Why hasnt there been more pressure on st kilda over the years?

Kwality

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Aug 14, 2011
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You just want to kill off Vic clubs because you have a giant chip on your shoulder about being West Australian.
I live in Melbourne by choice, ask my wife ...

We'll never have a fair comp until we get rid of a couple more Melbourne teams.

both the Suns & GWS should have kicked off with a couple of Melbourne clubs being stripped of their licences & new clubs started - there are too many ploddrs in the AFL playing pool, wasnt there 96 blokes delisted this year (including retirements) - if your go is 2nd tier footy go to the VFL/WAFL etc ...
 

Gavin Excell

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Apr 22, 2007
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Lol what? Heard of the likes of Chris Judd, Jobe Watson and Josh Kennedy?

The Sandringham Dragons are arguably the strongest underage football side in the country.

If it was still VFL zones, St Kilda would of dominated the last 2 decades.

Bayside Melbourne is probably the strongest area of metro melbourne in football terms, especially with the cross over of the Dandenong Stingrays and Oakleigh Chargers in parts.

The last decade alone:


View attachment 794440
It’s a good point on Zones. Sandy and Oakleigh are huge contributors talented kids last 10 years
 

Gavin Excell

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Apr 22, 2007
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I live in Melbourne by choice, ask my wife ...

We'll never have a fair comp until we get rid of a couple more Melbourne teams.

both the Suns & GWS should have kicked off with a couple of Melbourne clubs being stripped of their licences & new clubs started - there are too many ploddrs in the AFL playing pool, wasnt there 96 blokes delisted this year (including retirements) - if your go is 2nd tier footy go to the VFL/WAFL etc ...
By choice?

I live here by necessity.
Melbourne not the place it was 20 years ago
 

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Freomaniac

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This mentality is so ******* stupid.
I am suprised Moorabbin oval hasnt been upgraded for AFL games. Theres been millions of dollars poured into the ground for various reasons.



Agreed, but if you look at hawthorn’s base membership from 1997-2007 it was much higher then St Kilda’s.

Between 1997 and 2007 Hawthorn’s average membership was 29,835 (low 26,879, high 33,319) whilst the Saints was 24,305 (low 16,510, high 32,337)

In fact during that time period the Saints had more finals appearances (12 v 6), GF appearances (1 v 0) and finals victories (6 v 3)

Go back to 1984 and the Saints have only had 4 seasons (out of 36) where they have had more members then Hawthorn (1993/94, 1996 and 2005).

And unlike Collingwood (32,459 to 41,128 (2002/03) and 57,617 to 72,688 (2010/11)), Richmond (72,669 to 103,358 (2017/19) and Hawthorn (41,436 to 52,496 (2008/09) and 60,841 to 75,351 (2012/15) St Kilda did not enjoy a major bounce during their years in Grand Finals (membership just tipped 40,000 when the major clubs were all drawing 50,000, 60,000 and 70,000 members

I wouldn’t draw to many conclusions from finals attendances, the Hawthorn v W Bulldogs Semi Final in 2016 drew 89,000 but the Dogs didn’t emerge as a power house club even with the 2016 flag

That 2016 Grand Final has to go down as one of the most lopsided / one sided Grand Final crowds in history

If you look at Melbourne based finals crowds over the last 5-7 years we are in a golden age for MCG crowds in September
Seems like a typical Bandwagon effect.

Teams plays finals, more people rock up.

Again, look at the Demons. back in 2012 and 2013 Mark Neeld nearly killed off what was left of the demons fan base. Come the 2018 finals series, casual demons fans rock up.

Freo is another example. Back in 2000 and 2001, freo struggled to get 10,000 at a 20,000 seat WACA ground. They eventually moved to Subiaco full time just after. In 2004, the crowds went up to 25-30,000 fresh off the first final in 2003.

Then in 2007, freo was averaging 37,000 in a 43,500 subiaco oval fresh off the 2006 prelim final.


It’s not just the sponsorship you have 10,000 members in Tasmania if you loose your deal I imagine you would loose the majority of those members that’s a lot to loose it’s no coincidence that Kennett has been coming out in the press recently trying to suck up the tas governments arse he desperately wants to hold onto the deal!
Im curious what your deal was with Tassie from 2002-6. You guys got burnt in the end once the local tassie population realized your team was only there because of the Government cash.

From what I heard, Saints were getting $750,000 a game. 4 games a year equals 3 million a year. I dont blame the saints playing games there if docklands stadium rent is high.

North Play a couple of games a year in tassie as well now.
 

Elmer_Judd

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Jul 25, 2019
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I live in Melbourne by choice, ask my wife ...

We'll never have a fair comp until we get rid of a couple more Melbourne teams.

both the Suns & GWS should have kicked off with a couple of Melbourne clubs being stripped of their licences & new clubs started - there are too many ploddrs in the AFL playing pool, wasnt there 96 blokes delisted this year (including retirements) - if your go is 2nd tier footy go to the VFL/WAFL etc ...
What gives you the right to decide which original Melbourne based clubs who have been around for well over a century, to be kicked out of the league, its this kind of arrogance which puts people off interstate clubs.

If ever the Day comes where the league decides to operate in such a ruthless and heartless way like you are suggesting, I will walk away from the league for good.

With the inclusion of Gold Coast and The Giants, the talent pool will eventually increase, in more catchment years, but it is always going to take at least 20 years.
 

Freomaniac

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By choice?

I live here by necessity.
Melbourne not the place it was 20 years ago
So is melbourne better or worse than what it was 20 years ago?

I live in SA. Nothing much has happened in the last 10-15 years to be honest.

Meh if you got a full time job and paying off a mortgage, regardless on what city you live, I think your doing ok.

Sydneys and Perths Property prices are insane.

Imagine being on $1000 a week or $52,000 a year paying for a $650,000 mortgage over 25 years? Sure if you keep your house for 10-12 years and Sell the house for double what its worth then well done.
 

Forward Press

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Jul 5, 2011
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Although I don't agree with the tone of Kwality's posts in general, I don't think tradition should necessarily justify saving clubs at all costs.

Like it or not the AFL is all about the money and if a club (Victorian or interstate) keeps requiring tens of millions of dollars a year to survive, and it's been like that for a decade or more, it's justifiable to ask why the AFL aren't cutting their losses. GWS and GC at least have assisted in building support at the grassroots level in NSW and Queensland - St Kilda (for example) have sold games to NZ and are now playing in China. I think they should stay but if they are battling on and off-field in 2025 I think it's fair to debate.
 

Gavin Excell

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Apr 22, 2007
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So is melbourne better or worse than what it was 20 years ago?

I live in SA. Nothing much has happened in the last 10-15 years to be honest.

Meh if you got a full time job and paying off a mortgage, regardless on what city you live, I think your doing ok.

Sydneys and Perths Property prices are insane.

Imagine being on $1000 a week or $52,000 a year paying for a $650,000 mortgage over 25 years? Sure if you keep your house for 10-12 years and Sell the house for double what its worth then well done.
Young people may find it exciting and dynamic

As an older chap I find it overcrowded, difficult to get around, expensive
 

Freomaniac

Brownlow Medallist
May 3, 2007
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I live in Melbourne by choice, ask my wife ...

We'll never have a fair comp until we get rid of a couple more Melbourne teams.

both the Suns & GWS should have kicked off with a couple of Melbourne clubs being stripped of their licences & new clubs started - there are too many ploddrs in the AFL playing pool, wasnt there 96 blokes delisted this year (including retirements) - if your go is 2nd tier footy go to the VFL/WAFL etc ...
Although I don't agree with the tone of Kwality's posts in general, I don't think tradition should necessarily justify saving clubs at all costs.

Like it or not the AFL is all about the money and if a club (Victorian or interstate) keeps requiring tens of millions of dollars a year to survive, and it's been like that for a decade or more, it's justifiable to ask why the AFL aren't cutting their losses. GWS and GC at least have assisted in building support at the grassroots level in NSW and Queensland - St Kilda (for example) have sold games to NZ and are now playing in China. I think they should stay but if they are battling on and off-field in 2025 I think it's fair to debate.
well some eagles fans want the Freo dockers to be killed off.

And thought.....

why get rid of 2 certain wins each year? And deprived your team one less game to travel?

Yet Eagles fans are also against having a 3rd team in WA.

Eagles will get 4 certain wins each year. If its a 22 game comp, eagles will only travel out side of WA 9 times a year.
 

Forward Press

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well some eagles fans want the Freo dockers to be killed off.

And thought.....

why get rid of 2 certain wins each year? And deprived your team one less game to travel?

Yet Eagles fans are also against having a 3rd team in WA.

Eagles will get 4 certain wins each year. If its a 22 game comp, eagles will only travel out side of WA 9 times a year.
Didn't even mention Fremantle in my post and no one seriously thinks Freo should fold, it's not always about you mate.
 

Freomaniac

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Didn't even mention Fremantle in my post and no one seriously thinks Freo should fold, it's not always about you mate.
who said I mentioned you would think about it?

Port was losing 2-3 million a year from 2008-2011 then lost 6 million in 2012.

Point was back in 2001, freos future was in doubt after being 8 million in debt.
 

Forward Press

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who said I mentioned you would think about it?

Port was losing 2-3 million a year from 2008-2011 then lost 6 million in 2012.

Point was back in 2001, freos future was in doubt after being 8 million in debt.
And if Port and Freo continued losing millions every year for a decade questions would rightly be asked as to what value they added to the competition.

But this topic isn't about them anyway.
 

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Freomaniac

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And if Port and Freo continued losing millions every year for a decade questions would rightly be asked as to what value they added to the competition.

But this topic isn't about them anyway.
Point is Both port and freo turned it around.

i half expected the saints to do the same thing.
 

NeXus Nick

Team Captain
Jan 28, 2014
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The AFL in 2050 will comprise the following teams.....

Melbourne Kangaroos
Geelong Bulldogs
St Kilda Saints
Richmond Tigers
Collingwood Magpies
Hawthorn Hawks
Carlton Blues
Essendon Bombers

West Coast Eagles
Fremantle Dockers
Swan Districts
Peel Thunder

Adelaide Crows
Port Adelaide Power
Sturt Double Blues

Sydney Swans
Greater Western Sydney Giants

Brisbane Lions
Gold Coast Suns

Tasmania Devils
 

fumbler

Pick 54: Big Onions
Jun 28, 2012
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The AFL in 2050 will comprise the following teams.....

Melbourne Kangaroos
Geelong Bulldogs
St Kilda Saints
Richmond Tigers
Collingwood Magpies
Hawthorn Hawks
Carlton Blues
Essendon Bombers

West Coast Eagles
Fremantle Dockers
Swan Districts
Peel Thunder

Adelaide Crows
Port Adelaide Power
Sturt Double Blues

Sydney Swans
Greater Western Sydney Giants

Brisbane Lions
Gold Coast Suns

Tasmania Devils
Low paid comedian?
 

Freomaniac

Brownlow Medallist
May 3, 2007
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It’s not just the sponsorship you have 10,000 members in Tasmania if you loose your deal I imagine you would loose the majority of those members that’s a lot to loose it’s no coincidence that Kennett has been coming out in the press recently trying to suck up the tas governments arse he desperately wants to hold onto the deal!
which surprised me when the saints bailed out of their Tassie deal in 2006.

Each home game you got there you got $750,000 a game.

2-4 games and that's 1.5-3 million a year
 

Tasmanian saint

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Apr 24, 2018
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Yeah
which surprised me when the saints bailed out of their Tassie deal in 2006.

Each home game you got there you got $750,000 a game.

2-4 games and that's 1.5-3 million a year
Yeah it was madness buy rod butters president at the time in the two games we played in Launceston we were earning more then the other 9 home games at marvel put together there reason was we had a poor playing record in Launceston and were contending for finals was a crazy decision as st kilda naturaly has big following in Tasmania going back to the 1960 teams having a lot of locals in the team if we stuck it out I could have seen us having 15-20 thousand members in tas !
 

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