Training 2021 Pre Season training watch

[Mercy Seat]

Don't understand a lot of the knocks on TOB having a good intra game. He definitely needs to translate it to AFL but he can only do the best with what's in front of him. He was a player devoid of confidence in his early years and has only ever really clicked in a couple of games. IF and it's a big IF it all clicks we have a seriously underrated third tall who plays great forward defence. To his credit, he keeps improving and he would be quite cheap on the player cap. You need players like this in the squad and surely there is a bit more positivity for an older player still developing. If he was just picked up and did this in his first intra game a lot would be reacting like spangha back in the day.

Also seeing a big difference in player size (I know its pre season) but if it stays a focus the talls on our list will have a lot more impact in contests.

Nothing like a fit and health squad all pushing for list spots!

The only thing that brings out more criticism of TOB round here than a bad game, is a good game.

 

[TylerDurden]

Starting 18 in my round 1 side. Looking forward to seeing what Moorey can produce after a full pre-season and some renewed confidence.

Is he a rookie? Do we need to elevate him to pick him r1?

 

[WWSD]

Is he a rookie? Do we need to elevate him to pick him r1?

Greaves and Moore are nominated rookies.

 

[KermitJagger]

Ouch, looks like our prized draft pick ain't ready for senior footy in 2021 then.

O'Brien has done this the past few pre-seasons, always has really good hit outs. The bloke he did it on last year was Greaves and he played good senior footy so I'm not sure you're on the money with this one.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

People don’t want whipping boys to come good - it negates them being able to smugly post here ‘see I told you so’ and it would also mean they’d have to spend some energy finding a new whipping boy. Particularly with Frawley and Scully now gone, the whipping boy stocks are basically Cegs and TOB, with Hartigan likely to feature being that Frost was really good last year and didn’t make the transition from ‘omg what a spud recruit’ to ‘omg why does Frost get a game’.

People in this headspace would honestly rather have their negativity vindicated than be pleasantly surprised. Being right is more important than being happy. I’m not expecting TOB to be a dominant forward and kick 50 goals this year - but you better believe I hope that he does and enjoy that he kicked 6 in an intraclub game.

 

[KermitJagger]

People don’t want whipping boys to come good - it negates them being able to smugly post here ‘see I told you so’ and it would also mean they’d have to spend some energy finding a new whipping boy. Particularly with Frawley and Scully now gone, the whipping boy stocks are basically Cegs and TOB, with Hartigan likely to feature being that Frost was really good last year and didn’t make the transition from ‘omg what a spud recruit’ to ‘omg why does Frost get a game’.

People in this headspace would honestly rather have their negativity vindicated than be pleasantly surprised. Being right is more important than being happy. I’m not expecting TOB to be a dominant forward and kick 50 goals this year - but you better believe I hope that he does and enjoy that he kicked 6 in an intraclub game.

Thing is, when we've played good football in the past few years, Timmy has played good football. I still look to that really strong end of 2019 as what O'Brien would be capable of if our midfield wasn't so woeful.

Plus he's a good chop out ruck in the centre bounces, good leap. Rucks like a slighter version of Stef Martin. Not so good at ball ups around the ground though.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Thing is, when we've played good football in the past few years, Timmy has played good football. I still look to that really strong end of 2019 as what O'Brien would be capable of if our midfield wasn't so woeful.

Plus he's a good chop out ruck in the centre bounces, good leap. Rucks like a slighter version of Stef Martin. Not so good at ball ups around the ground though.

And for all of TOB’s faults he’s often not had the luxury of functional delivery inside-50. You have to wonder what he’d be capable of in a team with more cohesive forward entries and a dominant full forward to accompany him - every chance he could be a 30-40 goal a year forward in that position.

 

[KermitJagger]

Hawks Intraclub | Koschitzke finds his position

With a new role in 2021, Kozzy is becoming more impressive as the weeks go by! Will we see him debut in the opening rounds of the '21 season?

www.hawthornfc.com.au

For those that haven't seen it, young Kosi speaks really well.

 

[Teamwork Talks]

Based on pre-season form I'd say that Moore has a HFF position locked down.

I love what Moore has done.
Finally breaks into the team at the end of last year and makes the most of his opportunity and plays well enough to get a Brownlow vote. He is then left hanging not knowing if he going to get a new contract and then he is finally the last man to join the list. He goes into pre season training and lights it up.
He is my sort of player - Hard working, honest and determined with a bit of skill as well.

 

[daniel23]

I love what Moore has done.
Finally breaks into the team at the end of last year and makes the most of his opportunity and plays well enough to get a Brownlow vote. He is then left hanging not knowing if he going to get a new contract and then he is finally the last man to join the list. He goes into pre season training and lights it up.
He is my sort of player - Hard working, honest and determined with a bit of skill as well.

And finally injury free.

 

[Dewnior]

People don’t want whipping boys to come good - it negates them being able to smugly post here ‘see I told you so’ and it would also mean they’d have to spend some energy finding a new whipping boy. Particularly with Frawley and Scully now gone, the whipping boy stocks are basically Cegs and TOB, with Hartigan likely to feature being that Frost was really good last year and didn’t make the transition from ‘omg what a spud recruit’ to ‘omg why does Frost get a game’.

People in this headspace would honestly rather have their negativity vindicated than be pleasantly surprised. Being right is more important than being happy. I’m not expecting TOB to be a dominant forward and kick 50 goals this year - but you better believe I hope that he does and enjoy that he kicked 6 in an intraclub game.

Quoting because this deserves to be re-read

 

[TazHawk15]

Lewis is like 21 and has played 30 games, O’Brien has been in the afl for 7 years and played a lot more games and never shown much yet ppl are geting their hopes up about him because he kicked goals in a intra club lol.

Yet during match simulation the other week you payed out big time on TOB for getting beat by DGB (so why did a intra club giggle matter then) so he then turns around and kicks 6 goals and you pay out on him again.

At least you are consistent.

Seriously mate you don’t want him to be the player we all want him to become, so you can keep telling us what a genius you are by repeatedly saying “I told you so”.

I get that you don’t rate the kid, a bit like I don’t rate you as a poster.

By all means pay out on the kid when he has a bad game but at least give him some credit when he has a good one.

Before you fire back with “But it was only a friendly game played amongst teammates” that means we cant get excited by Downie or Moore or anyone who played well yesterday, because they all played in the same game.
I am not a complete rose coloured glasses person when it comes to all our players and have even gone on record as saying “I think Mitch Lewis is delisting material” in the next season or two.

However I hope like hell and pray to the footy gods that the kid becomes the player we all want him to be, I for one will be over the moon if the kid proves me wrong.

 

[Teamwork Talks]

Don't understand a lot of the knocks on TOB having a good intra game. He definitely needs to translate it to AFL but he can only do the best with what's in front of him. He was a player devoid of confidence in his early years and has only ever really clicked in a couple of games. IF and it's a big IF it all clicks we have a seriously underrated third tall who plays great forward defence. To his credit, he keeps improving and he would be quite cheap on the player cap. You need players like this in the squad and surely there is a bit more positivity for an older player still developing. If he was just picked up and did this in his first intra game a lot would be reacting like spangha back in the day.

Also seeing a big difference in player size (I know its pre season) but if it stays a focus the talls on our list will have a lot more impact in contests.

Nothing like a fit and health squad all pushing for list spots!

Leading Teams might be the making of him. Here's hoping. Everything else has failed.

 

[Pessimistic]

Problem is we want TOB to be the man . He’s never going to be that. In the right team he’ll be an upgrade on schoey. So agreed

And for all of TOB’s faults he’s often not had the luxury of functional delivery inside-50. You have to wonder what he’d be capable of in a team with more cohesive forward entries and a dominant full forward to accompany him - every chance he could be a 30-40 goal a year forward in that position.

 

[TylerDurden]

Greaves and Moore are nominated rookies.

So we don't need LTI to play them?

 

[threesixpio]

The whole rookie thing has changed hasn’t it? I thought they could play no matter what now

 

[burner1]

Can we not turn this into a TOB thread?

Great report Axeman. Really interested to see how the game against the dogs goes when preseason optimism clashes with real opposition.

 

[Stratton24]

The whole rookie thing has changed hasn’t it? I thought they could play no matter what now

Yes all rookies can play anytime now so really no need for a rookie list other than they only get 1 year contracts and $80 000 of their salary is outside the cap.

 

[WWSD]

So we don't need LTI to play them?

No. They can play at anytime.

 

[Milkshaker]

People don’t want whipping boys to come good - it negates them being able to smugly post here ‘see I told you so’ and it would also mean they’d have to spend some energy finding a new whipping boy. Particularly with Frawley and Scully now gone, the whipping boy stocks are basically Cegs and TOB, with Hartigan likely to feature being that Frost was really good last year and didn’t make the transition from ‘omg what a spud recruit’ to ‘omg why does Frost get a game’.

People in this headspace would honestly rather have their negativity vindicated than be pleasantly surprised. Being right is more important than being happy. I’m not expecting TOB to be a dominant forward and kick 50 goals this year - but you better believe I hope that he does and enjoy that he kicked 6 in an intraclub game.

What a load of nonsense. In all my time here I have never got the impression that anyone on here is 'smug' when there observations about a poorly performing Hawthorn player come to fruition.

Disappointment and frustration yes, plenty of times.

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

the problem with TOB was he was playing a difficult role where he had to move between 2nd ruck, a roaming HFF and playing as a pressure forward

his job was to create a contest in pretty much every situation and turn it into at least a 50/50 all around the ground, becaues we played Gunston as a 2nd forward (the correct option obviously) and mitch lewis and JP were nowhere near fit enough to impact as much as he was

TOB is elite aerobically and as a pressure fwd (for a big man) but he really lacks polish and finish

i believe if one of Jeka, Kosi or ML are able to become a 1st option and TOB can play a clear role as a 3rd fwd he could become the player we need him to be — 30 goals a year, 5 marks a game type. We've seen glimpses of it at times.

what's interesting is BB playing at CHF in training — he is also elite aerobically and getting around the ground and could play TOB's 2020 role, pushing Tim into a more comfortable position

i for one am rooting for Timmy's success. I'm not sold it will happen, but he's a player for our club so I'm always gonna be on his side. Even though much of the criticism aimed at him is warranted I feel like wanting him to fail is pretty ordinary, but that's just me

 

[SunshineHawkCal]

I love what Moore has done.
Finally breaks into the team at the end of last year and makes the most of his opportunity and plays well enough to get a Brownlow vote. He is then left hanging not knowing if he going to get a new contract and then he is finally the last man to join the list. He goes into pre season training and lights it up.
He is my sort of player - Hard working, honest and determined with a bit of skill as well.

Dyls was worried with the contract thing, I chatted to him most days & he'd say he has to sit & wait for the list size & salary cap to come out. Sucked for him, so good on him for stepping up this Pre-season

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

What a load of nonsense. In all my time here I have never got the impression that anyone on here is 'smug' when there observations about a poorly performing Hawthorn player come to fruition.

Disappointment and frustration yes, plenty of times.

its not even necessarily smugness but more the cherrypicking of mistakes (that everyone makes) even when the player has a really good game

like with morrison he had a really nice game in 2020 but he turned it over a couple of times so it was 'well my grandma could've hit that pass' instead of 'strong performance, just needs to tidy up his kicking'

or that CJ and Nash have similar flaws/strengths in their game but Nash is a spud who belongs in Ireland but CJ is this bright young talent when their ages are like less than a year apart

i just wish people would be more 'yeah this guy sucks now but i really hope he can turn it around' but i also think gatekeeping the way people should support a team is stupid so its whatever i guess, as long as we all support the same team we're good in my book

 

[Ned Ryerson]

What a load of nonsense. In all my time here I have never got the impression that anyone on here is 'smug' when there observations about a poorly performing Hawthorn player come to fruition.

Disappointment and frustration yes, plenty of times.

I’m not saying this is widespread, but there’s a few posters who I genuinely believe get more out of being right and miserable than being wrong and happy. It’s a definite personality type - I’ve been that person at stages of my life and was glad to be called on it. I’m far from a blissful optimist, I’m a cantankerous cynic who is riddled with anxiety - negativity is my default setting. I’m all for genuine criticism and I’ve absolutely criticised the players and the club when need be. What I get tired of is the few posters who only post negative diatribes on here and never contribute anything outside of that. It’s just tiring. Axeman posts paragraphs of really brilliant training summaries and someone’s only response is ‘lol don’t expect much from TOB’ - it’s just pathetic bullshit.

I expect this year to be very frustrating at times and I honestly don’t imagine us finishing any higher than the bottom third of the ladder. Hearing the positives from the training reports is great because it gives you things to look forward to. None of us are under the delusion of a flag or top 4 finish - so what does just posting uninsightful doom and gloom actually achieve?

Critique is great - rogiebear93 can criticise a player until the cows come home because he does it analytically rather than just say ‘lol he’s a spud’. If you’re going to be negative at least do it with some insight or be funny about it.

 

[Beachy]

This is an exciting year. With a number of players who are young looking like they are finding there feet. Traditionally until they have 50-100 games under there belt they struggle at the AFL Level. We have a number of
Kids who have done the normal hawks path of playing vfl for A few years to get stronger and understand the system. Think back too Sicily as a great one.

Mitch Lewis is 21, playing such a physically challenging role and was injured last year. It will be interesting to see his growth. For all the TOB knockers the kids just gets to so many contests. Even if he 50/50 that contest he brings the ball to ground. I just hope he keeps flying for the ball. Morrison drop off really hurt ball Movement so I hope he finds his confidence again and sounds like he is playing free again.

Greaves is reliable and good decision maker, scrim is a elite kick, day just reads the play so well and elite decision maker. Moore brings pace and repeat efforts, kosi and jeka are super exciting especially jeka with size and disposal making him a tough match up. Brockman is pure speed so adds zip which we’re missing a little. Forward pressure last year was horrible combined with slow ball movement made for terrible footy.

Impy back is huge and helps allow
Our Ball movement to be faster. He is one of the keys to our team and we just struggled with out him. Tich has had a full year which is what those horrible leg injuries take to get back. Omera is back outside which is where we need him. Phillips is a big plus, tough, runs all day. The big improvement is worps and the commentary around getting to the next contest. If he and tich get to multiple contests we are a very different and dangerous team.

I’m Excited about the year and the development of the team.


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