News AFL overhauls Academy and FS bid matching, discussing draft lockout

[FrogDude]

Lets compare the pair!!

Bris - 3 wins, 4wins, 7 wins, 10 wins = 24 wins in 4 years.
Roos - 2/3 wins, 2 wins, 4 wins, 3 wins = 11/12 wins in 4 years.

Half the wins - double the compo? Puts it around the Saunders 10!!

Brisbane also had the Go Home 5. That put them in such a bad spot that they challenged 2016 Essendon for the spoon.
North losing more games isn't the only factor that will be considered to some BS priority selection

 

[The Nostradamus]

Lets compare the pair!!

Bris - 3 wins, 4wins, 7 wins, 10 wins = 24 wins in 4 years.
Roos - 2/3 wins, 2 wins, 4 wins, 3 wins = 11/12 wins in 4 years.

Half the wins - double the compo? Puts it around the Saunders 10!!

people dont quite realise just how bad we have been

its a modern day record one not to be proud of but at least we will be compensated as a result

 

[briztoon]

Lets compare the pair!!

Bris - 3 wins, 4wins, 7 wins, 10 wins = 24 wins in 4 years.
Roos - 2/3 wins, 2 wins, 4 wins, 3 wins = 11/12 wins in 4 years.

Half the wins - double the compo? Puts it around the Saunders 10!!

I feel like you need to add the years.
Bris.
2015 4 wins. 17th
2016 3 wins. 17th
2017 5 wins. 18th

But we also got pillaged in 2013 by the Victorian & WA clubs, with 5 young players “going home”. Then lost our 2013 first round pick in 2015 to Collingwood.

 

[The Nostradamus]

I feel like you need to add the years.
Bris.
2015 4 wins. 17th
2016 3 wins. 17th
2017 5 wins. 18th

But we also got pillaged in 2013 by the Victorian & WA clubs, with 5 young players “going home”. Then lost our 2013 first round pick in 2015 to Collingwood.

thats only 3 years - to which we were 9 wins in 3 seasons compared to your 12 wins

you're missing a 4th year to compare to our 11 wins over 4 seasons, the big compo is due to 4 years of this not 3

 

[Red Black and Blue]

If North get pick 3 and Sanders this will be the biggest disgrace in draft history I’ve ever seen. How can the league allow this? They’ve put themself in this hole. Just be irresponsible with poor list management and you’ll be rewarded.

See Port Adelaide standing up to the AFL. More clubs must follow. If I was a Hawthorn fan in a deep rebuild I would genuinely be fuming.

Good luck to any other club apart from GC and North rebuilding through this draft.

I said this will be the most compromised non expansion draft in history, well it’s going to be as close as those expansion drafts.

While I dont advocate for them getting assistance; In defence of North what other way is there? You can scrap your way to building a good list and get to the top 8 and your direct competition gets a free superstar with academy or father son, destroying your entire builds window. Unless you have some sort of regional advantage like Geelong to attract superstars, the only way is accumulating an immense about of elite talent and the only way you can force that is at the pointy end of the draft.

 

[briztoon]

thats only 3 years - to which we were 9 wins in 3 seasons compared to your 12 wins

you're missing a 4th year to compare to our 11 wins over 4 seasons, the big compo is due to 4 years of this not 3

And you keep ignoring the central part to your current predicament.

You did it to yourselves. And you keep doing it to yourselves.

You refuse to acknowledge or discuss this part of the discussion.


We weren’t sh!t in the fourth year (2019), because we traded in a heap of veterans and a Brownlow medallist at the end of 2018.

Also in 2014, after losing so many young players in 2013, and then taking an heap of kids in the 2013 draft, our list management team recognised we needed experienced veterans, and did their best to get whatever players were available. Mitch Robinson, Dayne Beams, Allen Christensen.

We traded out of the draft for experienced players.

 

[briztoon]

While I dont advocate for them getting assistance; In defence of North what other way is there? You can scrap your way to building a good list and get to the top 8 and your direct competition gets a free superstar with academy or father son, destroying your entire builds window. Unless you have some sort of regional advantage like Geelong to attract superstars, the only way is accumulating an immense about of elite talent and the only way you can force that is at the pointy end of the draft.

Stop drafting mids and forward flankers with high picks every draft between 2016 and 2022.

North have sooo much young talent, but it’s all in the same two areas of the ground.

 

[danielG]

And you keep ignoring the central part to your current predicament.

You did it to yourselves. And you keep doing it to yourselves.

You refuse to acknowledge or discuss this part of the discussion.


We weren’t sh!t in the fourth year (2019), because we traded in a heap of veterans and a Brownlow medallist at the end of 2018.

Also in 2014, after losing so many young players in 2013, and then taking an heap of kids in the 2013 draft, our list management team recognised we needed experienced veterans, and did their best to get whatever players were available. Mitch Robinson, Dayne Beams, Allen Christensen.

We traded out of the draft for experienced players.

The FA compo was always going to be manipulated this way at some point. I remember years ago thinking how easy it would be to contrive a result like this. It’s putrid really.. FA compo shouldn’t be top 10 pick.. It’s too much.. The Sanders pre selection on top of that is just mind boggling.. North need a asterisk next to any success they have because it’s being handed to them on a platter..

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Stop drafting mids and forward flankers with high picks every draft between 2016 and 2022.

North have sooo much young talent, but it’s all in the same two areas of the ground.

Talls taken by brisbane with high draft picks in the last 12 years: Hipwood and Gardiner.

How would that have solved their problems?

 

[The Nostradamus]

And you keep ignoring the central part to your current predicament.

You did it to yourselves. And you keep doing it to yourselves.

You refuse to acknowledge or discuss this part of the discussion.


We weren’t sh!t in the fourth year (2019), because we traded in a heap of veterans and a Brownlow medallist at the end of 2018.

Also in 2014, after losing so many young players in 2013, and then taking an heap of kids in the 2013 draft, our list management team recognised we needed experienced veterans, and did their best to get whatever players were available. Mitch Robinson, Dayne Beams, Allen Christensen.

We traded out of the draft for experienced players.

Most teams do it to themselves and doesn’t matter If a team does it to themselves or not

No team has had a worse win loss record and if they did then I’d be open to them getting compensated

Especially If they never had a first round priority pick like north

 

[The 747]

If North get pick 3 and Sanders this will be the biggest disgrace in draft history I’ve ever seen. How can the league allow this? They’ve put themself in this hole. Just be irresponsible with poor list management and you’ll be rewarded.

See Port Adelaide standing up to the AFL. More clubs must follow. If I was a Hawthorn fan in a deep rebuild I would genuinely be fuming.

Good luck to any other club apart from GC and North rebuilding through this draft.

I said this will be the most compromised non expansion draft in history, well it’s going to be as close as those expansion drafts.

The biggest disgrace in draft history? You not just mad at North?

 

[sydney_gws]

North should get s**t and the draft should be uncompromised. No more academes and father sons.

I think northern academies stay. Remove 20 % discount, can only use 2 picks to match, then everything comes off first rounders.
Father son, same rules but maybe 5 to 10% discount.
And for free agents, make the signing club pay some of the compensation. But free agent compo can not include top 10 picks, the most someone can get is pick 11. Clubs have to manage them so they don't get to free agency ( year 8 ) unsigned. And for a free agent after 10 years, the best compo pick is pick 19.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

If someone offers 800k for McKay then sure no issue. But pre-listing a kid who isn't even in their academy at the moment irks me a bit given the players they have pulled from the Geelong academy.

 

[PenAndPaper]

If North get pick 3 and Sanders this will be the biggest disgrace in draft history I’ve ever seen. How can the league allow this? They’ve put themself in this hole. Just be irresponsible with poor list management and you’ll be rewarded.

See Port Adelaide standing up to the AFL. More clubs must follow. If I was a Hawthorn fan in a deep rebuild I would genuinely be fuming.

Good luck to any other club apart from GC and North rebuilding through this draft.

I said this will be the most compromised non expansion draft in history, well it’s going to be as close as those expansion drafts.

I'd say Essendon getting pick 1 after systematically doping would be up there

 

[The Nostradamus]

If someone offers 800k for McKay then sure no issue. But pre-listing a kid who isn't even in their academy at the moment irks me a bit given the players they have pulled from the Geelong academy.

He’s been in our academy since he was 14

For some reason they haven’t officially announced nga eligible players for us this year (not just him but all our former nga players)
But this guy is indigenous and should still be part of our academy

 

[CatToTheFuture]

He’s been in our academy since he was 14

For some reason they haven’t officially announced nga eligible players for us this year (not just him but all our former nga players)
But this guy is indigenous and should still be part of our academy

We've had kids that were in our academy at 14 and taken away from us. I don't really mind too much if he stays in your academy too. But pre-listing so others can't bid is a bit s***.

 

[Makeshift Park]

So it took us getting pick 3 FA compo and Sanders for all you poor romantics to realise the draft is rigged.

I mean really, where will this madness end?

What's next: unfair shenanigans with the fixture?

But sure, lets keep making a scapegoat of the latest club to derive a quirky benefit from this provincial entertainment brand we call the AFL, rather than directing our frustrations at the executives who have never made integrity or transparency a priority.

 

[bluespooner]

Is that meant to be a sledge? Some of his stuff is awesome - unless you're a vegan, a man playing in the Womens world cup or an orange oil protester.

I thought north were going to show the AFL that they meant business when they rejected the AFL relocation package of picks and financial security by going to the GC. Currently, north are begging for PPs; trying to get the AFL to breach the NGA rules by having Ryley Sanders listed in a sham arrangement to their academy (in itself a sham, as Hawthorn had played in Tas since 2001 putting money into junior development and the York Park redevelopment; where north has done zilch) and receive the highest AFL distribution of all the Victorian clubs.

So, I guess north really showed the AFL and it has turned out the way most would have predicted, with your club becoming a dead weight on the competition. I'm surprised the shockingly compromised purple hasn't written one of his crap articles about how north shedding experience back in 2015/16 has effectively meant that the club tanked - he seems to be selective on clubs he labels as tanking dependent on who he supports.

 

[Red Black and Blue]

I think northern academies stay. Remove 20 % discount, can only use 2 packs to match, then everything comes off first rounders.
Father son, same rules but maybe 5 to 10% discount.
And for free agents, make the signing club pay some of the compensation. But free agent compo can not include top 10 picks, the most someone can get is pick 11. Clubs have to manage them so they don't get to free agency ( year 8 ) unsigned. And for a free agent after 10 years, the best compo pick is pick 19.

Nah. The whole reason the other academies were brought in was because of how unbalanced the talent influx from the Northern academies was.

Gold Coast have been bribing others to take their contracted players. GWS list was so bloated with talent they couldnt even fit Coniglio in their midfield for a few years until Taranto left.

Talent retention isnt the problem anymore.

The ability to rebuild through the draft has been destroyed and should be prioirty one to repair.

 

[Makeshift Park]

I thought north were going to show the AFL that they meant business when they rejected the AFL relocation package of picks and financial security by going to the GC. Currently, north are begging for PPs; trying to get the AFL to breach the NGA rules by having Ryley Sanders listed in a sham arrangement to their academy (in itself a sham, as Hawthorn had played in Tas since 2001 putting money into junior development and the York Park redevelopment; where north has done zilch) and receive the highest AFL distribution of all the Victorian clubs.

So, I guess north really showed the AFL and it has turned out the way most would have predicted, with your club becoming a dead weight on the competition. I'm surprised the shockingly compromised purple hasn't written one of his crap articles about how north shedding experience back in 2015/16 has effectively meant that the club tanked - he seems to be selective on clubs he labels as tanking dependent on who he supports.

Would you say it'd be preferable for us to get a priority pick after staging "deliberate, elaborate and sophisticated" salary cap breaches instead?

Wouldn't happen to know any auditors from the big 4 with questionable professional scruples who could lend us a hand on that front, would you?

 

[Crow till I die]

people dont quite realise just how bad we have been

its a modern day record one not to be proud of but at least we will be compensated as a result

My take is that another youngster is not helping north get competitive next year which is the whole cux of the problem. Not only that , it seems they are going to lose one of their best KPD's exactly hen they should not be losing players like that.

Forget draft concessions, the AFL should offer 5 years worth of salary cap concessions to allow them to outbid rivals for players and offer big coin so they can get in the mature quality players to go with the hatful of top end drafted kids they already have. Let them work out how to deal with the salary cap falling back in line in the medium to longer term but for example, if they could have offered - and its just an example, Himmelberg and Redman $1 mil each for 5 years this year, they are blowing the other clubs out of the water and no doubt land both - far better for next year in terms of quality, leadership, experience etc than an 18 year old kid (remembering they are already getting the pick 2 kid from their draft position anyway)

The net effect of this is that it does not penalise the other rebuilding bottom ranked clubs at the draft and offers a way for them to bring in the exact type of players they need for the here and now and going forward.

Just my 2 bobs worth

 

[briztoon]

Talls taken by brisbane with high draft picks in the last 12 years: Hipwood and Gardiner.

How would that have solved their problems?

Schache & McStay.

Schache didn't work out.

McStay is a good role player and is missed (by some).

We (Lions) need to be prioritising talls this draft (with our currently weak draft hand). We might have a couple in our academy in next years draft.

 

[Turbocat]

Ess offer a 2 year deal on 900 ... not much different to several lopsided deals. 900 triggers band1 and then later additional years are added that smooths the payment.


Sanders as a player that is beyond the bid process is a good piece of assistance

My only issue is the loading up of talent thru the draft does nothing for years. One might say North already have a lot of early pick talent. Add West Coast who look to be ready to clean house we are still going to have a couple of teams that are fringe afl standard and very vulnerable to injuries.

 

[Makeshift Park]

My only issue is the loading up of talent thru the draft does nothing for years.

Same could be said for just about any draft assistance. Another reason why draft assistance is dumb.
Surely the AFL know this though. I wonder whether they just do it to give the club a bit of a sugar hit and retain a bit of supporter interest by selling hope when all looks pretty gloomy.

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Schache & McStay.

Schache didn't work out.

McStay is a good role player and is missed (by some).

We (Lions) need to be prioritising talls this draft (with our currently weak draft hand). We might have a couple in our academy in next years draft.

So thats 4, North have taken 5 inside the first two rounds in the same time. McKay, Comben, Nielson, Watson and Durdin.

Considering none of them for either have been very good. It clearly isnt a guaranteed winning strategy and played little part in your success.