Carlton's list

[doppleganger]

I think the commentators the other night noted he's one of the best contested marks in the comp.

Commentators are slow, the great Monkey was all over him based on 6 games in 2012.

Contested marks inside 50 are so 2012, it is now about running patterns and uncontested marks on the wing!

 

[JuddsABlue]

LoL avg goals means nothing due to the sample size, but Monkey can go on a thread killing rant about his contested mark avg from the same sample size!!

He is impacting the game more by winning less contested possessions, taking less contested marks, winning less HOs, having less inside 50s, taking less marks inside 50 and is less of a scoring threat than he was in 2012.

Monkey can do what he likes

The sample size from 2012 doesn't provide the bench mark here

He's played more games this year, is still putting up relatively close numbers over a larger sample playing a different role but has made obvious improvements in his kicking, even from the start of this year until now

If you want to shoot him down then that's fine, there are plenty of players in all teams I could do the same but I won't. We're very happy with casboults progress this year and he's a better player than he's ever been, it's evident just by watching him play

 

[Monkey King]

Commentators are slow, the great Monkey was all over him based on 6 games in 2012.

Contested marks inside 50 are so 2012, it is now about running patterns and uncontested marks on the wing!

You just gotta watch footy mate. I'd argue that he's actually a better contested mark now than he was in 2012. He definitely takes more pack marks of greater difficulty. That the role he plays now etc means he takes 0.4 less contested marks p/game doesn't change much. It's the folly of relying on stats alone.

 

[Monkey King]

LoL avg goals means nothing due to the sample size, but Monkey can go on a thread killing rant about his contested mark avg from the same sample size!!

You're mistaken. My comment on Casboult's marking prowess was based on observation. That certain Collingwood posters couldn't process the obvious meant that stats then had to be referred to. The small sample size was actually addressed in that thread as well btw. So there you go!

He is impacting the game more by winning less contested possessions, taking less contested marks, winning less HOs, having less inside 50s, taking less marks inside 50 and is less of a scoring threat than he was in 2012.

Winning less contested possessions - 0.2 - despite having fewer contested marks (i.e. wins more CP in general play). 0.2? Are you kidding? You must be kidding? How ridiculous. The guy has more disposals overall, takes more marks, lays more tackles, gets more clearances and has increased his DE% by 12%.

Yes, he is impacting games more now. That a handful of stats (some ridiculously negligible) have you baffled just highlights that you haven't seen enough of the bloke play from 2012 to now.

 

[CHIMP MAGNET]

Levi hasn't been omitted this year.

probably why carlton are below richmond on the ladder. certainly shows where their list is at. but at least levi has shown improvement. and more endeavour than tyrone this year, who only puts in against shit sides.

 

[etsal1]

probably why carlton are below richmond on the ladder. certainly shows where their list is at. but at least levi has shown improvement. and more endeavour than tyrone this year, who only puts in against shit sides.

Levi showing improvement and more endeavour is exactly why he hasn't been dropped. Not to mention he has played significantly less games in his career than Tyrone but is still showing more.

And being higher than us on the ladder isn't anything to hang your hat on. It's not that hard

 

[doppleganger]

You just gotta watch footy mate. I'd argue that he's actually a better contested mark now than he was in 2012. He definitely takes more pack marks of greater difficulty. That the role he plays now etc means he takes 0.4 less contested marks p/game doesn't change much. It's the folly of relying on stats alone.

You underestimate how enjoyable it is to watch Carlton play ordinary football! Might have seen quite a few of their games recently!

Yeah, you would isolate a pack mark against Hawthorn when the commentators start lavishing praise as your evidence, and then find some ridiculous stat off a small sample size to support your argument.

I can think of one team who needs a big KPF who can take contested marks inside 50 and create scoreboard pressure...

 

[Monkey King]

Yeah, you would isolate a pack mark against Hawthorn when the commentators start lavishing praise as your evidence, and then find some ridiculous stat off a small sample size to support your argument.

I can think of one team who needs a big KPF who can take contested marks inside 50 and create scoreboard pressure...

Bizarre post. I haven't isolated anything. But yes, I did note the commentators mentioned they thought Levi was one of, if not the, best pack mark in the game. You think that's my "evidence"? Pfft! It's an anecdote. I don't need evidence. I just need to watch the boy play. I suggest you do too.

 

[Monkey King]

probably why carlton are below richmond on the ladder.

Lulz. How many weeks you been waiting to say that? But you'd wanna get in quick. It's only by percentage and may change again by this time next week

 

[Captivating]

Carlton's list is OK, just poorly coached I'm afraid. MM just ain't the same coach he was. He can still coach good occasional games, but his style won't see Carlton succeed.

So he should stay on for 10 more years

 

[Gone Critical]

Monkey can do what he likes

The sample size from 2012 doesn't provide the bench mark here

He's played more games this year, is still putting up relatively close numbers over a larger sample playing a different role but has made obvious improvements in his kicking, even from the start of this year until now

If you want to shoot him down then that's fine, there are plenty of players in all teams I could do the same but I won't. We're very happy with casboults progress this year and he's a better player than he's ever been, it's evident just by watching him play

Lot of semantics being argued about Casboult. This is a much better summary. He is a relative rarity in that he is a relatively successful KPF off the rookie list. He has improved this year and is now a good role player. Although a different player his best role would be like Jesse White at Collingwood. 3rd Big forward and relieving ruck. The Leigh Brown role. Collingwood need Ben Reid back on the field for Jesse and Carlton need another better KPF for Levi. Don't think he has the tools to ever make a success of the main KPF role especially if Carlton ever became a top team.

 

[CHIMP MAGNET]

Lulz. How many weeks you been waiting to say that? But you'd wanna get in quick. It's only by percentage and may change again by this time next week

timed to perfection

 

[Beer n Skittles]

Lol yeah don't know what game you were watching.

But Yarran was shit like the last month.

Both coaches voted Yarran as 2nd BOG. You could maybe throw an edit in & change that to a McLean or Thomas or something

 

[peter9789]

Realistically how long before we think Carlton can regenerate their list to be a serious premiership threat? It's likely even if they were to perform miracles, that they could not be perceived as being any serious threat for 4-5 years (I know it's only speculation). This will be the era when we can expect the Northern based team (GWS / GCS) to start to dominate the landscape, so seriously Carlton fans may have a few more years to wait.

So having said that how many of the current list will be around to be part of the next serious finals campaign? Not many I'm guessing.

In my view, Carlton need to be bold (Captain obvious) this trade period to try and lure a key position forward. I would put Kruezer and Walker on the trade table and see if you get a nibble from GWS for a Patton / Boyd. Might be a bit of a stretch or maybe a Lynch from Gold Coast.

Frankly there are not that many other players on the list that would be worth a lot that Carlton would consider wanting to trade.

The difficulty is MM is not one to be to bold and will not want to trade someone like Kruezer who previously referred to as "untouchable"

Being a hindsight hero, getting Judd maybe really cost Carlton way more than they thought at the time. Having Kennedy in the forward line and Henderson at CHB has the beginnings of a strong spine.

 

[Fadge]

All this commentary about Levi Casboult - if he's the answer to Carlton's list deficiencies, I'd hate to know what the question is!

 

[Fadge]

Being a hindsight hero, getting Judd maybe really cost Carlton way more than they thought at the time. Having Kennedy in the forward line and Henderson at CHB has the beginnings of a strong spine.

This really is the elephant in the room.

If the Carlton hierarchy had a crystal ball at the end of 2007 and knew that they wouldn't make top four in any of the next seven years, and after 14 games in 2014 they would be sitting at 4 and 10, would the decision have been different?

One would hope so...

 

[Tippett2Goal]

This really is the elephant in the room.

If the Carlton hierarchy had a crystal ball at the end of 2007 and knew that they wouldn't make top four in any of the next seven years, and after 14 games in 2014 they would be sitting at 4 and 10, would the decision have been different?

One would hope so...

That's a false dichotomy though, as the consequence of not getting Judd could have been that they were like Melbourne for the last decade, and lost Murphy/Gibbs/Henderson/(Kennedy assuming they kept him instead of Judd) to other clubs who were looking like having success.

Judd was worth the trade at the time, and thats the only light in which it can be judged.

 

[Dave]

Criticise their list all you like, but Casboult (sp?) isn't one of the problems. Terrific contested mark & his kicking is improving, he's still a kid & looks to have a future.

 

[etsal1]

Criticise their list all you like, but Casboult (sp?) isn't one of the problems. Terrific contested mark & his kicking is improving, he's still a kid & looks to have a future.

Facts don't count when you get the chance to pot Carlton.

 

[Dave]

Facts don't count when you get the chance to pot Carlton.

Well, I can understand that, particularly here

 

[James44]

he's still a kid & looks to have a future.

He's 24.

 

[Dave]

He's 24.

Which is positively ancient.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Carlton's list is OK, just poorly coached I'm afraid. MM just ain't the same coach he was. He can still coach good occasional games, but his style won't see Carlton succeed.

So he should stay on for 10 more years

I think its the other way round - the list isn't that good and Malthouse is getting quite a lot out of them

Carlton been more than competitive last month but just lack quality

 

[hutchy31]

I think its the other way round - the list isn't that good and Malthouse is getting quite a lot out of them

Carlton been more than competitive last month but just lack quality

I agree - I think he's coaching his a*se off, and being let down by poor decision making, skills execution etc. Obviously only those inside the club know, but if they had a poorer coach maybe it'd look even worse.

 

[JohnnyFontane90]

He's 24.

played less than 50 games. do you remember many key forwards 50th game? of course not because they were all nobodies at that stage in their career.