Toast Geelong - going pokies free

[catempire]

Alcohol? should the Club be going dry,far more damaging than pokies.

We regulate alcohol.

It’s not all or nothing - allow unrestricted or ban.

 

[you pick one]

You're not trying to tell me Pokies are not regulated in Victoria,they sure as hell are up here.

 

[catempire]

You're not trying to tell me Pokies are not regulated in Victoria,they sure as hell are up here.

Regulation is a spectrum. They are regulated but there’s more that could be done to limit their damaging effects short of banning them outright.

 

[you pick one]

Regulation is a spectrum. They are regulated but there’s more that could be done to limit their damaging effects short of banning them outright.

True but the argument could be made for lots of things,go back to 6 oclock closeing for the pubs and closed Sundays,ban phone betting and TAB accounts,take TABs out of pubs.None of which I hope ever happens.

 

[catempire]

True but the argument could be made for lots of things,go back to 6 oclock closeing for the pubs and closed Sundays,ban phone betting and TAB accounts,take TABs out of pubs.None of which I hope ever happens.

I have no hope for those things either. Nor banning cars to prevent car accidents.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Meanwhile at Hawthorn....

What are you on about, revenue from pokies and the Tassie sponsorship are an important ingredient for the clubs income.

Precisely. Until someone outlaws pokies we would be absolutely mental to diminish our holdings.

Says it all really. Morally no conscience out at Dingley.

 

[El Dubya]

I'm in the not understanding pokies part, seems boring as batshit to me.
But plenty of things I do probably are boring to others. Each to their own, if you want to play them then that's nothing to do with me.

It is a shame so many people get hooked and sit there chasing the win that really will never happen for then if they are playing so much.. but there are demons in all facets of life

Pokies are no different to alcohol, except that it's become more socially acceptable to bash them. At the end of the day, while it's legal, we should be exploiting this revenue stream. Nobody is boycotting Coles and Woolworths for owning pokies.

 

[Cataholic]

Pokies are no different to alcohol, except that it's become more socially acceptable to bash them. At the end of the day, while it's legal, we should be exploiting this revenue stream. Nobody is boycotting Coles and Woolworths for owning pokies.

Alcohol can be enjoyed, in moderation, with benefits for one’s health and social interactions. It’s purpose is not to be detrimental, and only becomes so if abused.

Pokies, by deliberate design and purpose, have no other function than to strip people of their money.......money which they often can’t afford.

 

[Catsace]

Yeah where does it stop. It's hypocritical for someone like me to say ban pokies when I like drinking and betting at the TAB.
It's strange I have an addictive personality but have never liked the pokies at all. Just don't get it + always hate the dark lighting they have in pokie venues.
There's definitely something about them though. I have known so many people who've loved them and when I was a kid I remember the grandparents always going with a bus load of other oldies up to Moama just to play em.
I think not being able to smoke anymore while playing them is a good thing, I would probably ban that button you press when you want a drink too as I don't think that's good.
People need a break after a while just to stop and think about what they're doing.

Yeah where does it stop. It's hypocritical for someone like me to say ban pokies when I like drinking and betting at the TAB.
It's strange I have an addictive personality but have never liked the pokies at all. Just don't get it + always hate the dark lighting they have in pokie venues.
There's definitely something about them though. I have known so many people who've loved them and when I was a kid I remember the grandparents always going with a bus load of other oldies up to Moama just to play em.
I think not being able to smoke anymore while playing them is a good thing, I would probably ban that button you press when you want a drink too as I don't think that's good.
People need a break after a while just to stop and think about what they're doing.

That makes addictions a really strange thing too....as for someone who went to the casino many times and local venues, i never bought an alcoholic drink while playing the pokies! I'd of course have the free soft drinks that might get passed around, but for someone who was in the thrall of the pokies, i never drank alcohol!

Different things for different people i guess. Not sure if i would be considered a hypocrite regarding drugs though, again that's something i've never taken.....the hardest drug i've used is probably a panadol rapid! How the brain can rationalise the dangers of one form of addiction yet sort of not 'kick in' to address other forms. I'd play the pokies almost daily for so many years, until early in 2014 i lost $413 playing no more than 50c bets on Panda at the Wooly in Geelong. That was over about 2 1/2 hours....and got me thinking that i have to bloody well do something to stop this!

Thankfully a few weeks later i did, and i'd be bankrupt for sure and probably homeless had i not.

 

[El Dubya]

Alcohol can be enjoyed, in moderation, with benefits for one’s health and social interactions. It’s purpose is not to be detrimental, and only becomes so if abused.

Pokies, by deliberate design and purpose, have no other function than to strip people of their money.......money which they often can’t afford.

Who are you to say they can't afford it? Who are you to say they're not enjoying gambling as much as you are drinking?

 

[Cataholic]

Who are you to say they can't afford it? Who are you to say they're not enjoying gambling as much as you are drinking?

Easy tiger.

You get a good idea when you’ve worked bars, watched them spend endlessly for hours, urinating in the chair where they sit because they simply can’t leave, whilst knowing many of them personally and thereby knowing their personal circumstances.

 

[El Dubya]

Easy tiger.

You get a good idea when you’ve worked bars, watched them spend endlessly for hours, urinating in the chair where they sit because they simply can’t leave, whilst knowing many of them personally and thereby knowing their personal circumstances.

Absolutely, and its s**t. But why not address what makes people susceptible to that, rather than just banning one particular outlet? Those people will just move on to something else is pokies are banned.

 

[Cataholic]

Absolutely, and its s**t. But why not address what makes people susceptible to that, rather than just banning one particular outlet? Those people will just move on to something else is pokies are banned.

Yes, addiction takes many forms, and it’s singular cause can be hard to identify.

Pokies have very little to recommend them. They prey on people’s vunerabilities, take their money, often disrupt family lives and are absolutely anti-social. Ever seen people engage in conversation around a machine?

Sometimes you just got to protect people from themselves. When all is said and done it’s their addictive personality that causes the problem. They seek things like alchohol, drugs and pokies to serve as their crutch

 

[newcs]

Now all they need to do is get rid of The Brook

http://joshgilligan.com.au/wyndham-residents-hit-hardest-pokies-entire-state/

 

[Vdubs]

Alcohol? should the Club be going dry,far more damaging than pokies.

DRY T A P
Tobacco
Alcohol
Pokies

 

[Spazz Cat]

Now all they need to do is get rid of The Brook

http://joshgilligan.com.au/wyndham-residents-hit-hardest-pokies-entire-state/

Its gotta be said, they're outrageous numbers. 292k lost per day.

 

[4quarter_cat]

I can understand the libertarian argument here. Let people do as they please with their money, after all it is their money.

But have to disagree with the whole premise. I have studied psychology and computer science. So I understand both the algorithms, and their effect on the human brain.

Pokies are no more a game of skill than roulette (As much as they would like people to believe otherwise). It's not like betting on horses or dogs, or footy, where you can study trends and make judgement calls. On a poker machine your chance of winning on any particular press of the button is the same(like tossing a coin), and the odds of a win are never in your favour. Of course you do win sometimes, otherwise the psychological trick they play on our brains would not work. (Now I'll explain that)

Poker machines are much like Pavlov's classical conditioning. Only difference is you are only rewarded for pushing the button sometimes. All the research shows that if you randomise when rewards are granted (ie only some of the time) the psychological urge to press the button in hope of reward is stronger than if you rewarded someone everytime. (The 'I must keep pressing the button until I get my reward' phenomenon)

On a social level all the evidence shows that poker machines are a very effective method of redistributing wealth from the poor and working middle classes, to the wealthy. All of which has become much better understood since their legalisation in mid 90s.

I am proud Geelong is trying to take a lead on this issue. (Massive Kudos to North Melbourne) In an ideal world Tasmania will ban them and Victoria is able to follow their lead, or at least introduce a buy back scheme pokie licences are quite expensive (Like Guns in the past)

 

[dazbroncos]

I saw a great doco on History Ch about Vegas and how the Swedish or Norwegian inventor changed the Poker machine forever.
It used to be 3 reels with 11 slots.... 11x11x11 were the odds...

Then came the electronics...

its now 3 wheels with 255 spaces per wheel - and the computer algorithms have the decided result before the wheels stop spinning.

The odds are now 255x255x255.

So yeah... the odds of winning are REALY stacked in your favour.

cmon 7-7-7

Good luck.

GO Catters

 

[goyoucatters]

Even as a person who detests what addiction to the pokies does to families and the vulnerable, I can entirely accept they are here to stay as part of the 'entertainment' options in the wider community.

However, I have great antipathy for the AFL and its participating clubs that are caught up in it for their own craven purposes.

Sport should be free of this ugly taint where people are beguiled into seeing both sports gambling and playing the pokies as 'part of the footy experience'. Kids are fed these subtle lies from very early on these days, and if the AFL had any courage at all, they would move to break free from both of these activities and raise their funds from more equitable sources.

When so many families are hurt by the addiction of an ostensibly responsible adult through these activities, the AFL as "the people's game" would do well to steer very clear of any association with such revenue streams. As it is, we now have football clubs 'addicted' to the funds that roll in from the addiction of the patrons at their venues.

It's a cruel but unsurprising irony. For wherever gambling is involved, the losers always far outweigh the winners.

 

[Tandy]

I don't mind wasting $20 on them. Usually only a couple of times a year. Always either leave when its all gone or if I double my money.

 

[Boxhead_31]

The President made this commitment during the Presidents Lunch yesterday

“We’re making good on our commitment to exit gaming,” Carter said.

“We have now sold more than half of the machines we had and plan to be out completely by the end of the year.

“We recognise that many, perhaps most of the pokie machines, are used appropriately… we studied this and found that 90 per cent of the bets were for a dollar or less, which sounds pretty much like a recreational player and that is fine.

“But we also found … that around 10 per cent of the bets were for much more than a dollar and this is potentially the dark side of the business.

“So we have decided that we should not stay in an industry that can damage some of our patrons and have decided to get out.”

http://www.krockfootball.com.au/geelong-cats-news/cats-pull-pin-pokies/

 

[Spazz Cat]

The President made this commitment during the Presidents Lunch yesterday



http://www.krockfootball.com.au/geelong-cats-news/cats-pull-pin-pokies/

Good on us. Said we were going to do it and we are.
I know someone else will just buy them but a footy club should be more than just a buisness so I like it.

 

[Baby Duck]

Whether its $1 or $500, the basic concept behind pokie machines is negative and damaging. They are literally designed to suck money out of vulnerable people, with the hook being the very slim possibility of a big return. Im all for consenting adults to do as they please, but anyone can see that gambling in general is a con.

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Baby Duck]

I can understand the libertarian argument here. Let people do as they please with their money, after all it is their money.

But have to disagree with the whole premise. I have studied psychology and computer science. So I understand both the algorithms, and their effect on the human brain.

Pokies are no more a game of skill than roulette (As much as they would like people to believe otherwise). It's not like betting on horses or dogs, or footy, where you can study trends and make judgement calls. On a poker machine your chance of winning on any particular press of the button is the same(like tossing a coin), and the odds of a win are never in your favour. Of course you do win sometimes, otherwise the psychological trick they play on our brains would not work. (Now I'll explain that)

Poker machines are much like Pavlov's classical conditioning. Only difference is you are only rewarded for pushing the button sometimes. All the research shows that if you randomise when rewards are granted (ie only some of the time) the psychological urge to press the button in hope of reward is stronger than if you rewarded someone everytime. (The 'I must keep pressing the button until I get my reward' phenomenon)

On a social level all the evidence shows that poker machines are a very effective method of redistributing wealth from the poor and working middle classes, to the wealthy. All of which has become much better understood since their legalisation in mid 90s.

I am proud Geelong is trying to take a lead on this issue. (Massive Kudos to North Melbourne) In an ideal world Tasmania will ban them and Victoria is able to follow their lead, or at least introduce a buy back scheme pokie licences are quite expensive (Like Guns in the past)

Great post. So much of society is based on pavlovian style training, right down to what is acceptable to say and what is not, and even social media functions in much the same way. Interestingly a co-founder of facebook admitted that it was designed and geared towards being addictive, and getting little dopamine hits for each like and comment etc.

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[bresker]

Just because the bets are less than a dollar doesn’t mean that the total number of bets - and losses - can’t be significantly more

I only played the 1c and 2c machines but with multiple reels and doubling up you can lose a large amount in a short time.

But enough of the negativity - great news & thumbs up to the Cats