The next configuration change to the AFL

[Old Skool]

I honestly can't see the AFL losing clubs anywhere. The game will eventually absorb the winter sports market and expand all over the nation. I won't be surprised if the competition is made up of 24 clubs in 30 years time.

 

[legend166]

Here's a thought:

Begin funneling money into second tier clubs with the aim to creating a secondary national league. Once formed these teams get first access to the draft and a variety of concessions. The next year a relegation system comes into play where the weakest AFL teams are replaced by the strongest secondary teams.

Will relegation kill pretty much every club? Yes, but it also gives teams with a string history like the Centrals, Port Melnourne, the Perth clubs and Tassie teams like Glenorchy a shot at making the AFL. The process will take ages as the current teams are much stronger than the newer ones will be, but salary cap space for the second teams and the potential popularity of the new secondary league could make the league a much more national one in a few years time.

Quick Question.

If this was to eventuate, how many SANFL/WAFL/TSL/QAFL fans would stay loyal to their current brand?

Just fixed that up to make it a bit more accurate.

 

[Fluro Boots]

Merger option sounds good in theory. But try and explain that to the two hypothetical Melbourne clubs. The big four and Hawthorn aren't at risk, leaves the Dogs, Saints, Melbourne and North. Supporter base is too strong amongst them IMO

Should be able to get melbourne onboard. They were keen last time and I'm not sure they want to go on without Scully.

 

[Dr Awkward]

Probably Tassie and 3rd Perth team.

I dont wanna see anything else in QLD or NSW.

 

[Pessimistic]

We now have 18 teams in the AFL. What will be the next configuration change? I reckon there are 2 possibilities that the AFL should look at.

1. Put a Merger package on the table that is too good to be refused. eg. The first 2 Victorian clubs to merge (a real merger and not a takeover), the AFL will pay off all their combined debts, and the new club will receive $50million up front. If this offer is accepted then the AFL could go ahead and create a new team in Tassie as well and 18 teams is maintained.

If no takers then....

2. Look into creating 2 more new teams (same scenario as GCS & GWS), one in Tassie and another in WA. This would then mean that we would have a 20 Team competition. (Not sure if that is ideal but could work if every team played each other once plus one rivalry round for a 20 round season).

Please discuss.

Why just victorian clubs ?

The last merger was Fitzroy and Brisbane

 

[Sttew]

Has to be a team in Tasmania, so my money would be on North relocating.

This may sound like a broken record, but there are too many teams based in Melbourne for a national competition. London only fields 4 teams in the current Premier League.

 

[cos789]

Mate I am pretty sure the entire country including Victoria would prefer a 12 team comp

I am absolutely sure no one wants to lose one team let alone six teams.

where everyone plays twice etc etc.

The easier way is playing once in an expanded competition.

We are at 18 now and everyone knows there is not enough elite footballers to fill these sides.

The population has risen to 22 million.
There is increasing participation in NSW and QLD.
The AFL is already recruiting offshore and it's likely to ramp up.


In all probability there will be no change to the number of teams at the very least until GC and GWS have settled in.
There will be no mergers - they simply don't work.
There possibly will be relocations. e.g. tasmania, Canberra or Riverina.

 

[Tulip]

Has to be a team in Tasmania, so my money would be on North relocating.

This may sound like a broken record, but there are too many teams based in Melbourne for a national competition. London only fields 4 teams in the current Premier League.

5, actually:

Arsenal, Chelsea, Fulham, QPR, Tottenham

That's along with teams such as West Ham, Charlton, Watford, Millwall and Crystal Palace being in and among it.

 

[MaddAdam]

Has to be a team in Tasmania, so my money would be on North relocating.

This may sound like a broken record, but there are too many teams based in Melbourne for a national competition. London only fields 4 teams in the current Premier League.

Yes but England and Wales also has a far more decentralised population. Apart from Geelong, there's no real population centres outside Melbourne.

Nothing the equivalent of Manchester, Birmingham, Leeds, Newcastle, Cardiff etc.

 

[speedpeck23]

Game will get bigger in NSW and Qld...........and then see what happens????

 

[FootyJunkie]

Tasmania playing alternating home games in Hobart and Launceston and either a third Perth side or a Darwin based "Northern" side playing some token games in Alice Springs and Cairns. I think GWS will just absorb Canberra as its territory.

 

[madmug]

Tasmania playing alternating home games in Hobart and Launceston and either a third Perth side or a Darwin based "Northern" side playing some token games in Alice Springs and Cairns. I think GWS will just absorb Canberra as its territory.

I think we've been through this expansion stuff a fair bit.
I still dont agree with relocation. It caused so much grief for South Melbourne & Fitzroy, also the same with the various attempts at amalgamation.
Tasmania wants its own team. I dont believe that saying GWS will absorb Canberra has any currency either. Both places have their own identity.
Its obvious the AFL dont understand the term 'respect', but if you try to impose a team from outside, it will struggle to be properly accepted.
The best way to encourage support is if the local community feel some level of ownership & identity with the club.
If any Melbourne teams go anywhere, it should be to the VFL.

 

[Roylion]

I still dont agree with relocation. It caused so much grief for South Melbourne & Fitzroy, also the same with the various attempts at amalgamation.

Once again...Fitzroy didn't relocate anywhere, except back to the Brunswick Street Oval.

If any Melbourne teams go anywhere, it should be to the VFL.

Maybe even to the VAFA.

 

[NeXus_Rosie]

Once again...Fitzroy didn't relocate anywhere, except back to the Brunswick Street Oval.



Maybe even to the VAFA.

At the end of the 1996 AFL season Brisbane Bears and Fitzroy Lions merged to form a new entity "The Brisbane Lions".

 

[Roylion]

At the end of the 1996 AFL season Brisbane Bears and Fitzroy Lions merged to form a new entity "The Brisbane Lions".

I suggest you consult the Supreme Court of Victoria on that one. They don't see it that way at all.

I also suggest you consult the 1996 Deed of Arrangement between Fitzroy and the Brisbane Bears (text available on the Fitzroy board), which also doesn't say that. If you'd like me to point out the relevant parts let me know.

 

[Papa G]

I think we've been through this expansion stuff a fair bit.
I still dont agree with relocation. It caused so much grief for South Melbourne & Fitzroy, also the same with the various attempts at amalgamation.
Tasmania wants its own team. I dont believe that saying GWS will absorb Canberra has any currency either. Both places have their own identity.
Its obvious the AFL dont understand the term 'respect', but if you try to impose a team from outside, it will struggle to be properly accepted.
The best way to encourage support is if the local community feel some level of ownership & identity with the club.
If any Melbourne teams go anywhere, it should be to the VFL.

Bingo.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Tasmania will not get a team. I just don't see it happening. Right now, the AFL's philosophy is to grow the code. Gold Coast and the Giants are there to further spread the game, to bring through younger players. Tasmania is below the Barassi line, and it's dominated by football. Most Tasmanian's also have an AFL club, and most Tasmanian kids play footy rather than rugby (though I would approximate that soccer might be high in player numbers, as it is everywhere in Australia). The question marks over Tasmania have been there a long time. They're not moving or being resolved. The huge Launceston - Hobart issue is a huge fault... you can't play half your games at one stadium, because then it becomes almost a neutral ground. Then there's the shrinking population, the older population, and the financial risks involved.

If North Queensland grows by a few million, with Townsville housing 1.5-2 million, it could get a license. NRL is the only code there. How many North Queenslanders feel associated with either the Suns or Lions? That is the kind of question raised by Vlad and co. It might not happen for 20 years, but it doesn't seem too far off.

I don't see the need for a third WA franchise though. This state is footy through and through. We've a long, proud culture of the game here. Fremantle and West Coast are financially successful, and both will only grow from their very high popularity. There is a real battle between the Eagles and Dockers. A third club might dilute that.

In fifty years, we could accomodate more clubs. The standard should be even higher than it is now - if Australian Rules football takes 15% of the NSW/Queensland youngsters, we've expanded our talent pool by a few hundred thousand. Who can argue with that? The game will generate more money, and I truly believe "we" will soon eclipse the NRL in those northern states. Perhaps a North Sydney franchise? A Newcastle team called the 'Steelers' or 'Irons' (with Newcastle's history of the trade)? North Queensland? And I'd even place a current Vic team to play in Bendigo.

 

[____]

What I'd personally like to see by around 2020.

New Hobart team playing at Bellerive Oval.
New Launceston team playing at Aurora Stadium.
New Canberra team playing at Manuka Oval.

Merger between North Melbourne and Western Bulldogs to make it 20 teams (I believe there are too many teams in Melbourne). BUT North Melbourne and Footscray, along with South Melbourne and Fitzroy to have separate VFL teams.

Makes it 20 teams.

19 rounds every team playing each other once.
9 home games and 9 away games for each team, plus a neutral round. (Give Geelong 10 home games, but one of those home games against Lions or Swans in Melbourne, still get 9 away games). Neutral round for Queensland teams is the Q-Clash, Adelaide teams the Showdown etc. While Geelong plays a home game against a Melbourne team on that round and other Melbourne teams play interstate at regional or overseas grounds against other Melbourne teams or Canberra.

Every team goes to South-east Queensland at least once a season.
Every team goes to Sydney at least once a season.
Every team goes to Adelaide at least once a season.
Every team goes to Perth at least once a season.
Every team goes to Tasmania at least once a season.
Every team goes to Canberra at least once every two seasons.
Every team goes to Melbourne at least four times a season (At least five times every two seasons for Lions and Swans due to Fitzroy and South Melbourne connection).
Every team goes to Geelong at least once every two seasons (Except Lions and Swans for reasons stated above).

 

[NeXus_Rosie]

In the best interests of the AFL, the next configuration change should be a relocation of a Victorian team to Tassie. I am not about to say who I think that should be but obviously I have a team in mind.

The AFL should start their planning now. ie Upgrade both stadiums in Tassie to 30,000 capacity. The infrastructure must be in place before relocation is viable.

Obviously no teams will willingly agree to relocate however, the way things are going they will have no other choice. Much like South Melbourne in the early 80's.

 

[cos789]

Merger between North Melbourne and Western Bulldogs

Mergers will not happen because they don't produce anything.
The WB have a target region of West of Melbourne.
The only team with a confused identity is NM where North of Melbourne
is the domain of many established clubs.

(I believe there are too many teams in Melbourne).

Quite simply this is wrong.
The problem is market share.
Simply removing the "weaker" clubs and not addressing market share will just produce a stronger Collingwood.

 

[madmug]

In the best interests of the AFL, the next configuration change should be a relocation of a Victorian team to Tassie. I am not about to say who I think that should be but obviously I have a team in mind.

The AFL should start their planning now. ie Upgrade both stadiums in Tassie to 30,000 capacity. The infrastructure must be in place before relocation is viable.

Obviously no teams will willingly agree to relocate however, the way things are going they will have no other choice. Much like South Melbourne in the early 80's.

No Relocations
One team in Tasmania, two grounds.

 

[cos789]

No Relocations
One team in Tasmania, two grounds.

I don't know how you can say that.
An offer should be made if that's what Tasmanians want.(I suspect so)
Then a club should be free to take up the offer.
The Hawks have turned around since they've played in Tasmania and so they would not be interested. Any new team in Tasmania would have to emulate the Hawks. I suggest that this new team deffinitely did not rule out relocation before it played any games as another team did in Sydney, Canberra and the GC thus reducing games to mere exhibition matches.

 

[madmug]

Tasmania will not get a team. I just don't see it happening. Right now, the AFL's philosophy is to grow the code. Gold Coast and the Giants are there to further spread the game, to bring through younger players. Tasmania is below the Barassi line, and it's dominated by football. Most Tasmanian's also have an AFL club, and most Tasmanian kids play footy rather than rugby (though I would approximate that soccer might be high in player numbers, as it is everywhere in Australia). The question marks over Tasmania have been there a long time. They're not moving or being resolved. The huge Launceston - Hobart issue is a huge fault... you can't play half your games at one stadium, because then it becomes almost a neutral ground. Then there's the shrinking population, the older population, and the financial risks involved.

If North Queensland grows by a few million, with Townsville housing 1.5-2 million, it could get a license. NRL is the only code there. How many North Queenslanders feel associated with either the Suns or Lions? That is the kind of question raised by Vlad and co. It might not happen for 20 years, but it doesn't seem too far off.

I don't see the need for a third WA franchise though. This state is footy through and through. We've a long, proud culture of the game here. Fremantle and West Coast are financially successful, and both will only grow from their very high popularity. There is a real battle between the Eagles and Dockers. A third club might dilute that.

In fifty years, we could accomodate more clubs. The standard should be even higher than it is now - if Australian Rules football takes 15% of the NSW/Queensland youngsters, we've expanded our talent pool by a few hundred thousand. Who can argue with that? The game will generate more money, and I truly believe "we" will soon eclipse the NRL in those northern states. Perhaps a North Sydney franchise? A Newcastle team called the 'Steelers' or 'Irons' (with Newcastle's history of the trade)? North Queensland? And I'd even place a current Vic team to play in Bendigo.

Thanks for your positive outlook for us.
The Launceston -Hobart think is inconsequential. It dosnt apply to the Tassie Tigers in cricket, so it wont affect a Tassie AFL team. We have two grounds now, any Tasmanian team would/should play 5-6 games in each to maximise the market.
The term 'question marks' about having a Tasmanian team , is generally used by people who choose to ignore the fact that the AFL have to hand feed clubs in Melbourne now, & that Tassie already has two rentaclubs. A bloody pathetic situation at best.
If you have lived in those northern NRL places I dont think you would say AFL will eclipse NRL anytime soon.
And if Bendigo gets a home team before Tasmania IMO it would simply confirm the AFL as just a Victorian sham, not a proper national competition, oh & dont you think Bendigo people have an AFL team too?

 

[Papa G]

Thanks for your positive outlook for us.
The Launceston -Hobart think is inconsequential. It dosnt apply to the Tassie Tigers in cricket, so it wont affect a Tassie AFL team. We have two grounds now, any Tasmanian team would/should play 5-6 games in each to maximise the market.
The term 'question marks' about having a Tasmanian team , is generally used by people who choose to ignore the fact that the AFL have to hand feed clubs in Melbourne now, & that Tassie already has two rentaclubs. A bloody pathetic situation at best.
If you have lived in those northern NRL places I dont think you would say AFL will eclipse NRL anytime soon.
And if Bendigo gets a home team before Tasmania IMO it would simply confirm the AFL as just a Victorian sham, not a proper national competition, oh & dont you think Bendigo people have an AFL team too?

Surely the actions of AFL over the last 5 years in particular should have left you in no doubt of this, surely?

 

[Hornberger]

20 teams divided into 4 geographic confernces.

West
West Coast
Fremantle
Adelaide
Port Adelaide
Perth

East
Brisbane
Gold Coast
Sydney
GWS
Tasmania

Vic A*
Collingwood
Carlton
Geelong
North Melbourne
Western Bulldogs

Vic B*
Essendon
Hawthorn
Richmond
Melbourne
St Kilda

* The Victorian conferences could be fixed be redrawn periodically.

Teams play teams in their division twice (8 games) and teams in other divisions once (15 games). 23 rounds total.

Their will be two games every Friday Night. The early game will be between two Victorian teams and the late second game will be either a South Australian team and Western Australian team, two South Australian teams or Western Australian teams.