stewie griffen
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Career lol
The guy has increased his scoring average for 5 straight seasons and came in as a late first backup
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The guy has increased his scoring average for 5 straight seasons and came in as a late first backup
Dannnnnnnnnn
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I'm taking the guy who plays defence and is relatively close on most other stats 100 times out of 100.
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Oh sorry would you like to use the last game, the last 6 months or what?
You can pick and choose stats all you like to suit your argument.
But remember his team is gash so he cant be a superstar.
Upgrayedd
A Vote for Clive is a Vote for Justice
Me right now
Giannis is doing godly things. And for i am his child to educate the phillistines on his work
He's top 20 in points. Rebounds. Assists. Blocks. Steals and fg%.
Literally not being able to shoot consistently with a man infront of him is the only other thing he doesnt do at an elite level.
And hes doing this without any other all star on his team.kriss is the cloest and hes out. Hes got a supporting cast of brogdan and parker.
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Giannis is fantastic but it's not as though Parker is a bad second banana. He's currently averaging 20 points per game with a 20 PER. Monroe is also a pretty good back-up centre (PER of 22.6). LeBron wishes he had a supporting cast that good in his first stint in Cleveland.
There is plenty to work with at the Bucks. They are basically one piece away - or natural improvement from the likes of Giannis, Parker and Maker - from becoming a fixture in the top four in the East.
I know Kyrie is a superstar, i never said he wasn't. Irving has had a much better career so far, but in my opinion Kyrie isn't as great a player as Jimmy Butler is right now.
Theseventhhamster
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Parker isn't very good yet. Great talent and can obviously score but he's a terrible defender. Kind of like Kyrie. You can tell in this thread who likes to use boxscore stats and hates any impact stats.
Upgrayedd
A Vote for Clive is a Vote for Justice
Right now...He kinda is.
Don;t get me wrong, he's going to get there, He can hit a 3 now but he still has a bit of improvement on the defensive end to work on. Plus he still needs to work a bit more on his shot.
Monroe is a black hole. All he'll ever be is a back-up Big off the bench and he restricts how they play defense, I wouldn't be suprised if they let him walk
I honestly don't see Maker being any more then a 15MPG player
Theseventhhamster
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Monroe's a good bench player but there's also a reason he's not playing big minutes.
stewie griffen
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Now in his fifth season in the association, Kyrie is statistically enjoying a career year. He’s averaging a career high in points, field goal percentage, and three-point percentage, while his advanced metrics, from his Player Efficiency Rating (PER) to his Box Plus/Minus (BPM), have all reached similar crescendos.
Yet, when compared to the current crop of elite point guards in the NBA, and there are a ton, Irving’s numbers fall surprisingly short in many areas in contrast.
More specifically, he’s 12th among guards in PER, 10th in VORP, and 12th in BPM, according to Basketball-Reference. Likewise, he ranks 10th among all point guards in ESPN’s Real Plus-Minus (RPM) stat. Most notably, he consistently trails the likes of Kyle Lowry, John Wall and Isaiah Thomas in such statistical categories — a.k.a. his chief point guard competition in the East.
A click bait headline from hoops habit
Monroe has his limitations and a poor reputation but he's got to the point where he is probably underrated.
I was having a look at line-ups used by the Bucks. The top ten 5-man line-ups, in terms of net point differential per 100 possessions, include Monroe. He is featured in their top eight 4-man line-ups.
The Bucks have an offensive rating of 115.8 when Monroe is on the floor versus 105.2 when he is off. Defensively they have a rating of 105.0 when he is on the floor and 107.8 when he is off. Now admittedly Monroe doesn't play against the starters, which may distort the figures somewhat, but even measures such as BPM that adjust for that suggest that the Bucks are better with Monroe on the floor. (BPM: +3.9 per 100 poseessions; 30th in the league).
anyone out there who wishes to second ZG1?
Theseventhhamster
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He's not top 30 cat.
DaveyBoy123
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This just seems plain sensible to me, but for some reason I'm confident that it's an unpopular opinion:
Apart from the occasional play here and there, 6-11 guys should not be point guards!
Yes, I'm looking at you two KD & Greek Freak.
Apart from the occasional play here and there, 6-11 guys should not be point guards!
Yes, I'm looking at you two KD & Greek Freak.
Why not?
Durant doesn't run the point either. He merely initiates the offence and creates shots off the dribble a lot.
Upgrayedd
A Vote for Clive is a Vote for Justice
How
DARE
YOU
!!!!~!~~~
Due to how Milwaukee play defense (Length/defensive pressure/Switching due to players length being able to cover multiple positions/transition) his ability to grab the board and push it, Milwaukee's ability to switch from PNR to have Giannis in a mis-match with a PG playing down the post. ball screen to him inside he's so long he can finish in the middle/pass it out.
He's good at knowing when to force offense, Pass to open player, He's excellent at seeing angles, He closes out brilliantly on switches, On Transition he's so quick the Bucks get a shot blocker trailing often.
Not his skill level isn't as good as many PG's but he just makes the right pass at the right time.
KD is a pure scorer, He;'s not on Giannis' level as a distributor or defensively. Durant doesn't really play "PG"
DaveyBoy123
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Because all teams should have multiple better ball-handlers than a 6-11 guy. Their dribbling technique just can't be as good as a shorter guy.
Look at the end of the 2 knicks vs bucks games as perfect examples. One time he brought the ball up & had it stolen. The other he had it fed to him where he could isolate his defender. It really is as simple as that, for mine.
And KD does play the point a lot imo. I've seen him often bringing the ball up & then creating the shot off the dribble. Sounds like what a PG does to me.
DaveyBoy123
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I have no issue with this & he's definitely such a talented weapon because of this fact. But I almost don't count that as being a point guard. He's ad-libbing, as such.
There's a reason why Milwaukee are clearly a bad half-court offense team right now. In fact, I'd almost call them one of the bottom 5. It gets put down to "lack of experience" a lot (& I'm sure that's part of it). but I think there's other reasons.
Sure they should have another guard who can dribble but that's not by design. This is basically the first season where Giannis has fully displayed his talent. They've got plenty of time to cater the team to his abilities.
Why take the ball out of the hands of the talented Giannis just so you can play in the traditional way with a ball dominant point guard?
It's pretty hard to find point guards who can play next to a guy like Giannis and alternate between spotting up and running some offence too. The league is filled with point guards who want to dominate the ball.
I'm sorry but there is just no logical explanation for taking the ball out of Durant's hands. Bringing the ball up and initiating some offence from his position makes him a matchup nightmare and best allows him to utilise his offensive abilities. Making him play off ball makes it far easier for teams to defend him.
My only beef with Durant this season has been when the Warriors let him dominate the hall far too much while teams wrestle Curry and take him out of the game off the ball. Like what happened against the Cavs.
You should probably go watch that LeBron guy because playing point has worked fine for him.
DaveyBoy123
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Like I said, I knew it was gonna be an unpopular opinion. Maybe I'm just a traditionalist. I have no issue with either Giannis or KD being fed early in the play & then strutting their stuff... The point guard does not have to be ball dominant (I agree it's tricky to find these guys nowadays, but if team management are worth their salt, then they will).
As for Lebron, there are a few major differences: (a) He lets Kyrie handle the point a lot. (b) He's 6-8, not 6-11, and because of that [& his greater strength] (c) he's a much better ball-handler than either of the other 2.
EDIT: Watching the last 7-8 minutes of the GSW - Memphis game... Yeah, I'm thinking I want the traditional point guard over the tall guy! And yes, KD ran the point a few times during that time!
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I just don't see the need for a whole bunch of ball handlers. The Bucks definitely need someone to help out from time to time but too many and you're hurting Giannis' ability to control the game.
The biggest thing hurting the Bucks would surely be their lack of spacing. When Middleton returns and if they can find another guard who can shoot that makes things more comfortable for Giannis. It's very easy to force a guy into mistakes handling the basketball when the defence doesn't have to worry about shooters.
LeBron really isn't all that different. Yes he's shorter but he's also far from being a guy you'd typically see running the show. LeBron almost his whole career has played the point pretty much. Yes he hasn't as much with Kyrie around, but his whole time in Miami in particular revolved around him running the point with scrubs like Chalmers next to him and he won two titles in the process.
For all this talk of Giannis and Durant being poorer ball handlers the stats certainly don't show much cause for concern. They don't turn it over much.
I'm sorry but it's just madness to suggest these two shouldn't handle the ball a heck of a lot.
Upgrayedd
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Because their second best player is as stated, A third year player who tore out his ACL in his rookie season and Greg Monroe has more to do with it.
stewie griffen
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And their only floor spacer is injured
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