NO TROLLS Hawthorn Racism Review - Sensitive issues discussed. Part 2

[Wosh]

Don’t use this thread as an opportunity to troll North or any other clubs, you’ll be removed from the discussion. Stick to the topic and please keep it civil and respectful to those involved. Keep personal arguements out of this thread.
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Videos, statements etc in the OP here:

NO TROLLS - Hawthorn Racism Review - Sensitive issues discussed.

Don’t use this thread as an opportunity to troll North or any other clubs, you’ll be removed from the discussion. Stick to the topic and please keep it civil and respectful to those involved. Keep personal arguements out of this thread. Help moderators by not quoting obvious trolls and use the...

www.bigfooty.com

Link to Hawthorn Statement. - Link to ABC Sports article. - Leaked Report

Process Plan - https://resources.afl.com.au/afl/do...erms-of-Reference-and-Process-Plan-FINAL-.pdf


DO NOT QUOTE THREADS FROM OTHER BOARDS

 

[ferball]

Actually he has admitted to saying "you'll get yours", definitely a personal threat against a woman just doing her job and he was ironically defending someone facing charges for assault, harassment and threatening behaviour against women at the time.

Can you quote that can you?

Obviously not cos he said something different.

And if you can't be arsed to get a simple fact like his actual quote correct when you are quoting him, with quotation marks even, you wonder why i think you and other people in this thread are carrying on in bad faith and couldn't actually give a **** about racism?

 

[Chief]

Its a fairly common thing to say to people who are behaving badly and with what seems like impunity. It doesn't necessarily mean its a threat either. More a warning that karma will catch people out eventually.

Yeah but the parallel makes it noteworthy. It does. Of course it does.

He obviously said it to her because it's what Thomas said.

No. No that's not what anyone is saying.

 

[Chief]

Hillary Clinton seemed to use it to pump girls up

Context-blindness is a very real danger to our children.

Please give generously.

 

[Beerfish]

I think some of the North supporters itt need a lie down.

 

[the big lebowski]

He said it to her and two men as they were going over the line in harassing players. He clearly meant one day you will face public scrutiny and might reflect on how you have acted today.

Any other way of taking it is ridiculous and shows a bias.

 

[the big lebowski]

Context-blindness is a very real danger to our children.

Please give generously.

Do you think he was saying “one day I will come and physically harm you”?

 

[Chief]

I googled “define what “your time will come” means”

I Super Googled it:

The phrase "your time will come" can be used as a threat to imply that the person being threatened will eventually face negative consequences or punishment for their actions or behavior. It suggests that the person making the threat is aware of some wrongdoing or perceived slight by the other person, and is warning them that they will not escape justice forever.

In this context, the phrase implies that the person being threatened should expect to face some form of retaliation or retribution in the future. It can be a way for the person making the threat to assert their power or control over the situation, and to intimidate the other person into complying with their wishes or demands.

For example, a boss might say "Your time will come" to an employee who has been repeatedly late for work or has been insubordinate. The boss is warning the employee that they will face disciplinary action if they don't improve their behavior.

Overall, the phrase "your time will come" can be a menacing and ominous threat that suggests that the person being threatened should be afraid of what may happen to them in the future.

 

[faible]

Gimme names.
Give me the names of multiple North supporters who have tried to downplay the seriousness of what the coaches were alleged to have done at Hawthorn.
Otherwise it will be hard to escape the conclusion you're attributing false positions to North supporters because you're engaging in this thread in bad faith, with little to no concern for the actual victims.

Nah. Gonna call bullshit here.

Keep trying to shift those goalposts though. Keep supporting the individual most alleged to have been involved in all these incidents in question though and pretend it's the other people who have no concern for the victims.

Hell, old mate Simpkin posted a few hundred times trying to downplay the reports due to fuzzy recollections or simply outright calling them liars. But no, it's everyone else that's wrong.

 

[yodellinhank]

I googled “define what “your time will come” means”

Nothing in the first 3 pages mentioned it was a threat.

Hillary Clinton seemed to use it to pump girls up

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/compost/wp/2016/11/09/dont-worry-little-girls-your-time-will-come-someday/

Ah, the old "didn't behave in the manner described" defence.

 

[Shadow89]

Anyone else find it curious and noteworthy, that Clarko needed to be told that his comments were offensive and crossed a line - to the female reporter in question?

I found this really interesting, because it sort of adds credence to the idea that Clarko really is a bit tone-deaf when it comes to understanding what may be crossing a line/what he thinks is in the best interest of his club or players.

If Clarko doesn't know that uttering the same commentary that landed TT in the sh*t, and saying it to a female reporter, is crossing a line...then did he know whether what he was saying/doing when it came to the management of Indigenous players under his watch, was crossing a line either?

I'm not saying this is the case, but it's something that has come to mind seeing his commentary in the media after this latest incident. He genuinely does not seem to recognize when he is crossing a line, and even Viney himself has said that he's there to keep him under control, in so many words.

I wonder how many other times he's done or said something and not realized what lines he's crossing, when no-one has corrected him on it - due to his status and standing within the game?

 

[the big lebowski]

I Super Googled it:

The phrase "your time will come" can be used as a threat to imply that the person being threatened will eventually face negative consequences or punishment for their actions or behavior. It suggests that the person making the threat is aware of some wrongdoing or perceived slight by the other person, and is warning them that they will not escape justice forever.

In this context, the phrase implies that the person being threatened should expect to face some form of retaliation or retribution in the future. It can be a way for the person making the threat to assert their power or control over the situation, and to intimidate the other person into complying with their wishes or demands.

For example, a boss might say "Your time will come" to an employee who has been repeatedly late for work or has been insubordinate. The boss is warning the employee that they will face disciplinary action if they don't improve their behavior.

Overall, the phrase "your time will come" can be a menacing and ominous threat that suggests that the person being threatened should be afraid of what may happen to them in the future.

So do you think clarko was telling the three people that he was going to physically harm them in the future?

 

[Chief]

Do you think he was saying “one day I will come and physically harm you”?

No. See my earlier posts for detail on my thoughts on this.

Clarko has other power in the game as well.

 

[Maddo11]

The reporter in question accepted the apology and people dug it up weeks later to use against him. And it still doesn't justify the reporter behaving like a jerk. Did she hassle Jordan De Goey like that or does she think she can get away with it with Thomas cos he is black?

Jesus christ... where do you even start with this shit take

 

[Beerfish]

Jesus christ...

Yes they seem to think so.

 

[ferball]

Yeah but the parallel makes it noteworthy. It does. Of course it does.


No. No that's not what anyone is saying.

I think its pretty obvious that's why he said it and why he went and apologised.

 

[Sentinel]

He might have a very different interpretation of those events. One that is completely at odds with the way that story was presented in the media.

Why should he publically address any of it?

The original conversations at Hawthorn were all private and sposed to be confidential. Anything he says about it breaks that confidentiality. You also mentioned tht he's waiting for documentation from Hawthorn. Maybe he doesn't know who is making these allegations. They were made in a confidential way after he left.

I'm not saying he needs to publically address it prior to the report being released, or even after it comes out (although, he did put out a statement about this topic). I don't dispute the last paragraph of your post either.

My comment was in direct reply to yours which stated that he "denies he told someone to abort their kid." He has not done that, at least publically.

 

[faible]

I think its pretty obvious that's why he said it and why he went and apologised.

So in your eyes it's more acceptable if Clarkson knowingly used the words Thomas used to threaten a female, to threaten a female?

Interesting.

 

[Chief]

I think its pretty obvious that's why he said it and why he went and apologised.

Well then he's a terrible, terrible person.

 

[Saucery]

Can you quote that can you?

Obviously not cos he said something different.

And if you can't be arsed to get a simple fact like his actual quote correct when you are quoting him, with quotation marks even, you wonder why i think you and other people in this thread are carrying on in bad faith and couldn't actually give a * about racism?

He has not deigned the quote, in fact he has acknowledged its meaning and context, though it may not be word for word I will grant you.

Saying I can't be arsed to "get a simple fact like his actual quote correct" implies you have access to the actual quote, or how wolud you know?

So here are the quotes:


"Clarkson came under scrutiny last week for telling Nine journalist Elisabeth Moss “your time will come” as she and other reporters sought comment in relation to allegations of harassment and intimidation from Kangaroos player Tarryn Thomas."

‘No one to control him’: Clarkson comments expose ‘mixed messaging’ at North Melbourne

‘No one to control him’: How latest Clarko ‘rant’ exposed North’s big problem

www.foxsports.com.au

"As revealed by SEN’s Sam Edmund, Clarkson told reporter Elisabeth Moss on February 1 words to the effect of “your time will come”. The incident occurred as media descended on Arden Street as further allegations were levelled against Tarryn Thomas."

Clarkson denies being condescending, can’t guarantee reporter outburst won’t happen again

Alastair Clarkson told reporter Elisabeth Moss on February 1 words to the effect of “your time will come”.

www.sen.com.au

"He admitted he said something "along the lines of, 'Your time will come,'" which is reportedly similar to what Kangaroos player Tarryn Thomas wrote in text messages to a woman."

Alastair Clarkson defends temper after latest clash with reporter

The North Melbourne coach says his testy exchange with a female reporter at Kangaroos training was a "wake-up call", but admits he cannot guarantee it will not happen again.

www.abc.net.au

Saying I can't be arsed to "get a simple fact like his actual quote correct" implies you have access to the actual quote, or how would you know?

So now put up or shut up, you show us the quote where he said something different.

And on my so called "bad faith" I am concerned that this issue has run on far too long and only joined this thread when I discovered Clackson is hold up the very proceedings has wished expedited quickly buy waiting on some paperwork. Why? The allegations are all verbal statements, surely he will only be asked to respond to those? This saga is affecting my club too you know so pretending it's the world against North Melbourne is just crying wolf.

 

[Makeshift Park]

I Super Googled it:

The phrase "your time will come" can be used as a threat to imply that the person being threatened will eventually face negative consequences or punishment for their actions or behavior. It suggests that the person making the threat is aware of some wrongdoing or perceived slight by the other person, and is warning them that they will not escape justice forever.

In this context, the phrase implies that the person being threatened should expect to face some form of retaliation or retribution in the future. It can be a way for the person making the threat to assert their power or control over the situation, and to intimidate the other person into complying with their wishes or demands.

For example, a boss might say "Your time will come" to an employee who has been repeatedly late for work or has been insubordinate. The boss is warning the employee that they will face disciplinary action if they don't improve their behavior.

Overall, the phrase "your time will come" can be a menacing and ominous threat that suggests that the person being threatened should be afraid of what may happen to them in the future.

I sent it to ChatGPT.


If a male football coach says to a female reporter "your time will come", what does he mean by that?

The meaning of the statement "your time will come" can vary depending on the context and tone in which it is said. In a football context, the coach may be referring to the possibility of the female reporter becoming a coach or entering into the football industry in a more significant capacity. However, it's also possible that the coach may be implying that the reporter needs more experience before being taken seriously, or that her current role is temporary.
The statement can also be interpreted more broadly as a general expression of encouragement or support. Nevertheless, it's essential to consider the context and tone in which the comment was made to determine its intended meaning fully. If the comment made the reporter feel uncomfortable, she has the right to speak up and ask for clarification or express her discomfort.

Could the use of the phrase "your time will come" in that instance reflect that the coach is actually a racist?

The phrase "your time will come" itself does not necessarily imply racism. However, if there are other factors involved in the context of the statement, such as the race of the reporter or coach, it's possible that the comment could be racially charged.
If there is evidence that the coach has a history of making racist comments or treating people unfairly based on their race, it's possible that the use of the phrase in this instance could reflect racist attitudes or biases.
It's important to investigate the context and any additional factors before making any conclusions about the meaning behind the statement. If the reporter feels uncomfortable or discriminated against in any way, she has the right to report the incident and express her concerns.

Could the use of the phrase "your time will come" indicate that the coach is an angry, impulsive megalomaniac?

The phrase "your time will come" alone does not necessarily indicate that the coach is an angry, impulsive megalomaniac. However, if the coach's tone and demeanor when making the statement suggest anger, hostility, or arrogance, it's possible that the coach may have issues with anger management or a tendency towards megalomania.
It's important to consider the context in which the statement was made and the coach's behavior more broadly to determine whether the coach's behavior is problematic. If the coach frequently exhibits anger or hostility towards others, engages in manipulative or controlling behavior, or behaves inappropriately in other ways, it may be necessary to address these issues through coaching or other interventions.
Regardless of the specific behavior, it's important to ensure that everyone involved feels safe and respected in the workplace. If the coach's behavior is impacting the well-being of others, it may be necessary to take action to address the situation and create a more positive and productive workplace environment.

Is it possible to gain an understanding of the coach's motivations in saying "your time will come" without having the full context of how it was stated?

Without having the full context of how the coach stated "your time will come," it may be difficult to fully understand the coach's motivations or intended meaning behind the statement.

Would supporters of the coach's team have any reason to disrespect him after he used the words "your time will come"?

It's difficult to say whether supporters of the coach's team would have any reason to disrespect him specifically for using the phrase "your time will come," without additional context about the situation.
If the coach's use of the phrase was viewed as inappropriate or disrespectful by fans or supporters of the team, it's possible that this could negatively impact their perception of the coach or the team more broadly. However, the severity of the impact would likely depend on a variety of factors, including the specific context of the situation and the coach's reputation and track record.
In general, it's important for coaches and other public figures to be mindful of their language and behavior, as their actions can have an impact on the broader community and their public image. If the coach's use of the phrase "your time will come" was viewed as problematic by fans or supporters, it may be necessary for the coach to address the situation and take steps to repair any damage that may have been done to his reputation or relationship with the team's supporters.

What if that coach was Alastair Clarkson, the greatest coach in modern day AFL?

Regardless of the coach's reputation or accomplishments, the use of inappropriate language or behavior should still be addressed in a professional and respectful manner.
While Alastair Clarkson is certainly a highly regarded coach in the AFL, this does not exempt him from criticism or accountability for his actions. If his use of the phrase "your time will come" was viewed as inappropriate or disrespectful by the reporter or others, it would be important to address the situation and work towards a resolution that is fair and respectful to everyone involved.
It's also worth noting that the coach's reputation and track record could impact how the situation is perceived by fans and the broader community. If the coach has a history of positive leadership and respectful behavior, fans may be more willing to give him the benefit of the doubt in a situation like this. However, this does not mean that inappropriate behavior should be excused or ignored.

 

[Osho]

I sent it to ChatGPT.


If a male football coach says to a female reporter "your time will come", what does he mean by that?

The meaning of the statement "your time will come" can vary depending on the context and tone in which it is said. In a football context, the coach may be referring to the possibility of the female reporter becoming a coach or entering into the football industry in a more significant capacity. However, it's also possible that the coach may be implying that the reporter needs more experience before being taken seriously, or that her current role is temporary.
The statement can also be interpreted more broadly as a general expression of encouragement or support. Nevertheless, it's essential to consider the context and tone in which the comment was made to determine its intended meaning fully. If the comment made the reporter feel uncomfortable, she has the right to speak up and ask for clarification or express her discomfort.

Could the use of the phrase "your time will come" in that instance reflect that the coach is actually a racist?

The phrase "your time will come" itself does not necessarily imply racism. However, if there are other factors involved in the context of the statement, such as the race of the reporter or coach, it's possible that the comment could be racially charged.
If there is evidence that the coach has a history of making racist comments or treating people unfairly based on their race, it's possible that the use of the phrase in this instance could reflect racist attitudes or biases.
It's important to investigate the context and any additional factors before making any conclusions about the meaning behind the statement. If the reporter feels uncomfortable or discriminated against in any way, she has the right to report the incident and express her concerns.

Could the use of the phrase "your time will come" indicate that the coach is an angry, impulsive megalomaniac?

The phrase "your time will come" alone does not necessarily indicate that the coach is an angry, impulsive megalomaniac. However, if the coach's tone and demeanor when making the statement suggest anger, hostility, or arrogance, it's possible that the coach may have issues with anger management or a tendency towards megalomania.
It's important to consider the context in which the statement was made and the coach's behavior more broadly to determine whether the coach's behavior is problematic. If the coach frequently exhibits anger or hostility towards others, engages in manipulative or controlling behavior, or behaves inappropriately in other ways, it may be necessary to address these issues through coaching or other interventions.
Regardless of the specific behavior, it's important to ensure that everyone involved feels safe and respected in the workplace. If the coach's behavior is impacting the well-being of others, it may be necessary to take action to address the situation and create a more positive and productive workplace environment.

Is it possible to gain an understanding of the coach's motivations in saying "your time will come" without having the full context of how it was stated?

Without having the full context of how the coach stated "your time will come," it may be difficult to fully understand the coach's motivations or intended meaning behind the statement.

Would supporters of the coach's team have any reason to disrespect him after he used the words "your time will come"?

It's difficult to say whether supporters of the coach's team would have any reason to disrespect him specifically for using the phrase "your time will come," without additional context about the situation.
If the coach's use of the phrase was viewed as inappropriate or disrespectful by fans or supporters of the team, it's possible that this could negatively impact their perception of the coach or the team more broadly. However, the severity of the impact would likely depend on a variety of factors, including the specific context of the situation and the coach's reputation and track record.
In general, it's important for coaches and other public figures to be mindful of their language and behavior, as their actions can have an impact on the broader community and their public image. If the coach's use of the phrase "your time will come" was viewed as problematic by fans or supporters, it may be necessary for the coach to address the situation and take steps to repair any damage that may have been done to his reputation or relationship with the team's supporters.

What if that coach was Alastair Clarkson, the greatest coach in modern day AFL?

Regardless of the coach's reputation or accomplishments, the use of inappropriate language or behavior should still be addressed in a professional and respectful manner.
While Alastair Clarkson is certainly a highly regarded coach in the AFL, this does not exempt him from criticism or accountability for his actions. If his use of the phrase "your time will come" was viewed as inappropriate or disrespectful by the reporter or others, it would be important to address the situation and work towards a resolution that is fair and respectful to everyone involved.
It's also worth noting that the coach's reputation and track record could impact how the situation is perceived by fans and the broader community. If the coach has a history of positive leadership and respectful behavior, fans may be more willing to give him the benefit of the doubt in a situation like this. However, this does not mean that inappropriate behavior should be excused or ignored.

Were they free questions, or paid for? Cause BF can provide the same answers, in more vivid language, for free

 

[Chief]

LOL!

Super Google does it again!

"In a heated encounter, how might a male sports coach be interpreted when, believing they are protecting a player from being questioned over a fellow players alleged domestic violence and abuse of female partners, they tell a female reporter "your time will come"?"

"A statement such as "your time will come" from a male sports coach to a female reporter in a heated encounter could be interpreted as a threat or a warning to the reporter. If the coach is perceived to be using the statement to protect a player from being questioned over allegations of domestic violence and abuse of female partners, it could be seen as an attempt to silence the reporter and prevent them from doing their job. It could also be interpreted as a display of sexism and a disregard for the reporter's professional role. This type of behavior could be seen as unacceptable and could lead to negative consequences for both the coach and the team they represent. It is important for coaches and other sports leaders to communicate in a professional and respectful manner, regardless of the situation or their personal beliefs."


I can do this all day: I have ChatGPT Plus so I never get a "service busy" message.

 

[Osho]

I Super Googled it:

The phrase "your time will come" can be used as a threat to imply that the person being threatened will eventually face negative consequences or punishment for their actions or behavior. It suggests that the person making the threat is aware of some wrongdoing or perceived slight by the other person, and is warning them that they will not escape justice forever.

In this context, the phrase implies that the person being threatened should expect to face some form of retaliation or retribution in the future. It can be a way for the person making the threat to assert their power or control over the situation, and to intimidate the other person into complying with their wishes or demands.

For example, a boss might say "Your time will come" to an employee who has been repeatedly late for work or has been insubordinate. The boss is warning the employee that they will face disciplinary action if they don't improve their behavior.

Overall, the phrase "your time will come" can be a menacing and ominous threat that suggests that the person being threatened should be afraid of what may happen to them in the future.

Don't trust your own interpretation?

AI may end up reducing all our collective brain functions.

 

[ferball]

I'm not saying he needs to publically address it prior to the report being released, or even after it comes out (although, he did put out a statement about this topic). I don't dispute the last paragraph of your post either.

My comment was in direct reply to yours which stated that he "denies he told someone to abort their kid." He has not done that, at least publically.

That's how I interpreted it at the time.

Months ago SbtDotB made the point that Clarkson and Fagan may have acted in what they thought was a completely reasonable manner. But young indigenous people, like the couples in question may have interpreted those actions as orders from an authority figure they couldn't refuse. It could have been a triggering event like cops standing over them when they were young. Its an easier thing for you to understand now, maybe a decade later when most of you white people have been exposed to the concept for a few years.

But we're talking about events that happened during a time when Malthouse and Buckley were letting their players call one of their teammates "Chimp" because he was black.

They (the Hawthorn people) may not have acted with what some people would consider appropriate cultural sensitivity today, but who did back then? Probably only a few clubs had any idea about relating to indigenous people properly. Not everyone did what Pagan's side did - actively target opposition players with a history of racist attitudes. Clarkson said when he came back to North that as a young man at the club he nearly went off the rails and gave away his footy career to be a trouble making jerk. It was only that Ron Joseph, John Kennedy and Pagan were able to get him to get his shit together. Probably by speaking to him in no uncertain terms about what he was doing wrong and laying down the law about how he should behave.

Easy to see him doing that to indigenous people thinking he's doing exactly what helped him get his shit together but it not working that way cos he didn't understand the cultural differences that came across.

At no point has anyone except North supporters and maybe one or two other posters who aren't active in this thread at the moment acknowledged that. People in this thread acting as if Clarkson's behaviour at hawthorn was worse than Eddie Maguire or the Collingwood coaching staff at the time.

 

[Makeshift Park]

Were they free questions, or paid for? Cause BF can provide the same answers, in more vivid language, for free

Its not really free. There are 19 different ad trackers on this site.