Finals Appearances

[relapse]

Other people have hit the nail on the head, the club is obsessed with trying to be good which has come at the expense of chasing greatness.

It's the Neil Craig ethos that has become a cultural albatross around our neck.

 

[frenzy]

I was looking at each teams finals appearances from each decade and found out something I didn't realise.

We held the most appearances in finals in the 2000's, the top 2 sides were the following

1: Adelaide- (8) 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008 and 2009

2: Sydney (7) 2001, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 and 2008

When discovering this I felt so much disappointment in how much we underachieved in that period, I think we could have won at least 2-3 premierships in that decade with so many star players but I suppose our team could just never take that next step to success. I mean Sydney have 7 finals appearances in the decade for 2 grand final appearances and 1 premiership while we have 8 finals appearances for nothing at all.

The point I am getting to is that I don't want to see the current list we have underachieve just like the sides during the 2000's did. We cannot afford to underachieve anymore than we already have. I would hate to see this club waste players such as Walker, Sloane, Laird, Smith, Betts and Talia just like we wasted guys like Johncock, Doughty, Burton and Rutten.

The other amazing thing through that period is that Sydney never beat us. Unfortunately we never faced them in the finals. In 05/06 I always felt we could beat Sydney but we kept coming up against our seemingly bogey side in West Coast and could never beat them in September. Who knows what might have been had the infamous 06 prelim went the other way...

 

[SC26]

The other amazing thing through that period is that Sydney never beat us. Unfortunately we never faced them in the finals. In 05/06 I always felt we could beat Sydney but we kept coming up against our seemingly bogey side in West Coast and could never beat them in September. Who knows what might have been had the infamous 06 prelim went the other way...

For the 2006 prelim, if we didn't give away that free in the dying seconds we could have marked it and scored a goal after the siren, and win by 2 points. But instead we gave away a free, West Coast got possession, marked it in their 50 and scored a goal after the siren. West Coast win by 10 points.
Could have and should have been our win by 2 points, and really even more than 2 points if we didn't choke in the last quarter.

 

[Tex200]

For the 2006 prelim, if we didn't give away that free in the dying seconds we could have marked it and scored a goal after the siren, and win by 2 points. But instead we gave away a free, West Coast got possession, marked it in their 50 and scored a goal after the siren. West Coast win by 10 points.
Could have and should have been our win by 2 points, and really even more than 2 points if we didn't choke in the last quarter.

We were 4 goals up at half time, at home, kicking with a strong wind in the third.

One of the great chokes of all time that one.

 

[SC26]

We were 4 goals up at half time, at home, kicking with a strong wind in the third.

One of the great chokes of all time that one.

The whole fantastic period of 2005/2006 was put to waste in two horrific preliminary finals. The even sadder thing is that we probably would have won both the 2005 and 2006 GFs if we made it through.

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[PCORF]

The whole fantastic period of 2005/2006 was put to waste in two horrific preliminary finals. The even sadder thing is that we probably would have won both the 2005 and 2006 GFs if we made it through.

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You have to take your chances because these chances don't come often.

 

[PCORF]

For the 2006 prelim, if we didn't give away that free in the dying seconds we could have marked it and scored a goal after the siren, and win by 2 points. But instead we gave away a free, West Coast got possession, marked it in their 50 and scored a goal after the siren. West Coast win by 10 points.
Could have and should have been our win by 2 points, and really even more than 2 points if we didn't choke in the last quarter.

Ahh Tyson Edwards, got him around the neck. Not sure if he intended it or not. If he didn't do that and we'll have a kick inside 50 and who knows. I knew after that game it was going to be a long, long battle mentally for this team to try to get back. You have to win those games in the regular season so you can get that better chance in the finals.

 

[SC26]

You have to take your chances because these chances don't come often.

Well we have wasted our chances in every finals series we've been in since 1998 with our 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2012, 2015 and 2016 finals.

2005 and 2006 should have been back to back premierships. This year felt so wasted.

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[PCORF]

Well we have wasted our chances in every finals series we've been in since 1998 with our 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2012, 2015 and 2016 finals.

2005 and 2006 should have been back to back premierships. This year felt so wasted.

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Exactly, 2016 was wasted in Round 23 and I think some people in the crowd let the players know when they walked off after that game. Now 2017 is our last chance for this decade before I expect us to bottom out at the end of the decade. If we fail in 2017 we need to start over, it will be a good thing actually.

 

[SC26]

Exactly, 2016 was wasted in Round 23 and I think some people in the crowd let the players know when they walked off after that game. Now 2017 is our last chance for this decade before I expect us to bottom out at the end of the decade. If we fail in 2017 we need to start over, it will be a good thing actually.

And Hawthorn had to beat Collingwood by 1 point to keep us out of the top 4. Round 23 was miserable. It was good Hawthorn went out in straight sets and lost the qualifying, some karma for them

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[DD#23]

Exactly, 2016 was wasted in Round 23 and I think some people in the crowd let the players know when they walked off after that game. Now 2017 is our last chance for this decade before I expect us to bottom out at the end of the decade. If we fail in 2017 we need to start over, it will be a good thing actually.

don't have the midfield for 2017, we botched that badly.

will need to take a jet with pick 13, see massive improvement in Brad Crouch, Milera, Menzel, Greenwood, Wigg this year and finally bag a big fish for a big crack at 2018.

 

[Iron]

Exactly, 2016 was wasted in Round 23 and I think some people in the crowd let the players know when they walked off after that game. Now 2017 is our last chance for this decade before I expect us to bottom out at the end of the decade. If we fail in 2017 we need to start over, it will be a good thing actually.

How did you come to this conclusion? Who is leaving in the next few years other than Betts?

 

[DD#23]

How did you come to this conclusion? Who is leaving in the next few years other than Betts?

if all we've got to rely on is "organic growth" I'm afraid our veggie patch is going to look a bit average next to GWS and The Bulldogs' because ours is not even half planted. Even clubs like Melbourne will rise with an absolute mountain of young talent starting to get through the middle.

sure we won't be out of contention, but even if we make it to a prelim this year or next its hard to see us going in as favourites given the opposition around us. On the other hand Geelong and Hawthorn look like sliding so that might inflate our standing a bit. Won't help our aspirations to be top of the heap however.

unfortunately getting 2nd hand half back flankers and taking picks over 40 into the draft aren't going to keep us on the curve let alone put is ahead of it, even if Milera and Menzel become the next Shaun Burgoynes we're going to look thin through the middle without Greenwood becoming Fyfe as well.

so if the next two years end up as busts the likes of Tex, Sloane, Talia, Smith, Jenkins start to transition from their prime to heading towards the twilight zone and it'll really be the last chance saloon. That's before you even start talking about (probably) still relying on Jacobs, Douglas, Mackay etc who are as good as cooked already.

the draft sanctions and the over reliance on aging players as a result just won't go away. We're stretched pretty thin trying to stay up the top half of the ladder and its reaaaally hard to see where the significant boost we need to get to win a premiership is going to come from in the next 5 years. There's just no denying our soft underbelly I'm afraid, and our conservative approach to selection this year has only made it worse.

 

[Iron]

if all we've got to rely on is "organic growth" I'm afraid our veggie patch is going to look a bit average next to GWS and The Bulldogs' because ours is not even half planted. Even clubs like Melbourne will rise with an absolute mountain of young talent starting to get through the middle.

sure we won't be out of contention, but even if we make it to a prelim this year or next its hard to see us going in as favourites given the opposition around us. On the other hand Geelong and Hawthorn look like sliding so that might inflate our standing a bit. Won't help our aspirations to be top of the heap however.

unfortunately getting 2nd hand half back flankers and taking picks over 40 into the draft aren't going to keep us on the curve let alone put is ahead of it, even if Milera and Menzel become the next Shaun Burgoynes we're going to look thin through the middle without Greenwood becoming Fyfe as well.

so if the next two years end up as busts the likes of Tex, Sloane, Talia, Smith, Jenkins start to transition from their prime to heading towards the twilight zone and it'll really be the last chance saloon. That's before you even start talking about (probably) still relying on Jacobs, Douglas, Mackay etc who are as good as cooked already.

the draft sanctions and the over reliance on aging players as a result just won't go away. We're stretched pretty thin trying to stay up the top half of the ladder and its reaaaally hard to see where the significant boost we need to get to win a premiership is going to come from in the next 5 years. There's just no denying our soft underbelly I'm afraid, and our conservative approach to selection this year has only made it worse.

A lot of this is guessing, you have to admit that. The bulldogs and GWS are being talked up something chronic. We've all heard that script before and it rarely gets played out as suggested.

And no, I'm not going to say this or that to try and prove we'll rocket ahead of ostensibly more talented sides - just wanted to point out how sometimes you just have to go in with a plan to win a premiership and hope it works. I feel like, however it might look on paper, we're doing that.

 

[DD#23]

A lot of this is guessing, you have to admit that. The bulldogs and GWS are being talked up something chronic. We've all heard that script before and it rarely gets played out as suggested.

And no, I'm not going to say this or that to try and prove we'll rocket ahead of ostensibly more talented sides - just wanted to point out how sometimes you just have to go in with a plan to win a premiership and hope it works. I feel like, however it might look on paper, we're doing that.

well yeah there's some guessing involved but I'd prefer to say projecting, and its not so much that I want to talk up The Bulldogs and GWS so much as I'm very unimpressed by what we've done in the last 12 months to make sure we improve.

I actually think we lack a clear plan, or at the very least our coaches plan is vastly different to the list management team's.

 

[Coopers]

Two words cost us dearly in the 2000's:

Neil Craig

No way. We were pegged to finish dead last by the media in '05. Looking at our '04 performances that seemed reasonable.
Neil Craig led the club in an amazing turnaround and basically invented zone football.
Crowbots '05 and '06 should have been premiership years. Unfortunately we choked both times. No hiding from that.

But Neil Craig was the main reason we even got anywhere close. We were on track to be... Melbourne.

 

[phill1795]

No way. We were pegged to finish dead last by the media in '05. Looking at our '04 performances that seemed reasonable.
Neil Craig led the club in an amazing turnaround and basically invented zone football.
Crowbots '05 and '06 should have been premiership years. Unfortunately we choked both times. No hiding from that.

But Neil Craig was the main reason we even got anywhere close. We were on track to be... Melbourne.

Neil Craig could also be partly blamed for the failures in both 2005 and 2006. It had became more and more evident after each finals series that Craig could not coach well under finals pressure, lack of the right moves cost us dearly.

 

[brucetiki]

Neil Craig should never have been given the full time coaching gig in the first place. Probably the only coach given a full time gig weeks after coaching a side to a 23 goal loss followed by one of the worst football matches ever where we failed to score a goal until the third quarter in perfect conditions.

 

[phill1795]

Neil Craig should never have been given the full time coaching gig in the first place. Probably the only coach given a full time gig weeks after coaching a side to a 23 goal loss followed by one of the worst football matches ever where we failed to score a goal until the third quarter in perfect conditions.

I totally agree, the club took the easy option by appointing someone within the club. Apparently I am not quite sure but the club didn't go through the proper interviewing process after Ayres got sacked, therefore missing out on some good coaches that were available at the time.

 

[brucetiki]

I totally agree, the club took the easy option by appointing someone within the club. Apparently I am not quite sure but the club didn't go through the proper interviewing process after Ayres got sacked, therefore missing out on some good coaches that were available at the time.

That doesn't surprise me in the slightest

 

[phill1795]

That doesn't surprise me in the slightest

We could have had Alastair Clarkson instead I think and their is no denying Clarko is a great coach. Also though if you notice under the Craig era after our failure in 2005 the club did not trade for any players to improve on that season.