Preview Hawks vs - Port Changes and Discussion

[killerspud]

No change.

Ordinarily I'd agree

BUT We have just played a very physical bruising and have an important run of games - maybe two or three changes Hooper Peterson and Ladson in for Brown (rested got a broken nose), Lewis (a rest), Rioli (a rest up)

Not saying we should definitely do this but just think playing the exact 22 might see us a bit flat.

Also is Taylor ready to go?? If he is then Maybe Skipper or Renouf could be given a rest - we might need Taylor come september so it would be important to get him game time.

Its important we all keep the faith

 

[Phil McCreviss]

Where did i say i thought he was responsible for the draw? That would be a stupid thing to say hence i never said it. A off night i can tolerate if he's showing genuine endeavour, but he didn’t seem to be making much of an effort to me. I don't know he might have had the flu of something but if i just purely judged him on his performance then yes i believe he deserves to be dropped.

Semi concussed in the second quarter which explains his lacklustre effort. Also his role has changed. A lot of people want him to pick up his 25 on the wing but Clarko isn't asking him to play the ball magnet role anymore.

 

[TBoyleSuperstar]

You're right but in saying that he was put on fisher as a defensive matchup similar to previous weeks. I think he got ahead of himself and tried to be too offensive neglecting the defensive side of his game

Whilst I agree to a point, he had chances and a couple of fumbles and that miss in the goal square could have turn the tables on Fisher. End of the day, that didn't eventuate, but he had an off night handling wise and I think it made his job on Fisher look worse than it probably was.

 

[Consumed]

Just for some posters information Lewis played a defensive forward role on one of the Saints best rebound defensive players (Gilbert) and kept him to like 7 touches. Completely shutting down his influence. He spilt a few marks and had a few fumbles that would have led to his name being on the score sheet and comprehensivley dominating Sam. This is the role he is playing to have a role in the team (he is not required in midfiled rotations when we have, well everyone knows who we have).

As for Ellis, he was fine, good even. One holding the ball in the last when he tried to do too much in heavy traffic, but everyone forgets the 1-2, 1-2 he had from defensive 50 to kick the ball inside 50 so Roughy could mark and kick the goal that put us 7 up. His efforts were fantastic.

As for Whittey..hmmm...slotted a crucial goal, nice kick of the ball, but feel he is slightly slow or blows up really quickly after making 1 effort..not fit enough to be considered a dual effort player. This was the case one poster referred to when he seemed like he wasnt trying to run down Schnieder, but indeed he was, except he was blowing so hard after making 1 effort towards the wing. Not in the best 22 come finals.

Birchall....G.Birchall, very important player to the side, not having a right foot kills it for me. Under pressure, confined to his right, he MUST MUST MUST use his RIGHT foot no matter what it takes. I actually remember on a number of occasions (not just last night) when he has buckled...ie fallen to the ground, when he is corraled on his right, and constantly trying to get back on his left and subsequently gets pinned holding the ball. If under pressure and on your right (especially in defensive) just attempt to hack the ball out of there with your RIGHT boot. Anywhere will do, until he proves this or adds this to his game I do not mind seeing him DROPPED at all.

Now...

In. Peterson, (Hooper if available), Ladson
Out. Whitecross, Birchall (sorry but no room for 1 sided passengers )

Great Post.

Agree completely with your take on Lewis' game. Both him and Osborne played shut-down roles up forward. The rebounding defensive players at St Kilda are top shelf.

To keep Gilbert and Co from playing their usual game helped stifle the run out of defensive, and with that, the Saints turned the ball over a lot in the mid field.

I thought they both played well. I love having Osborne up forward and in form. At his best he is a game breaker. With his marking ability, toughness and ability to beat players one out, he adds that X-factor in big games.

That one incident with Birchall showed up his glaring deficiency on his right. Like when a player pulls up short to a contest, that split second screams volumes about who this bloke is. In that moment, unable to kick on his right, Birchall had to butcher that ball forward.

But one kick compared to 4 years of sustained high quality, team oriented games doesn't really matter. Birchall is dynamite on his left and rarely gets caught out. Keep him in the back half/midfield and everything's sweet.

As for Ellis, he looks worse than he is. The dinky, floating kicks are annoying, but his game is really quite solid. I reckon his best is still to come. I always pegged him as a late bloomer, he will probably improve over the next few years.

Apart from a returning player who shows good form, I think we the leave the team pretty much as is. The longer they are settled the better it will be.

The 2 point loss, the draw and the win against the Doggies shows this team can match it with the best teams in the league. Small improvements is all that it will take to get over them. Settle the 22 and keep them healthy for 2 more months.

 

[xXDaOne2KillXx]

Great Post.

Agree completely with your take on Lewis' game. Both him and Osborne played shut-down roles up forward. The rebounding defensive players at St Kilda are top shelf.

To keep Gilbert and Co from playing their usual game helped stifle the run out of defensive, and with that, the Saints turned the ball over a lot in the mid field.

I thought they both played well. I love having Osborne up forward and in form. At his best he is a game breaker. With his marking ability, toughness and ability to beat players one out, he adds that X-factor in big games.

That one incident with Birchall showed up his glaring deficiency on his right. Like when a player pulls up short to a contest, that split second screams volumes about who this bloke is. In that moment, unable to kick on his right, Birchall had to butcher that ball forward.

But one kick compared to 4 years of sustained high quality, team oriented games doesn't really matter. Birchall is dynamite on his left and rarely gets caught out. Keep him in the back half/midfield and everything's sweet.

As for Ellis, he looks worse than he is. The dinky, floating kicks are annoying, but his game is really quite solid. I reckon his best is still to come. I always pegged him as a late bloomer, he will probably improve over the next few years.

Apart from a returning player who shows good form, I think we the leave the team pretty much as is. The longer they are settled the better it will be.

The 2 point loss, the draw and the win against the Doggies shows this team can match it with the best teams in the league. Small improvements is all that it will take to get over them. Settle the 22 and keep them healthy for 2 more months.

Thanks mate, between us i thnk we have pretty much summed it up nicely. I am not saying Birchall is not in our best 22, i just think he needs to train harder or maybe exclussively for a while on his right. Like i dont know if you remember, but how about in the last quarter were he had a shot from 30 out but couldnt straighten up and kicked it exactly the way his body was facing (which was out on the full coincidently). Now that should have at least been a behind.

Not saying it cost us the 2 points, as other things occurred 2, like Ozzy out on the full from angle 5m out, jeez man what was that seriously. There should have been at least another point. What im trying 2 say is i dont want it 2 cost the team again in the future when we have another like player who has been working on his deficencies in the 2's and is almost a like 4 like swap with Birchall...look i love the bloke, just want him 2 use the right leg if neccessary.

Watching the replay back, and i know im 1 eyed Hawthorn, but clearly we had the greater chances to get at least 1 more point, so we will learn alot yet again and hopefully take all those lessons learnt and use them in finals, i acknowledge its hard to play the perfect game.

 

[WillowSF]

Ellis is really not bringing much to the table at the moment...

Out: Ellis
In: One of the following - Hooper, Muston or Ladson

 

[Brant]

To me, Ellis is bringing a lot to the table:
- Wins the ball in contests;
- Defends opponents / tackles well / & zones off to defend space well; &
- Good hands inside.

I know a lot of people don't value his disposal by foot but he gets contested ball & hits targets - effectively closing out the contest & allowing us time to create. He also picks out team mates in traffic.

 

[Henry Jr]

Ellis is way ahead of the next guys in line at this stage....

Muston
Whitex
Savage
Tuck
JKT

 

[Cynic]

Whilst I agree to a point, he had chances and a couple of fumbles and that miss in the goal square could have turn the tables on Fisher. End of the day, that didn't eventuate, but he had an off night handling wise and I think it made his job on Fisher look worse than it probably was.

A flogging is still a flogging.

Disagree with those saying he should be dropped though.

 

[Neville Bartos]

Dare I say it, should we rest anyone this weekend? We're not going to make the top 4 and if we want to make the GF we'll have to do it without the week off...

Hodge has played every game, Roughead has played every game, Gilham has played every game, Renouf has played almost every game. Perhaps give Simon Taylor a go against Dean Brogan this weekend and give Renouf a week off. His ankle has been borderline every week and he'll be vital in any finals we play.

 

[Goody1971]

Dare I say it, should we rest anyone this weekend? We're not going to make the top 4 and if we want to make the GF we'll have to do it without the week off...

Hodge has played every game, Roughead has played every game, Gilham has played every game, Renouf has played almost every game. Perhaps give Simon Taylor a go against Dean Brogan this weekend and give Renouf a week off. His ankle has been borderline every week and he'll be vital in any finals we play.

I think this is a realistic comment and agree. Hodge and Gillham are running hot so let them keep playing. Renouf has earned a rest after a massive effort all year and maybe Roughie could spend a week meditating and visualising kicking goals from 30m out straight in front?

 

[Cynic]

I think this is a realistic comment and agree. Hodge and Gillham are running hot so let them keep playing. Renouf has earned a rest after a massive effort all year and maybe Roughie could spend a week meditating and visualising kicking goals from 30m out straight in front?

Does Roughead look like the meditating type to you?

 

[Dinsdale]

No, dont agree with resting players, I reckon very few players would like to be rested - what if their replacement has a blinder, how do they get back into the team?

 

[raff23]

Just for some posters information Lewis played a defensive forward role on one of the Saints best rebound defensive players (Gilbert) and kept him to like 7 touches. Completely shutting down his influence. He spilt a few marks and had a few fumbles that would have led to his name being on the score sheet and comprehensivley dominating Sam. This is the role he is playing to have a role in the team (he is not required in midfiled rotations when we have, well everyone knows who we have).

As for Ellis, he was fine, good even. One holding the ball in the last when he tried to do too much in heavy traffic, but everyone forgets the 1-2, 1-2 he had from defensive 50 to kick the ball inside 50 so Roughy could mark and kick the goal that put us 7 up. His efforts were fantastic.

As for Whittey..hmmm...slotted a crucial goal, nice kick of the ball, but feel he is slightly slow or blows up really quickly after making 1 effort..not fit enough to be considered a dual effort player. This was the case one poster referred to when he seemed like he wasnt trying to run down Schnieder, but indeed he was, except he was blowing so hard after making 1 effort towards the wing. Not in the best 22 come finals.

Birchall....G.Birchall, very important player to the side, not having a right foot kills it for me. Under pressure, confined to his right, he MUST MUST MUST use his RIGHT foot no matter what it takes. I actually remember on a number of occasions (not just last night) when he has buckled...ie fallen to the ground, when he is corraled on his right, and constantly trying to get back on his left and subsequently gets pinned holding the ball. If under pressure and on your right (especially in defensive) just attempt to hack the ball out of there with your RIGHT boot. Anywhere will do, until he proves this or adds this to his game I do not mind seeing him DROPPED at all.

Now...

In. Peterson, (Hooper if available), Ladson
Out. Whitecross, Birchall (sorry but no room for 1 sided passengers )

he actually played the defensive role on fisher, did an ok job as fisher ended up with 15 touches i think and than went to buddy for the last qtr. Osborne played on gilbert and completely destroyed him, had he kicked that goal in the pocket which would have made 3 goals for the night, you could nearly give him votes for his performance. Whitecross i think will miss out for ladson or even savage who had a blinder yesterday in the vfl. WhiteX has an issue with getting into good positions to win the ball from what i have seen, having said that the more games he plays in the 1s the better he will get at it. Cant really see many changes at all until hooper is ready to go imo, taylor will get a run soon to relieve renouf or skipper, we can use skipper in a different role once taylor is back, is quite versatile and imo could be a suprise for us in the finals.

 

[raff23]

Dare I say it, should we rest anyone this weekend? We're not going to make the top 4 and if we want to make the GF we'll have to do it without the week off...

Hodge has played every game, Roughead has played every game, Gilham has played every game, Renouf has played almost every game. Perhaps give Simon Taylor a go against Dean Brogan this weekend and give Renouf a week off. His ankle has been borderline every week and he'll be vital in any finals we play.

Simon taylor must play at some stage, we have 3 healthy ruckman for the 1st time in a while so we need to utilise this to give renouf or skipper a week off to rest the bodies. Taylor will give us good service so we wont lose anything. Skipper and taylor are a good combination because 1 will be good at hitouts and the other very good at winning the ball around the ground, this is the important factor for us going forward, the fact that we have a mobile ruckman capable of doing some damage with the ball in his hands so skipper should probably get the gig to play over renouf who needs to rest so he can go again come finals time.

 

[The Kipster]

lewis played on fischer and got taken to the cleaners. In saying that he played very well against enright and last week so no big deal

bollocks 4P

 

[The Kipster]

Ellis is way ahead of the next guys in line at this stage....

Muston
Whitex
Savage
Tuck
JKT

Yup, this sums it up to a 'tee' in my view...he played some good footy Friday night

 

[buddylg]

Does anyone think Savage might get a run? Had a good game for BH on the weekend, is a great runner and might provide something different to Whitecross?

In: Savage and accurate goal kicking
Out: Whitecross and ridiculous side-on bananas from 20m out on a 30 degree angle! Ossie can kick, why would he even bother trying this????

 

[Brant]

Ossie's set shot to finish the game vs the Scum a month ago proves what he is like from an angle - sometimes I think players try to be a little too clever...

As for resting players - I think Renouf's ankle may need a rest - but with 2008 in his mind there would be no chance in hell he would sit out for a rest & allow Taylor into the team on Final's Eve!!

 

[ventor1]

Does Roughead look like the meditating type to you?

Pure gold!

 

[macdaddio]

When do the MRP results come out?

 

[Brant]

When do the MRP results come out?

Give 'em a chance Mac-D: Disregarding video evidence & creating justifications for awful decisions takes time.

I would like to see you take 8 games full of simple, straight forward incidents & twist them into suspensions for some players; whilst being careful not to suspend other players, based on which teams they play for & whether or not they have previously won a Brownlow...

Not as easy as you would think!

 

[macdaddio]

Give 'em a chance Mac-D: Disregarding video evidence & creating justifications for awful decisions takes time.

I would like to see you take 8 games full of simple, straight forward incidents & twist them into suspensions for some players; whilst being careful not to suspend other players, based on which teams they play for & whether or not they have previously won a Brownlow...

Not as easy as you would think!

When its Hawthorn it should be pretty easy for them, they just throw the book out when it comes to the rules/regulations/law/spirit of the game...

 

[Scrads]

On the Lewis front, surely if he was playing to offensive Clarko would have let it happen for a whole 5 minutes before either sending the runner out or dragging him to spray him himself.

Lewis was probably a bit groggy after his friendly fire from franklin (oooh illiteration) but other than that it was a genuine poor game from him.

 

[Flukey!]

Ladson maybe in for C Brown now he has 2 weeks off courtesy of the MRP.