Rumour Future of the club (Bevo, board, assistant coaches, football department)

[Tommycash]

What we know is that Bevo overruled Dalrymple on Gowers, and that he’s obsessed with playing these guys once drafted - until he’s hit by the same realisation everyone else had long ago (they’re terrible).

It’s all conjecture of course but I think it reads as Bev pushing for these kinds of moves.

I always find these posts interesting. I would assume while we are in a window if the Coach sees a player they think can come in and instantly play a role, their desire to have them over some 18 year old project player should be respected. Obviously with a cap and list limits you wouldn't want a full draft of those types, but it is more akin to a trade than a true long-term draftee.

Gowers did turn out ok for us in the short term with 33 games and a club leading goalkicker in an admittedly dire year for scoring. The AFL average for a player is 30 games, so to get what we got from him at pick 9 of the Rookie draft is hardly something to lose sleep over. I would imagine Dalrymple didn't leave us purely because he was bummed out about not getting to use pick 9 of the Rookie draft on his desired project.

While I understand we'd want the list manager to have a big say in building for the future, you would also want that to be done with a huge amount of input from the coach as they will be the one who knows what game style they will be asking the players to play. I would also want my coach to be able to choose a mature age player with a late draft pick or rookie pick if they think they have an immediate place in the team as well.

 

[BulldogMuscle]

Look I blame everyone at this stage.
Beveridge, Grant, Bains, KWW, Bontempelli, Spangher, McComb, the three Smith brothers, the ITKs (likely the same people as some I've already listed! ), all the supporters, posters on BF, politicians, public servants, other clubs.

But the dumbest palooka is the idiot on here that keeps shooting his mouth off when he obviously knows SFA about anything...

So geoffjennings79 - just STFU already!

I'm Kylie Watson-Wheeler

 

[Here we go dogs]

I think it would be a mistake to get rid of baines with the training facility redevelopment ongoing.

I’ve always seen baines as a very good operator.

 

[Unorth]

I always find these posts interesting. I would assume while we are in a window if the Coach sees a player they think can come in and instantly play a role, their desire to have them over some 18 year old project player should be respected. Obviously with a cap and list limits you wouldn't want a full draft of those types, but it is more akin to a trade than a true long-term draftee.

Gowers did turn out ok for us in the short term with 33 games and a club leading goalkicker in an admittedly dire year for scoring. The AFL average for a player is 30 games, so to get what we got from him at pick 9 of the Rookie draft is hardly something to lose sleep over. I would imagine Dalrymple didn't leave us purely because he was bummed out about not getting to use pick 9 of the Rookie draft on his desired project.

While I understand we'd want the list manager to have a big say in building for the future, you would also want that to be done with a huge amount of input from the coach as they will be the one who knows what game style they will be asking the players to play. I would also want my coach to be able to choose a mature age player with a late draft pick or rookie pick if they think they have an immediate place in the team as well.

I guess the question for Gowers, McComb etc is that while they far exceed production/games played from where they were drafted - should they? It reflects well on their personal careers, but has it benefitted the team/results? And that’s where you’ll probably get different answers encompassing all the factors you mentioned.

 

[DognBones]

From an outsider's point of view, that is, someone who doesn't have a clue what's going on behind the scenes, I find this and other threads related to club management and coaching very confusing. I think I need some facts and then I'm sure I can "handle the truth".

 

[Mofra]

Long term lurker here - don’t often have anything useful to add… but I agree something not adding up….. for what it is worth, this is my take on all the swirling information with a big dollop of optimism!

What if the coach hasn’t lost the players but the players are concerned about the coach who has tried to do too much, is burnt out and is unable to do his job to the best of his ability?
Captain goes to president/CEO about the coach’s current wellbeing and workload that is impacting his capacity to coach (player management/relationships and game day strategy and leadership). Captain is clear something has to change- more support and help for coach or coach has to go? CEO/ board also see a burnt out coach and give option for the coach to walk with severance. Coach says nope- I got this and am still committed to the job. Hopefully coach also says yes I do try and do too much and want to hold too much control and this has burnt me out.
So coach and players relationship is jeopardised- team on field is a shambles- but players also know this is a coach that can win premierships and has supported them for years- they want the Bevo they have known and trusted back or if that is not possible want him replaced?

I am basing this on:
Bevo at the Bruce lunch
Bevo distress in press conference when discussing Bubba leaving- who was also at Pub lunch and clearly loved and respected by players
Bont press conference this week where he says it is a shared responsibility and Bev ‘supports playing group and players wherever he can and we have to do that for him’.

I also don’t think there is a coach available who can match Bev at his best- so hope we can have a set up that supports this to happen. Bevo recognising he needs strong people who he listens to around him and the board committing money to pay skilled people would all need to happen.

What you're posing has been hinted at publicly by Bevo himself and noted by the coaches association, so is entirtely plausable.

It's been speculated elsewhere that Bevo is a 100% lock to coach next year, but with different assistants and reduced responsibility (closer to what most other coaches in the competition do - notably, MacCrae and Hinkley).

 

[SonOfScray]

Bevo staying is a catastrophic outcome for this iteration of the playing squad.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

What you're posing has been hinted at publicly by Bevo himself and noted by the coaches association, so is entirtely plausable.

It's been speculated elsewhere that Bevo is a 100% lock to coach next year, but with different assistants and reduced responsibility (closer to what most other coaches in the competition do - notably, MacCrae and Hinkley).

History repeats, Rocket was found to be doing to much, and measures were put in place to allow him to coach and not be expected to do other things in a yearly review. Does this club never learn?

 

[Werewolf]

Bevo staying is a catastrophic outcome for this iteration of the playing squad.

I don't see how there wasn't some degree of tanking on Sunday. West Coast are so bad (FIVE >100 point losses this year) that's the only way we could lose to them. If the players believe in the coach, that doesn't happen. So how can Beveridge coach next year?

Hopefully he's privately resolved to leave and this week is the farewell game (and finals if we make it). Geelong have put the cue in the rack, so we should win provided our players give their all.

 

[HK_Bulldog]

Fronk hasn’t posted for 2 years. Maybe someone got into his account. Who knows.
Also, Fronks info, like anyone, isn’t 100% I think I remember he once said that Patton was across the line to join us.

 

[doggies ftw]

I don't see how there wasn't some degree of tanking on Sunday. West Coast are so bad (FIVE >100 point losses this year) that's the only way we could lose to them. If the players believe in the coach, that doesn't happen. So how can Beveridge coach next year?

Hopefully he's privately resolved to leave and this week is the farewell game (and finals if we make it). Geelong have put the cue in the rack, so we should win provided our players give their all.

Spot on, it’s genuinely deplorable - at home, against a team who’s won 2 games all year and didn’t even want to win due to losing pick 1. And we’re playing for finals spot and we lost. You can’t even say oh it’s just one of those weeks they’ll bounce back, no that was last week - this was the week we were supposed to bounce back.

It literally does not matter whose fault it is after those two weeks, there is only one option and that is a new coach. It’s honestly that simple.

 

[cleveland]

Fronk hasn’t posted for 2 years. Maybe someone got into his account. Who knows.
Also, Fronks info, like anyone, isn’t 100% I think I remember he once said that Patton was across the line to join us.

He was untill he did his knee

 

[LittleG]

Fronk hasn’t posted for 2 years. Maybe someone got into his account. Who knows.
Also, Fronks info, like anyone, isn’t 100% I think I remember he once said that Patton was across the line to join us.

Fronk left due to harassment.

People rubbishing the information he provided IF he didn’t get everything 100%. His information has been better than any other poster I know.

Even the Patton thing…. People can change their minds. Nothings guaranteed until it happens.

 

[geoffjennings79]

I'm Kylie Watson-Wheeler

At this stage, I am more than prepared to believe that... Kylie.

 

[doggies ftw]

We’ve gone backwards in basically every key statistic, we have the same issues as we did 5 years ago not to mention the worst issues we had last year have followed us through to this year and likely gotten even worse rather than improving. We topped up with 30 year olds year after year and made it clear we had premiership ambitions, yet we’ve fallen incredibly short of those - now we’re questioning the list…

To add to the list of issues we were facing last year (ie run of goals, scoring efficiency, defensive efficiency, beating top 8 sides etc etc) we’ve now added new issues to the list (ie lack of ability to transition the footy from our defence, holding a lead, winning close games, beating the bottom teams we should be beating - THESE WERE NEVER AN ISSUE PREVIOUSLY)

We’re going backwards at an alarming rate, AA quality players are dropping off for no good reason. And people still want to give Bev another go?

No you don’t get another ****ing chance, **** me dead how many chances do you get? We. Are. Going. Backwards. We cannot afford another year.

Oh surround him with good people to make up for his weaknesses, good idea - here’s a better one though, why don’t we **** him off and bring in someone who doesn’t have those weaknesses that we have to mould our whole club around ffs

Change the assistants! The whole assistant panel is already new, what’s next? How many compromises need to be made before we just admit the campaigner is past it and needs to move on

 

[Anja_Nees]

History repeats, Rocket was found to be doing to much, and measures were put in place to allow him to coach and not be expected to do other things in a yearly review. Does this club never learn?

Rocket was handling council matters related to parking at the new WO in 2007. Quite extraordinary.

They brought in Fantasia who, for some of the crap he copped on this board, took a huge amount of pressure off Rocket.

I get the impression some of Bevo’s responsibilities are self-inflicted and he needs to be saved from himself, but giving him more time to do what he does best will not hurt.

 

[W W Biscuit]

We’ve gone backwards in basically every key statistic, we have the same issues as we did 5 years ago not to mention the worst issues we had last year have followed us through to this year and likely gotten even worse rather than improving. We topped up with 30 year olds year after year and made it clear we had premiership ambitions, yet we’ve fallen incredibly short of those - now we’re questioning the list…

To add to the list of issues we were facing last year (ie run of goals, scoring efficiency, defensive efficiency, beating top 8 sides etc etc) we’ve now added new issues to the list (ie lack of ability to transition the footy from our defence, holding a lead, winning close games, beating the bottom teams we should be beating - THESE WERE NEVER AN ISSUE PREVIOUSLY)

We’re going backwards at an alarming rate, AA quality players are dropping off for no good reason. And people still want to give Bev another go?

No you don’t get another ******* chance, * me dead how many chances do you get? We. Are. Going. Backwards. We cannot afford another year.

Oh surround him with good people to make up for his weaknesses, good idea - here’s a better one though, why don’t we * him off and bring in someone who doesn’t have those weaknesses that we have to mould our whole club around ffs

Change the assistants! The whole assistant panel is already new, what’s next? How many compromises need to be made before we just admit the campaigner is past it and needs to move on

I don't think the Dogs have ever really managed high expectations in my long time as a supporter. Even on a week to week basis, let alone year to year.

From memory, in the aftermath of the 2016 flag, someone (I think it was Bevo) mentioned the 'D' word - in that it would be nice to build a 'dynasty.' Or that it should be the aim. Somebody set me straight if I am just imagining it. But the very hint of an ambition has seen us implode.

I don't know. It's a real problem that seems to be woven into the cultural fabric of the club. We love coming from nowhere, being written off, flipping the bird to the critics...but raising expectations and following through has never been our bag. Supporters know this well, and it's as frustrating as hell!

 

[Unorth]

I believe had we managed to make Bevo and Dalrymple settle their differences, “let the bakers bake”, it would have set us up in many ways. Kept Dalrymples outstanding drafting, not setting a precedence for Bev to step out of his lane etc.

there was a lot of ego after 2016. Bevo, Dal, Jmac (LOL) all wanted the credit, maybe the split was inevitable, but it would have set the tone for Bevo early to focus on what he’s good at and leave the rest to others.

All a bit late now of course but I hope the lesson has been learned going forward.

 

[Bushdid911]

It's probably got to the point now where if we are bringing in all new assistants etc, it really should be people who have not had any connection to the club before in any capacity.

 

[Bald]

It's probably got to the point now where if we are bringing in all new assistants etc, it really should be people who have not had any connection to the club before in any capacity.

I’d say we don’t want anyone who’s had any link to anyone currently at the club, as opposed to the club itself. Given we’ve got Darcy and Grant on the board though that’s fairly slim pickings so I’d agree.

 

[dogwatch]

I believe had we managed to make Bevo and Dalrymple settle their differences, “let the bakers bake”, it would have set us up in many ways. Kept Dalrymples outstanding drafting, not setting a precedence for Bev to step out of his lane etc.

there was a lot of ego after 2016. Bevo, Dal, Jmac (LOL) all wanted the credit, maybe the split was inevitable, but it would have set the tone for Bevo early to focus on what he’s good at and leave the rest to others.

All a bit late now of course but I hope the lesson has been learned going forward.

This, and recent posts from DRB and WWB, along with the 8 year cycle of crises, is what I was alluding to about corporate culture.

You don’t build a dynasty just because you’ve got a generationally good list (essential though that is). You’ve got to have hard headed strategy and management that drives consistent, sound practices, retains all the necessary checks and balances and doesn’t fall into the saviour trap where one individual gets too much rein and responsibility. That’s (partly) how Hawthorn rose from battling VFL latecomer to AFL power over a 30 year period.

They’re the sort of time frames we need to be showing reliable, responsible administration. Not 3-5 years of revival before lapsing again. Only then do you expunge the “battler” culture and image … and become a genuine destination club.

 

[Shacf501]

It's probably got to the point now where if we are bringing in all new assistants etc, it really should be people who have not had any connection to the club before in any capacity.

the issue is if everything we hear relating to Bevo's power imbalance, who would actually want to be an assistant at the bulldogs.

 

[Charlie Bucket]

Long term lurker here - don’t often have anything useful to add… but I agree something not adding up….. for what it is worth, this is my take on all the swirling information with a big dollop of optimism!

What if the coach hasn’t lost the players but the players are concerned about the coach who has tried to do too much, is burnt out and is unable to do his job to the best of his ability?
Captain goes to president/CEO about the coach’s current wellbeing and workload that is impacting his capacity to coach (player management/relationships and game day strategy and leadership). Captain is clear something has to change- more support and help for coach or coach has to go? CEO/ board also see a burnt out coach and give option for the coach to walk with severance. Coach says nope- I got this and am still committed to the job. Hopefully coach also says yes I do try and do too much and want to hold too much control and this has burnt me out.
So coach and players relationship is jeopardised- team on field is a shambles- but players also know this is a coach that can win premierships and has supported them for years- they want the Bevo they have known and trusted back or if that is not possible want him replaced?

I am basing this on:
Bevo at the Bruce lunch
Bevo distress in press conference when discussing Bubba leaving- who was also at Pub lunch and clearly loved and respected by players
Bont press conference this week where he says it is a shared responsibility and Bev ‘supports playing group and players wherever he can and we have to do that for him’.

I also don’t think there is a coach available who can match Bev at his best- so hope we can have a set up that supports this to happen. Bevo recognising he needs strong people who he listens to around him and the board committing money to pay skilled people would all need to happen.

This makes a lot of sense.

Although I believe the club may have offered a severance and that Bont may have gone to the pres, it doesn’t seem to be for the reason a lot are assuming.

I just can’t see Bevo going and being a part of the pub catch up if he’s just been told the players want him gone. Nothing in the media since either. That would’ve leaked out like a sieve.

I hope whatever decision is made, it has the players support because although you never want the tail wagging the dog, you certainly don’t want to them to be unhappy. Seems like they are in the coaches’ corner, particularly Smith’s. And with the young group of key players about to hit their straps, we don’t want to be losing any because the clubs made the wrong decision.

 

[BrisDog]

Gowers did turn out ok for us in the short term with 33 games and a club leading goalkicker in an admittedly dire year for scoring. The AFL average for a player is 30 games, so to get what we got from him at pick 9 of the Rookie draft is hardly something to lose sleep over. I would imagine Dalrymple didn't leave us purely because he was bummed out about not getting to use pick 9 of the Rookie draft on his desired project.

For a very short period….’Gower’s was God’!

Remember that game in 2020 when he had the ball marked on his chest about 70 out, 30 seconds to go, up by 3 against GCS and he decided to switch play and completely balls it up? Pretty sure he never played again for the club.

 

[hutchy31]

For a very short period….’Gower’s was God’!

Remember that game in 2020 when he had the ball marked on his chest about 70 out, 30 seconds to go, up by 3 against GCS and he decided to switch play and completely balls it up? Pretty sure he never played again for the club.

Vividly. Still up there as one of the worst decisions/plays I've ever seen. He could have done literally anything else - kick it backwards, bomb it to the forward pocket, get it intercepted by the defender, kick it OOF - some of which would have been pretty bad, but nothing quite like turning it over crossfield and exposing the defense to a transition goal when they weren't expecting it to come back from there.

It was all-time terrible.