Opinion Commentary and media

[Dirty_11]

Wayne Carey obviously does not rate our youth or depth.

I have heard him say twice now that we have 23 games left to win a flag with this group.

I'm more confident than that.

I rate our depth and with some gutsy, smart recruiting and the addition of free agency, I don't see why we couldn't extend our window further

The media and big footy have this on going love affair with youth. Apparently, the lower your average age the more certain you are for future premiership success. Have a read of some of the Dogs fans posts, it's like it is now their god given right to win the flag. Players careers don't end at 30, many play their best footy at this age, the whole youth thing is a myth that grew legs with the pies 2010 flag.

 

[Jimmy's Hot Dogs]

We would've missed out on Waite and Higgins. Are you ok with that?

When looking at what the players have bought to North, the answer would be no.

However in principal, the idea of a team playing in the last two weeks if the season being further bolstered by picking at the carcasses of a bottom 4 club doesn't sit well. I'm more than happy for fair and reasonable trades to occur but I look at Lake and Frawley and wonder if it is fair?

 

[big_e]

Um, free agency isn't designed to help clubs, it's designed to help players.

 

[Liam Boy]

When looking at what the players have bought to North, the answer would be no.

However in principal, the idea of a team playing in the last two weeks if the season being further bolstered by picking at the carcasses of a bottom 4 club doesn't sit well. I'm more than happy for fair and reasonable trades to occur but I look at Lake and Frawley and wonder if it is fair?

Well, first of all, Lake wasn't a free agent. They traded a pick for him. Second, when Frawley left Melbourne, people had been saying for years how horrible it must be for him to be working so hard and playing so well in a poorly managed club where he was surrounded by nothing players, and how he should be trying to get out as soon as humanly possible. Now he does that and he dogged the club? If they wanted to retain their players they shouldn't have flushed their club culture down the toilet with all the tanking.

 

[hilly]

Well, first of all, Lake wasn't a free agent. They traded a pick for him. Second, when Frawley left Melbourne, people had been saying for years how horrible it must be for him to be working so hard and playing so well in a poorly managed club where he was surrounded by nothing players, and how he should be trying to get out as soon as humanly possible. Now he does that and he dogged the club? If they wanted to retain their players they shouldn't have flushed their club culture down the toilet with all the tanking.

Agree re: Frawley, but Lake was a year off becoming a free agent. Hawthorn got him for a song (picks 21 and 43 for Lake and 27).

 

[Liam Boy]

Agree re: Frawley, but Lake was a year off becoming a free agent. Hawthorn got him for a song (picks 21 and 43 for Lake and 27).

The Bulldogs agreed to those terms so how can you say there's any issue with that? Do you think they deserved more for a 30 year old key defender?

 

[RobZombie]

But the club that they choose to go to should be made to give up the compensation forwarded to the club they have left, not the competition. In effect last year clubs 6 gave Melbourne another pick by shifting down the draft order, those clubs had nothing to do with the transaction.

Problem with that is that it costs a top team less to pursue a FA. Even with a points system it's easy for hawthorn to justify giving up a package that includes pick 18 than a club on the fringe of the 8 to give up a pick in the 7-10 range.

I'm ok with compo picks in principle, though giving Melbourne and Carlton actual incentive to let Frawley an Kreuzer go is a bit off. Protecting ranges of picks, be it top 6, top 10 or the whole first round, would solve most of the problems. Make band 1 middle of first round regardless of position, band 2 end of first round and so on.

 

[archereleven]

Problem with that is that it costs a top team less to pursue a FA. Even with a points system it's easy for hawthorn to justify giving up a package that includes pick 18 than a club on the fringe of the 8 to give up a pick in the 7-10 range.

I'm ok with compo picks in principle, though giving Melbourne and Carlton actual incentive to let Frawley an Kreuzer go is a bit off. Protecting ranges of picks, be it top 6, top 10 or the whole first round, would solve most of the problems. Make band 1 middle of first round regardless of position, band 2 end of first round and so on.

Compo picks should never interfere with another clubs pick imo. All clubs should get there first pick in order of year before finish. jmo

 

[RobZombie]

Compo picks should never interfere with another clubs pick imo. All clubs should get there first pick in order of year before finish. jmo

Fair enough. So protect the first round. There's only ever going to be 1 or 2 band 1 FAs in any year. I personally would be less bothered by 15 becoming 17 than 5 becoming 7, but "keep the first round sacrosanct" is a fair enough position.

 

[Roosurgence]

I think the compensation system is one of the more short-sighted initiatives the AFL has brought in, and was clearly designed to mitigate the "strong teams stronger, weak teams weaker" which will always happen in any sport that has free agency, purely because players want to experience success.

But Hawthorn are a poor example. They have gained Frawley and lost Franklin through free agency, so clearly a net loss. Every other player they've gotten from another club who has contributed to their dynasty (Gunston, Hale, Gibson, Burgoyne, McEvoy, Lake) has been traded for, and they are good traders because they are prepared to give up the picks required to get deals done. They don't "stockpile talent without having to give anything up" at all.

I'm not referring to the past, I am referring to what the potential of the current system is.

Problem with that is that it costs a top team less to pursue a FA. Even with a points system it's easy for hawthorn to justify giving up a package that includes pick 18 than a club on the fringe of the 8 to give up a pick in the 7-10 range.

I'm ok with compo picks in principle, though giving Melbourne and Carlton actual incentive to let Frawley an Kreuzer go is a bit off. Protecting ranges of picks, be it top 6, top 10 or the whole first round, would solve most of the problems. Make band 1 middle of first round regardless of position, band 2 end of first round and so on.

That's why it has to be based on points, not just a blanket rule of your first pick etc. Pick 7 will have a higher value than pick 18. The AFL will be setting the compensation, so surely they can come up with something reasonable to both parties? Then the draft order is preserved.

 

[Thewlis Dish]

I'm not referring to the past, I am referring to what the potential of the current system is.

That's fine, just pointing out Hawthorn are pretty much the opposite of what you're complaining about.

 

[Contra Mundum]

Sick of the late night tossbags on SEN saying "North cannot get beyond a Prelim" - just **** OFF!!!

 

[TooUglyForFugly]

There's a reason I don't listen to the radio.

 

[archereleven]

Fair enough. So protect the first round. There's only ever going to be 1 or 2 band 1 FAs in any year. I personally would be less bothered by 15 becoming 17 than 5 becoming 7, but "keep the first round sacrosanct" is a fair enough position.

My opinion on compo picks is that they are there to bolster a list, not transform it over night. If carltank had of gotten rid of Kruezer(**** knows why they didnt!) they effectively could of gotten Schache and Wietering with their first 2 picks and had CHB and CHF stitched up for 10-12 years providing they played to potential.

Carltons first round under my proposal would be:

#1
#19 Compo
#20

If the AFL hadnt of ****ed it to start with(i know "integrity unit" lols) it would of be an even playing field from the start.

Compo picks should also be handed out based on salary offered first, times AA(very subjective) and other personal accolades.

Kreuzer should really be a 2nd round compo pick imo if he signed with another club. He just hasnt done enough to warrant a 1st. This would also force clubs/players to re sign previous 1st rounders with potential instead of getting rid of them for a rediculous pick.

 

[Mr Reliable]

Anyone hear Jonno Brown On the Couch last night? Asked who could challenge the Dawks next year he went with "West Coast of course" followed by Fremantle, Sydney, Adelaide, Richmond, Port Adelaide and Collingwood.

Unless I misheard him, he doesn't seem to rate his old mate Brad's team too highly.

 

[Kangaroos4eva]

Anyone hear Jonno Brown On the Couch last night? Asked who could challenge the Dawks next year he went with "West Coast of course" followed by Fremantle, Sydney, Adelaide, Richmond, Port Adelaide and Collingwood.

Unless I misheard him, he doesn't seem to rate his old mate Brad's team too highly.

You should see the main board, more than half the posters have us missing the 8 entirely, they never learn.

 

[Duck king Carey]

Anyone hear Jonno Brown On the Couch last night? Asked who could challenge the Dawks next year he went with "West Coast of course" followed by Fremantle, Sydney, Adelaide, Richmond, Port Adelaide and Collingwood.

Unless I misheard him, he doesn't seem to rate his old mate Brad's team too highly.

Probably forgot, too many hits to the head, I'm not sure he understands what he is saying half the time, lol Collingwood

 

[Passmore]

Anyone hear Jonno Brown On the Couch last night? Asked who could challenge the Dawks next year he went with "West Coast of course" followed by Fremantle, Sydney, Adelaide, Richmond, Port Adelaide and Collingwood.

Unless I misheard him, he doesn't seem to rate his old mate Brad's team too highly.

Whether he rates us or not, clearly he's done no homework. Adelaide improving given they have lost Dangerfield? Can't see how Richmond are going to improve, nor Freo. Collingwood and Port may improve a little, Sydney, who knows? West Coast are no guarantees to return.

 

[Rooboy 96]

Probably forgot, too many hits to the head, I'm not sure he understands what he is saying half the time, lol Collingwood

your forget, Collingwood is a prime example of a club looking down the barrel of mediocrity, and pulling itself out of it with a high performance culture of accountability. that is why they finished 8 spots below North Melbourne this year.

 

[Mr Reliable]

None of the other panellists questioned him. Gerard, Jason and Kingy. Gerard and Jason rated us in the finals, I thought. We lost so Kingy would be off our bandwagon this week.

Maybe they have to stick to the script?

 

[Roosurgence]

Um, free agency isn't designed to help bottom clubs, it's designed to help players and successful clubs.

EFA

 

[coopers pale]

I think the system needs to factor in the spots on the ladder the player is leaving FROM and going TO, where the team is required to pay additional compensation over and above the AFL offer of compensation where the club they're leaving finished greater than 4 spots on the ladder below the team they're going too, and graduating upwards. The system would make it easy for teams to trade within their range, but a top-ranked team cherry-picking off the carcass of a Melbourne or Carlton would lose some attractiveness for the club. This would only work where the deals being offered matched, or came close, Waite was offered 2 years instead of 1, for example so sits outside this.

Obviously the player would still be keen and I don't see you can stop that, it's the top clubs who need a handbrake of some description IMO.

 

[Mr Reliable]

Greg Denham in fine form on SEN this morning - if Hawthorn recruits Yarran, he (Denham) will retire. Reckons Ralphy's story in today's paper that Hawthorn is after Yarran is ridiculously wrong.

KB said many listeners will now be hoping Yarran goes to the Hawks.

 

[LT Smash]

Sick of the late night tossbags on SEN saying "North cannot get beyond a Prelim" - just **** OFF!!!

Carlton was also finished after bombing out in 94 and 94 with an old list. They then turned that into a dominant 95 season.

 

[Gasometer]

NMFC Website is doing player reviews and are offering fan comments.

Will end in tears.