Opinion Bloods' leadership - 2024 and beyond

[Grand Uncle Horace]

For me at least our best on field leaders have always combined lead by example, high footy IQ, high quality empathic and natural teaching skills among other quality values. All have a good voice on and off the field and have team and bravery branded into their footy DNA.

In 2023 we have three current greats of the Club as co-captains and a mix of blokes on the LG.

Irrespective of where and maybe more importantly how we finish in 2023, I reckon it is important we look ahead. Our future prospects rely on those 26 and under.

I would ask Parker and Rampe to step aside as co-captains but along with Lloyd assume the new role of Honoured On and Off field mentors. Each of the three are not naturally endowed with A Grade talent but raised their performances to these levels through bloody hard work. In the off and pre-season, I'd ask each to take on three mentors and I'd top their contracts by $90k each.-

• Parker - takes on Sheldrick, Roberts and Konstanty
• Lloyd - takes on Magor, JMac, Corey W
• Rampe - takes on Edwards, Arnold and Buller

I'd have two Captains in Mills and Gulden. Latter is controversial but he is already an on field leader, very articulate off field and could easily wear the gutsy bloodied helmet of a Kirk or Bolton.

My vice captains would be Tom McCartin

30

Tom Mccartin

Age

24

Ht

194cm

Wt

99kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.3

2star

K

5.6

2star

HB

3.7

3star

M

3.7

4star

T

1.6

4star

MG

129.5

2star

D

7.2

2star

K

4.4

2star

HB

2.8

2star

M

3.2

3star

T

0.8

1star

MG

87.4

2star

D

9.0

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

4.0

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.0

4star

MG

168.0

3star

and Hayden McLean

2

Hayden Mclean

Age

25

Ht

197cm

Wt

99kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.1

2star

K

5.1

2star

HB

4.0

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

4.0

5star

G

0.4

3star

D

7.5

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.3

4star

G

0.8

4star

D

10.0

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

4.6

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

4.4

5star

G

0.2

3star

. Both are very smart and exemplify the values of hard work.

I would abandon the broader participation ribbon LG model that is currently in place.

Your thoughts?

 

[kickthething]

For me at least our best on field leaders have always combined lead by example, high footy IQ, high quality empathic and natural teaching skills among other quality values. All have a good voice on and off the field and have team and bravery branded into their footy DNA.

In 2023 we have three current greats of the Club as co-captains and a mix of blokes on the LG.

Irrespective of where and maybe more importantly how we finish in 2023, I reckon it is important we look ahead. Our future prospects rely on those 26 and under.

I would ask Parker and Rampe to step aside as co-captains but along with Lloyd assume the new role of Honoured On and Off field mentors. Each of the three are not naturally endowed with A Grade talent but raised their performances to these levels through bloody hard work. In the off and pre-season, I'd ask each to take on three mentors and I'd top their contracts by $90k each.-

• Parker - takes on Sheldrick, Roberts and Konstanty
• Lloyd - takes on Magor, JMac, Corey W
• Rampe - takes on Edwards, Arnold and Buller

I'd have two Captains in Mills and Gulden. Latter is controversial but he is already an on field leader, very articulate off field and could easily wear the gutsy bloodied helmet of a Kirk or Bolton.

My vice captains would be Tom McCartin and Hayden McLean. Both are very smart and exemplify the values of hard work.

I would abandon the broader participation ribbon LG model that is currently in place.

Your thoughts?

Reasoned, good thoughts and provides a strong discussion base. I have one question about Gulden. I am not sure if I see him as a leader who needs the weight of the official role. I feel some players, and I am learning toward him being one, need the freedom from captaincy and as result will be a stronger leader for the team. Parker/Mills provide the 'captain' style of leadership if you like. People engage and follow them. Gulden I think is a player where I feel the team watch rather than follow. Not sure if I am getting my thoughts across as clear as I would like, however its not a knock of Gulden of course, its a comment on how I think leadership and he go together.

 

[GoTheSwannies]

I'd personally give Gulden a couple more years and then make him sole captain. Or alternatively, have a transition period where he and Mills are co-captains until Mills steps down.

He's just had a breakout year, he'll attract more attention next year and will need to work his way through being tagged more consistently next year. I feel like the captaincy would add unnecessary additional weight that may impact his ability to focus on his own game, particularly if he starts the season with some uncharacteristic poor performances.

So ideally we'd shield him from that potentially happening and make him captain once he's even more established as a player.

My 2c

Edit: just thought I'd mention. I thought your suggestion was well thought out and a great suggestion. Just that I think it would be beneficial for Gulden to wait another year or two before we give him the responsibility.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Reasoned, good thoughts and provides a strong discussion base. I have one question about Gulden. I am not sure if I see him as a leader who needs the weight of the official role. I feel some players, and I am learning toward him being one, need the freedom from captaincy and as result will be a stronger leader for the team. Parker/Mills provide the 'captain' style of leadership if you like. People engage and follow them. Gulden I think is a player where I feel the team watch rather than follow. Not sure if I am getting my thoughts across as clear as I would like, however its not a knock of Gulden of course, its a comment on how I think leadership and he go together.

Thanks. Yep your points are fair re Gulden.

I guess I am persuaded by seeing his on field clear direction. Horse reckons he and McLean are the two hardest workers at the Club. I really value that.

 

[kickthething]

Thanks. Yep your points are fair re Gulden.

I guess I am persuaded by seeing his on field clear direction. Horse reckons he and McLean are the two hardest workers at the Club. I really value that.

Yep, agree. Its going to be interesting to see who starts to get annointed...is it even worth considering a Rowbottom type. As a fearless, no nonsense leader who drives standards....I can see him being that. Players like Gulden and Blakey may be LG candidates. McLean is an interesting one, imagine that story if it evolved that way. Is Warner a likely captain type. Not now of course but moving forward? He could be but also may be a bit similar to Gulden. Gulden, off the top of my head, is a much stronger two way player that Chad, I would like to see Chad impose himself more without the ball to really elevate to be in this type of discussion.

I do actually think Gulden will be in this discussion for some time and likely atm be the one. I am sure it will be long discussed.

Who knows , the next captain of the Swans may not be playing for us yet?

 

[caesar88]

I think next year will have Parker & Mills as co-captains. A leadership group of Rampe, Lloyd, Cunningham, Papley, Heeney, Hayward & Gulden.

I think it's only a matter of time before Blakey & McCartin are added, while my smokeys would be Florent and McInerney.

 

[Kiama Chris]

For me at least our best on field leaders have always combined lead by example, high footy IQ, high quality empathic and natural teaching skills among other quality values. All have a good voice on and off the field and have team and bravery branded into their footy DNA.

In 2023 we have three current greats of the Club as co-captains and a mix of blokes on the LG.

Irrespective of where and maybe more importantly how we finish in 2023, I reckon it is important we look ahead. Our future prospects rely on those 26 and under.

I would ask Parker and Rampe to step aside as co-captains but along with Lloyd assume the new role of Honoured On and Off field mentors. Each of the three are not naturally endowed with A Grade talent but raised their performances to these levels through bloody hard work. In the off and pre-season, I'd ask each to take on three mentors and I'd top their contracts by $90k each.-

• Parker - takes on Sheldrick, Roberts and Konstanty
• Lloyd - takes on Magor, JMac, Corey W
• Rampe - takes on Edwards, Arnold and Buller

I'd have two Captains in Mills and Gulden. Latter is controversial but he is already an on field leader, very articulate off field and could easily wear the gutsy bloodied helmet of a Kirk or Bolton.

My vice captains would be Tom McCartin and Hayden McLean. Both are very smart and exemplify the values of hard work.

I would abandon the broader participation ribbon LG model that is currently in place.

Your thoughts?

Really thoughtful contribution Uncle, and a lot to recommend it. Formalising mentorship I think is a great way to go. kickthething comments are also worth consideration.
In my old business life mentoring was considered very important in bringing people on in their personal skills. Rhyce Shaw was considered a terrific mentor. It isn't something that everyone can be good at but I believe the people you mentioned would be. There are courses that are helpful too.
Cheer cheer mate, well done!

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Campbell

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Really thoughtful contribution Uncle, and a lot to recommend it. Formalising mentorship I think is a great way to go. kickthething comments are also worth consideration.
In my old business life mentoring was considered very important in bringing people on in their personal skills. Rhyce Shaw was considered a terrific mentor. It isn't something that everyone can be good at but I believe the people you mentioned would be. There are courses that are helpful too.
Cheer cheer mate, well done!

Thanks. Your comments struck a chord with me. In the last decade of full time work I was bored rigid with managing people and functions but my employers wanted to keep me. I was lucky to have pretty much an in house policy consultancy role where if necessary and there was a sizeable issue I could select project teams to work with.

I also took on formal mentoring roles with heaps of whip smart young people. I loved that and the youngsters helped kept me sharp. Invariably the mentoring included how to prep for meetings inc getting a position authorised, tactics and how to analyse outcomes and how to deal with wins, losses, setbacks and build working relationships etc.

The nature of the work these kids did often involved writing about difficult issues for which there was no straightforward responses, let alone answers.

Often their work would be red inked by their bosses- often to their frustration. One technique I used was to get them to red ink a piece I had written. They always had a ball red inking my stuff but their take away was that they and I did not own the product and the best product was often a team effort.

Imagine the value a Konstanty would get sitting with Parker and going through vision from both their recent games. Each would critique their own and the others game.

What would a JK or Gus say in response to Luke’s famous shrug to Dylan Shiel when the Dons were going through the motions? My work equivalent was cancelling and rescheduling a meeting on a complex matter 15 minutes after it started because it was clear some participants from other orgs had not read the papers and were ill prepared. Like Luke I copped blow back but the outcome was no one coming to meetings I chaired arrived without doing their homework.

Who knows how Luke interprets his famous shrug? For me it was saying the great game has to be played with honour and bravery and that day the Dons were not prepared and dishonouring the game. The unintended consequence may have been the Dons now try harder when playing against the Bloods and Luke in particular.

Haha… it took until I read your comments that I realised how much my own experience as a mentor had informed the OP.

 

[Kiama Chris]

Thanks. Your comments struck a chord with me. In the last decade of full time work I was bored rigid with managing people and functions but my employers wanted to keep me. I was lucky to have pretty much an in house policy consultancy role where if necessary and there was a sizeable issue I could select project teams to work with.

I also took on formal mentoring roles with heaps of whip smart young people. I loved that and the youngsters helped kept me sharp. Invariably the mentoring included how to prep for meetings inc getting a position authorised, tactics and how to analyse outcomes and how to deal with wins, losses, setbacks and build working relationships etc.

The nature of the work these kids did often involved writing about difficult issues for which there was no straightforward responses, let alone answers.

Often their work would be red inked by their bosses- often to their frustration. One technique I used was to get them to red ink a piece I had written. They always had a ball red inking my stuff but their take away was that they and I did not own the product and the best product was often a team effort.

Imagine the value a Konstanty would get sitting with Parker and going through vision from both their recent games. Each would critique their own and the others game.

What would a JK or Gus say in response to Luke’s famous shrug to Dylan Shiel when the Dons were going through the motions? My work equivalent was cancelling and rescheduling a meeting on a complex matter 15 minutes after it started because it was clear some participants from other orgs had not read the papers and were ill prepared. Like Luke I copped blow back but the outcome was no one coming to meetings I chaired arrived without doing their homework.

Who knows how Luke interprets his famous shrug? For me it was saying the great game has to be played with honour and bravery and that day the Dons were not prepared and dishonouring the game. The unintended consequence may have been the Dons now try harder when playing against the Bloods and Luke in particular.

Haha… it took until I read your comments that I realised how much my own experience as a mentor had informed the OP.

Fantastic! I had some similar experience, though not perhaps as fulfilling as that as I had hands on management responsibilities up until the end. What you describe with a senior and junior player or players debriefing a period of play is ideal IMO. We often think that only coaches should do that sort of thing but that's nonsense. Young players can get a lot from interacting with the guys they look up to.
The thing I particularly liked about your post was taking a fresh look at player leadership and how to get the most out of it.

 

[Wolftone]

For me at least our best on field leaders have always combined lead by example, high footy IQ, high quality empathic and natural teaching skills among other quality values. All have a good voice on and off the field and have team and bravery branded into their footy DNA.

In 2023 we have three current greats of the Club as co-captains and a mix of blokes on the LG.

Irrespective of where and maybe more importantly how we finish in 2023, I reckon it is important we look ahead. Our future prospects rely on those 26 and under.

I would ask Parker and Rampe to step aside as co-captains but along with Lloyd assume the new role of Honoured On and Off field mentors. Each of the three are not naturally endowed with A Grade talent but raised their performances to these levels through bloody hard work. In the off and pre-season, I'd ask each to take on three mentors and I'd top their contracts by $90k each.-

• Parker - takes on Sheldrick, Roberts and Konstanty
• Lloyd - takes on Magor, JMac, Corey W
• Rampe - takes on Edwards, Arnold and Buller

I'd have two Captains in Mills and Gulden. Latter is controversial but he is already an on field leader, very articulate off field and could easily wear the gutsy bloodied helmet of a Kirk or Bolton.

My vice captains would be Tom McCartin and Hayden McLean. Both are very smart and exemplify the values of hard work.

I would abandon the broader participation ribbon LG model that is currently in place.

Your thoughts?

I think Parker goes forward last season. I think he could be the missing link there. Parker for Clarke forward. Grundy to the ruck, Sheldrick & Roberts to the mids. We apparently have interest in Harmes, who will likely end up at Essendon. Jordan was poor in the final against Carlton. Do we take a chance on him?

Yes, leadership is important. When Rampe & all talls were out I thought lloyd would have taken hold of the young backs but he didn't. Either him, Fox or Harry. But none of them did. I am not so sure of his leadership skills. Ramps is proven. He will do well but I fail to see why Buller is on that list. He is a forward and will probably stay so after being able to rack up some good numbers toward the end of the season.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

I think Parker goes forward last season. I think he could be the missing link there. Parker for Clarke forward. Grundy to the ruck, Sheldrick & Roberts to the mids. We apparently have interest in Harmes, who will likely end up at Essendon. Jordan was poor in the final against Carlton. Do we take a chance on him?

Yes, leadership is important. When Rampe & all talls were out I thought lloyd would have taken hold of the young backs but he didn't. Either him, Fox or Harry. But none of them did. I am not so sure of his leadership skills. Ramps is proven. He will do well but I fail to see why Buller is on that list. He is a forward and will probably stay so after being able to rack up some good numbers toward the end of the season.

Had Ramps as a mentor for Buller as don’t have any tall forward mentors on the List. As a champion defender and smart fella he knows heaps about forward craft craft having defended it for a decade. I reckon he would be a great mentor for Jack.

 

[Kiama Chris]

Had Ramps as a mentor for Buller as don’t have any tall forward mentors on the List. As a champion defender and smart fella he knows heaps about forward craft craft having defended it for a decade. I reckon he would be a great mentor for Jack.

A mentor is more about getting the best out of yourself and your teammates than how you play the game. The important thing is that the mentor has experience, is respected, communicates well and so on. Any specific knowledge is a bonus.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

A mentor is more about getting the best out of yourself and your teammates than how you play the game. The important thing is that the mentor has experience, is respected, communicates well and so on. Any specific knowledge is a bonus.

Ramps ticks all those boxes.

 

[Kiama Chris]

Ramps ticks all those boxes.

Absolutely. I agree with your other two as well in Parker and Lloyd. Another I would consider would be Cunningham.

 

[wills2g]

rampe shouldnt be captain next season

parker and mills lucky to stay captains mainly because there isnt anyone else ready to take the role

 

[The King!]

I think our leadership has been pretty ordinary the last few years. Rampe is a brain fart expert at times, he is a stellar player for sure. Parker plays hide and seek in big moments, Mills I thought lacked a bit last year. Guys like Papley Hayward Heeney all are a bit flakey or me me me.

I miss the Kennedy mcveigh goodes shaw richards bolton grundy type leaders we had.

We go to water a bit under pressure and I think that is on field leadership.


Obviously hard to judge off field.

I think the multi captains thing is junk, I would just make Mills captain, Gulden vice. Not against the leadership group,

But yeah I think people here overrate Parker and Rampe as leaders

 

[Crust]

Went to an away GWS game a couple of years back, sat in the outer with about two other people and a brown dog. Because of this I could hear the players quite clearly. Rampe never stopped talking - sending players to position, encouraging, telling some to stay out, calling some in ....everything. By the end of the game he was hoarse.
He is our backline general and that's why he is in the leadership group, and deserves to be.

 

[Kiama Chris]

Went to an away GWS game a couple of years back, sat in the outer with about two other people and a brown dog. Because of this I could hear the players quite clearly. Rampe never stopped talking - sending players to position, encouraging, telling some to stay out, calling some in ....everything. By the end of the game he was hoarse.
He is our backline general and that's why he is in the leadership group, and deserves to be.

Said it before, say it again. Replacing Rampe is a lot more than just replacing the player. Lloyd is experienced but not the same as a leader. Ditto Harry. Not sure where it will come from.

 

[bloodsbigot]

Not sure where it will come from.

Ohhhh Errol.

 

[Kiama Chris]

Ohhhh Errol.

Not in defence I hope! Mills?

 

[Big Blood]

Dump Rampe, game's gone past him. Dump Mills, has some growing up to do.

Maybe stay with Parker for continuity.

The obvious candidate is Papley. He's our barometer and gamebreaker already - the roles that vastly more talented players like Heeney and Mills should be playing. We all love his passion and intensity and he has the ability to bring it when the team needs him. Paps for cap'n for mine.

Rowbo and Blakey not far away.

Gulden's the long-term captain. He'll be in the leadership group next year, but give him a couple more years before we thrust captainncy on him.

 

[wills2g]

Dump Rampe, game's gone past him. Dump Mills, has some growing up to do.

Maybe stay with Parker for continuity.

The obvious candidate is Papley. He's our barometer and gamebreaker already - the roles that vastly more talented players like Heeney and Mills should be playing. We all love his passion and intensity and he has the ability to bring it when the team needs him. Paps for cap'n for mine.

Rowbo and Blakey not far away.

Gulden's the long-term captain. He'll be in the leadership group next year, but give him a couple more years before we thrust captainncy on him.

Paps selfish at times & loves a good roast at his team mates when they make even a small mistake

 

[caesar88]

A bit of chatter recently about our captaincy. I'm just gonna say any suggestion Mills give it up is absurd, but with our two other co-captains on the wrong side of 30, it did get me thinking about who we have under Mills in the potential captain department.

Gulden gets there one day, obviously not yet, but among all the rest under Mills who would be considered candidates - Blakey, Papley, Warner, Hayward, McCartin, McInerney - none of them scream captaincy to me in the really obvious way that Mills did, or that Parker did before him. Then again, I guess Rampe didn't either and he turned out great.

 

[sataris]

A bit of chatter recently about our captaincy. I'm just gonna say any suggestion Mills give it up is absurd, but with our two other co-captains on the wrong side of 30, it did get me thinking about who we have under Mills in the potential captain department.

Gulden gets there one day, obviously not yet, but among all the rest under Mills who would be considered candidates - Blakey, Papley, Warner, Hayward, McCartin, McInerney - none of them scream captaincy to me in the really obvious way that Mills did, or that Parker did before him. Then again, I guess Rampe didn't either and he turned out great.

I can see Grundy doing it eventually.