Jumper clash fails

[doppleganger]

The AFL is a renamed VFL, it is the same competition.
Sure, but should that count against a team that came into the AFL and is purely asking to honor its heritage because of it. Most teams existed in some form before the VFL should we just discount any of their history too?

The clubs retain that heritage, Carlton's own hall of fame and museum retains all the pre VFL heritage.

But it isnt relevant to the AFL competition.

But in 1989 when you have 3 clubs Sydney, Brisbane and West Coast competing it didnt make sense to continue to call it Victorian.
Sure, but again, thats a decision the AFL made to expand and make it a national comp, doesnt make much sense to do this then argue that any club coming in from another comp forgoes any links to that history (which it didnt really with Port anyway, it only had to because of the clash with Collingwood)

It does.

There was already a magpies team, who played in black n white.

Just as if the Tassie team is to enter, they would have to ensure that their colours and branding doesnt compete with another club.

Tassie Saints in a red, white and black tri-colour would be correctly told to go and get ****ed.

Yet people like you think, just give em this one...nup they knew the terms, have had 25 years to create a non black n white identity.
Aaaaaand there its is. You really think people are gonna confuse Port playing once a year in Adelaide for Collingwood. The ego is outrageous.

No you miss the point.

They have had 25 years to push the national Port Power identity, but they have instead focussed all their energy on trying to sneak the old SANFL magpie back into the AFL.

Why arent you arguing against Ports current away? I mean its black, white and gray (a shade of black and white) SURELY people must confuse that with the only black and white sporting organisation in the world?

It is a different design, no black n white stripes to be seen.

As said repeatedly, Port should use the PB design but go with a non magpie colour scheme.

The below are some starting options, all clearly highlight the bars design whilst adhering to the agreement to not go the magpies black n white colours in the AFL.

 

[Pocket Terrace]

their new history started when THEY walked away from their old one.

If that's the case, Collingwood started their new history in 2001 when they started to wear mostly black home jumpers.

 

[jakson68]

I have great faith that Port will one day wear the prison bars again as their regular home strip. A number of times throughout history the bars have been sidelined for various reasons (the world wars, dye shortages, or-- believe it or not-- wanting to emulate the great Collingwood teams of yore by wearing their actual black and white stripes) but they have always returned to the PBs because that is what the fans wanted. It is the guernsey that has always brought success-- despite having worn them for slightly over half their existence, 30 odd of 37 flags were won in the PBs. They also organically emerged as a unique and specific representation of the Port Adelaide wharf pylons. There is nothing that better represents the club and its origins, its heritage and its success.

Right now it looks tough, Port is up against a Victorian-centric AFL that panders to the big old Vic club insecurities and also controls the majority of Port's board, hamstringing them from actually doing what is the will of the supporters. But the club will one day return to the hands of the members and then will act in accordance with what the members want. And there is no reason why Port shouldn't wear whatever guernsey they see fit, all that really matters is that it represents the club and its supporters. In the long run we supporters will always care more than the dinosaur cronies that think they can crush the will of the people it matters to.

This is one of the the main reasons Collingwood are reluctant to agree to Port wearing the stripes.
Give an inch and take a mile.
Step 1 - Port wear stripes for Heritage game
Step 2 - Port wear stripes for 150 year celebration
Step 3 - Port wear stripes for all home showdowns
Step 4 - Port wear stripes for all showdowns
Step 5 - Port wear stripes for all home games
Step 6 - Port just wears stripes
This is how you would like to see it go I assume.

And you wonder why we have concerns.

 

[phantom13]

The clubs retain that heritage, Carlton's own hall of fame and museum retains all the pre VFL heritage.

But it isnt relevant to the AFL competition.

It does.

There was already a magpies team, who played in black n white.

Just as if the Tassie team is to enter, they would have to ensure that their colours and branding doesnt compete with another club.

Tassie Saints in a red, white and black tri-colour would be correctly told to go and get *ed.

No you miss the point.

They have had 25 years to push the national Port Power identity, but they have instead focussed all their energy on trying to sneak the old SANFL magpie back into the AFL.

It is a different design, no black n white stripes to be seen.

As said repeatedly, Port should use the PB design but go with a non magpie colour scheme.

The below are some starting options, all clearly highlight the bars design whilst adhering to the agreement to not go the magpies black n white colours in the AFL.

View attachment 1463903

Saints candy stripe is the same design with one extra color, it’s closer to your design than ports but you don’t argue that one.

It’s selective and even amongst pies supporters your on your own here

 

[doppleganger]

If that's the case, Collingwood started their new history in 2001 when they started to wear mostly black home jumpers.

Collingwood have always worn black and white stripes.

Even going back to this thread - clash jumpers - we have enabled the perfect clash that keeps our heritage

A black kit with white stripes
A white kit with black stripes

Other clubs can play in stripes, but no other clubs can play in black n white stripes.

 

[Saltiga]

their new history started when THEY walked away from their old one.

hahaha if only the interstate clubs, who saved the debt ridden vfl clubs of the time demanded Collingwood relinquish their history to be part of the AFL. You'd be squealing like stuck pigs!

 

[phantom13]

This is one of the the main reasons Collingwood are reluctant to agree to Port wearing the stripes.
Give an inch and take a mile.
Step 1 - Port wear stripes for Heritage game
Step 2 - Port wear stripes for 150 year celebration
Step 3 - Port wear stripes for all home showdowns
Step 4 - Port wear stripes for all showdowns
Step 5 - Port wear stripes for all home games
Step 6 - Port just wears stripes
This is how you would like to see it go I assume.

And you wonder why we have concerns.

Well you guys agreed to step one a couple years back. Why did you allow it then if you’re so concerned about this?

 

[beerbandit]

Port's traditional prison bars jumper (mostly black) and Collingwood's traditional white with black stripes home jumpers are so different from each other that none of this should matter. Comparing it to a whole new entity coming in and choosing an existing jumper design as you've done with the saints example is a complete overreaction.

Collingwood are the club that have created the most jumper clashes over the past 20 years by changing from white with black stripes to black with white stripes. This creates a clash with Essendon, Richmond, St Kilda, Carlton, Melbourne, Adelaide.

Collingwood fans don't seem willing to acknowledge that Eddy actually inverted their home strip in his first few years as President as part of the Adidas deal. Coincidentally (or perhaps not), Port Adelaide had just joined the AFL a few years prior.

These days, I enjoy when Collingwood are drawn as the away team as it means they are a chance to wear their traditional strip, as is likely to be the case this Friday night. Every Pies fan should love that jumper.

As for brand identity, Liverpool are the Reds and ManU the Red Devils. Both clubs co-exist in Lancashire with red shirts and don't seem to have any of these petty issues. You ever watched a one-dayer between Australia and South Africa?? Same colours, but one mostly yellow and the other mostly green. It's not a problem.

Nice post, unfortunately you are wrong. Collingwoods original jumper was Black with white stripes.

And for the jumper clashes, Collingwoods is just about the best, they are black and white striped yes, but one is a black jumper and the other is white. If you can’t tell the difference in the contrast then off to spec savers.

 

[melanChronic]

This is one of the the main reasons Collingwood are reluctant to agree to Port wearing the stripes.
Give an inch and take a mile.
Step 1 - Port wear stripes for Heritage game
Step 2 - Port wear stripes for 150 year celebration
Step 3 - Port wear stripes for all home showdowns
Step 4 - Port wear stripes for all showdowns
Step 5 - Port wear stripes for all home games
Step 6 - Port just wears stripes
This is how you would like to see it go I assume.

And you wonder why we have concerns.

I don't see all of these steps happening whilst the weight of VFL power and insecurity crushes our club's identity. That you view it as giving inches reflects that your foot is on our throat and inherent imbalance in the league's structure means that Port people have no agency in how any of this plays out at present. I would take any of those steps, but really the resistance to it will keep the fire burning and keep reminding Port people that the PBs is what truly represents us.

What I would like to see is Port's members actually being able to choose freely what their club wears. That will only happen when we are not AFL controlled. And once we can I don't see how it is any concern of Collingwood, or will impact them in any tangible way.

 

[jakson68]

Well you guys agreed to step one a couple years back. Why did you allow it then if you’re so concerned about this?

We did agree to step one and to step two. I would nearly agree to step three.
Unfortunately though that will never be enough and they will always want more.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

So West Coast, Adelaide, GWS, GC were all part of the VFL? I didnt realise, give me more history scholar.

THE VFA is dead and the current VFL has more ex VFL clubs (as AFL reserves) than VFA clubs.

This is a dumb argument. You look silly. The VFL became the AFL. Hence why Carlton has 16 premierships. The SANFL did not become the AFL, hence why Port only has 1

 

[jakson68]

I don't see all of these steps happening whilst the weight of VFL power and insecurity crushes our club's identity. That you view it as giving inches reflects that your foot is on our throat and inherent imbalance in the league's structure means that Port people have no agency in how any of this plays out at present. I would take any of those steps, but really the resistance to it will keep the fire burning and keep reminding Port people that the PBs is what truly represents us.

What I would like to see is Port's members actually being able to choose freely what their club wears. That will only happen when we are not AFL controlled. And once we can I don't see how it is any concern of Collingwood, or will impact them in any tangible way.

As Port (like every other club) are a part of the AFL, there is little to no freedom for members to choose what their team wears.
In most cases we get the privilege's to choose our president and board but after that, the AFL controls it.

What if Tasmania got in and said "Hawthorn were popular when they were here, how about our jumper is brown with slightly thinner gold stripes"
The AFL must protect the traditions of its existing clubs, when allowing others to enter the comp.

Sadly for Port black with white stripes, is already taken.

Though with my second eye open, I can understand the frustration from the other side.

 

[Pocket Terrace]

Nice post, unfortunately you are wrong. Collingwoods original jumper was Black with white stripes.

And for the jumper clashes, Collingwoods is just about the best, they are black and white striped yes, but one is a black jumper and the other is white. If you can’t tell the difference in the contrast then off to spec savers.

On several occasions, my post mentions the difference between the mostly white (current clash) and mostly black (current home) Collingwood jumpers. That would suggest I understand the difference between the two jumpers without needing a visit to spec savers.

Now, as for this original Collingwood jumper that’s supposedly mostly black as you have claimed. Do you have any photos of this jumper? The only ones I’ve seen from that era have plenty of white across the back and are nothing at all like the current home jumper design that the club have used since 2001. I’m happy to stand corrected if you can find anything other than what McGuire erroneously claimed at the time. The photos and links already posted in this thread don’t support your claim.

 

[Pocket Terrace]

As Port (like every other club) are a part of the AFL, there is little to no freedom for members to choose what their team wears.
In most cases we get the privilege's to choose our president and board but after that, the AFL controls it.

What if Tasmania got in and said "Hawthorn were popular when they were here, how about our jumper is brown with slightly thinner gold stripes"
The AFL must protect the traditions of its existing clubs, when allowing others to enter the comp.

Sadly for Port black with white stripes, is already taken.

Though with my second eye open, I can understand the frustration from the other side.

This I agree with. I just don’t think the two jumpers in question are that similar overall, so I could see it potentially working without problems.

If the argument was that both sets of fans would end up looking too similar (scarves, jackets, etc.), then yes absolutely. Both home crowds would look almost identical.

But the jumpers are very different in a lot of respects, especially if the Pies still wore the home jumper that they’ve worn for the vast majority of their existence.

 

[phantom13]

We did agree to step one and to step two. I would nearly agree to step three.
Unfortunately though that will never be enough and they will always want more.

So. Let them want more, you guys agreeing to nothing and not even be willing to discuss the matter is silly.

This is a dumb argument. You look silly. The VFL became the AFL. Hence why Carlton has 16 premierships. The SANFL did not become the AFL, hence why Port only has 1

I’ve never argued the sanfl became the Afl but your punishing a team for earning the right to enter the premier (and only) national competition because others got gifted entry. The counter of the VFL IS THE AFL isn’t right either it is now a National competition and ever expanding.

 

[phantom13]

As Port (like every other club) are a part of the AFL, there is little to no freedom for members to choose what their team wears.
In most cases we get the privilege's to choose our president and board but after that, the AFL controls it.

What if Tasmania got in and said "Hawthorn were popular when they were here, how about our jumper is brown with slightly thinner gold stripes"
The AFL must protect the traditions of its existing clubs, when allowing others to enter the comp.

Sadly for Port black with white stripes, is already taken.

Though with my second eye open, I can understand the frustration from the other side.

I think this is a rare reasonable position from a collingwood supporter and doesn’t go down the “what will they want next” road. Respect to this

 

[Saltiga]

This is a dumb argument. You look silly. The VFL became the AFL. Hence why Carlton has 16 premierships. The SANFL did not become the AFL, hence why Port only has 1

The VFL didn't become the AFL. That's just a convenient argument for VFL clubs to be able to have their history count in the AFL whilst denying the history of interstate clubs. It's very hypocritical and says we value our history but you can't value yours.

All current AFL teams entered the competition at some point when it changed from the VFL to the AFL.

Collingwood just seems to get some sick perverse enjoyment from being c*nts to Port over one round per season like they do/did from being c*nts to their aboriginal players for decades.

 

[yodellinhank]

Saints candy stripe is the same design with one extra color, it’s closer to your design than ports but you don’t argue that one.

It’s selective and even amongst pies supporters your on your own here

It has an extra colour. I think I've read plenty of pie fans say they don't object to the teal.

 

[yodellinhank]

hahaha if only the interstate clubs, who saved the debt ridden vfl clubs of the time demanded Collingwood relinquish their history to be part of the AFL. You'd be squealing like stuck pigs!

If only.

 

[beerbandit]

The VFL didn't become the AFL. That's just a convenient argument for VFL clubs to be able to have their history count in the AFL whilst denying the history of interstate clubs. It's very hypocritical and says we value our history but you can't value yours.

All current AFL teams entered the competition at some point when it changed from the VFL to the AFL.

Collingwood just seems to get some sick perverse enjoyment from being c*nts to Port over one round per season like they do/did from being c*nts to their aboriginal players for decades.

You didn’t come into the AFL as Port Adelaide Magpies, you came into the AFL as Port Adelaide Power in a Teal jumper. You left the PA Magpies in the SANFL.

It is your club sir who are being c*nts by selling merchandise with Magpies on it, who do you think you guys are? There is no teal in your logo anymore and it is your club who are pushing the boundaries and I think as Collingwood supporters we have every right to be pissed off, why wouldn’t we be? And all the other clubs couldn’t give a hoot because it doesn’t effect them.

You guys came into the AFL 25 years ago as the Power and you are the ones now trying to distance yourself from that, but unfortunately for you there already is a Magpies in the AFL and unfortunately for you they are the biggest club in this country so they will not back down from there position in allowing the Port Power to wear black and white stripes.

 

[Mr39]

This thread is meant to be reserved for complaining about white shorts and number panels. Can the PB talk move elsewhere?

 

[phantom13]

Yeh my bad. Apologies.

 

[doppleganger]

This thread is meant to be reserved for complaining about white shorts and number panels. Can the PB talk move elsewhere?

The number panel should get in the bin, it creates clashes.

The original intent of number panels was to ensure the number stood out when many striped jumpers were fully striped on the back.

Now it creates clashes, Ports original Chevron jumper had a full black back and white number...Port should revert back to their heritage chevron jumpers.

 

[yodellinhank]

Obviously the biggest game in the world doesn't compare, lets go to a 1 country game with 32 teams with unique branding. The NFL has
San Franscisco, Kansas City in Red & Yellow (Even Washington with Maroon)
Both LA sides wear Blue & Yellow
Buffalo, New England and New York Giants Red, White & Blue
Detroit & Indianapolis Blue & White

These billion dollar franchises have no issue with branding

Not sure its a good comparison. The heritage of those teams goes back beyond the NFL Superbowl era to when they played in separate competitions. Only Bills and Patriots are in the same conference, and actually the same division. They've both chopped and changed their branding to try to differentiate better from their rivals.

When you look at it, you could probably a argue there's a football competition in Australia with 18 teams and 3 of them wear blue and white?

 

[yodellinhank]

And Port Adelaide is Port Adelaide Doofus.

I thought they were The Power?