Europe War in Ukraine - Thread 4 - thread rules updated

[Gethelred]

Hey all,

Seeing as multiple people seem to have forgotten, abuse is against the rules of BF. Continuous, page long attacks directed at a single poster in this thread will result in threadbans for a week from this point; doing so again once you have returned will make the bans permanent and will be escalated to infractions.

This thread still has misinformation rules, and occasionally you will be asked to demonstrate a claim you have made by moderation. If you cannot, you will be offered the opportunity to amend the post to reflect that it's opinion, to remove the post, or you will be threadbanned and infracted for sharing misinformation.

Addendum: from this point, use of any variant of the word 'orc' to describe combatants, politicians or russians in general will be deleted and the poster will receive a warning. If the behaviour continues, it will be escalated. Consider this fair warning.

Finally: If I see the word Nazi or Hitler being flung around, there had better have a good faith basis as to how it's applicable to the Russian invasion - as in, video/photographic evidence of POW camps designed to remove another ethnic group - or to the current Ukrainian army. If this does not occur, you will be threadbanned for posting off topic

This is a sensitive area, and I understand that this makes for fairly incensed conversation sometimes. This does not mean the rules do not apply, whether to a poster positing a Pro-Ukraine stance or a poster positing an alternative view.

Behave, people.

 

[barreness]

I had to have a laugh at this one.


Ukraine hijacked an Iranian drone. This is the ultimate form of EW against drones, taking control of them. Sure a few folks in western militaries will be interested in this.


From the same source as the above, a graph of losses for both sides, divided into those by loitering UAV munitions versus other. This literally charts the rise of the robots.
View attachment 1997558

Sorry the first one is just silly. A sped up video of a practised deconstruction vs a soldier near the front trying to readjust the sight in a combat area(why would he click it back into place if he was trying to remove it, it's off centre and he has no opportunity to live fire a ranging round or two, nor the appropriate tools it would seem).

What's the translation from the narrator if anyone has a link?

 

[barreness]

Just as a I thought, the whole Ukraine can use foreign weapons inside Russia statement a week or so ago was all lies and bluster.

Biden and his team have really s**t the bed on this. Really needs to be pressured into changing their tune.

Nuclear threats work it seems. Wonder how they handcuff, just words or some direct control of targeting

 

[barreness]

I love mental gymnastics. You have performed a beautiful 'battered sav' followed by a 'hello boys ' and finishing with a splendid 'crazy date.' Sadly to no avail. I think you will find it's a matter of public record that the division of Poland was, as they say, written into the pact. Not a whoops, we forgot Poland kind of thing. All planned, plotted and documented.

Sure ignore all history and geopolitics. Yes they split Poland on the page. A lot of the Polish units thought they were coming to directly fight the Germans and let them through, fog of war and all that. They did eventually and almost lost everything, I'd say a bad situation for all had the Nazi's won that front

I haven't disagreed with the bolded at all, just tried to add context, which is important

 

[Rob R]

More than expressed. Seems they have put it into law now.

Provoking Finland, Lithuania and thereby NATO. Going on recent history, nothing will be done and Russia will get some territory for free.

Russia changes maritime border in Baltic Sea

The world will just ignore his illegal claims like they do those of other dictators and continue to sail through them etc. It will just make Putin look even more despotic and weak

On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Zidane98]

Sure ignore all history and geopolitics. Yes they split Poland on the page. A lot of the Polish units thought they were coming to directly fight the Germans and let them through, fog of war and all that. They did eventually and almost lost everything, I'd say a bad situation for all had the Nazi's won that front

I haven't disagreed with the bolded at all, just tried to add context, which is important

The cognitive dissonance here is pretty obvious.

Stalin and the Nazis were allies and would continue to have done so if Hitler didn't double cross him. Nazis were once welcomed for military parades in Russia. Putin to this day glorifies Stalin.

You attempt to rewrite history by portraying Stalin's actions as appeasement. It's just not reality, no other state that tried to appease Hitler agreed to divide up Europe into spheres of influence.

 

[Mobbs]

Sorry the first one is just silly. A sped up video of a practised deconstruction vs a soldier near the front trying to readjust the sight in a combat area(why would he click it back into place if he was trying to remove it, it's off centre and he has no opportunity to live fire a ranging round or two, nor the appropriate tools it would seem).

What's the translation from the narrator if anyone has a link?

Pretty much can't understand it at all, one of the words seems to be the Russian for "that" which is used in phrases like "like that". No idea of the rest. I believe it's audio from the second clip, not an external narration of the entire mashup.

 

[Zidane98]

From the article.
In September 2022, Reuters reported that Putin's envoy on Ukraine Dmitry Kozak had struck a provisional deal that would satisfy Russia's demand for Ukraine to stay out of NATO, but the plan was rejected by Putin who preferred a full-scale military invasion.

Vlad's terms are clear

Ukraine must become a nation full of vatniks that operates at the behest of Russian interests as it really isn't a nation at all / Russia owns the place.

It's why NATO was always a bullshit reasoning. I reckon Vlad would rather have Ukraine in NATO run by an Orban clone who he could easily manipulate.


Vlad can't accept an independent European leaning Ukraine where he can't pull strings. It's why he will never back down until forced to do so either militarily, politically or economically. .

Negotiations are futile with such a person. This is the modern day version of appeasing Hitler prior to WW2.

 

[Andre]

The cognitive dissonance here is pretty obvious.

Stalin and the Nazis were allies and would continue to have done so if Hitler didn't double cross him. Nazis were once welcomed for military parades in Russia. Putin to this day glorifies Stalin.

You attempt to rewrite history by portraying Stalin's actions as appeasement. It's just not reality, no other state that tried to appease Hitler agreed to divide up Europe into spheres of influence.

Let's also not gloss over that Stalin would have been the one to double cross Germany, if he'd had 2 to 3 more years to build up his army, whilst the Germans were weakening themselves fighting others. Yeah, Hitler was worse then Stalin, like a serial killer who murdered 20 is worse than one who murdered 15. They were both shit human beings, with no regard for human life.

 

[Zidane98]

Let's also not gloss over that Stalin would have been the one to double cross Germany, if he'd had 2 to 3 more years to build up his army, whilst the Germans were weakening themselves fighting others. Yeah, Hitler was worse then Stalin, like a serial killer who murdered 20 is worse than one who murdered 15. They were both s**t human beings, with no regard for human life.

Ironically this is what Xi is doing right now. Taking over gradually in Central Asia as Russia exhausts itself on a futile invasion in Ukraine. The aim for China is to then have Russia operate as a client state and/or return Vladivostok back to its rightful owner - China.

 

[wannabejack]

Potential Peace Deal with Russia: Current Status and Prospects

Numerous statements regaring potential peace talks between Russia and Ukraine can be found in the information space in Ukraine and elsewhere across the world, and their numbers have been increasing during May. Is that real politics or just information noise? â Ukrinform.

www.ukrinform.net

"There are proponents of peace talks even now, where there are certain concessions by Russia. There is a more pragmatic approach proposed as well - negotiations with Russia regarding an end to this war should be started only from a position of strength, when the war situation in Ukraine stabilizes, the Russian aggressor is stopped (or even better, pushed back at least from part of its occupied areas) and Putin realizes that he will not be able to win this war he is waging in Ukraine."

It is this view, the expert emphasizes, that currently dominates among Western elites: "The official stance of Western leaders remains as it was – it is Ukraine who will decide when and on what terms to start negotiations. This is exactly the stance the US Secretary of State, Anthony Blinken made public in Kyiv."

The Ukrainian strategy is for the international community (at least a significant part of it) to agree on a common line on future peace negotiations, with due account taken of the provisions of President Zelensky's Peace Formula. This is what the Global Peace Summit is for.
Russia's strategy is the exact opposite of that of Ukraine; it is aimed to force Ukraine and the West into negotiating peace on its own terms by escalating the war further still.

So the next two weeks will be very busy. Specifically, we will carefully monitor China to see if they will send a representative to attend the summit in Switzerland," Ihor Reiterovych summed up.

 

[Mobbs]

Explosions at Alushta on the southern Crimean coast. [K1 TG]

View attachment IMG_6537.mp4

 

[Mobbs]

And at Mospyno just past Donetsk:

[Supernova+ TG]
"The strike was carried out using 5 ATACMS ballistic missiles.
Losses:
• 2 S-300/400 air defense missile launchers were destroyed;
• 1 S-300/400 air defense missile launcher was damaged;
• Radar “96L6E” was destroyed;
• The control center of the S-300/400 air defense system was destroyed;
There are no casualties among personnel."

 

[Mobbs]

"The number of prisoners in Russia has decreased to a record level over the past year"

Количество заключенных в России рекордно уменьшилось за прошлый год

Их стало на 58 тысяч меньше

www.sibreal.org

In 2023, the number of prisoners in Russian colonies decreased by 58 thousand people, according to data from the FSIN magazine, which drew the attention of the project “To Be Precise.”

In October 2023, Mediazona wrote with reference to a statement by Deputy Minister of Justice Vsevolod Vukolov that since the beginning of the year, the number of prisoners may have decreased by a record 54 thousand people. Data from the FSIN journal confirms that in 2023 an absolute record was set for the reduction in the number of prisoners.

The previous record was recorded in 2022. Then, in two autumn months, 23 thousand people disappeared from the colonies , and in total, by the end of the year, there were 32 thousand fewer prisoners.

The trend towards fewer prisoners has been observed in Russia for many years. Thus, from 2009 to 2023, the total number of people in the colonies decreased almost threefold from 732.6 to 249.6 thousand.

The reduction in the number of prisoners in the early 2010s is associated with the humanization of punishment, experts say. For example, punishments for economic crimes were eased : bail instead of pre-trial detention, the introduction of a multiple fine system.

The reduction in the number of prisoners in 2022-2023 is associated with recruitment into the Wagner PMC, and later into the Storm detachments of the Ministry of Defense to participate in hostilities in Ukraine.

 

[Cap]

And at Mospyno just past Donetsk:

[Supernova+ TG]
"The strike was carried out using 5 ATACMS ballistic missiles.
Losses:
• 2 S-300/400 air defense missile launchers were destroyed;
• 1 S-300/400 air defense missile launcher was damaged;
• Radar “96L6E” was destroyed;
• The control center of the S-300/400 air defense system was destroyed;
There are no casualties among personnel."

View attachment 1998754View attachment 1998755

Its amazing when adequately equipped, how much damage Ukraine can do.

 

[Zidane98]

"The number of prisoners in Russia has decreased to a record level over the past year"

Количество заключенных в России рекордно уменьшилось за прошлый год

Их стало на 58 тысяч меньше

www.sibreal.org

Putin's a genius, sending them as cannon fodder to Ukraine is saving him a fortune on prison management costs.

 

[Aussie in exile]

Any problems? Yeh, I'd laugh. You think the UK can extend supply lines 6000km? let alone the other details. MI6 is pretty active in Ukraine though, as is the GRU/FSB

If Mexico started saddling up to china you think the US wouldn't coup(or invade if that failed)? s**t when Gough questioned Pine Gap he was gone in a few months. Not like this is a new action

But you think its ok for Russia in ilgally invade Ukraine.
Now yes or no, are illeagle invasions acceptable to you?

 

[wannabejack]

Any problems? Yeh, I'd laugh. You think the UK can extend supply lines 6000km? let alone the other details. MI6 is pretty active in Ukraine though, as is the GRU/FSB

If Mexico started saddling up to china you think the US wouldn't coup(or invade if that failed)? s**t when Gough questioned Pine Gap he was gone in a few months. Not like this is a new action

So if russia have a “concerted campaign to bombard Ukrainian civilians”, by your reckoning it would be OK for Ukraine to have a concerted campaign to bombard russian civilians? “Not like this is a new action”.

Hey, wait a minute russia do have a “concerted campaign to bombard Ukrainian civilians” (hence the war crimes) but Ukraine hasn’t.

 

[GhostofJimJess]

Let's also not gloss over that Stalin would have been the one to double cross Germany, if he'd had 2 to 3 more years to build up his army, whilst the Germans were weakening themselves fighting others. Yeah, Hitler was worse then Stalin, like a serial killer who murdered 20 is worse than one who murdered 15. They were both s**t human beings, with no regard for human life.

And the only difference between a serial killer who murdered 20 and one who murdered 15 is opportunity.

 

[GhostofJimJess]

Putin's a genius, sending them as cannon fodder to Ukraine is saving him a fortune on prison management costs.

I know you write that kind of tongue-in-cheek, but I doubt if it's actually too far from the truth.

 

[CD Xbow]

Paul Dibb has an article in the Strategist discussing stupid Putin's threats to use nuclear weapons.

Is Putin preparing for nuclear war? | The Strategist

On 6 May, Russian President Vladimir Putin announced he had authorised a military exercise involving the deployment of tactical nuclear weapons in southern Russia. He claimed there was ‘nothing unusual’ in such a planned training ...

www.aspistrategist.org.au

There is a certain irony in the Russian elites feeling the war they started without justification has become a threat to the Russian state and values. Mr Putin himself seems to have done the greatest damage to the Russian state, time for them to realise that.

 

[Cap]

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/putin-wants-ukraine-ceasefire-current-frontlines-sources-say-2024-05-24/

Looks like a certain leader is finally feeling the pressure.

Give Ukraine what it needs to finish this guy off

 

[Zidane98]

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/putin-wants-ukraine-ceasefire-current-frontlines-sources-say-2024-05-24/

Looks like a certain leader is finally feeling the pressure.

Give Ukraine what it needs to finish this guy off

Cease fire can happen when Putin withdraws out of Ukraine.

 

[Visions]

And at Mospyno just past Donetsk:

[Supernova+ TG]
"The strike was carried out using 5 ATACMS ballistic missiles.
Losses:
• 2 S-300/400 air defense missile launchers were destroyed;
• 1 S-300/400 air defense missile launcher was damaged;
• Radar “96L6E” was destroyed;
• The control center of the S-300/400 air defense system was destroyed;
There are no casualties among personnel."

View attachment 1998754View attachment 1998755

Apparently its been geolocated to a different town. Footage shows a lot of launching but no intercepting and then the whole Ruskie defence system getting pulverised.

New age Russian S-400 air defence system - 0
Old ass US ATACMS missiles - 1

Turkey and India must be over the moon they bought these from Russia.....

 

[barreness]

But you think its ok for Russia in ilgally invade Ukraine.
Now yes or no, are illeagle invasions acceptable to you?

No I don't, unfortunately our opinion doesn't matter

How do you not get this? Illegality doesn't matter in invasions and never has. See the amount of countries that the US have bombed in their time as global hegemon, or Britain before when they were etc etc

 

[Visions]

A lot of purging going on with the terrorists. Putin uses them up and spits them out.