously but opting out of the G not far behind.

Essendon V hawthorn this week is in ways the delinquent VS the star pupil. Essendon the wastrel giant frittering away natural advantage against a club which has none of the natural advantages Essendon had in terms of traditional base but has been getting it right in so many ways.

Essendon has been a shambles. It is high time they sought to reconnect.

Thing is, pre 1980 Essendon was middle of the road in terms of fans at the gate (no different to a St Kilda or Melbourne). Behind St Kilda (who really are blessed with the greatest advantage of all!) pre Coleman, up with Melbourne through the 1950s, 1960s and 1970s (when they secured their natural constituency in the N/W suburbs of Melbourne). Essendon really didn't come into their own (as a powerhouse) until Sheedy went to the place, they won the 1984-85 flags and their fan base exploded in the late 1980s and early 1990s once they moved to the MCG

So more than Carlton or Collingwood the MCG is very important symbolically for Essendon. Whether they can get all the parties to agree to a move is doubtful. If / when the AFL acquires Ethiad we are going to see more and more Collingwood, Richmond, Hawthorn games shifting to Docklands to make the AFL pits of money...the precedent was set when the AFL used to push Carlton v Collingwood / major SF's and PF's out to Waverley Park in the 1970s and 1980s. That is the new reality once the AFL take over the stadium and until that point Essendon is the anchor club for Docklands management (they are the real money spinner, 2nd to Collingwood)

Remember for all the bluster of moving to the MCG full time (9-2, the 8-3, 7-4 and now 6-5) Carlton couldn't move away from Ethiad (and they had no where near the water tight stadium contract Essendon has). In recent seasons we've seen Hawthorn and Richmond play a fluctuating amount of home games at the stadium (both fan bases despise the venue - we play in Tasmania partly because of this) while Collingwood are locked into playing 2-3 home games their a year as well (and they hate it as well)...and it's only going to get worse once AFL takes full possession

 

[Demonic Ascent]

I know that both sides lost in Round 1 and expectation is limited but a little disappointing that WCE couldn't get 35,000 to a fixture that was a regular 40,000 in the decade from 2000 to 2010.

I was thinking that as well - for all the talk of drawing crowds from some West Coast supporters (ok there's one in particular) I was surprised they could only draw a mere 7k more to their first home game than Melbourne drew against Gold Coast last week. I would've expected a capacity crowd, around 45k.

Also surprising considering Carlton has decent support in WA.

 

[Rouel_14]

Thankgod we have Carlton round 1 cause any later and we would be lucky to get 20000 through the gates [emoji23]

 

[dave10]

Thankgod we have Carlton round 1 cause any later and we would be lucky to get 20000 through the gates [emoji23]

Amazing what 2 weeks can do. If you played them this week as their hone game you would be lucky to get 50,000. We have them next week, most likely both teams 0-2, 50,000 maybe all we can expect.

For us, I think this year will be the reverse of Richmonds 2014. A tough start before we probably win our fair share of games in the 2nd half and the crowds will improve.
For Carlton, they may well beat us next week but it's shaping as a pretty bleak year for attendances you would think. A few wins would go wonders fir Carlton at present. They will be back (sadly and thankfully if this makes sense).

 

[Rob]

I know that both sides lost in Round 1 and expectation is limited but a little disappointing that WCE couldn't get 35,000 to a fixture that was a regular 40,000 in the decade from 2000 to 2010.

Nah, that was entirely expected with the 6pm start and rain around. It's not like people could just rock up at the gate and buy the empty seats.

 

[Hawkk]

Carlton is very quickly (and rather alarmingly) dancing the dance irrelevance. It's hard to see them challenging for a flag over the next 2-3 years and it's plausible that they could go another 5 years without a flag (meaning it'd be a quarter century since their last flag)

Hard to imagine that a club that for so long was the perpetual challenger (where only a GF performance was a pass grade through the 80s) are entering into a period of such insignificance

 

[fabulousphil]

Carlton is very quickly (and rather alarmingly) dancing the dance irrelevance. It's hard to see them challenging for a flag over the next 2-3 years and it's plausible that they could go another 5 years without a flag (meaning it'd be a quarter century since their last flag)

Hard to imagine that a club that for so long was the perpetual challenger (where only a GF performance was a pass grade through the 80s) are entering into a period of such insignificance

Swings and round-a-bouts, hard to imagine a more arrogant club than Carlton..... maybe Richmond ?, when in full flight.

Lot of old money around Carlton, it is just a matter of time before they are back.

 

[Hawkk]

Perhaps but 25 years without a flag for a club that has been as successful as Carlton (16 flags in 89 years between 1906-1995) is a very long wait (especially when they haven't made a GF since 1999...where they were spanked)

I guess Essendon could soon be in the same boat but they did have that whole 1965-1984 hiatus (but they did make GF's in 1968 and 1983)

Edit: I just realised that Carlton didn't win a flag between 1947-1968 (although they did make GF's and contended in 1949 and 1962)

 

[fabulousphil]

Perhaps but 25 years without a flag for a club that has been as successful as Carlton (16 flags in 89 years between 1906-1995) is a very long wait (especially when they haven't made a GF since 1999...where they were spanked)

I guess Essendon could soon be in the same boat but they did have that whole 1965-1984 hiatus (but they did make GF's in 1968 and 1983)

Edit: I just realised that Carlton didn't win a flag between 1947-1968 (although they did make GF's and contended in 1949 and 1962)

Also we are not dividing premierships by 12 clubs anymore, you can't just buy a premiership easily as has been Carlton's MO in years gone by.

The best talent from SA, WA and even the northern states will stay more and more at home if possible.

 

[Rob]

Also we are not dividing premierships by 12 clubs anymore, you can't just buy a premiership easily as has been Carlton's MO in years gone by.

Which made the irony of Malthouse's lament that they couldn't pick up any free agents because they didn't make finals delicious.

 

[Hawkk]

Also we are not dividing premierships by 12 clubs anymore, you can't just buy a premiership easily as has been Carlton's MO in years gone by.

The best talent from SA, WA and even the northern states will stay more and more at home if possible.

Not biased or anything but

http://www.afr.com/opinion/adjusting-the-count-makes-the-hawks-afl-winners-20140929-jl30g

LEVELLING THE PLAYING FIELD
A simple solution is to adjust for the number of seasons in which each team has participated.

Doing so dramatically elevates both the Brisbane Lions and the West Coast Eagles, each with three premierships but still lower than the three traditional superpowers as well as Hawthorn (now in second place behind Essendon). However, this adjusts only for part of the story.


There is a further bias that has to be corrected, specifically the number of teams in the league across time, because the original teams from 1897 initially had fewer teams to contend with for winning premierships.

After all, winning in an eight-team league is statistically more than twice as likely than in the modern-day 18-team version.

When the number of premierships for all teams in VFL-AFL history is then inflated to provide them with the same opportunity to win flags as Carlton and Collingwood (the only two teams to have played every single season), the results can be charted.

From this, not only do the Brisbane Lions and the West Coast Eagles jointly jump almost to the top, but also other non-Victorian teams surge up the list as well – except those yet to taste their maiden salute.

A first triumph for Fremantle last year would have seen them at 8.45 premierships on this count.

The caveat to these calculations is that just a few more years without an extra flag will see the Lions and Eagles decline quickly on this measure.

However, just one more title to either of them (or even to the Adelaide Crows for that matter) will see that team burst clear to the top.

Hawthorn is the only Victorian team to make a notable upward move on this basis. Indeed, its 2014 success sees it rise directly to the summit.

In any event, while this list may be treated with the proverbial grain of salt, it potentially adds yet another – this time, economic – spin on the perpetual battle for premiership supremacy bragging rights.

Most definitely the completion is much more difficult to win today then it was in the early 1980s (with no salary cap, splitting talent across SA, WA and Tas amongst a select few VFL clubs etc)

Carlton is just one of a number of clubs that have strongly to adapt to the changing environment. In fact aside from Geelong (4), Hawthorn (4), Collingwood (4) and St Kilda(2) no Victorian club has got within boo of a GF since 2001 (whilst 5/6 non Victorian clubs around in 2001 have made it to the GF - the Lions (4), Swans (4), Eagles (2), PA (2), Fremantle (1))

As for crowds, pretty decent crowd in at the MCG. Looks high 40,000's / low 50,000's on the TV - a terrific roll up for a game against the Doggies

 

[BallaratBulldog]

Just under 50,000 they said on seven. Unlucky.

 

[Kwality]

I was thinking that as well - for all the talk of drawing crowds from some West Coast supporters (ok there's one in particular) I was surprised they could only draw a mere 7k more to their first home game than Melbourne drew against Gold Coast last week. I would've expected a capacity crowd, around 45k.

Also surprising considering Carlton has decent support in WA.

I would've expected a capacity crowd, around 45k - fair dinkum, bog ignorant.
The strength of the Eagles are the season seatholders, so attendances arent the issue they are for some of the clubs. There are concerns over vacant seats, just as there is at Geelong.

The Equalisation Set of Melbourne would be squealing for a bigger handout IF the game started at 6.10 Friday night.

T