Pick 1, Give us your best offer

[Mr Magic]

FA would be years away , im not sure that comes into consideration. Its more about boosting the group rather than having a gun in one spot. Yes the would cop it , like Melb did.... but imagine having 4-6 kids in the top 30. Thats a fresh start and Car need that type of news. I doubt many other clubs could do it. Melb maybe. They have been burned by the Messiah Pick as well.

Of course it comes into consideration.

Weitering add 8 years, Carlton will not be in contention then. They should be on the way up but not near threatening IMO. So I can't see them chasing GWS youngsters for example because most going there would know they are forgoing a premiership unless very young.

Not sure what could be done.

I suppose for example RFC 2 first rounders including a possible FA compo if we lose Rance maybe even throw in McKenzie for Carlton's pick 1 if they come last. McKenzie is only playing his first year now so that is how young we are talking about IMO as an example.

I rate McKenzie and we stole him in last years draft. Don't really want to let him go but as an example McKenzie vintage is the type that could go to Carlton and still see a premiership with them. But I think if we gave McKenzie, assuming he was willing and interested as well, plus top round 1 picks for Carlton's top 1st pick we probably might something else in return for Carlton like a player or later pick

Ideally IMO instead of Carlton getting pick 1 for little benefit they would be better off getting more draft picks (top ones of course). Then they build a few draft picks GWS style so in couple of years the players and talent forms a bond and belief that it will take a while but there is enough talent and youth as a group that if they stick together once you get 3-4 really talented youngsters they feel they can forge a base for a future premiership team if they stick together. Bearing in mind Carlton probably get more pick 1's and 2's in the next 3-4 years to build a futher base on. The main thing is they develop not 1 or 2 but a core group of youngsters such that they critical mass of quantity and quality around similar ages in terms of window of opportunity makes it realistic for them to believe in the longer term a bona fide premiership victory is very achieveable. It is just harder to do with sole pick 1's over a few years IMO. Apart from that all your eggs in a few players becomes a bit riskier with injury as well as other anomalies like other opportunities they may turn to via a Boyd type play or whatever. That's why Carlton better of getting more draft picks this year then chase the pick 1's, 2's etc.. to consolidate the base. This year has a nice blend of upper end talent to IMO as well which probably suits Carlton. Of course every year may no have the absolute cream top 1 picks but Carlton should have a few years to pick from, there should be a Mills type mid or 2 coming up in the next few years as well as your key forward types to build a team around a building young talent base

 

[Mr Magic]

Unfortunately we need an elte key forward and Patton would be the only one that is half gettable.

Patton is too old for you guys and too risky IMO.

No club would pay big for Patton IMO. He is too risky in terms of further injury unless he gets lighter or changes his style which is no guarantee either.

You have to remember once Carlton get a number of good quality draft picks together that really rise. They probably will trade off Murphy, Gibbs or whatever for their last premiership chase at other clubs and Carlton will start to think about targeting younger FA targets once the draftee base form.

For example they could get Patton via FA down the track if he is permanently over the injury and playing very well assuming the window suits. It may not so Carlton might be looking at a younger Patton equivalent via FA later as their list and development dictates.

This was the trouble with what Carlton did chasing Judd. They failured to allow their list to develop and grow in their own way, driven by the abilities and will of the playing group mainly which win you GF's apart from other aspects and impatience got the better of them pushing the envelope chasing Judd so their list build was pushed all out of whack!

 

[pinot]

When he's good, he's very very good, but when he is bad he is terrible.

But when you have a squad low on talent, you need to take those punts - and Carlton have that sort of squad.

We need quality players not punts.

 

[pinot]

Patton is too old for you guys and too risky IMO.

No club would pay big for Patton IMO. He is too risky in terms of further injury unless he gets lighter or changes his style which is no guarantee either.

You have to remember once Carlton get a number of good quality draft picks together that really rise. They probably will trade off Murphy, Gibbs or whatever for their last premiership chase at other clubs and Carlton will start to think about targeting younger FA targets once the draftee base form.

For example they could get Patton via FA down the track if he is permanently over the injury and playing very well assuming the window suits. It may not so Carlton might be looking at a younger Patton equivalent via FA later as their list and development dictates.

This was the trouble with what Carlton did chasing Judd. They failured to allow their list to develop and grow in their own way, driven by the abilities and will of the playing group mainly which win you GF's apart from other aspects and impatience got the better of them pushing the envelope chasing Judd so their list build was pushed all out of whack!

Patton just turned 22 he is far from old has 10 years of football in front of him. SOS would know best.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Why trade pick 1 when there is a KPP that will be the best pick 1 in years available. I'm all for trading Gibbs, Yarran, etc but pick 1 should be off the table. Use your 2nd rounder to get another pick inside the top 15. If you end up with pick 1, 10 (ish) (Yarran/Gibbs), and 20, then head to the draft.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I could see advantages to both clubs for a deal like that.... but one issue is gws need picks for their acc kids. two rated top 10

Pick 1 could easily get both of those kids but honestly who knows. I just don't see the point from Carlton's perspective. Keep pick 1, trade your 2nd + steaknives for Patton and see if GWS bites. A Gibbs for Patton trade could be a sort of win/win.

 

[Lord_Bumfluff]

What's the purpose of this post when it's only round 8? Is Carlton tanking again?

 

[davis_756]

What's the purpose of this post when it's only round 8? Is Carlton tanking again?

its a forgone conclusion we will not win another game for the season, making it impossible for us to finish anywhere but 18th

 

[inamedthegiants]

Patton is too old for you guys and too risky IMO.

No club would pay big for Patton IMO. He is too risky in terms of further injury unless he gets lighter or changes his style which is no guarantee either.

You have to remember once Carlton get a number of good quality draft picks together that really rise. They probably will trade off Murphy, Gibbs or whatever for their last premiership chase at other clubs and Carlton will start to think about targeting younger FA targets once the draftee base form.

For example they could get Patton via FA down the track if he is permanently over the injury and playing very well assuming the window suits. It may not so Carlton might be looking at a younger Patton equivalent via FA later as their list and development dictates.

This was the trouble with what Carlton did chasing Judd. They failured to allow their list to develop and grow in their own way, driven by the abilities and will of the playing group mainly which win you GF's apart from other aspects and impatience got the better of them pushing the envelope chasing Judd so their list build was pushed all out of whack!

Also, if you were to cut open Patton's knees you'll see he bleeds orange.

He loves this club nearly as much as I do.

I'd keep him on the list forever. Regardless of his injury or risk. He is the perfect team man.

 

[SugarHealey]

What would you give up to get Pick 1 in 2015 draft?

 

[SugarHealey]

What would you give up to get Pick 1 in 2015 draft?

well you take the Pies coach & then player. maybe you need to take a Weideman as well?

And maybe sheedy could coach your guys. ratten's smiling midweek these days, off camera.

 

[Turbocat]

Also, if you were to cut open Patton's knees you'll see he bleeds orange.

He loves this club nearly as much as I do.

I'd keep him on the list forever. Regardless of his injury or risk. He is the perfect team man.

or at least till he can't play any more? Hard choice are made all the time , great clubmen can get traded

 

[Turbocat]

Pick 1 could easily get both of those kids but honestly who knows. I just don't see the point from Carlton's perspective. Keep pick 1, trade your 2nd + steaknives for Patton and see if GWS bites. A Gibbs for Patton trade could be a sort of win/win.

Luke your club and my club have shown that you do not need P1 to rebuild , to recruit , to develop... Carlton on the other hand have been a Messiah Mindset Club for as long as I can remember.. from the time they pinched Barrassi from Melb and succeeded by it , they have just thought a gun player was their solution to everything. And it worked for them so they were not wrong. But times change. In the modern era , much was made of Melbs questionable approach in some games , but Carlton too played some very questionable games in that Kruszer year. How many P1's have they had , and I still hear the reason for their current circumstance was being penalised for cheating and then losing Goddard and Wells.

For Carlton , it would be a step in a different direction ...if they could spread P1 into three very good players..it would be better than one Messiah pick . Imagine if they pick the Wietering kid and he has Patton's knee issue .. Spread the risk a bit I think is something they should consider , but to do it they would need an obvious immediate win. Few could play overs for 1 , but GWS could... and a young gun CHB in their side... just about tops it off.

 

[Silvagnis]

Pick 1 could easily get both of those kids but honestly who knows. I just don't see the point from Carlton's perspective. Keep pick 1, trade your 2nd + steaknives for Patton and see if GWS bites. A Gibbs for Patton trade could be a sort of win/win.

Patton has more question marks than Kreuzer who still played 100 games after rupturing an ACL and breaking down with foot injuries. Patton's body could put him on a similar track as Gumbleton, Koschitzke and Schwarz. No thanks.

Gibbs and Yarran shouldn't be offered up for trade. Poor suggestions in light of our idiotic whingers and the Carlton haters who mock us for Betts, Jacobs, Garlett and Kennedy. They'll play better footy than these players and Vince who cost the Demons pick 23.

Perhaps SOS could copy the Dom Tyson trade and offer up pick one and our second round pick to the Giants for an uncontracted young player and a top ten pick.

SOS won't have as many cards to play as the Giants who can afford to trade players to secure quality youth and senior players.

We'd be better off going for another value trade for an out of contract player ala Gunston, Polec, Longer, Yeo and Docherty. All were all traded for second round picks. Give or take.

 

[Tulip]

Carlton doesn't need Weideman, or whoever ends up at #1. They would be better off trading it for two picks at the bottom half of the top 10 and another one in the 20s or 30s. They need a lot of genuine talent to work with, rather than one stand out.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Carlton doesn't need Weideman, or whoever ends up at #1. They would be better off trading it for two picks at the bottom half of the top 10 and another one in the 20s or 30s. They need a lot of genuine talent to work with, rather than one stand out.

Have you seen Carlton's defence or KPP's in general? They NEED Weideman period.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Luke your club and my club have shown that you do not need P1 to rebuild , to recruit , to develop... Carlton on the other hand have been a Messiah Mindset Club for as long as I can remember.. from the time they pinched Barrassi from Melb and succeeded by it , they have just thought a gun player was their solution to everything. And it worked for them so they were not wrong. But times change. In the modern era , much was made of Melbs questionable approach in some games , but Carlton too played some very questionable games in that Kruszer year. How many P1's have they had , and I still hear the reason for their current circumstance was being penalised for cheating and then losing Goddard and Wells.

For Carlton , it would be a step in a different direction ...if they could spread P1 into three very good players..it would be better than one Messiah pick . Imagine if they pick the Wietering kid and he has Patton's knee issue .. Spread the risk a bit I think is something they should consider , but to do it they would need an obvious immediate win. Few could play overs for 1 , but GWS could... and a young gun CHB in their side... just about tops it off.

I agree that they don't need pick 1, but if they come last (and that doesn't mean tank the season away) then they MUST keep pick 1 and build from there. Their whole list has holes, you take the best kid at pick 1 and build from there. I would be looking at the pick 20 (or whatever their 2nd rounder is) an packaging it with Gibbs/Yarran/Walker/Murphy/Henderson etc and see what you can get. Sometimes you must make a hard decision as much as it hurts the club short term. Carlton need to be realistic- what players can they see playing a role in their next premiership? Write out a list, and anyone not on that list should be on the table for the right price. See if you can turn that pick 20 into 2 picks inside the top 15.

 

[inamedthegiants]

or at least till he can't play any more? Hard choice are made all the time , great clubmen can get traded

Give him a job licking membership envelopes after his done playing.

 

[TheJackal]

Carlton doesn't need Weideman, or whoever ends up at #1. They would be better off trading it for two picks at the bottom half of the top 10 and another one in the 20s or 30s. They need a lot of genuine talent to work with, rather than one stand out.

Have you seen Carlton's defence or KPP's in general? They NEED Weideman period.

Are you guys trying to say Weitering when you say Weideman?

 

[Mr Magic]

I agree that they don't need pick 1, but if they come last (and that doesn't mean tank the season away) then they MUST keep pick 1 and build from there. Their whole list has holes, you take the best kid at pick 1 and build from there. I would be looking at the pick 20 (or whatever their 2nd rounder is) an packaging it with Gibbs/Yarran/Walker/Murphy/Henderson etc and see what you can get. Sometimes you must make a hard decision as much as it hurts the club short term. Carlton need to be realistic- what players can they see playing a role in their next premiership? Write out a list, and anyone not on that list should be on the table for the right price. See if you can turn that pick 20 into 2 picks inside the top 15.

Yeah but no point building for pick 1 when there are a few more pick 1's down the track for Carlton. remember the bulk of Carlton's players have to retire shortly and most of their players will not see a premiership with Carlton. Cripps might play a premiership with Carlton but I doubt even Docherty will win a premiership at Carlton

 

[Mr Magic]

Carlton doesn't need Weideman, or whoever ends up at #1. They would be better off trading it for two picks at the bottom half of the top 10 and another one in the 20s or 30s. They need a lot of genuine talent to work with, rather than one stand out.

Agree with that in general.

They can always chase a Patton later via FA even if he is still playing and playing well assuming they even get to the desired premiership window. Why cross a bridge until you come to it and risk other opportunities?

Anyway GWS would hardly need Weitering. Their priority obviously is Hopper, Kennedy etc.. to build the club, moral soul and fuse the whole list together with the region etc...

GWS could easily do a FA play for a Rance or equivalent so no need for them to invest heavily in a number one pick when they have other draft priorities

 

[Snow]

Name your price I want it!!

You asked gillo that really? He would say Martin, Miles, Deledio, Riewoldt, Cotchin and your first draft pick for one.

 

[Tulip]

Are you guys trying to say Weitering when you say Weideman?

Tells you how much attention I pay to the draft these days!

 

[jakson68]

What's the purpose of this post when it's only round 8? Is Carlton tanking again?

No, not this time. They really are that bad!!

 

[Mr Magic]

After seeing Weitering today dominate at CHB I don't want to give up #1 for really anything.
He'll be a supreme player at AFL level. And I've heard he's a ripping kid as well.

I think now after thinking about it you should pick him with your pick 1.

He is apparently 195cm and is not too heavy, build seems okay. The risk of injury would be very low at the outset.

Richmond, GWS or other clubs can trade for him in 2016 and suit your interests better with draft picks etc...

In fact if you give Kruzeur another year we could help you with a FA compo pick going after Kruzeur in 2016 which should be a good pick for you guys to.

You could get a heap of top draft picks next year which suits window creations for your list management and if it is a good draft year in 2016 it could be a boom for you guys! Ball is in your court then to with you holding advantage to set your destiny and prospects up