Analysis Bloods' Performance Discussion 2022

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GoTheSwannies

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I don't care what people say, whether Joey played for 1.5 quarters or whatever, whether or not he was fresher than others, doesn't make a difference to me, Joey was playing for his life on Monday. I don't really care, the main thing for me was he was being played in position. I've said it before, but Kennedy needs to spend time in the middle, probably not the whole game, but he needs to play periods in the middle where he's playing to his strengths and can have a positive impact for the team.

There's a balance to be struck between playing to Joey's strengths, and developing our youth. It's pretty straight forward imo, the coaching staff just need to adjust their plan, and get Joey into the middle throughout the game.

You could see the competitive fire was still burning for him, he was hunting the ball like a man possessed.

I don't think I've ever questioned the swans coaching team and have always backed their decisions. But this is a situation where I'll be watching closely.
 

caesar88

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Apr 26, 2016
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I don't care what people say, whether Joey played for 1.5 quarters or whatever, whether or not he was fresher than others, doesn't make a difference to me, Joey was playing for his life on Monday. I don't really care, the main thing for me was he was being played in position. I've said it before, but Kennedy needs to spend time in the middle, probably not the whole game, but he needs to play periods in the middle where he's playing to his strengths and can have a positive impact for the team.

There's a balance to be struck between playing to Joey's strengths, and developing our youth. It's pretty straight forward imo, the coaching staff just need to adjust their plan, and get Joey into the middle throughout the game.

You could see the competitive fire was still burning for him, he was hunting the ball like a man possessed.

I don't think I've ever questioned the swans coaching team and have always backed their decisions. But this is a situation where I'll be watching closely.

IMO yes we need to have an eye to the future, but I believe the flag is up for grabs this year. One bad night or a handful of injuries to Melbourne and the flag will be there for the taking for whoever the next best team in line is. The only reason I would doubt us being able to be that team is not having enough consistency, experience and composure in the midfield. JPK offers all three of these things in spades. So I see the importance of investing in the youth, but we shouldn't sacrifice the chance at giving the flag a red hot shake by giving opportunities to younger mids who don't make the most of them.
 

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caesar88

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Something that I think has me feeling optimistic about the remainder of the year ahead is how much upside there is in the team. Last year by season's end I had counted just three Swans players who made regular/semi-regular senior appearances whose trajectory stagnated or declined (Rampe, Rowbottom, Stephens.) It was such an incredible year of consistency and/or improvement across the whole playing group.

This year I would argue there are eleven who have either stagnated* or declined: Stephens, McDonald, Cunningham, Rowbottom, Hayward, Kennedy, Florent, Wicks, Reid, Rampe and Lloyd.

If even just a few of those guys can reverse that trend and turn their seasons in a positive direction, then we will be an even better side than we already are. And I think it will be needed, as the rest are doing their bit, and it is now up to that group to provide the aforementioned improvement.

*In the context of kids like Stephens & McDonald, I don't mean stagnation as a negative or a criticism of them. I just mean they haven't yet taken that next step in their performance.
 

rustycrate

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Something that I think has me feeling optimistic about the remainder of the year ahead is how much upside there is in the team. Last year by season's end I had counted just three Swans players who made regular/semi-regular senior appearances whose trajectory stagnated or declined (Rampe, Rowbottom, Stephens.) It was such an incredible year of consistency and/or improvement across the whole playing group.

This year I would argue there are eleven who have either stagnated* or declined: Stephens, McDonald, Cunningham, Rowbottom, Hayward, Kennedy, Florent, Wicks, Reid, Rampe and Lloyd.

If even just a few of those guys can reverse that trend and turn their seasons in a positive direction, then we will be an even better side than we already are. And I think it will be needed, as the rest are doing their bit, and it is now up to that group to provide the aforementioned improvement.

*In the context of kids like Stephens & McDonald, I don't mean stagnation as a negative or a criticism of them. I just mean they haven't yet taken that next step in their performance.
How do you measure trajectory as stagnated or declined?
 

Kapers

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Sep 25, 2019
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Something that I think has me feeling optimistic about the remainder of the year ahead is how much upside there is in the team. Last year by season's end I had counted just three Swans players who made regular/semi-regular senior appearances whose trajectory stagnated or declined (Rampe, Rowbottom, Stephens.) It was such an incredible year of consistency and/or improvement across the whole playing group.

This year I would argue there are eleven who have either stagnated* or declined: Stephens, McDonald, Cunningham, Rowbottom, Hayward, Kennedy, Florent, Wicks, Reid, Rampe and Lloyd.

If even just a few of those guys can reverse that trend and turn their seasons in a positive direction, then we will be an even better side than we already are. And I think it will be needed, as the rest are doing their bit, and it is now up to that group to provide the aforementioned improvement.

*In the context of kids like Stephens & McDonald, I don't mean stagnation as a negative or a criticism of them. I just mean they haven't yet taken that next step in their performance.
I would have to agree.

I think we focus too much on what we don't have (I myself am in favour of bringing in a tall defender), the fact of the matter is that if we see improvements from a few players we can still win.
 

Kapers

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I also wonder how the team is dealing with the changing roles. It's like Horse saw how Blakey blossomed in a position after being moved around, and said, "can we do this to everyone?".

The only players im confident of seeing in position are Mills and McCartin. Feels like everyone else is being thrown about. Horse often talks about flexibility come big games, and I'm interested to see if he ever settles the team, or decides this is how he wants to do it.
 

GoTheSwannies

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The more I think about it, the clearer it becomes for me, but that Brisbane game is the blueprint for what we need to improve in order to be a genuine contender.

We played well, but Brisbane exposed a few deficiencies that we need to fix. This wasn't a loss where we had a few key players well below their best. We played well, we had a number of players who could do better, but as a whole, I felt like it was a fairly accurate depiction of where we're at compared to one of the two benchmark teams in the comp.

It was the same handful of players who squandered opportunities, or had a quiet game and failed to assert themselves and impact the result.

Imo, if the coaches and players study this game, and use the rest of the year to work through the deficiencies (and work on separating the wheat from the chaff), we'll go a long way to putting ourselves in a position to win the flag. And if we fail we did everything we could.

A couple of players were really below their best, and need to be called into question. Rampe, Lloyd, Reid, McLean.

A few others who had quiet games and can improve, mainly the younger guys who we need to take on more responsibility - mcinerney, rowbottom, Gulden, florent.

One player who really impressed me (apart from buddy) was Campbell, to me he showed he was ready for the fight. I look forward to seeing him in finals, I think he'll impress with his willingness to compete, even with his inexperience.
 

BloodySwan

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Progress isn't linear. It's something which improves over time rather than at each measurement.

Our inside midfield has seen a great improvement. We're getting a lot more of the ball first than we have in a long long time. Midfield is still very young but looking promising.

Forward 50 has looked promising at times and others been bland. We looked our best when Buddy wasn't there. I'd be happy if we pushed Buddy further up the ground and he played more of a CHF or HFF. Feels like we have 2 full forwards in McLean and Buddy

Defensive 50 is where we have really fallen flat. We have all the right pieces but have struggled in some games where we should have done a better job at keeping the ball out. Defence starts from the front, when we apply the right structures all over the ground our back 50 look better.

Overall our midfield has improved from last year but our defence and attack don't look as great as before. Neither feels like they've fallen off the wagon completely though
 

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Grand Uncle Horace

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I also wonder how the team is dealing with the changing roles. It's like Horse saw how Blakey blossomed in a position after being moved around, and said, "can we do this to everyone?".

The only players im confident of seeing in position are Mills and McCartin. Feels like everyone else is being thrown about. Horse often talks about flexibility come big games, and I'm interested to see if he ever settles the team, or decides this is how he wants to do it.

For years the Swans played a predictable system with people locked in to the same role. This worked when we were a pretty good team but increasingly became unpicked by other coaches. The declining influence of our same face midfield became obvious.

The advent of our new systems and the requirements of having people able to execute and some old champs in decline meant change.

I need to watch the replay of the third quarter and who was attending CB's during our period of dominance and then who attended from around the 12 minute mark when momentum shifted to the Brions.
 

Kapers

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Sep 25, 2019
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For years the Swans played a predictable system with people locked in to the same role. This worked when we were a pretty good team but increasingly became unpicked by other coaches. The declining influence of our same face midfield became obvious.

The advent of our new systems and the requirements of having people able to execute and some old champs in decline meant change.

I need to watch the replay of the third quarter and who was attending CB's during our period of dominance and then who attended from around the 12 minute mark when momentum shifted to the Brions.
I actually like the though process behind having a very fluid midfield.

But we have to recognise that it's very much going against the grain. The best teams have a set midfield and let them get used to each other. We seemingly have a different midfield each bounce.

We will either be creating a new way to structure midfields, or go back to the tried and true with our tail between our legs.
 

the hypnotoad

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Mar 7, 2021
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I actually like the though process behind having a very fluid midfield.

But we have to recognise that it's very much going against the grain. The best teams have a set midfield and let them get used to each other. We seemingly have a different midfield each bounce.

We will either be creating a new way to structure midfields, or go back to the tried and true with our tail between our legs.

there'll be no "tail between the legs", it'll be a process not necessarily of trial and error but working out which combination of players clicks best ...
the good thing is we're talking about a group of young players with outstanding skills and potential as a group
mills and parker are the core (certainly parker for the near-term), then working with gulden, mcinerney, warner, rowbottom, florent, campbell, possibly wicks at some point, stephens, sheldrick, maybe roberts ... most likely heeney has a role, whether permanent or rotating, same possibly goes for papley ... kennedy will fill gaps where required for this season, which i'm assuming is his last
that's how i'd see it over the next season or two
and this will also involve how we use hickey and ladhams
i know a few of those aren't specifically in midfield roles now but i include the running players such as mcinerney and warner
and i'd usually include blakey but he now seems well entrenched as the springboard from defence ... campbell is similar but i'm sure he'll end up in the middle
 

BloodySwan

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Oct 2, 2016
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I actually like the though process behind having a very fluid midfield.

But we have to recognise that it's very much going against the grain. The best teams have a set midfield and let them get used to each other. We seemingly have a different midfield each bounce.

We will either be creating a new way to structure midfields, or go back to the tried and true with our tail between our legs.
Having a more fluid midfield should mean:

1. Our midfield group can be changed depending on our opposition. We will be better at counteracting the opps midfield and getting the best matchup. This extends to our forward line, if Heeney is being blanketed in the 50 we move him to the wing

2. We should run out games. We'll last 4 quarters more often than not

3. We'll last the season better. When key midfielders go down we'll have more ready made replacements so the impact isn't felt as much

It does mean we will be slowing our immediate progress but our midfield has already improved upon last year. Hopefully it all clicks come September
 

Kapers

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Sep 25, 2019
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We can't win against teams that play man on man. We only do well against zone defences which gives our players room to kick.
We need more movement in the team. The one time we got a good transition was when Mill ran about 50m. We were unbelievably stationary today.
 

caesar88

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Apr 26, 2016
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Aside from the more fixed issues that I think will take a pre-season (or two) to improve on, like our hand skills and the aforementioned issues with our ball movement against man on man defences ^... I reckon Horse could maybe just loosen the reins on the kids a little. They appear a bit flat and lethargic, not offering the kind of youthful exuberance that they should be offering.

The most obvious example is Rowbottom. He's having his first year without injuries since he had a breakout season as a future gun, yet he's being asked to negate. Not surprising that he appears flat. Just let the kid do what he's always known and go after the ball.

But there are other examples. Gulden's role the last few weeks seem to be primarily about applying defensive pressure on HHF types. We've previously seen Florent playing an outlier role that didn't really utilise him but it was for the sake of structure around stoppages. Even Campbell... to me he's the one kid whose energy or intent hasn't seemed to dip once this year... maybe he's the injection of energy we need further up the ground around the ball rather than trying to shut down opponents who at this stage might be too good for him.

I get that to win a flag you need 22 blokes working together as a team, which means players playing a role and not just being able to all have their way. But I think given we're in something of a slump and a constant of this slump has been a lack of intensity, maybe for now we just have to go back to basics and get the kids actually enjoying their footy a bit more. And then their talent might shine through and speak for itself.
 

Punts

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John is a Fuxking idiot if he thinks bombing the ball at will gets you’s
 

Kapers

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It's a weird thing watching the Swans atm. Maybe it was impossible to avoid a drop off this year.
I was hoping for top 4, more consistency, and strong gameplan.
Right now we're are looking like an outside chance at best, less consistent (even from quarter to quarter), and I feel like we are playing to stop the opponent.

We are definitely in a slump, and I keep watching hoping things will click, but we seem to be getting worse each week. I imagine Longmire strip it all back this week.
 

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