VoteCompass 2022

[kickazz]

the ‘centre’ is in a bit of a funny spot

Agreed.

An absolute 'centre' cannot objectively exist - but surely the centre should be the middle of all Australian voters.

I think this tool is a cool idea but it needs:

a lot more questions,
maybe a few more dimensions (there are data visualisations that can show 4/5 dimensions reasonably well),
a dot for some of the other parties. Though god knows where UAP would sit.

 

[kickazz]

The concept is that it isnt meant to be a living wage because they want people moving off it and in to jobs.

No I disagree here - Newstart most definitely should be a living wage. Otherwise you just make it too hard for people to jump out of that rut.

By living wage I do mean the basics - the incentive for getting a job is that you can then afford 'nice' things.

The problem we have in this country is that some of these 'basics' (housing, utilities, healthy food, some medicines) are horrendously expensive.

 

[Gralin]

The concept is that it isnt meant to be a living wage because they want people moving off it and in to jobs.

the reality is they know that not everyone will get a job though
they talk like its a safety net, which it isn't
they talk like its there to help you get back on your feet, but it doesn't
and they act like the only reason you would be on it is laziness, but that's not true

Job vacancies are through the roof at the moment and unemployment is at a 40 year low. So its probably not the right time to be complaining.

4% of people that want work can't even find an hour of work
working doesn't automatically get you off welfare either if you can't get enough hours

Ignore people using the 'dole bludger' narrative. It has always been destructive

When there's an information vacuum, be wary of people who rush to fill it, writes Gareth Hutchens.

www.abc.net.au

We've got more people on welfare than before the pandemic started


not everyone on welfare is considered unemployed, and I don't mean pensioners (though they are on welfare and not considered unemployed)



none of this is new though, they've been demonizing people on welfare for a good 40 years now as policy

 

[rank and file]

Agreed.

An absolute 'centre' cannot objectively exist - but surely the centre should be the middle of all Australian voters.

I think this tool is a cool idea but it needs:

a lot more questions,
maybe a few more dimensions (there are data visualisations that can show 4/5 dimensions reasonably well),
a dot for some of the other parties. Though god knows where UAP would sit.

I'm the red dot,sometimes you just have to rise above it all.

 

[HairyO]

No I disagree here - Newstart most definitely should be a living wage. Otherwise you just make it too hard for people to jump out of that rut.

By living wage I do mean the basics - the incentive for getting a job is that you can then afford 'nice' things.

The problem we have in this country is that some of these 'basics' (housing, utilities, healthy food, some medicines) are horrendously expensive.

And if its a living wage why bother getting a job?

 

[Baltimore Jack]

And if its a living wage why bother getting a job?

Here's a bludger self projecting that because he is a bludger therefore others must be

 

[kickazz]

And if its a living wage why bother getting a job?

Because you want to enjoy better things other than just getting by?

 

[FredLeDeux]

And if its a living wage why bother getting a job?

And if it's not a living wage, how do you live?

 

[HairyO]

And if it's not a living wage, how do you live?

By getting a job as quickly as possible.

 

[FredLeDeux]

By getting a job as quickly as possible.

Are there many post mortem vacancies in the jobs market?

 

[Ice-Wolf]

I don’t think that’s appropriate, the adjustments to income tax were necessary given the bracket creep and lack of wage growth we’ve seen over the last couple of decades

Consumption taxes are better than income taxes because they are harder to dodge, and the GST is very low by global standards… 15% would be a good start

Consumption taxes * the poor.

Progressive taxation is far better.

 

[MyFootHurts]

Consumption taxes fu** the poor.

Progressive taxation is far better.

How about a flat tax where everyone pays the same percentage? Wouldn’t that be fair?

 

[Caesar]

Consumption taxes fu** the poor.

Progressive taxation is far better.

simplistic take

just because consumption taxes aren’t progressive doesn’t mean they can’t be part of a progressive tax system

consumption taxes are one of the most efficient and effective tax vectors and all good tax systems have them - Australia’s GST is way too low

 

[FredLeDeux]

simplistic take

It's not simplistic, it's simple - there's a difference

 

[Caesar]

It's not simplistic, it's simple - there's a difference

yes - Ice-Wolf is simplistic and you are simple

 

[kickazz]

How about a flat tax where everyone pays the same percentage? Wouldn’t that be fair?

It would be unfair an ineffective.

To get the same revenue as we have now would require lifting the base tax rate significantly. Those on the lowest incomes (who already have little left over after paying pretty high portions of their incomes for housing, utilities, food, etc) would end up with nothing left over or even worse. This reduces spending across the economy dragging it all down.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Consumption taxes fu** the poor.

Progressive taxation is far better.

How about a flat tax where everyone pays the same percentage? Wouldn’t that be fair?

How about a tax rate that's applied to what one earns?

Yeah I know 'we already have this', however it's clear it's not adjusted enough to take pressure off the lower end of the wage scale.

Ok the top end might not like getting taxed more, but it wouldn't take much change in tax rate to make real positive change.

Yeah that'll lose votes among the high earners, no I'm not talking the billionaires tax policy the Greens have. I'm talking about those who earn a million or half a million or there abouts. A slight hike on those earners, coz there's probably a lot of them, could greatly increase the country's coffers and greatly reduce the pressure on our low end wage earners.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

How about a flat tax where everyone pays the same percentage? Wouldn’t that be fair?

Ha ha ha...No

Dumbest thing ever

 

[Crankyhawk]

Consumption taxes fu** the poor.

Progressive taxation is far better.

if you have flat cash rebates as compensation though it can balance out.

 

[Crankyhawk]

How about a tax rate that's applied to what one earns?

Yeah I know 'we already have this', however it's clear it's not adjusted enough to take pressure off the lower end of the wage scale.

Ok the top end might not like getting taxed more, but it wouldn't take much change in tax rate to make real positive change.

Yeah that'll lose votes among the high earners, no I'm not talking the billionaires tax policy the Greens have. I'm talking about those who earn a million or half a million or there abouts. A slight hike on those earners, coz there's probably a lot of them, could greatly increase the country's coffers and greatly reduce the pressure on our low end wage earners.

whats wrong with also having the billionaire tax hit as well as what you propose?
and certainly torpedo the dumb* stage 3 tax cuts

 

[Carringbush2010]

whats wrong with also having the billionaire tax hit as well as what you propose?
and certainly torpedo the dumbfu** stage 3 tax cuts

Purportedly it would drive billionaires to park there $ elsewhere to avoid it.

 

[Gralin]

How about a tax rate that's applied to what one earns?

Yeah I know 'we already have this', however it's clear it's not adjusted enough to take pressure off the lower end of the wage scale.

Ok the top end might not like getting taxed more, but it wouldn't take much change in tax rate to make real positive change.

Yeah that'll lose votes among the high earners, no I'm not talking the billionaires tax policy the Greens have. I'm talking about those who earn a million or half a million or there abouts. A slight hike on those earners, coz there's probably a lot of them, could greatly increase the country's coffers and greatly reduce the pressure on our low end wage earners.

at the top end you need to tax based on assets not income, they can make income zero but have incredible increases in wealth via assets


if you want a more progressive tax system we also need income brackets above the current top one with higher rates

they've flattened out our system over the years to less brackets

 

[MyFootHurts]

Ha ha ha...No

Dumbest thing ever

Fairness is something lost upon Australians?

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Fairness is something lost upon Australians?

Yes it is, how did you lose it?

 

[Gough]

Purportedly it would drive billionaires to park there $ elsewhere to avoid it.

Joe Hockey has entered the room.