What's going on with Carlton's list

[Hodgepodge]

Podge, you're as boring as ever. Whooped Collingwood twice this year. And the season before last had wins against top 4 sides.

In other words, no wins against Top 4 sides the last two years except for Collingwood.

You're just pumping out tired trolls from last year, but even then, we'd run Geelong to the wire and lose only with a missed shot on goal from a concussed Warnock from 7m out

Not convincing. . . plenty of clubs have a side they do uncharacteristically well against. Melbourne have run Collingwood to within a point and drew with them, doesn't make them capable of beating Top 4 sides in the sense that they would be flag contenders.

 

[Wayne Arnold]

Get with the program. They were one kick away from a prelim in 2011. This is what they hang their hat on these days. How the mighty have fallen.

 

[laminex]

Well argued yet againt, you mental giant. Really picked apart my points one by one.

Mate you didn't make a point, you attached your self to a sporting club and acted like you have have glory from it and that your opinion matters. It doesn't you don't count mate at all, sorry but thems the facts. I'm not saying i count or anyone here we don't but at least i don't claim some glory that my club has or in yr case hasn't even got. Your team should have been playing for a flag but because your president fell in love with a bad idea you sacked the best coach in the league for a bloke who could be the greatest of all tiem or just another coach. In the end sacking Micky has cost 2 chances at a flag.

Sun bake away in yr glory my friend.

 

[laminex]

Yeah gotta say the problems with Carlton's season went far beyond injuries I thought.

I agree to a degree

 

[chunkylover53]

I agree to a degree

I just thought Carlton's best 22 injury list wasn't any worse than Collingwood or WCE's, they had players ready to fill the gap. Carltons next line of players were injured also.

But there is no excuse for those insipid performances against Port, GC, even the 10 goal (should've been 20 goal) loss against Hawthorn, 10 goal loss against the Roos. I'll grant Adelaide/Essendon games were horrid with the players that went down.

But yeah, some players really need a kick up the arse. I saw Juddy won the time trial. Would've been nice if Gibbs put it on himself to have a crack and become the best over the off-season. Ah well.

 

[Wayne Arnold]

Mate you didn't make a point, you attached your self to a sporting club and acted like you have have glory from it and that your opinion matters. It doesn't you don't count mate at all, sorry but thems the facts. I'm not saying i count or anyone here we don't but at least i don't claim some glory that my club has or in yr case hasn't even got. Your team should have been playing for a flag but because your president fell in love with a bad idea you sacked the best coach in the league for a bloke who could be the greatest of all tiem or just another coach. In the end sacking Micky has cost 2 chances at a flag.

Sun bake away in yr glory my friend.

I think you may lack comprehension skills. My post was indicating that you ain't in a position to attack other clubs considering the position of your own. Was not basing my own personal worth on the success of my football club. All you seem to do is attack the man in every thread if there is something you disagree with or don't like.

Anway, speaking of Mick, a lot of assistant coaches and ex-players were pretty keen to work with him. Enjoy the Green Machine, as I'm sure every other club was in a rush to obtain his services.

 

[BM123]

Yeah gotta say the problems with Carlton's season went far beyond injuries I thought.

Since you decided to not elaborate how about I do it for you?

Below is a list of a few things in non-chronological that smashed Carlton's season into fine inhaleable dust ( Not recommended would probably caused severe migraines and excessive sweating).

Rucks

Carlton as we all know has three rucks which would one could argue could say with not undeserved confidence is more then enough to last a year. Well in Carlton's case that would QUITE wrong since we had Kreuzer getting his knee drained after almost every game(still smashed Jolly twice so suck eggs Collingwood) and Warnock( Rioli chicken wing that went unnoticed by everyone except a few observant Carlton supporters ( I wasn't one of them and only noticed it when I got shown in a video on the Carlton board since it was done quickly but subtlely) but I guess Judd is a just a gloriously evil bastard who not ONLY kicks puppies but eats them and their mother as well ..... along with poor uncoordinated but unlucky Hampson who timed his leap amazingly badly as he for whatever reason tried to leap on to Dane Swan for support but his unappropriate girth (cheers Collingwood + Jesters pies I would presume) but your team managed to injure Simpson and Hampson in the same game. So Swan's back or high enough was not solid enough for Hampson to bounce off and have enough time to land properly. So his knee buckled and his injured PCL kept him from playing for the rest of the season. So both ruckmen still had season ending injuries in successive weeks our injuries were so common that even Simpson had his run of games of games ended by Wellingham who even I had thought was quite likeable up to that point with an unecessary hit.

Our backline was decimated with Jamison and Henderson both struggling with injuries as Jamison managed to injure himself several times in the preseason and actual season. Later on the year Jamison's last injury was against Sydney in the third quarter and Mcinnes in the Gold Coast game early on and our forward line injuries were laughable literally had to play Andrew Walker as full forward with Nick Duigan as a defender playing his 2nd game up forward as our heroic CHF against North. The joke was that Andrew Walker managed to injure his calf early in the first quarter which left us with Nick Duigan as our only medium size make-shift forward.



Ratten had also decided to play Marc Murphy back from injury four weeks against North before he was estimated to return. Murphy played the rest of the season but you could tell he was very aware of its fragility with the most noticeable incident when he avoided possible contact with it when he was on low on the ground against a oncoming Essendon player running in for the ball early in the first quarter. Murphy still dominated against Essendon because they were playing soft but also very poor footy, sides in better form such as Gold Coast and Sydney were well aware of this year and fear prevented him from playing the sort of footy that got him injured by going in hard against Dangerfield who is unforunately made of sort of stone like material. Chris Judd aside from getting suspended also was playing sore for most of the season which was partly due to Ratten trying to play him inside too often when he most biggest impact on the game happens when he is on the outside.



We lost Carazzo ( our best inside mid and tagger), Yarran ( needed run off half-back and would struggle with fitness for the rest of the season he played) and Laidler ( this what killed us defensively as Laidler allowed players like Jamison and Henderson to spoil and move off their man which was lost by his injury. Sadly for Carlton this all happened in the exact same game but we made up for Essendon boasting how they were supposely just better then us by smashing them by 96 points later on. The funniest thing was Essendon fans talking about how great and tough Lonergan was and some even gloating about his rank tackle on Carazzo when he ended up getting delisted this year in a real life example of karma like retribution. Unforunately the damage to our season was beyond repair but it is still frustrating to look at all our close games that we could have won if Carazzo, Laidler and Yarran were playing fit. In particular Marc Murphy injury alone would have enough for us to probably beat Geelong who managed to overrun us once Warnock's 2nd injury allowed Geelong back into the game.


But Ratten still got sacked since A) we are Carlton and therefore sack-happy but it was justified because B) we had no structure or noticeable solutions this year and Ratten played quite a few players when they were injured. Bringing Laidler back only for him to get injured again was tremendously stupid He had favourites too which is why only Ratten thought playing someone as thin as Bootsma against teams like Geelong and Hawthorn was a good idea. Continuing to play Garlett and Jordan Russell for far too long and ignoring Bret Thornton in favor of Duigan as a chf? Ratten's flaw was also a bad tendancy to think whatever worked last week would work against a totally different team which is why the club decided to move him on. Our gameplan was actually so simple that it got worked out in three rounds and Ratten couldn't adapt which lead to a loss of team confidence especially after our shit performance against GWS which was helped by resting Judd and Waite for some reason six weeks into the season . Ironically Waite would injure himself for the majority of the season the very next game against St Kilda which would led to him getting dominated by Blake Bray after been rested the week before . Our gameplan getting worked out was sort of similiar to how Carlton showed how to beat Collingwood ( tag Shaw and Maxwell to prevent Collingwood from moving the ball quickly enough from the defensive fifty to play effective corridor footy) which was exploited by several other teams such as North and Hawthorn in later weeks.

To be honest I am only tipping the iceberg on all the crap that hit us this year but I don't want to continue on forever lets just say it was a bad year.

 

[chunkylover53]

Blues_man123, so it's Rattens + injuries fault.. So everyone except the players? Sorry but I disagree.

 

[BM123]

I just thought Carlton's best 22 injury list wasn't any worse than Collingwood or WCE's, they had players ready to fill the gap. Carltons next line of players were injured also.

But there is no excuse for those insipid performances against Port, GC, even the 10 goal (should've been 20 goal) loss against Hawthorn, 10 goal loss against the Roos. I'll grant Adelaide/Essendon games were horrid with the players that went down.

But yeah, some players really need a kick up the arse. I saw Juddy won the time trial. Would've been nice if Gibbs put it on himself to have a crack and become the best over the off-season. Ah well.

Our injury list was worse then Collingwoods ( didn't even lose Cloke or Reid for long as we lost Jamison/Henderson) but probably very similiar to WCE in terms of quality and time of who we lost. We don't exactly have our own patersons stadium house of pain advantage over the competition though. WC and Collingwood both had bad performances against other teams they were expected to be competitive against. Collingwood lost to North, Carlton X2, Hawthorn times 3 with all of these losses been rather insipid with one of those games even a bigger loss then what Carlton experienced against Hawthorn with Collingwood having there best mids playing against Hawthorn ( who had no buddy playing) while we were missing Marc Murphy and playing three rucks due to our lack of a forward line. Collingwood also played like complete crap against WC while Carlton were at least competitive for more then one quarter of the game with Judd playing like absolute crap anyway. Even Jordan Lewis kicked five goals against Collingwood so they sure had similiar experiences of playing like absolute crap too. WC got smashed by Adelaide and by Sydney who even Carlton without Judd playing for us gave more of a fight against. If we are so bad how did we manage to give Collingwood two spankings in the same year?

Yeah Gibbs was too sick to even compete so he basically spent the entire event talking to Malthouse so maybe you should be more informed when you start using the whole Gibbs is underperforming ( Because its not like he wasn't played out of position and we didn't already know this already ) generic response to anything about Carlton.

 

[Monkey King]

In other words, no wins against Top 4 sides the last two years except for Collingwood.

Except this, except that, the last two years, blah blah, blah blah. Clause A, clause B. Sorry pal. Over the last few years we've had some good performances against top four sides that have resulted in wins, others that haven't resulted in wins and definitely some poor performances to go with them. We have proven that we can match it with top four teams, just not consistently, which I've already conceded has been an issue for this team under Ratten. You can keep trotting out the same tired old line, I just think it makes you a poor judge of football.

 

[chunkylover53]

Our injury list was worse then Collingwoods ( didn't even lose Cloke or Reid for long as we lost Jamison/Henderson) but probably very similiar to WCE in terms of quality and time of who we lost. We don't exactly have our own patersons stadium house of pain advantage over the competition though. WC and Collingwood both had bad performances against other teams they were expected to be competitive against. Collingwood lost to North, Carlton X2, Hawthorn times 3 with all of these losses been rather insipid with one of those games even a bigger loss then what Carlton experienced against Hawthorn with Collingwood having there best mids playing against Hawthorn ( who had no buddy playing) while we were missing Marc Murphy and playing three rucks due to our lack of a forward line. Collingwood also played like complete crap against WC while Carlton were at least competitive for more then one quarter of the game with Judd playing like absolute crap anyway. Even Jordan Lewis kicked five goals against Collingwood so they sure had similiar experiences of playing like absolute crap too. WC got smashed by Adelaide and by Sydney who even Carlton without Judd playing for us gave more of a fight against. If we are so bad how did we manage to give Collingwood two spankings in the same year?

Yeah Gibbs was too sick to even compete so he basically spent the entire event talking to Malthouse so maybe you should be more informed when you start using the whole Gibbs is underperforming ( Because its not like he wasn't played out of position and we didn't already know this already ) generic response to anything about Carlton.

Jeez you're touchy mate.

My mistake about Gibbs being too sick to compete. Didn't realise, don't care if he was playing out of position, he was uninterested all year. You're getting paid big money to fill a spot for your injured mates, you do the job. I never said Carlton were 'so bad', and I never said WC and Collingwood didn't have bad performances, they had some shockers.

There's obviously no convincing you that injuries and Ratten weren't entirely to blame for the horrendous season. And I never said that Collingwoods injury list was worse than Carltons. I said from the best 22 missing, Collingwood/Carlton/WCE were on par. Carlton's depth players were all injured though, Collingwoods weren't, which is where people get confused.

 

[forwardflanker]

Since you decided to not elaborate how about I do it for you?

Below is a list of a few things in non-chronological that smashed Carlton's season into fine inhaleable dust ( Not recommended would probably caused severe migraines and excessive sweating).

Rucks

Carlton as we all know has three rucks which would one could argue could say with not undeserved confidence is more then enough to last a year. Well in Carlton's case that would QUITE wrong since we had Kreuzer getting his knee drained after almost every game(still smashed Jolly twice so suck eggs Collingwood) and Warnock( Rioli chicken wing that went unnoticed by everyone except a few observant Carlton supporters ( I wasn't one of them and only noticed it when I got shown in a video on the Carlton board since it was done quickly but subtlely) but I guess Judd is a just a gloriously evil bastard who not ONLY kicks puppies but eats them and their mother as well ..... along with poor uncoordinated but unlucky Hampson who timed his leap amazingly badly as he for whatever reason tried to leap on to Dane Swan for support but his unappropriate girth (cheers Collingwood + Jesters pies I would presume) but your team managed to injure Simpson and Hampson in the same game. So Swan's back or high enough was not solid enough for Hampson to bounce off and have enough time to land properly. So his knee buckled and his injured PCL kept him from playing for the rest of the season. So both ruckmen still had season ending injuries in successive weeks our injuries were so common that even Simpson had his run of games of games ended by Wellingham who even I had thought was quite likeable up to that point with an unecessary hit.

Our backline was decimated with Jamison and Henderson both struggling with injuries as Jamison managed to injure himself several times in the preseason and actual season. Later on the year Jamison's last injury was against Sydney in the third quarter and Mcinnes in the Gold Coast game early on and our forward line injuries were laughable literally had to play Andrew Walker as full forward with Nick Duigan as a defender playing his 2nd game up forward as our heroic CHF against North. The joke was that Andrew Walker managed to injure his calf early in the first quarter which left us with Nick Duigan as our only medium size make-shift forward.



Ratten had also decided to play Marc Murphy back from injury four weeks against North before he was estimated to return. Murphy played the rest of the season but you could tell he was very aware of its fragility with the most noticeable incident when he avoided possible contact with it when he was on low on the ground against a oncoming Essendon player running in for the ball early in the first quarter. Murphy still dominated against Essendon because they were playing soft but also very poor footy, sides in better form such as Gold Coast and Sydney were well aware of this year and fear prevented him from playing the sort of footy that got him injured by going in hard against Dangerfield who is unforunately made of sort of stone like material. Chris Judd aside from getting suspended also was playing sore for most of the season which was partly due to Ratten trying to play him inside too often when he most biggest impact on the game happens when he is on the outside.



We lost Carazzo ( our best inside mid and tagger), Yarran ( needed run off half-back and would struggle with fitness for the rest of the season he played) and Laidler ( this what killed us defensively as Laidler allowed players like Jamison and Henderson to spoil and move off their man which was lost by his injury. Sadly for Carlton this all happened in the exact same game but we made up for Essendon boasting how they were supposely just better then us by smashing them by 96 points later on. The funniest thing was Essendon fans talking about how great and tough Lonergan was and some even gloating about his rank tackle on Carazzo when he ended up getting delisted this year in a real life example of karma like retribution.Unforunately the damage to our season was beyond repair but it is still frustrating to look at all our close games that we could have won if Carazzo, Laidler and Yarran were playing fit. In particular Marc Murphy injury alone would have enough for us to probably beat Geelong who managed to overrun us once Warnock's 2nd injury allowed Geelong back into the game.


But Ratten still got sacked since A) we are Carlton and therefore sack-happy but it was justified because B) we had no structure or noticeable solutions this year and Ratten played quite a few players when they were injured. Bringing Laidler back only for him to get injured again was tremendously stupid He had favourites too which is why only Ratten thought playing someone as thin as Bootsma against teams like Geelong and Hawthorn was a good idea. Continuing to play Garlett and Jordan Russell for far too long and ignoring Bret Thornton in favor of Duigan as a chf? Ratten's flaw was also a bad tendancy to think whatever worked last week would work against a totally different team which is why the club decided to move him on. Our gameplan was actually so simple that it got worked out in three rounds and Ratten couldn't adapt which lead to a loss of team confidence especially after our shit performance against GWS which was helped by resting Judd and Waite for some reason six weeks into the season . Ironically Waite would injure himself for the majority of the season the very next game against St Kilda which would led to him getting dominated by Blake Bray after been rested the week before . Our gameplan getting worked out was sort of similiar to how Carlton showed how to beat Collingwood ( tag Shaw and Maxwell to prevent Collingwood from moving the ball quickly enough from the defensive fifty to play effective corridor footy) which was exploited by several other teams such as North and Hawthorn in later weeks.

To be honest I am only tipping the iceberg on all the crap that hit us this year but I don't want to continue on forever lets just say it was a bad year.

congratulations for making the longest list of pathetic excuses itt.

When are Carlton going to wake up and accept that they just aren't good enough? How long can they justify rolling out the same old excuses year in year out? When is the "quick fix" going to be abandoned for long term objectives that breed a winning culture and foster success? Are Carlton no longer one of Melbourne's elite sporting clubs?

Discuss

 

[chunkylover53]

Can never tell if Wayne Arnold is taking the piss when he likes my posts.

 

[BM123]

Blues_man123, so it's Rattens + injuries fault.. So everyone except the players? Sorry but I disagree.

Hard to play well when you are getting outcoached almost every single game. Honestly the key to beating Carlton this year was simply creating congestion and having more numbers at stoppages to nullify our midfield. It took Ratten and his coaching department at three quarters of our season to put two players on the defensive side for him to fix that issue at which point our season was over and the players confidence lost. Never would have lost to Saints or Essendon if he had solved that issue early enough. Our midfield actually broke even statistically in a lot of games we got completely smashed on the scoreboard because the midfield was simply trying to kick long to Eddie Betts over the top due to coaching instructions. Huge amount of games where Carlton would dominate huge periods of general play but we either lacked the tall timber due to injury along with proper forward structure and defensive set up to prevent teams scoring too easily. Carlton vs Sydney is a good example considering you seem to think that Carlton would have gotten smashed by the Swans from your reasoning. We were competitive in general play unlike other teams who finished outside the eight but our lack of structure resulted in it been too easy to score against us. Seems odd that we can lose to Sydney by a similiar margin to what we lost to GC by because our structures and player selection were always crap.

Players underperforming generally happens when the coach is too as well. Ratten only put Gibbs in the midfield after our season was pretty much unsalvagable and unsurprisingly our performances improved due to having someone of Gibbs talent in instead of a Ellard running around. Sydney, Geelong and Adelaide are three examples in just the few years of teams that underperformed. Adelaide is a nice example with players like Patrick Dangerfield not having the output one would expect of him solely in the forward line until the new coach put him in the midfield. We were very unlucky this year but maybe you don't understand that even in Ratten's last game we had Judd and Yarran both injured against St Kilda to finish the season off nicely. The players were trying very hard to get the win but injuries prevented it from happening in the end like it did many times this year. Plenty of games Carlton would have probably won if it wasn't for injuries only so its unfair to blame players when the interchange bench is smaller then the oppositions. Hard to match the opposition when you have half the rest they do in the game. We didn't fire a coach because it was fun to do so and I doubt Ratten would be fired with a year left on his contract if people thought he was capable of improving our inconsistency.

 

[Monkey King]

I am not trying to make this a pissing contest just point out that your assertion that Collingwoods form trended along with our injury situation. It didn't.

I don't really agree formwise, but in terms of win-loss you're right.

It is illustrative in a way that you describe the "injury crisis" as beginning before round 1. Despite the best football your club has player in well over a decade you were already in "injury crisis". It's too easy an escape and excuse.

Not usually like you to twist words like this, but there you go. My use of the term "injury crisis" relates to the season as a whole ... and when looked at in retrospect as a whole, it began before round one. Never said we were in an injury crisis before round one and also clarified this by saying it was continued injuries to key players further down the track that exacerbated the situation. Your eagerness to point the finger has got in the way of your usual tendency to good sense.

Injuries played a factor in Carlons 2012 season but they can't explain away those early season losses. If you were satisfied that the Essendon, St Kilda, Adelaide and Port losses can be explained away by injury you are easily pleased. Then again having been down for so long does lead to such thinking. It's a long way away from the "We're Carlton F-ck the rest mentality" your mob once aspired to.

Where's my slice of lemon Serge? You're on a roll with this tonight. I'm not explaining anything away, rather pointing out that anyone discounting the toll of injuries to Carlton's performance in 2012 would be missing a significant contributing factor. Nor have I ever claimed that losses were wholly and solely due to injury. You're taking a fair bit of liberty here mate. You keep going on about Adelaide, but they were a top side in 2012 and Carlton were matching them before Murphy went down in the second quarter. And Hendo got injured in that game too. If you can't recognise how significantly injuries like that, in-game, impact team performance, then I've overrated your nous.

We were jumped by Essendon, granted ... already said I agreed with you. Same with the Saints, which I've agreed with you and even said I predicted due to reasons beyond injury. Adelaide, you're wrong on that count, but can't admit it and Port was an abomination ... worst I've seen Carlton play since the dark days last decade; but still I doubt it would have occurred if our best 22 was in the park. So that's 2 unexpected losses with standard to poor levels of injury to key players and Carlton were top 4 at that stage with the best percentage in the league. I don't even get the point you're trying to make here beyond reaching for something to argue

 

[Monkey King]

Can never tell if Wayne Arnold is taking the piss when he likes my posts.

I just assume he's taking the piss all the time. My favourite Collingwood poster

 

[Monkey King]

Ratten's flaw was also a bad tendancy to think whatever worked last week would work against a totally different team which is why the club decided to move him on.

I've actually been a defender of Ratten, but this point is one of a couple of things this year that had me second guessing my belief in him growing into the job. I said it to my brother, if Duigan lines up in the same role again next week, you know Ratten is simply out of ideas. And look what happened.

 

[BM123]

congratulations for making the longest list of pathetic excuses itt.

When are Carlton going to wake up and accept that they just aren't good enough? How long can they justify rolling out the same old excuses year in year out? When is the "quick fix" going to be abandoned for long term objectives that breed a winning culture and foster success? Are Carlton no longer one of Melbourne's elite sporting clubs?

Discuss

You couldn't really disagree with what I said and your ignorance of anything involving Carlton meant you had to make another generic bigfooty response is what you meant to say? My post was fairly reasonable except for its length and honestly you act like this was the first year in a teams history that they have underperformed. Collingwood used to be the competitions loser and everyone used to laugh at the colliwobbles but I guess that just never happened in your world. It is kind of ironic when Collingwood supporters still troll Carlton when your team literally has a huge stretch of just pure fail in its history.

We had Ratten from 2007 to 2012 and he delivered us fairly little so we hardly are going for a quick fix solution. That is five years without making a preliminary. Collingwood have won 2 flags in 40 years so may I ask where this culture of success is that allows you to somehow bag a team that is technically more succesful then you are? Your not a Geelong supporter but you act like your team is currently in the middle of a dynasty? You also know that our 16 flags is still more then what Collingwood has and Carlton even decided to implode to give Collingwood a chance to catch up. Alas it wasn't until Malthouse was given a extra week from the drawn grand final that he could fix the expected ****-ups of Collingwood players that suddenly appear on grand final day to the surprise of almost everyone who has coached Collingwood.

 

[Monkey King]

When are Carlton going to wake up and accept that they just aren't good enough?

Top assessment from a deep football thinker

 

[BM123]

I just assume he's taking the piss all the time. My favourite Collingwood poster

Very subtle but often generates good dicussion at the same time.

 

[forwardflanker]

You couldn't really disagree with what I said and your ignorance of anything involving Carlton meant you had to make another generic bigfooty response is what you meant to say?

You got the standard generic bigfooty response because your painfully long post basically plagiarized all its excuses from other Carlton posts in this thread. Honestly you offered nothing different to the 20 odd excuses that monkeyking has given us itt, why waste your time making such a long post.

For all Carlton supporters, this is not the thread for making excuses. We're looking for solutions to a very serious problem here. If you want to make excuses either restrict them to your own board, or even better email them Optus Oval where they will happily accept them.

 

[Gone Critical]

I don't really agree formwise, but in terms of win-loss you're right.

Why not formwise? Round 4-14 for mine was clearly Collingwoods best form run for the year as well as 10 wins on the trot. It coincided with our injury run being at its worst. When did you see our form being at its best?

Where's my slice of lemon Serge? You're on a roll with this tonight. I'm not explaining anything away, rather pointing out that anyone discounting the toll of injuries to Carlton's performance in 2012 would be missing a significant contributing factor. Nor have I ever claimed that losses were wholly and solely due to injury. You're taking a fair bit of liberty here mate. You keep going on about Adelaide, but they were a top side in 2012 and Carlton were matching them before Murphy went down in the second quarter. And Hendo got injured in that game too. If you can't recognise how significantly injuries like that, in-game, impact team performance, then I've overrated your nous.

We were jumped by Essendon, granted ... already said I agreed with you. Same with the Saints, which I've agreed with you and even said I predicted due to reasons beyond injury. Adelaide, you're wrong on that count, but can't admit it and Port was an abomination ... worst I've seen Carlton play since the dark days last decade; but still I doubt it would have occurred if our best 22 was in the park. So that's 2 unexpected losses with standard to poor levels of injury to key players and Carlton were top 4 at that stage with the best percentage in the league. I don't even get the point you're trying to make here beyond reaching for something to argue

My point is it's too easy to blame injuies. You will recall Collingwoods clash v Carlton in round 3. You spanked us fair and square. However if I wanted to play the injury excuse I could say we were coming off a 2 day shorter break, Carlton jumped us but we came back and by 15 mins into the 2nd Q we had the difference back to 9 points. Pity Ben Reid got subbed out in the 1st min of the 2nd Q and nd then Luke Ball did his ACL just as we got close to being back on terms. From there we fell away because of the injuries. Easy to bury the loss in such terms.

However I was at that match and Carlton were on fire. They systematically pulled us apart and exposed us particularly with their pace. We didn't lose that match because of injuries to Ball and Reid. Buckley was very up front about that after the match. We were beaten by a better team on the night.

It's very similar to the Carlton matches against Ess, St K, Adel and Port. Injuries were there but they were not the reason you lost to teams you expected to be inferior to yourselves. It was too many bad losses early in the season and it's something MM will be addressing very closely IMHO

 

[brett15]

Losing Carazzo was the biggest injury hit, then Murphy, but beyond those two injuries can't be used as an excuse to explain why the team capitulated after their loss to Essendon.

 

[jasonwilde]

Mate you didn't make a point, you attached your self to a sporting club and acted like you have have glory from it and that your opinion matters. It doesn't you don't count mate at all, sorry but thems the facts. I'm not saying i count or anyone here we don't but at least i don't claim some glory that my club has or in yr case hasn't even got. Your team should have been playing for a flag but because your president fell in love with a bad idea you sacked the best coach in the league for a bloke who could be the greatest of all tiem or just another coach. In the end sacking Micky has cost 2 chances at a flag.

Sun bake away in yr glory my friend.

Vale the English language...

 

[jasonwilde]

Yeah gotta say the problems with Carlton's season went far beyond injuries I thought.

Not according to their supporters. FFS have you not been reading this thread?