How Long Can We Stay with Holden?

[Apples]

Considering the car wreck that is Holden, not to mention its total lack of ethics and morality at having screwed over every Australian tax payer for years and then pissing off home and closing manufacturing in Australia, how long can we remain associated with this washed-up has been?

Holden is a company on life-support, with totally crap offerings apart from a few of its bigger vehicles. It's had its lowest sales in 70 years these last few months.

I understand we have a contract, but it's not a good look for Collingwood to be associated with this steaming heap of mediocrity in my opinion. The writing was on the wall when we signed up to the current contract and things have become steadily worse. Collingwood is directly linked to a company with demonstrably no ethics, just like Sydney with Volkswagen. If I were a Swans supporter I'd be filthy that my club was associated with those corporate cowboys, and I say that as a VW owner.

It's probably happening behind the scenes now; the search would be on for a replacement naming-rights sponsor. I hope we give just as much thought to ethics and morality as we do to the money, when we make the decision going forward.

 

[Tarkyn_24]

Ford vs Holden shitfight in 3.... 2....

 

[AmericanMustard]

Until they stop giving us the most money

 

[jimmy35]

Until they stop giving us the most money

Probably this I’d say.

 

[left at home]

Until they stop giving us the most money

Yep, agree, a contract is a contract, and it’s worth a lot,

 

[Apples]

Well yes, the money is important; I think it's $3 mill a year for the life of the contract, but I'd reckon there'd be other key companies that would want to be aligned to Collingwood. Companies with a good record.

Whilst I'm at it, I have always hated the way our HQ looks like a bloody Holden facility. You have to look pretty hard for a Collingwood presence; especially on the Yarra side.

At one stage not so long ago, Olympic Park looked like Holden headquarters and not the home of the biggest Club in the land. Why wasn't holden black and white? The logo I mean.

It's one thing to take the money and align yourself to a company (and vice-versa), but another altogether to lose identity. Collingwood guards the black and white stripes aggressively, but it seems not at its home. Sad.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Well yes, the money is important; I think it's $3 mill a year for the life of the contract, but I'd reckon there'd be other key companies that would want to be aligned to Collingwood. Companies with a good record.

Whilst I'm at it, I have always hated the way our HQ looks like a bloody Holden facility. You have to look pretty hard for a Collingwood presence; especially on the Yarra side.

At one stage not so long ago, Olympic Park looked like Holden headquarters and not the home of the biggest Club in the land. Why wasn't holden black and white? The logo I mean.

It's one thing to take the money and align yourself to a company (and vice-versa), but another altogether to lose identity. Collingwood guards the black and white stripes aggressively, but it seems not at its home. Sad.

I think all those things you say are wrong, is the very reason the sponsorship deal is worth so much

It would be unviable for a sponsor to sponsor us and not have their corporate logo plastered everywhere

 

[Apples]

I don't think it's wrong to suggest that Collingwood's brand should be front and centre at its own headquarters.

 

[Jen2310]

They pay the $$, they can command whatever they want, unfortunately.

 

[neilk]

Toyota have done pretty much the same thing and they are still a major sponsor of the AFL, as have Ford with Geelong.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

I don't think it's wrong to suggest that Collingwood's brand should be front and centre at its own headquarters.

Sure, but that is the compromise with the potential $ on offer

 

[Scodog10]

I don't think it's wrong to suggest that Collingwood's brand should be front and centre at its own headquarters.

Extremely valid point Apples. There’s a balance between selling your soul for the almighty $ and doing what is right. In this case maintaining a Holden presence in black and white should be a bare minimum as it was with CUA (changing from green to white on our black jumper panel).

We have a history of chasing the $ over brand alignment when we jettisoned Adidas a move that we’ve been all the poorer for. This board is facing a similar issue with the amount of good people we’ve bled. In all cases like this it’s the fault of the leadership and you don’t have to look much further than the former CEO to understand why Holden needs to go as well as to see why Anderson has been a breath of fresh air.

Change is sometimes necessary for regeneration!

 

[Apples]

But that's the whole point BJ. Collingwood guards its identity more vigilantly than any other club in Australia. We fight for our jumper on a yearly basis; from AFL pressure to the Johnny-come-latelies in Adelaide. It's annoying that we meekly roll over when it comes to our HQ branding, and it's totally unnecessary.

 

[sideswipe]

Moralising about sponsors is a slippery slope. What about being aligned with a certain state-owned airline when the state isn't exactly big on respecting human rights?

 

[Apples]

Toyota have done pretty much the same thing and they are still a major sponsor of the AFL, as have Ford with Geelong.

As far as I'm aware, Toyota didn't promise to stay, take millions of dollars of our money and then piss off home to Detroit. And in any case, Toyota at least makes good, reliable cars. Not sure if Holden has done that in many a long year. Ford is pretty much irrelevant these days too and their customer support is almost as bad as those a....holes at Volkswagen.

 

[Apples]

Moralising about sponsors is a slippery slope. What about being aligned with a certain state-owned airline when the state isn't exactly big on respecting human rights?

That's true sideswipe, but Holden has no ethics or morals, AND makes totally crap vehicles. That's a lose-lose. The UAE may not be a beacon of democracy, but at least its airline provides one of the best experiences you can buy. Emirates is a top airline and a global success story. I'm fine with it being aligned with Collingwood.

 

[Scodog10]

Moralising about sponsors is a slippery slope. What about being aligned with a certain state-owned airline when the state isn't exactly big on respecting human rights?

From my perspective there aren’t many big brands that can afford the sort of sponsorship AFL clubs receive that haven’t had a moral or ethical issue or two along the way so that’s not the issue I have. Happy for others to have that discussion though and I think it’s a legitimate one.

My take though is that the product the sponsor offers needs to be premium (Hawthorn - Audi) and if at all possible someway aligned (Cotton On/ Geelong BOQ/ Brisbane because of location). Holden ticks neither of those boxes whereas the sponsor you’re referring to at least ticks one...

 

[Horaceg]

As far as I'm aware, Toyota didn't promise to stay, take millions of dollars of our money and then piss off home to Detroit. And in any case, Toyota at least makes good, reliable cars. Not sure if Holden has done that in many a long year. Ford is pretty much irrelevant these days too and their customer support is almost as bad as those a....holes at Volkswagen.

Holden couldn't make it work here, no-one can continue to run a Company that does not make a profit. A Company is in business to make money and a return for shareholders.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

But that's the whole point BJ. Collingwood guards its identity more vigilantly than any other club in Australia. We fight for our jumper on a yearly basis; from AFL pressure to the Johnny-come-latelies in Adelaide. It's annoying that we meekly roll over when it comes to our HQ branding, and it's totally unnecessary.

I don't disagree, but I kind of think there would be a similar outcry if we 'only' accepted $1M in sponsorship and gave up a potential $2M or $3M because we wanted to keep the Collingwood brand at the forefront of the Holden/Westpac/Insert Name Here centre
I suspect the knives would be out for Eddie if we passed that amount over

But that's just the cynic in my I guess

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Holden couldn't make it work here, no-one can continue to run a Company that does not make a profit. A Company is in business to make money and a return for shareholders.

I think the wider point is they undertook to stay here and build cars locally, if the Federal Government gave them a ($150M ?) grant
They took the money then shot through

 

[Vicky Park]

I don't think it's wrong to suggest that Collingwood's brand should be front and centre at its own headquarters.

The club has tried. The old Olympic Pool, which we occupy, is on the Victorian Heritage Register, and I know for a fact that they asked Heritage Victoria for approval of more and bigger CFC related signage and it was knocked back. Signs on heritage buildings are a sensitive issue.

Although the new Glasshouse is not protected, so maybe we could go for broke on that building.

 

[Apples]

Agreed. They couldn't make it work because they produced what Australians didn't want to buy and treated customers like crap. There didn't appear to be any plan in place and the decision making made Holden look like a bunch of muppets. The business model is unsustainable. It has 'retired' the Commodore and the Astra to focus on its SUV and ute lineup. What's it got? The embarrassing Trax and the hopeless Acadia Equinox. These are SUVs that few people want. They are outsold by 4 to 1 by opposition vehicles made by Hyundai, Kia, Toyota and Mazda. The Trailblazer and Colorado seem to be decent enough vehicles going by reliability surveys. I don't see that as a viable future.
Toyota outsells Holden 5-1 on current sales. The failure of the company is a foregone conclusion. The brand is dead. Collingwood must know this. I wonder what is playing out in our boardroom. Holden will sink in 2020; it's probably a good idea to be announcing a new naming sponsor asap.

 

[Horaceg]

I think the wider point is they undertook to stay here and build cars locally, if the Federal Government gave them a ($150M ?) grant
They took the money then shot through

Sounds like the Government did a really bad deal if they could take 150M and just walk away.

 

[Dynamics]

Emirates is wholly owned by the UAE government via their investment company.

Just in case people aren't familiar with the human rights issues in the UAE... There's no freedom of speech and no freedom of press.

Sharia law governs marriage, divorce and child custody, even for non-Muslims.

They like to champion themselves as leading the way in human rights compared to their neighbours like Saudi Arabia, and there seems to be some truth to that. BUT a human rights activist is currently serving 10 years in jail because his advocacy was insulting to the UAE's "prestige". There are many reports of academics and activists being tortured and even disappearing.

I don't have a particularly strong view on this sponsorship issue, but I'd be wary of waving away these sorts of major moral issues because the service on their planes is nice.

 

[Apples]

The club has tried. The old Olympic Pool, which we occupy, is on the Victorian Heritage Register, and I know for a fact that they asked Heritage Victoria for approval of more and bigger CFC related signage and it was knocked back. Signs on heritage buildings are a sensitive issue.

Although the new Glasshouse is not protected, so maybe we could go for broke on that building.

We could Vicky, but we haven't done. I'm attaching a snap I took a few weeks back. This is the view most commuters get of our facility. Unlike Punt Rd Oval which is unmistakably Richmond, our home has no Collingwood identity.