Rayner was the main one affected - pretty obvious
Coach Fages and the coaching group
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- Aug 21, 2013
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Was at the game yesterday.. Same problem we had since Fagan took over
We cannot stick tackles, too slow in midfield and have no mid who can break lines.
None of our mids can break a game apart. Put all our Eggs into Rayner who plays 3-4 good games a year still.
Apart from Dunkley most are crap sticking tackles.
Neale a great player tries his guts out although he is not damaging
Nor is McCluggae or Berry. I really like Bruce and Fletcher although again not going to have 5 min spell that breaks the game open.
Of all our knee injuries I think Kiddy been the hardest to cover. Apart from kicking we lost his intercepting, dropping into a hole and tackling was great. His kicking was a difference and did break games open.
We replaced him with Zorko who kicks 20-30m and cannot defend. Gives away stupid frees still
So basically we running one defender down.
I watch a lot of non lions games.. You just do not see our players chase or tackle hard.
The word soft does come to mind. At the game you see players jog after guys. Or just let them kick it instead of throwing themselves at the player.
Fagan seems a great people manager builds guys up. Really backs the guys and believes in them
Said time and again not a great tactician seems no plan B.
A new voice help even as I said lots of times we got someone in to help Fagan.
We cannot stick tackles, too slow in midfield and have no mid who can break lines.
None of our mids can break a game apart. Put all our Eggs into Rayner who plays 3-4 good games a year still.
Apart from Dunkley most are crap sticking tackles.
Neale a great player tries his guts out although he is not damaging
Nor is McCluggae or Berry. I really like Bruce and Fletcher although again not going to have 5 min spell that breaks the game open.
Of all our knee injuries I think Kiddy been the hardest to cover. Apart from kicking we lost his intercepting, dropping into a hole and tackling was great. His kicking was a difference and did break games open.
We replaced him with Zorko who kicks 20-30m and cannot defend. Gives away stupid frees still
So basically we running one defender down.
I watch a lot of non lions games.. You just do not see our players chase or tackle hard.
The word soft does come to mind. At the game you see players jog after guys. Or just let them kick it instead of throwing themselves at the player.
Fagan seems a great people manager builds guys up. Really backs the guys and believes in them
Said time and again not a great tactician seems no plan B.
A new voice help even as I said lots of times we got someone in to help Fagan.
- Aug 21, 2013
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Maybe although he always plays one break out game every 6 weeks. Where we go that's the real Rayner
Although the real Rayner is the other 5 weeks
Section 5
Norm Smith Medallist
- Nov 26, 2018
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I usually don't care who the sub is as they rarely make a difference to the end result.
Just another player available for rotations that usually is struggling to be best 22.
However, because of the role of sitting idle usually for 3/4 of a game an experienced player over youth would be my choice.
I would class experienced as 50 plus AFL games or 3 years minimum in the system.
So, this is the list of players i would choose a sub from each week. Including a few regulars people will disagree on.
50 Plus AFL games: Lyons, Ah-Chee, Answerth.
3 years + in AFL system: Fort, Joyce, Madden, Carter Michael, Prior, Dev Robertson, Sharp, Smith,
Viceregal
Premium Platinum
If we got Josh Carr and left them with Hinkley the melts on the Port board would be epic
Just thinking of Fagans stressless press conference despite a potentially season ending loss, lack of media scruitany, media hysterics, and lack of them going after Fagan and Brisbane..;
Fages wasn't in the least upset of the loss at the press conference last night. Certainly not the stress and disappointment we've seen from him earlier this year and last year. He didnt get the hard questions he normally would receive when a team has potentially lost their year. Which makes me wonder..
What if, as i suspect, Fagans fate was sealed weeks ago and he has already been advised this is his last year? Only those that need to know would be advised; Lions, AFL execs, and top media execs. Hence the media laying off him and his much less stressed interviews? King discussing alternative coaches, and all and sundry seemingly accepting this year being his last, despite him 'being a great bloke and having done a good job'.
Are the Lions actively looking for a coach already? Is that what Kingy is pandering to? Has he got a sniff of what may have transpired behind closed doors? Suggesting last night Chris Scott for the job, Kingy 2 weeks ago suggested Luke Beverage as well. Something's up. Hes an astute observer.
I suspect Fages has got the nudge already.
Fages wasn't in the least upset of the loss at the press conference last night. Certainly not the stress and disappointment we've seen from him earlier this year and last year. He didnt get the hard questions he normally would receive when a team has potentially lost their year. Which makes me wonder..
What if, as i suspect, Fagans fate was sealed weeks ago and he has already been advised this is his last year? Only those that need to know would be advised; Lions, AFL execs, and top media execs. Hence the media laying off him and his much less stressed interviews? King discussing alternative coaches, and all and sundry seemingly accepting this year being his last, despite him 'being a great bloke and having done a good job'.
Are the Lions actively looking for a coach already? Is that what Kingy is pandering to? Has he got a sniff of what may have transpired behind closed doors? Suggesting last night Chris Scott for the job, Kingy 2 weeks ago suggested Luke Beverage as well. Something's up. Hes an astute observer.
I suspect Fages has got the nudge already.
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McIvor
Premiership Player
I’m not a huge fan of Gerard Wheatley but when him and King were discussing Brisbane earlier he basically implored the club to forget about seventh or scraping into the finals and just try new things and players and set ourselves for round one 2025. In addition, he said we should challenge ourselves to just go all out offensive and see what happens given we’re a very good at that and not worry about the results.
He actually surprised me in that he wasn’t overly critical but his idea that we should forget about finals and just use this back half to experiment and get ready for next year actually resonated. Doubt Fagan would agree given his comments that we’ll do a Carlton and GWS of 23.
Elixuh
See you on the 9th green at 9
mpal6
Norm Smith Medallist
I agree with this approach, we need to try something new/different and keeping at it in the same way isn't going to benefit anyone. Of course it'll make things uncomfortable for a few who don't suit new game plans or changes, but coach needs to do what's best for the club long term.
That’s questionable, as many here would have Brain as a better player and choice.
Probably better to play Sharp the whole game, and pick Bruce Reville as the sub.
What Jivlain was saying goes beyond who is the best sub option, it goes to team balance and selection.
- May 3, 2015
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A couple of probablys and maybes between our posts
It's not an exact science team selection but in hindsight it's pretty easy
McIvor
Premiership Player
It blows my mind that he could remotely think that or think Lions supporters are such dead beats that we’ll lap up such garbage based on everything we’ve seen this year. One good win; that’s it and beat up on Kangaroos and Tigers and the Suns. Yep, plenty of reason that we’re about to go on a tear in the back half of the season. Excuse my sarcasm
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One thing Fages has always been is very loyal and protective of his players. With where the club was at, it was what was needed from whoever we got to replace Leppa at the time. It would be very hard to change that in a person even if it could end up costing someone their job.
Firstly there's zero chance of us giving Fagan the nudge as has been suggested imo.
Secondly we've beaten Melbourne ,North ,Richmond and the Suns managing to draw with Adelaide. Two of those were home games against very poor opposition on the day. So whichever way you look at it we've fallen off a cliff so far this year and as long as we recognise that we can plot the best way back into 2025.
Secondly we've beaten Melbourne ,North ,Richmond and the Suns managing to draw with Adelaide. Two of those were home games against very poor opposition on the day. So whichever way you look at it we've fallen off a cliff so far this year and as long as we recognise that we can plot the best way back into 2025.
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Really feels like a losers attitude to basically tank the second half of the season to get picks for Levi and/or "play da kids"
Would be different if we were coming out of a rebuild but we are still a good team who can go on a run if we get it together, as unlikely as it seems at the moment. I'd be pretty annoyed as a supporter if the coaches weren't still trying to win at all costs for the rest of the year
Would be different if we were coming out of a rebuild but we are still a good team who can go on a run if we get it together, as unlikely as it seems at the moment. I'd be pretty annoyed as a supporter if the coaches weren't still trying to win at all costs for the rest of the year
Nah. Rayner is just shit.
He will definitely have a role with that team. Most likely coach
- Oct 13, 2015
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Briefly put us up to 17th on expected score for. Don't know if we are back to 18th after the weekend.
- Oct 13, 2015
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Also, no point to tanking. We aren't bad enough to finish below at minimum North, Richmond and West Coast, and very likely the Saints too. If all we end up with is pick 5/6 which we have to trade away anyway because of Levi, what's the point?
I'll differ slightly on the 'play da kids' though - I don't want us to just pick them willy nilly, but I do want us to experiment. Can we get a different midfield mix in there?
What does fletcher look like as an inside mid for say 5 CBAs a game?
If we give Berry an extended run, is he worth keeping as part of the rotation next year?
Can we try change up our ball movement somewhat? It was sad to see how easily it was blocked off by the hawks, and how afraid we were of bold kicks.
Zorko has been good but yesterday was bad zork of 2022 - too focused on niggle and how unjust every umpire is towards him, not focused on performance. Wouldn't mind resting him for the trip to perth if we are pretty much out of contention and seeing how Shadeau goes for a full game.
If/when we aren't a realistic shot to make finals then I want to see us use the year for something. Port tried out a different gamestyle in 2022 when they started poorly and helped paper over their defensive issues more for 2023. No reason we can't try do the same.
I'm not saying don't try to win or drop players purely on age - but consider a wider range of options for selection and for strategy, and accept the risk that it might not be best for wins in 2023.
Absolutely there is a difference between trying a few new things and rashly dropping guys simply to play kids, I think we have experimented quite a bit over the past few weeks (by our standards) and there has probably been a number of other changes that have happened that have gone unnoticed or that we are not privy to. Not sure how many others we could potentially bring in due to form/injuries - Torrent maybe? Plus find out some more about guys like Tunstill I guess.
We've always been a second half of the year team under Fagan and I would hope that continues this year
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Hardwick?
Neale is clearly not ok...could do with a break.
Bomber Thompson took 7 years as well. Two of the best coaches of the last 30 years. Mick Malthouse took 10 years with Collingwood before breaking through in 2010.
