Roast A reflection of where Pie fans think their club is really at. It's not positive.

[Dead Eye Didak]

On top of our year, l must admit hugely disappointed with Pendles. I absolutely love Pendles, champion and legend of our club, but l thought his comments over the weekend about him looking at player/transition to coach packages from opposition clubs was ordinary from the leader of the club.
The club is at it's lowest ebb, and Pendles comments were a further kick to the guts while we're down. I didn't like the sound of "l will look at it" if he was to be offered something from an opposition club, that didn't sit well with me at all.
He could have not even brought up that comment, as it wasn't even asked of him in the interview, Pendles brought it up himself, referring to something Jay Clark had written. It will be a real glitch on his stellar career, if he walked out on the Pies now, when the younger players and club, need him the most.

 

[Carringbush2010]

But isn’t that the same thing?

No, I'd be willing to bet the club is doing this report to alleviate bad pr, of course pr is pr, but good pr is always preferred. Clutching at straws at this one.

Sure. But in an 18 team competition that’s heavily equalised (it hasn’t been 18 years yet since our last Premiership, it’s not yet our turn) people are going to live a miserable existence if the only thing that gives them joy is winning AFL Premierships.

Few if any are arguing this point, yes premierships are the most important but it's not the only - I mention this in just about every post on this subject.

Of course. And I’d go further and say that for most fans seeing a young player kick a bag of goals in a losing game will give them more pride than our social work. Seeing somebody like Gary Lyon reluctantly admit that Collingwood played well would give a lot of fans pride. There’s little sources of pride everywhere.

Again no one is arguing this.

Of course.

But you will get Collingwood fans disengage if they believe that Collingwood is a racist (or sexist, or homophobic, or …, or …) organisation.

And you will get six year old kids getting picked on in the play ground for supporting a racist club (or feel alienated because …) and so they go and follow another club.

That's a given, again no one is arguing this but to suggest it's an only reason to follow the club is laughable. Otherwise it's a moot point in reality.

Ask any Essendon supporter whether the supplements scandal justified the pursuit of Premierships?

Ask any Melbourne supporter whether their tanking in the mid 2000’s justified their pursuit of success?

Ask any Carlton supporter whether the pursuit of Premierships justified John Elliott’s brown paper bag policy at the end of the 90’s?

Ask any Storm supporter whether their club’s salary cap cheating and having Premierships stripped off them was worth it?

(And if Premierships are really that important to Collingwood supporters, why do very few believe that missing out on the 2018 Premiership by a kick justified the punt on Dayne Beams? Or back ending Treloar’s contract?)

And I'll go back to my previous comment, it'd be better to perform ourselves rather than rely on our competition to fail. Of course this is not the clubs intent, yet again another moot point.

Not so. Despite us finishing 17th, I had no problem at all listing a stack of things that made me proud of Collingwood in 2021. And in most of those moments I was alongside my Collingwood homies also wearing broad smiles at the time.

I think you'd be in the minority here, whether or not it is justified to be unhappy with our season, again, is another moot point. If the majority are unhappy then they're unhappy - justified schmustified. Doesn't matter, continue without hope and likelihood of flags then eventually they'll leave, justified or not.

As I’ve always said “Premierships are just a means to an end - an extremely important means - but they’re not the only means and they’re certainly not the end.”

The problem with this answer is the fact for every club every year this IS THE END GAME or at worst used to be, even that is highly unlikely. The reason it's the end game is because it's the best way to instill the pride in your fanbase, your fanbase is your survival, without your fanbase you die.

If the club continues like it has in the last 6 decades, self inflicted incompetence that has cost itself that pride, then eventually we'd end up like the dees.

How much pride would you have then?

 

[76woodenspooners]

This is so true, but the problem is that is the only relevance the club has and if it continues to disappoint its fan base, it will likely lose them and then by extension lose the media attention. Can't last forever.

We survived and maintained relevance through the Colliwobbles - and we’ve got a few more decades to go before we get back to that stage.

 

[BEEG]

No picks
Kids aren't anything special
No coach
No board structure
No cap room
No midfield
No forward

On the way out
Pendles
Sidey
Howe
Roughead

I have said it time and time again, trading that pick was lazy list management and will be worse then the Beams trade.

Stack of pain on the way.

 

[Markfs]

With all due respect, your sarcasm here is actually pretty close to the mark.

It's history and the hope or witnessing that again that results in our (supposed) behemoth following, there is no other reason. In fact we have more reason than any other club for fans to vote with their feet, no other club has teased its fan base as much as ours.

And no premierships don't solve all problems, but they go a long long way.

with all due respect, you can make any judgements you like on what i type.

and you think people choose teams because they think that those clubs are going to be a good tease? This isnt high school sex..

 

[Markfs]

Why has the club put so many resources into the Do Better report actions? It’s got nothing to do with winning Premierships?

It’s because our members and supporters wouldn’t want to be associated with a racist organisation. That in turn affects membership, sponsorship, and ultimately the financial viability of the club.

IMO the purpose of the club is to bring pride to its members and supporters. Some days that means winning games of footy. Some days that means showcasing young kids streaming through the corridor and kicking goals. Some days that means taking steps to heal our racist past. Some days that means seeing our VFLW girls winning a Prelim final to be undefeated in the season. Some days that means thumping Carlton. And yes, some days that means winning Premierships.

There have only been two days in my life that Collingwood have won Premierships, but Collingwood have brought me a lot more days of pride and joy than simply those two.

I think they did the do better because of a string of reasons - the members abuse to winmar years ago, the monkey-michael long incident, the endless eddie incidents, and the lumumba thing as well as others...

if those events hadnt occurred, no report.

And as for your perception of what brings your pride, whatever happens in your world is relevant for you. It may bear little relevance to the other pie supporters on the planet.

 

[76woodenspooners]

No picks

True.

Kids aren't anything special

Sure, none are Jayden Stephenson who won the Rising Star in their debut year …

… but a bit harsh to go this early.

No coach

True. But what really matters is that we have a coach appointed before the trade period.

No board structure

Wait, what??

We’ve got two board members on the coach selection panel. Another is busy with the Do Better report. Our board is working as hard as they ever have?

No cap room

We don’t know that. All we know is that Wright said that there’s still cap remediation to be done. Why would he telegraph to all those player mnagwrs that we have money to spend?

No midfield

Harsh. We’ve got a fair mix of players on the way out, players on the way in, and players going nowhere.

No forward

Agree.

On the way out
Pendles
Sidey
Howe
Roughead

+ Elliott?

 

[TakingThePies]

I just can't fathom the list management. How did it get that bad? and how did people let it...

I just want a club culture that brings in people but strives for nothing but the best. Harder on each other and harder on field. I don't care what they do or who they are... just sick of watching us get pushed over each week because we don't want too win. Theres too many players to comfortable. It's embarrassing.

 

[stormskye]

No picks
Kids aren't anything special
No coach
No board structure
No cap room
No midfield
No forward

On the way out
Pendles
Sidey
Howe
Roughead

I have said it time and time again, trading that pick was lazy list management and will be a worse then the Beams trade.

Stack of pain on the way.

How is Daicos not a pick exactly?

 

[Scritchyscroony]

We survived and maintained relevance through the Colliwobbles - and we’ve got a few more decades to go before we get back to that stage.

Ya reckon???? few more decades???

1959 to 1990 - 32 years; 1 flag
1991 to 2021 - 31 years; 1 flag

we won't be winning a flag in the next 2 years.

we have less runners up trophies these last 31 years though I guess... only lost the 4 from 5
big improvement

Korda to the rescue...

 

[76woodenspooners]

I think they did the do better because of a string of reasons - the members abuse to winmar years ago, the monkey-michael long incident, the endless eddie incidents, and the lumumba thing as well as others...

if those events hadnt occurred, no report.

I agree. The Do Better report itself is not a source of pride. Ed found that out the hard way.

Sometimes it’s not so much about finding a source of pride, but rather more about fixing a source of ‘unpride’.

And as for your perception of what brings your pride, whatever happens in your world is relevant for you. It may bear little relevance to the other pie supporters on the planet.

Agree with that. But I’ve spent enough time on here, in crowds at footy games, chatting footy around the water cooler to get a vague sense of what other footy supporters find pride in.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Ya reckon???? few more decades???

1959 to 1990 - 32 years; 1 flag
1991 to 2021 2010 - 31 20 years; 1 flag
2011 to 2021 and counting, 11 years and counting; 0 flags … yet

EFA

 

[Markfs]

He was being satirical

i wasnt. my son was a geelong supporter in 1989. He liked the cats. I was happy that he was following Geelong because they looked like they could bring him some happiness in life, rather than all the dumb grand final losses...

so we won it in 1990. I watched it alone at home. He was out with his mother. He came home and we had won. I shed a tear. I bought him a Pie jumper and he became a collingwood supporter. So you could say that i brainwashed him in the end, as all parents do to their kids, but it wouldnt have happened unless we won that premiership.

i can't find the satire in that story.

To sum up the last 30 years, he and I have talked about the pies a lot over the years..... which is a good thing. However, that's balanced out by the fact that I took him away from those geelong premierships before 2011.

 

[Markfs]

Agree with that. But I’ve spent enough time on here, in crowds at footy games, chatting footy around the water cooler to get a vague sense of what other footy supporters find pride in.

thats because we are clutching at straws.... like someone crossing the simpson desert sucking a few drops of moisture out of a plant, in the hope that a big rain will come (and at the current rate, the big rains come every 30 or 40 years)

 

[Markfs]

It just occurred to me. We mightnt win a premiership for another 20 years. I wonder what the millennials would do if they knew that to be the case.

 

[Carringbush2010]

We survived and maintained relevance through the Colliwobbles - and we’ve got a few more decades to go before we get back to that stage.

Oh agreed, I'm not suggesting it's a right now but whichever you boil it down and dissect the fan base can only take so much, can't last forever.

What that means to me (and I imagine most) the tangible of the club operating as close to optimum as possible, that will give fans hope and likelihood of premiership success - the opposite of the litany of twilight zone decisions that have hampered the club in the past in regularity.

 

[Carringbush2010]

with all due respect, you can make any judgements you like on what i type.

and you think people choose teams because they think that those clubs are going to be a good tease? This isnt high school sex..

Well obviously fans aren't gonna choose teams with guaranteed failure infinitum.

 

[Carringbush2010]

EFA

Well that's a classic fudging the numbers to make it look better.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Well that's a classic fudging the numbers to make it look better.

I’m just calling it how it is - 11 years (and counting) since our last Premiership.

Dunno why people would want to fudge the numbers to make them look worse but?

 

[Markfs]

the weakest bit about democracy is that a large percentage of voters are looking for an easy answer...

 

[wcv1475]

So my take on the club is this.

Eddie came in and got Mick in as coach it looked like the start of a new era a more ruthless Hawthorn like era (who are the most successful club in my lifetime) but it was not to be.

Not sure why but it seems we fell back into the unprofessional way of running things and I am not just meaning the Bucks appointment but things like getting rid of Balme, did we get Gubby Allan in to replace him? The numerous ex players we have had as assistants, Rocca(ruck coach) seems we never went with best available just ex Collingwood people.

So whilst our offseason last year was horrific could have had pick 2 we have to move forward and hopefully that starts with a good coaching appointment.

Regarding the Pendlebury situation if he chose to leave he is still a legend of the club but I guess it is just the new era, and honestly if he did say what the media are reporting (he would consider offers) I do wonder how tenable his position as captain is for 2022. The unfortunate thing is we need him to mentor our young players but his statement on weekend really doesn’t come across well unless media are overblowing it.

So first step for me is getting the coaching appointment right

 

[Carringbush2010]

I’m just calling it how it is - 11 years (and counting) since our last Premiership.

Dunno why people would want to fudge the numbers to make them look worse but?

Ok then let's look at the last 11 years vs the competition, let's see how good you can make that look then. Don't forget to include the whole comp in that time.

Doesn't look pretty does it.

 

[peter9789]

No picks
Kids aren't anything special
No coach
No board structure
No cap room
No midfield
No forward

On the way out
Pendles
Sidey
Howe
Roughead

I have said it time and time again, trading that pick was lazy list management and will be worse then the Beams trade.

Stack of pain on the way.

100% agree.

Not even a rising star nomination and not 1 player in the AA squad.

Then the club Captain goes on radio to tout for offers from other clubs for a playing / coaching gig - bad look.

Club certainly on its knees and with 3 to 4 years at least before we can consider being part of finals.



On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Aussie pie]

First off, I’m not interested in a point by point analysis of everything I mention in this post which it seems certain people want to do to everyone who comments in this thread, so don’t bother, these are my opinions and fair enough if you disagree in fact I’m sure many will but I don’t need a point by point Analysis of everything I said.

No it’s not positive where the club is at and I see a lot of pain in our future. As in long term pain like Carlton and Essendon have been in. Premierships is how I judge the club after all that’s our core business. Let’s be honest the last 60 odd years has been very bad. Finals and grand finals are fine but it’s like NASA at the moment, they went to the moon but now they don’t even orbit the earth, resting on past glories.

The rebuild of the whole club is going to take a long time, it’s not just the playing list but the whole club. We all know the issues even though some want to ignore them or put lipstick on the pig, it’s still a pig.

Eddie screwed us with the Buckley/Malthouse hand over. Bucks couldn’t handle our top players and was too pig headed to help the kids. Those dead years after 2011 should have been our dynasty years but bucks wanted it done his way despite what success Mick had and the players he had to work with but I won’t make this about that as that’s old news and both Ed and Bucks are gone.

I’m smelling the 1990’s all over again, average side, no finals and one or two players carrying the load, Daicos and Moore. Finances up s**t creek, public persona as low as you can get, not a destination club for free agents and basically a basket case. Maybe five or so years at the bottom will be good as long as the recruiters do their job. (not Hine) Five or more top 10 picks in the next 6-8 years then maybe things will be different but it all depends on decisions made now with the coach, salary cap problems, list management/ recruiting staff and a stable board who are there to win flags not create an empire or make themselves look good. I would love in 5 years time for people to not even know who’s on our board because like any great organisation it’s not about them it’s about the club being a success and the supporters finally being proud to admit they follow the pies.

I’m ashamed of our year this season, one or two good wins on field but let’s be honest it’s 17th on the ladder, no all Australians, no rising star nominations despite 9 debutants, no key forwards coming through the VFL that are making people excited for a debut, just a bunch of good ordinary players who will do their best. There’s no spark except for ND and he’s just one person like Bucks in the 90’s.

Anyway that’s my opinion. Again I don’t need an Analysis of what I said just because you disagree because you may be right and I’m full of s**t which is probably right.

I’m very happy for this to be quoted next season if we are flying and killing it, in fact I encourage it.

So now let’s dust off the whites and prepare for the Ashes and a season of listening to Shane Warne talk through his arse.

Thanks ️️

 

[Countrypie]

First off, I’m not interested in a point by point analysis of everything I mention in this post which it seems certain people want to do to everyone who comments in this thread, so don’t bother, these are my opinions and fair enough if you disagree in fact I’m sure many will but I don’t need a point by point Analysis of everything I said.

No it’s not positive where the club is at and I see a lot of pain in our future. As in long term pain like Carlton and Essendon have been in. Premierships is how I judge the club after all that’s our core business. Let’s be honest the last 60 odd years has been very bad. Finals and grand finals are fine but it’s like NASA at the moment, they went to the moon but now they don’t even orbit the earth, resting on past glories.

The rebuild of the whole club is going to take a long time, it’s not just the playing list but the whole club. We all know the issues even though some want to ignore them or put lipstick on the pig, it’s still a pig.

Eddie screwed us with the Buckley/Malthouse hand over. Bucks couldn’t handle our top players and was too pig headed to help the kids. Those dead years after 2011 should have been our dynasty years but bucks wanted it done his way despite what success Mick had and the players he had to work with but I won’t make this about that as that’s old news and both Ed and Bucks are gone.

I’m smelling the 1990’s all over again, average side, no finals and one or two players carrying the load, Daicos and Moore. Finances up sh*t creek, public persona as low as you can get, not a destination club for free agents and basically a basket case. Maybe five or so years at the bottom will be good as long as the recruiters do their job. (not Hine) Five or more top 10 picks in the next 6-8 years then maybe things will be different but it all depends on decisions made now with the coach, salary cap problems, list management/ recruiting staff and a stable board who are there to win flags not create an empire or make themselves look good. I would love in 5 years time for people to not even know who’s on our board because like any great organisation it’s not about them it’s about the club being a success and the supporters finally being proud to admit they follow the pies.

I’m ashamed of our year this season, one or two good wins on field but let’s be honest it’s 17th on the ladder, no all Australians, no rising star nominations despite 9 debutants, no key forwards coming through the VFL that are making people excited for a debut, just a bunch of good ordinary players who will do their best. There’s no spark except for ND and he’s just one person like Bucks in the 90’s.

Anyway that’s my opinion. Again I don’t need an Analysis of what I said just because you disagree because you may be right and I’m full of sh*t which is probably right.

I’m very happy for this to be quoted next season if we are flying and killing it, in fact I encourage it.

So now let’s dust off the whites and prepare for the Ashes and a season of listening to Shane Warne talk through his arse.

Thanks

Lost me at Shane Warne. I think I'll go surfing