The Liberal Party - How long?

Remove this Banner Ad

Status
Not open for further replies.
  • Thread starter
  • Moderator
  • #76
Maggie5 said:
Porter on 7.30 Report... "We need to better messengers, not getting across all the great things we have done".

Good idea start with spending less time on scaremongering and race bait, then maybe you can tell us how everybody is so much better off and all the good things you are doing re climate change, not cutting Medicare, explaining how immigration works and for whom, education, etc etc.

I did hear the one about electricity prices savings of $100-$300 over the next 3 years which then reminded me about the $500 Abbott promised.
What about Gas prices? You know things that affect everyone especially low income earners, you know the ones I mean, the ones that you cut the penalty rates from because it would encourage more employment. Got any figures on that?

Oh dear, not sure what they need before they get the message.

Shame that the opposition is not strong in NSW as might not get the message.
Click to expand...
It's a catch twenty two for the government, the more they crow about the economy the more a lot of people are reminded that they're not seeing of the benefits of this and question why we're constantly being told we can't afford things.
 
sorted said:
Nearly 5 million people voted no to SSM, many of them in areas with high numbers of conservative immigrant cultures such as Chinese, Lebanese, Turkish, and Lebanese. Yet it was a Liberal government that enacted SSM. Only the Twitterverse could get outraged over this.

Climate change is almost irrelevant to most people's priorities, except electricity prices.

The ALP has backed down on Safe Schools so that it's hardly visible.

Of these issues only electricity prices will be front and foremost at the next Federal Election.
Click to expand...
Maybe within the circles you mix. Other circles not so much.
 
The Speaker said:
Ideological differences always become an issue. Should the economy fall over while federal Labor is in government, these will come to the fore.
Click to expand...

I mean yes, to a degree. But to be a major party in this country, you have to accomodate them. It’s fine for people within a party to have a difference of opinion. When the minority side starts trying to hold the rest of the party to ransom, that’s when it becomes a problem.

Whether the ALP can manage that in government - we’ll find out soon.

If you just can’t handle working with people with whom you have disagreements- well the Greens and the Conservatives are a thing. Neither are very worthwhile things of course, but they are there.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Badesumofu said:
I mean yes, to a degree. But to be a major party in this country, you have to accomodate them. It’s fine for people within a party to have a difference of opinion. When the minority side starts trying to hold the rest of the party to ransom, that’s when it becomes a problem.

Whether the ALP can manage that in government - we’ll find out soon.
Click to expand...

Which is the minority in the ALP? Is that problematic given it should be the case that each major ideological group has a party of its own?

Badesumofu said:
If you just can’t handle working with people with whom you have disagreements- well the Greens and the Conservatives are a thing. Neither are very worthwhile things of course, but they are there.
Click to expand...

The Greens are a non-solution - they share the same ideological grounding as the current ALP, with a very mild environmental twist.

The Conservatives are a non-entity, partly because they are new but mostly because their leader holds that Thatcher, a political liberal, is the image of a great conservative leader.
 
Maggie5 said:
Porter on 7.30 Report... "We need to better messengers, not getting across all the great things we have done".

Good idea start with spending less time on scaremongering and race bait, then maybe you can tell us how everybody is so much better off and all the good things you are doing re climate change, not cutting Medicare, explaining how immigration works and for whom, education, etc etc.

I did hear the one about electricity prices savings of $100-$300 over the next 3 years which then reminded me about the $500 Abbott promised.
What about Gas prices? You know things that affect everyone especially low income earners, you know the ones I mean, the ones that you cut the penalty rates from because it would encourage more employment. Got any figures on that?

Oh dear, not sure what they need before they get the message.

Shame that the opposition is not strong in NSW as might not get the message.
Click to expand...

I thought the message was we are too scared to go out to dinner?
 
The Speaker said:
Bernardi has a big problem in attracting people to his party: he's a Thatcherite. His economic beliefs are anathema to many genuine conservatives.
Click to expand...

Old-school Menzies conservatives yes, but modern conservatives (Abbott) are generally Thatcherite monetarists.
 
The Speaker said:
Which is the minority in the ALP? Is that problematic given it should be the case that each major ideological group has a party of its own?
Click to expand...

Why should it be the case? I think it works perfectly fine as it is. If some issue is really dear to my heart I can band together with other like minded ALP members and agitate for it within the party. We are stronger united than if we fractured into sub-groups.


The Greens are a non-solution - they share the same ideological grounding as the current ALP, with a very mild environmental twist.
Click to expand...

Agree that the Greens are a non-solution. But it’s because of the way they run their party and the very fact that they demand such a high level of ideological purity. Basically it’s because they are what you seem to want the ALP to turn into.

I don’t agree at all about ideological grounding. The Greens don’t particularly care about things like Change the Rules.

The Conservatives are a non-entity, partly because they are new but mostly because their leader holds that Thatcher, a political liberal, is the image of a great conservative leader.
Click to expand...

The Conservatives are largely a non-entity. Might swipe a Senate seat or two and weaken the Liberals as a result. Too focussed on the leader like a lot of current minor and micro parties.
 
about time they got a good kick up the backside.. they just have been coasting along with the belief that the 'rich' and the 'prosperous'
were going to just saddle up each election and number one was theirs, and then they would gather up the rest of those aspirants to the
rich and famous.. but the famous and the rich are also red bloods.. it seems... there is no actual difference..

they need to be less aspirational in terms of being obvious to the rich and famous and get on board with the rich and working famous..

working is the hamburger, the pasta, the schnitzel, the chops and indeed the green salad of us all..

IN other words there is no difference, it is a personality and squeaky wheel thing..

rattle my cage if you disagree...
 
To be fair on The Liberal Party they should just dissolve The Liberal Party, they only exist to serve themselves and a few key stakeholders. They are incompetent, corrupt, and have the same policies as a two bit terrorist cult organisation.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

One for the Python fans.

YTkPJjl.jpg
 
sorted said:
Nearly 5 million people voted no to SSM, many of them in areas with high numbers of conservative immigrant cultures such as Chinese, Lebanese, Turkish, and Lebanese. Yet it was a Liberal government that enacted SSM. Only the Twitterverse could get outraged over this.

Climate change is almost irrelevant to most people's priorities, except electricity prices.

The ALP has backed down on Safe Schools so that it's hardly visible.

Of these issues only electricity prices will be front and foremost at the next Federal Election.
Click to expand...

That’s massively off the mark.

As long as the economy is going ok - and it is - people start voting on these things.
 
sorted said:
Nearly 5 million people voted no to SSM, many of them in areas with high numbers of conservative immigrant cultures such as Chinese, Lebanese, Turkish, and Lebanese. Yet it was a Liberal government that enacted SSM. Only the Twitterverse could get outraged over this.

Climate change is almost irrelevant to most people's priorities, except electricity prices.

The ALP has backed down on Safe Schools so that it's hardly visible.

Of these issues only electricity prices will be front and foremost at the next Federal Election.
Click to expand...
Forefront of next Federal election will be the price of housing, and the collapsing of the market. If the Sydney slide continues the Libs will be absolutely routed there.
 
The Liberal Party was formed by those who once ran the United Australia Party (UAP) after they just gave up, when the Second World War came along and they had no idea of how to deal with it and effectively resigned from Government.

This was not surprising given that the UAP, just like the Liberal Party they formed afterwards, exist for one reason and one reason alone, that is, they are an anti-labour party or as Keating put it, "an outfit". Their whole raison d'être is to keep the status quo where big business and it's interests, whether that business be agricultural, industrial, financial, mining, energy production etc, trumps the interests of every other section of society.

The Liberal Party is by it's very nature, a party that exists only to fight for entrenched interests and to fight against any changes that threaten the status quo and when it comes to making money, they see their biggest threat as being that of organised labour. If the Liberal/UAP Party had their way, workers would still be working 16 hours per day earning 10 cents an hour, 6 days a week with women earning just a third of that with no sick pay or holidays.

Do people actually think that businesses/bosses just woke up one day and said "You know what? I'm going to cut the working hours down to 35 hours per week, give the workers massive increases in their hourly rates of pay with penalty rates for working overtime and for working unsociable hours and equal pay for women; give them four weeks a year off for holidays and 10 sick days per year. I'm also going to make sure that occupational health and safety is going to be given priority over everything else." Do people actually think these advances in the workplace just happened out of kindness of the bosses heart?

These basic humanitarian advances took place because of the concerted efforts of organised labour and everyone of these incremental gains faced fierce resistance from business and their political party, the Liberal/UAP party and how do you win support from the blue collar and white collar workers to vote for you? Well you get yourself a boogie man and and go hell-bent-for-leather to convince the prols that the ALP is somehow connected to this boogie man and/or, sympathetic to the monster. First it was communism, then Asians, it's always been Aboriginals and now the latest instalment is Islam as well as those pesky gay types.

The problem that the anti-labour forces face is that when something profound comes along like World War and now, climate change, they have no idea of how to handle those changed conditions and when it comes to climate change, there is the added conundrum of a very powerful section of their business constituency who do not want to stop using 19th century technologies, because they make billions out of using them whilst another section of business, but not anywhere near as powerful as the Victorian era section, these businesses know that the consumer has woken up to the reality of climate change, just as it did to the dangers of tobacco and asbestos and they know that consumers are demanding more environmentally sensitive products/processes. This less powerful sector is pleading for a compromise but the vastly dominant Victorian era sector, won't have a bar of it as can be seen by the NEG debacle.

This state of affairs is bad enough but a compromise like the laughable "Direct Action" appeased both these sections more or less but their is also another factor, the tiny matter of how to win the popular vote so they can stay in government and rule over the plebeians?

Once upon a time, before climate change was quantified and accepted as real by the majority of the electorate, (and rising every day), it was probably just enough to dust off the boogie man and the pretend middle class and the bourgeoisie would more than likely plump for the "tough-on-crime, no compromise" Liberals.

Unfortunately for the Liberal Party, one of these profound issues has come along and found them out again and that issue is climate change so what has happened is that whilst it can work through this issue with it's business masters, it cannot pull the wool over the eyes of those who have been voting for it for many years, therefore, when it comes to climate change, what do the Liberals do? They do what they have always done and that is blow their dog whistles as hard as they can and mobilise all the none to insignificant forces eg. Murdoch & "mainstream media", to try and scare the living daylights out of people and make them ignore climate change but the "base", that is the electoral base, not the extreme right business and supremacist core that make up the actual Liberal Party of today, but the electoral base made up of the bourgeois and those descendants of 1950's Australian's who fell hook line and sinker for the "Reds-under-the-beds" mantra and whose families have never voted for the ALP since, these people are leaving the Party they used to vote for as a matter of course because the Liberal Party has now been stripped bare and shown up for what they actually are: an ancient thinking, backward looking, sexist and extremist party that has lost any and every pretension of being a truly "liberal" Party and that spells curtains for them, just as it did when the UAP were found out and exposed as the Party of privilege and big business who had no idea of what to do when anything else bar making sure that government enacted policies ensuring that their businesses made big profits.

The carnage inflicted upon the Liberal Party in the Victorian State election has severe consequences for the Liberal Party. If the election were a "steady-as-she-goes" result where the Liberals either gained a few seats, or lost a few seats, then it would have been just carry on regardless but the horrendous bloodbath, has drawn any number of "Liberal" people out of the woodwork, sewer, shadows, pulpit; all with faeces running down their leg at the thought of loosing privilege and power and offering up all sorts of "solutions" to get the Party "back on track".

We've got the supremacist rabid right winger Bolt, saying that Guy came to see him in his office with a couple of advisers instead of just himself (?) and that he was not vicious enough during the election campaign and laments the fact that there weren't any young people having "fun" during election night like those devils of the "Left"!

Miranda Devine bangs on about Guy not going in hard enough over the Safe Schools programme and that is why they weren't elected. Alan Jones reckons that Guy didn't appear on his programme and that was a critical mistake whereas Kroger reckons he personally did well! Pesutto reckons they will have to do a "root-and-branch review" from "top to bottom" and then went on to blame the Feds. Prue MacSween reckons that the Victorian Liberals would have been in a better position if Dutton were leader and Credlin, the absolute right wing cretin, said that the Burke Street knife attack was a contributing factor for the Liberals doing badly because, "... ,you couldn't go out there hard in at least that immediate week for fear of looking like you're politicising the issue."! Then we have Frydenberg saying that there's nothing to see here so move on and that the Party is at it's best when it's a "broad church" and Tim Wilson said, “I sat there on polling booths and every second person either gave you deadly silence, which is a very cold, deadly silence, or there were people mentioning energy, climate, or the deposing of the prime minister,” and still this fool reckons he's a "moderate" and that the party should return to it's more to the moderate base of the party even though, this coward is still a member of the Party that vilified and abused homosexuals during the most disgusting "plebiscite" ever witnessed in Australia which was nothing more, than an invitation for the bigots, the religious zealots and the knuckledraging Hansonites to bash homosexuals and of course, it's all Malcolm Turnbull's fault. Strangely, the Leader and Prime Minister is nowhere to be seen!

The Liberal Party are on deaths doorstep because there is absolutely no way you can mend a political party after having either booted out or assassinated a vital part of the party that made you electable; the "liberal" part of the party. I cannot see how the Liberal Party can survive in it's current manifestation. The crunch came, because of climate change, where it either had to become a truly liberal party or, be true to it's core as the party of and for, big business and privilege. It can only be one or the other and it was always going to be big money, big business and privilege.

In my estimation, the only thing that the anti-labour party can do now, is to break it's ties with the true liberals and form their own party and for the true "liberals", to revisit the "democrats" moniker, either way, the current Liberal Party has run it's course. They may however, persevere and preserve until after the Federal election which looks to be increasingly more like an absolute bloodbath and install the hyena Julie Bishop as leader but the problem will and will always remain, that those like the Sydney Institute, will never countenance any movement towards accepting that climate change is "real" nor will they ever accept multiculturalism and all that will happen, is that the Liberal Party will continue to fight itself until they split.
 
Last edited:
Northalives said:
In my estimation, the only thing that the anti-labour party can do now, is to break it's ties with the true liberals and form their own party and for the true "liberals", to revisit the "democrats" moniker, either way, the current Liberal Party has run it's course.
Click to expand...

So what's now the Coalition would become a three-way coalition:
*The Nationals, who are likely to remain relatively unchanged
*The current Liberal Party wets
*The anti-Labor RWFW reactionaries- comprised of the current Liberal Party hard right, Bernardi's Wingnuts, and to some extent One Notion and the Katter mob

The problem there is it's looking like long stints in power for federal Labor and several states. This is likely to drag Australia leftwards irrevocably. In turn this will make the far right of this hypothetical coalition look more and more like an extremist splinter group. And any attempt by the Wets to seize the center might succeed... but might also see them go the way of the Australian Democrats.
 
Badesumofu said:
Dee Madigan on Sky the other night said something very insightful. Said something like: 'people don't vote Labor because they decide the Liberal party isn't far enough to the right'. You might think that's more obvious than insightful, and you'd be right, except that as far as I can see there actually are a large number of people within the Liberal party who genuinely believe their problem is that they aren't far enough to the right. They toss out platitudes like that the people who'd prefer Malcolm Turnbull to Dutton would never actually vote Liberal anyway.

They are collectively fleeing the centre because they think the centre is electoral poison. How have they convinced themselves of this? I have no fukin' clue. But if it continues they won't continue to be a major party for too much longer.
Click to expand...

They could get less than 30% of the vote if they keep going this way.
 
Did anyone actually get their power bills reduced by $500?

How many times can you fail to do something, yet claim the other side would be worse

Frustrated that this question is not asked enough
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Aristotle Pickett
Vic The joke that is the Victorian Liberal Party.
3 4 5 6 7
Replies
162
Views
7K
QuietB
QuietB
Geoff
The Joke that is the West Australian Liberal Party
2 3 4
Replies
75
Views
4K
E Shed
E Shed
Bunk Moreland
The major parties versus social media
Replies
0
Views
89
Bunk Moreland
Bunk Moreland
Northalives
"Praying For Power". The City Builders Pentecostal Church and the Victorian Liberal Party.
Replies
8
Views
1K
Sun Ra
Sun Ra
Chief
Libertarian Nutters
2
Replies
26
Views
1K
Chief
Chief
M
How the coalition can win the next Victorian election
2 3 4
Replies
77
Views
3K
Johnny Bananas
Johnny Bananas
Cookie
Peter Dutton - How Long?
58 59 60 61 62
Replies
2K
Views
66K
Freomaniac
Freomaniac

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top