Certified Legendary Thread China History in the Making Part 2

[Jason K]

Obviously not Victoria's fault they're getting huge numbers of cases per day because no one is willing to wear a mask, socially distance, and keep their security penises in their pants.

Nah it's more that you think you would be safe in China. Covid19 or no.

Vics premier has totally f’ed it up but I'd still take my chances there.

 

[Jason K]

The China thing is over.

Stop deluding your selves that it's going to continue. The federal government has issued a travel warning for the shithole because of the threat of being detained, the relationship keeps getting sour, and you lot think we'll be off to Shanghai post pandemic? Lmfao

You lot?

It's 1 person. That doesn't watch the news.

 

[PatientMental]

Ah yes, 1 case in the last day from a returned traveller in Shanghai (the place we play, not all of China btw) vs your casual 288 today.

 

[GremioPower]

The China thing is over.

Stop deluding your selves that it's going to continue. The federal government has issued a travel warning for the shithole because of the threat of being detained, the relationship keeps getting sour, and you lot think we'll be off to Shanghai post pandemic? Lmfao

It's only over if we want it to be. Setbacks are a part of any enterprise.

We, however, have already set roots over there. We don't need to begin from the scratch. The situation now is better than when the club started moving towards China.

Just keep doing the groundwork. The rest will eventually take care of itself. When it happens, we must be ready.

 

[1954]

Grave Danger's post in the John Abley thread took me to the https://www.instagram.com/pafc_memorabilia/ site run by SgtSchulz who went onto Port's history committee to prepare for the 150th celebrations and left Big Footy worrying about a conflict of interest. Hope he comes back.

About 40 minutes ago he had the image of a story from a newspaper about these gentlemen in the instagram post below, visiting Adelaide and there was a Port connection - they visited Port play Norwood at Adelaide Oval but it has all of a sudden vanished. But this instagram post is still there - think SgtSchulz edited his comment in the picture to add the story.

A year later the White Australia policy effectively started when the ship the Afghan carrying some older Chinese who had worked on the gold fields were returning to Oz as well as other legal Chinese migrants were banned from entering Victoria by premier Duncan Gillies. So telegrams were fired up to London as UK had a free trade agreement with China which wasn't just for free movement of goods, but was also for free movement of people, effectively made them British subjects.

The Afghan sailed to Sydney, originally premier Henry Parkes was going to let it, but he was lobbied to stop it and he then refused entry. It was the start of the White Australia policy, the 50 year boom cycle driven by gold rushes was about to end as the shockwaves of a global banking crisis was about to hit, the land bust recession of the 1890's. Oz was first in, last out 20 years later and Australia slide down the economic totem pole as the richest nation per capital when still a collection of colonies and also in 1901 when federated, until WWII.

The economic crisis was used as way to shut out people we did't want. The "stain" of convict migration had been washed away somewhat since the last convict ship in 1868. In 1888 Australian born overseas population was about 33%, 1901 at federation it was 20%, 1911 next census was 15% and early 1930's less than 10%. The phrase Australian Native was born.

So whenever Australia has gone the Mick Malthouse protectionist shut ourselves off to the rest of the world route, we have stagnated and gone backwards. The stopping of the Afghan didn't start the downward spiral but it accentuated i,t because it was the start of the xenophobic approach and the answer to every problem, from economic crisis, protectionism, labour protections against cheap foreigner labour, to what our society would look like, to make us more cohesive society, we were rich, we were entitled, we will become the society we chose - ie a mono culture.

Grave Danger's post in the John Abley thread took me to the https://www.instagram.com/pafc_memorabilia/ site run by SgtSchulz who went onto Port's history committee to prepare for the 150th celebrations and left Big Footy worrying about a conflict of interest. Hope he comes back.

About 40 minutes ago he had the image of a story from a newspaper about these gentlemen in the instagram post below, visiting Adelaide and there was a Port connection - they visited Port play Norwood at Adelaide Oval but it has all of a sudden vanished. But this instagram post is still there - think SgtSchulz edited his comment in the picture to add the story.

A year later the White Australia policy effectively started when the ship the Afghan carrying some older Chinese who had worked on the gold fields were returning to Oz as well as other legal Chinese migrants were banned from entering Victoria by premier Duncan Gillies. So telegrams were fired up to London as UK had a free trade agreement with China which wasn't just for free movement of goods, but was also for free movement of people, effectively made them British subjects.

The Afghan sailed to Sydney, originally premier Henry Parkes was going to let it, but he was lobbied to stop it and he then refused entry. It was the start of the White Australia policy, the 50 year boom cycle driven by gold rushes was about to end as the shockwaves of a global banking crisis was about to hit, the land bust recession of the 1890's. Oz was first in, last out 20 years later and Australia slide down the economic totem pole as the richest nation per capital when still a collection of colonies and also in 1901 when federated, until WWII.

The economic crisis was used as way to shut out people we did't want. The "stain" of convict migration had been washed away somewhat since the last convict ship in 1868. In 1888 Australian born overseas population was about 33%, 1901 at federation it was 20%, 1911 next census was 15% and early 1930's less than 10%. The phrase Australian Native was born.

So whenever Australia has gone the Mick Malthouse protectionist shut ourselves off to the rest of the world route, we have stagnated and gone backwards. The stopping of the Afghan didn't start the downward spiral but it accentuated i,t because it was the start of the xenophobic approach and the answer to every problem, from economic crisis, protectionism, labour protections against cheap foreigner labour, to what our society would look like, to make us more cohesive society, we were rich, we were entitled, we will become the society we chose - ie a mono culture.

Not directly connected REH, but a few days after Colonel Light's statue was defaced I heard a radio interview where a woman who claimed to be representing the local indigenous community described him as a `white oppressor,' and the statue should be permanently removed.

She obviously hadn't done her homework, as Light was of mixed race, his father was English and his mother was Asian, and he wouldn't have been allowed to enter this country under the `white Australia' policy.

Historical reports from Light's time suggest he was on very good terms with the local indigenous population including involving them in what he was planning, and he was vilified by certain sections of the Adelaide community for that, and also for his ethnicity.

 

[Janus]

Although I believe that playing in Shanghai is off for the foreseeable future (too many unknown variables), that doesn’t mean I think we should give up on China.

The main problem China has is that it needs to create 12 million jobs every single year to not fall into a recession. So their mercantile nature is one of necessity.

However, without the endeavour of individualism, it’s impossible to innovate. Case in point - Tesla started manufacturing in Shanghai last year, and already they are selling more cars than any of the Chinese BEV manufacturers. Why? Because of the brand and because of the innovation.

Just keep focusing on the schools and building relationships with everyone. If the Three Gorges Dam scenario plays out like it did for the Kuomintang back in 1931, it will make coronavirus look like child’s play.

 

[FPPF]

It's only over if we want it to be. Setbacks are a part of any enterprise.

No, it's over because our governments aren't getting along.I don't know if what's going on between the two countries has reached the news in Brazil but the relationship has soured dramatically and continues to do so. The latest thing is Australia extending the visas of Honkongers already here up to 5 years with permanent residency at the end of it, and offering essentially asylum to Hongkongers who want to flee Chinas anti-democracy crackdown in Hong Kong.
It's widely accepted that the increase in defence procurements ($270 billion total) over the next decade is aimed at China.
The geopolitical situation is going to dictate that this match will not continue in the near term. In the long term we will likely not need this distraction in Shanghai because we will have outgrown the need for it.

We, however, have already set roots over there. We don't need to begin from the scratch. The situation now is better than when the club started moving towards China.

Just keep doing the groundwork. The rest will eventually take care of itself. When it happens, we must be ready.

What roots? The chinese don't give a sh*t about AFL much less Port Adelaide.
For China this was just a use of their soft power to gain influence for geopolitical purposes.

When what happens we must be ready for?

 

[GremioPower]

the relationship has soured dramatically and continues to do so...
The geopolitical situation is going to dictate that this match will not continue in the near term.

That's the setback, and precisely why our mission has become more important than ever.

What roots?

All the connections we've made; the programs we've established; etc.

When what happens we must be ready for?

The Chinese are a patient people and play the long game. We should learn from them and do the same. The current political climate won't last forever. It will change. We must be ready for that.

 

[1954]

That's the setback, and precisely why our mission has become more important than ever.


All the connections we've made; the programs we've established; etc.


The Chinese are a patient people and play the long game. We should learn from them and do the same. The current political climate won't last forever. It will change. We must be ready for that.

As opposed to the Trumpmeister's short game, ie shoot from the hip and get it horribly wrong, then shoot from the other hip, for wrong again, and follow all of that up by playing the why is everyone picking on me card!

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

 

[OneGreatClub]

 

[PowerForGood]

What about the Tasmanian equivalent... far more intertwined?

 

[jac147]

What about the Tasmanian equivalent... far more intertwined?

No it’s all about sinking the boot into Dan!

 

[OneGreatClub]

What about the Tasmanian equivalent... far more intertwined?
[/QUOTE
Liberal Government so nothing to see there ?

 

[jac147]

No it’s all about sinking the boot into Dan!

And also the “lefties” at the Australian universities. It will make a difference to current research projects, but I’m sure Scotty will step up!

 

[ibd77]

Sorry guys but this pipedream of China and investment into the club and game is over. Time to cut and run while we are still ahead and focus on other markets. AFL got a lot of exposure in the US during their pandemic shutdown. Maybe we should focus our efforts their instead?

 

[Lockhart Road]

Sorry guys but this pipedream of China and investment into the club and game is over. Time to cut and run while we are still ahead and focus on other markets. AFL got a lot of exposure in the US during their pandemic shutdown. Maybe we should focus our efforts their instead?

Contradiction herein: If it’s a ‘pipedream’ how come ‘we are still ahead’?

It’s happened, it’s come off, the Club has benefitted from it ... and now here’s the inside story explaining how the Club has got as far as it has between 2015 and 2019, inclusive. It’s a unique story with a plot never before explained.

For example, the excerpt posted just above by REH introduces the role of JUSS Events in Shanghai in 2017. A couple of years later, Andrew Hunter subsequently reveals, JUSS introduced us to SAIC, from which came the MG logo that in 2020 has appeared so prominently amongst our 150 celebrations - an example of us still being ahead in this particular game, in this challenge. No pipedream anywhere here.

I had the honour, the pleasure, of assisting Andrew by perusing his first draft, mainly detailing for him what happened before he came on the scene in early 2015. His book was always going to be for the Club, not for him, proceeds going to the new Alberton Museum.

A lot of Club people, inside Alberton and out, stretched themselves a long long way to help each other bring off these three matches thus far in Shanghai. It makes me feel very proud to read about it. It makes me feel very proud of the Club for having taken on the challenge ... and to still be ahead of it.

 

[Tibbs]

Sorry guys but this pipedream of China and investment into the club and game is over. Time to cut and run while we are still ahead and focus on other markets. AFL got a lot of exposure in the US during their pandemic shutdown. Maybe we should focus our efforts their instead?

Maybe stick your head a bit deeper into the sand. Stick your bum up a bit higher, and let LR give it another kick!

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Our sponsor of the China games and general China strategy, Auswan Creek have been smart about their China approach - less retribution. Helps they are owned by a Chinese-Australian citizen Wei Li.

 

[El Zorro]

Lockhart Road , what are the realistic chances of rescuing our China strategy in the current climate? Should we:

- aim to be part of the solution
- cut our losses and run
- wait and see if things calm down over the next X years
- other

I'd love your insights as you are probably the most knowledgeable poster on this topic.

 

[FishingRick04]

I'd think in this current climate with CHina it would be ZERO

 

[manureid]

Lets be honest here, the whole China things is up the shitter, and could be dead in the water now given the current situation. Going to be hard to ever get back to it.

 

[Lockhart Road]

Lockhart Road , what are the realistic chances of rescuing our China strategy in the current climate? Should we:

- aim to be part of the solution
- cut our losses and run
- wait and see if things calm down over the next X years
- other

I'd love your insights as you are probably the most knowledgable poster on this topic.

Thank you, mate.

I may have been slightly ‘knowledgable’ at some point ... but now I sit with my oldest mate Heineken in Pro Drinkers Corner, shaking my head, accepting that I still know far too little, despite my half-century of personal experience in Asia and especially Hong Kong, China.

One thing I have been taught, over and over and over again, is that everything always changes. When you start to feel confident the project you have been sweating pints over for years is finally threatening success, that’s when red lights start flashing and the whole thing starts crashing; when you feel the crashing has reached a crescendo and the only sympathetic ear within reach is that of old mate Heineken ... that’s when the crashing stops, something wholly unpredictable comes on the TV news, and the green shoots of success-after-all start poking their heads out of the scorched earth.

This cycle is endless. What propels it in its perpetual motion helter-skelter around its axis are the imperfections of that demographic of the human race who are last to admit they are less than perfect, and who call themselves ‘leaders’.

Prime example: Donald J. Trump, alias Agent Orange, Putin’s most obvious mole. Who, looking back, can believe he could ever have been POTUS? Well 70 million-plus Americans for a start.

PAFC’s China Stategy was in big trouble the instant Trump was elected, in more trouble the further his knees trespassed into the sacred shadow under that power desk gifted to the White House by Whitehall, crafted from the timbers of HMS Resolute, subsequent to her discovery stuck fast in the ice of the Northern Passage and her repatriation to the Old Country in 1856.

We were in big, big trouble the moment such shonky thick-headed Trump ‘advisors‘ as Steve Bannon started travelling the world, squirting toxic international Trumpism upon such fertile fields of quasi-intelligence as existed in the corridors of Canberra’s national security and military intelligence agencies. Still exist. Bannon, after all, was being quoted on the front page of Murdoch’s ‘The Australian’ a few weeks ago, despite publicity he has attracted as an arch spiv selling square inches of Agent Orange’s Mexican Wall to the gullible - you know, the same type of innocent that voted to re-elect The Donald.

Trump is out. A paradigm shift beckons. A watershed looms. A likely excuse for a 180 between Canberra and Beijing takes shape. It’s happened before.

My first visits to Hong Kong were in 1969: a few days R&R from Vietnam in May, and a two-week real holiday on my pre-discharge leave that September ... during which I stood on a hill overlooking a double-row fence topped with barbed wire and peered into Red China. What I saw is called Shenzhen today. In 1969 I saw a small village, a few people wearing farming garb, and a noisy pack of wild dogs. Things change.

By December 1971 I was back and I had landed a job. Ping-pong diplomacy had taken place across the border and, two months after I started in that job, Nixon was in Beijing cuddling up to Mao, and fumbling his chopsticks at a table in Shanghai next to Zhou Enlai - the greatest statesman in Asia’s post-war history.

Things change.

More statesmanship is needed to make change reappear. ScoMo needs to stop insularly over-reacting and to read a few books on China’s history and the Chinese mind. He needs to hire a few real China minds for himself, and strike a balance with the national security and military intelligence spooks to whom he’s gifted too much priority, and in the process has made himself look, from up here, not too wordly-wise. He can learn. He can change.

So can Emperor Xi, at whom an equally sharp finger of critique can be pointed.
He can change, too. Or he can, maybe, be purged.

It’s happened before.

So El Zorro my good mate we wait. We do not run. We keep our ear to the ground ... and we wait.

Our chance will come again.

It’s happened before.

 

[VineValerian]

Immensely proud of what our club has achieved with the China exercise, however the diplomatic impasse looks irretrievable at the moment.
May unfortunately mean the abandonment of the exercise.
All out of our control sadly - bigger political agendas and egos in play here.

 

[El Zorro]

Thank you, mate.

I may have been slightly ‘knowledgable’ at some point ... but now I sit with my oldest mate Heineken in Pro Drinkers Corner, shaking my head, accepting that I still know far too little, despite my half-century of personal experience in Asia and especially Hong Kong, China.

One thing I have been taught, over and over and over again, is that everything always changes. When you start to feel confident the project you have been sweating pints over for years is finally threatening success, that’s when red lights start flashing and the whole thing starts crashing; when you feel the crashing has reached a crescendo and the only sympathetic ear within reach is that of old mate Heineken ... that’s when the crashing stops, something wholly unpredictable comes on the TV news, and the green shoots of success-after-all start poking their heads out of the scorched earth.

This cycle is endless. What propels it in its perpetual motion helter-skelter around its axis are the imperfections of that demographic of the human race who are last to admit they are less than perfect, and who call themselves ‘leaders’.

Prime example: Donald J. Trump, alias Agent Orange, Putin’s most obvious mole. Who, looking back, can believe he could ever have been POTUS? Well 70 million-plus Americans for a start.

PAFC’s China Stategy was in big trouble the instant Trump was elected, in more trouble the further his knees trespassed into the sacred shadow under that power desk gifted to the White House by Whitehall, crafted from the timbers of HMS Resolute, subsequent to her discovery stuck fast in the ice of the Northern Passage and her repatriation to the Old Country in 1856.

We were in big, big trouble the moment such shonky thick-headed Trump ‘advisors‘ as Steve Bannon started travelling the world, squirting toxic international Trumpism upon such fertile fields of quasi-intelligence as existed in the corridors of Canberra’s national security and military intelligence agencies. Still exist. Bannon, after all, was being quoted on the front page of Murdoch’s ‘The Australian’ a few weeks ago, despite publicity he has attracted as an arch spiv selling square inches of Agent Orange’s Mexican Wall to the gullible - you know, the same type of innocent that voted to re-elect The Donald.

Trump is out. A paradigm shift beckons. A watershed looms. A likely excuse for a 180 between Canberra and Beijing takes shape. It’s happened before.

My first visits to Hong Kong were in 1969: a few days R&R from Vietnam in May, and a two-week real holiday on my pre-discharge leave that September ... during which I stood on a hill overlooking a double-row fence topped with barbed wire and peered into Red China. What I saw is called Shenzhen today. In 1969 I saw a small village, a few people wearing farming garb, and a noisy pack of wild dogs. Things change.

By December 1971 I was back and I had landed a job. Ping-pong diplomacy had taken place across the border and, two months after I started in that job, Nixon was in Beijing cuddling up to Mao, and fumbling his chopsticks at a table in Shanghai next to Zhou Enlai - the greatest statesman in Asia’s post-war history.

Things change.

More statesmanship is needed to make change reappear. ScoMo needs to stop insularly over-reacting and to read a few books on China’s history and the Chinese mind. He needs to hire a few real China minds for himself, and strike a balance with the national security and military intelligence spooks to whom he’s gifted too much priority, and in the process has made himself look, from up here, not too wordly-wise. He can learn. He can change.

So can Emperor Xi, at whom an equally sharp finger of critique can be pointed.
He can change, too. Or he can, maybe, be purged.

It’s happened before.

So El Zorro my good mate we wait. We do not run. We keep our ear to the ground ... and we wait.

Our chance will come again.

It’s happened before.

Wow. I was expecting a good well-thought-out reply. But this is next level. Thanks.

Also, when is your book coming out? I am not too keen to read Andrew's but yours, I would definitely read.