- Jun 17, 2019
- 7,378
- 17,472
- AFL Club
- Hawthorn
Swallow a top 50 player?
Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
The argument isn't that St Kilda were wrong to take Riewoldt because he never won them a flag, it's that tanking for pick 1 hasn't really paid off in the last couple of decades, therefore there's no much point in doing it.Nick Reiwoldt pick 1, never won a flag... was the decision to take him at pick 1 a failure/bad decision?
If the Saints had taken 4 time flag winner Shaun Burgoyne(went pick 12 in the same draft) instead of Reiwoldt would that have netted them a flag?
in his first few seasons he was 2nd best GC player to Ablett, then injuries got himSwallow a top 50 player?
Pick Number | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 |
Premiership Player | 4 | 8 | 10 | 7 | 6 |
All Australian | 11 | 12 | 7 | 8 | 10 |
100 Games | 25 | 22 | 24 | 15 | 20 |
How many of those tanked, in your opinion? Cos your post is about tanking, is it not?I have listed the no 1 draft pick for the 2000s and a little summary of what i think the players peak was. The number of premierships won is pretty damning which leads me to think tanking to get a number 1 pick is futile and there are better ways to win a premiership.
What are your thoughts?
2000Nick Riewoldt St Kilda no premierships Champion - no 1 player in the league 2001Luke Hodge Hawthorn 3 premierships Champion - top 10 player 2002Brendon Goddard St Kilda no premierships top 3 player - enigmatic 2003Adam Cooney Western Bulldogs no premierships Brownlow medalist 2004Brett Deledio Richmond no premierships Top 25 player 2005Marc Murphy Carlton no premierships Top 25 player 2006Bryce Gibbs Carlton no premierships Top 25 player 2007Matthew Kreuzer Carlton no premierships injuries curtailed his career 2008Jack Watts Melbourne no premierships He is Jack Watts, enough said 2009Tom Scully Melbourne no premierships retired early - top 50 player maybe 2010David Swallow Gold Coast no premierships top 50 player 2011Jonathon Patton Greater Western Sydney no premierships career ended early . injury prone. 2012Lachie Whitfield Greater Western Sydney no premierships top 25 player 2013Tom Boyd Greater Western Sydney 1 Premiership 1 great year - retired early 2014Paddy McCartin St Kilda no premierships delisted. injury prone back and playing well , top 100 player 2015Jacob Weitering Carlton no premierships no 1 defender in the league 2016Andrew McGrath Essendon no premierships upmarket list clogger 2017Cameron Rayner Brisbane Lions no premierships upmarket list clogger 2018Sam Walsh Carlton no premierships potential best midfielder 2019Matthew Rowell Gold Coast no premierships jurys out. showing top 25 promise 2020Jamarra Ugle-Hagan Western Bulldogs no premierships jury out 2021Jason Horne-Francis North Melbourne no premierships jury out
The Melbourne and Carlton sides were either so bad or tanked to get high draft picks in the 2000s and early 2010s but I find that my friends talk about that they want their sides to tank to get a number 1 pick and the evidence is there that it doesn't really help winning premierships or even getting to finalsHow many of those tanked, in your opinion? Cos your post is about tanking, is it not?
And are you insinuating that anybody is tanking this year?
What about teams that tank but don't get number one, perhaps a later priority pick? Is that "worth it"?
You need better friends.but I find that my friends talk about that they want their sides to tank to get a number 1 pick
why so aggressive?You need better friends.
People also seem to forget that Hawthorn didn't finish last the year before we drafted Hodge.Because in this context, we're talking about the value of a team tanking to get pick 1. If only one of those teams have ever (well, since 2000 at least) gone on to win a flag, it makes for an interesting discussion.
Ummmm If you want to include AFL drafts from 1990 onwards.....Correct me if I am wrong, but only one Number 1 draft pick has played in a team that won a flag?
Hodge?
Hmm no I dont........Ummmm If you want to include AFL drafts from 1990 onwards.....
1992: Drew Banfield. Played in the 1994 and 2006 eagles premiership sides.
1998: Des Headland. Played in the 2002 side with Brisbane. that 2002 AFL grand final was his last game for Brisbane before he was traded to the dockers.
Scouting is improving over the decades too. Not to mention development coaches.Recruiting in recent years is far better than the chook-lotto of drafts in the 80s and 90s.
Culture > draft picks though, especially if we're talking differences at the pointy end of the draft where the first handful of kids are all outstanding talents anyway.
Looking at those 3 number 1 picks Carlton had in 2005-7.Marc Murphy won the AFLCA award in 2011 - his peak was a fair bit higher than top 25. Gibbs came 9th in the Brownlow in 2009, so he arguably peaked as a Top 10/Top15 player also.
It's not worth tanking though. You can net a decent player, but it sinks your culture and more than likely the player you choose wont be the best player in their draft cohort. You're just as likely to end up with Jack Watts or Andy McGrath.
I have listed the no 1 draft pick for the 2000s and a little summary of what i think the players peak was.
Murphy was AA in 2011Looking at those 3 number 1 picks Carlton had in 2005-7.
Marc Murphy was easily the best out of the 3. Your team got 300 games out of him. Sort of surprised he didn't get All Australian in his career. 2011 was the best case he could of got in. Played all 24 games. 700 disposals and 22 goals, 13 behinds.
Bryce Gibbs was the 2006 1st pick. Solid B grader. Was never an all Australian player but had a few solid seasons over a decade at Carlton until his career rotted at the crows.
2007 number 1 pick was Matt Kreuzer. Played 194 games. Had some injury prone seasons but was solid when fit.
The thing was trading Chris Judd at the end of 2007 helped improved all 3 of those blokes.
I have listed the no 1 draft pick for the 2000s and a little summary of what i think the players peak was. The number of premierships won is pretty damning which leads me to think tanking to get a number 1 pick is futile and there are better ways to win a premiership.
What are your thoughts?
2000Nick Riewoldt St Kilda no premierships Champion - no 1 player in the league 2001Luke Hodge Hawthorn 3 premierships Champion - top 10 player 2002Brendon Goddard St Kilda no premierships top 3 player - enigmatic 2003Adam Cooney Western Bulldogs no premierships Brownlow medalist 2004Brett Deledio Richmond no premierships Top 25 player 2005Marc Murphy Carlton no premierships Top 25 player 2006Bryce Gibbs Carlton no premierships Top 25 player 2007Matthew Kreuzer Carlton no premierships injuries curtailed his career 2008Jack Watts Melbourne no premierships He is Jack Watts, enough said 2009Tom Scully Melbourne no premierships retired early - top 50 player maybe 2010David Swallow Gold Coast no premierships top 50 player 2011Jonathon Patton Greater Western Sydney no premierships career ended early . injury prone. 2012Lachie Whitfield Greater Western Sydney no premierships top 25 player 2013Tom Boyd Greater Western Sydney 1 Premiership 1 great year - retired early 2014Paddy McCartin St Kilda no premierships delisted. injury prone back and playing well , top 100 player 2015Jacob Weitering Carlton no premierships no 1 defender in the league 2016Andrew McGrath Essendon no premierships upmarket list clogger 2017Cameron Rayner Brisbane Lions no premierships upmarket list clogger 2018Sam Walsh Carlton no premierships potential best midfielder 2019Matthew Rowell Gold Coast no premierships jurys out. showing top 25 promise 2020Jamarra Ugle-Hagan Western Bulldogs no premierships jury out 2021Jason Horne-Francis North Melbourne no premierships jury out
Marc Murphy did make it. So did Judd.
The biggest advantage in finishing last should be getting pick 1 in the PSD and a free swing at any uncontracted player.
It's rare there is a consensus pick 1 in the ND that is that much better than other players in the top 10.
We'll probably get pick 2 this year and it may still be pick 1. I don't care one way or the other. If it was the NBA I would really want pick 1.
Collingwood just smashed sides all year. They were the best team in it losing to just one side all season- Geelong- 3 times.Marc Murphy did make it. So did Judd.
Looked at the 2011 AA side. Midfield was mainly Collingwood players.
Surprised guys like Selwood and Bartel didn't get in
Jury out on Horne Francis? Has played about 10 games. Pull your head in.I have listed the no 1 draft pick for the 2000s and a little summary of what i think the players peak was. The number of premierships won is pretty damning which leads me to think tanking to get a number 1 pick is futile and there are better ways to win a premiership.
What are your thoughts?
2000Nick Riewoldt St Kilda no premierships Champion - no 1 player in the league 2001Luke Hodge Hawthorn 3 premierships Champion - top 10 player 2002Brendon Goddard St Kilda no premierships top 3 player - enigmatic 2003Adam Cooney Western Bulldogs no premierships Brownlow medalist 2004Brett Deledio Richmond no premierships Top 25 player 2005Marc Murphy Carlton no premierships Top 25 player 2006Bryce Gibbs Carlton no premierships Top 25 player 2007Matthew Kreuzer Carlton no premierships injuries curtailed his career 2008Jack Watts Melbourne no premierships He is Jack Watts, enough said 2009Tom Scully Melbourne no premierships retired early - top 50 player maybe 2010David Swallow Gold Coast no premierships top 50 player 2011Jonathon Patton Greater Western Sydney no premierships career ended early . injury prone. 2012Lachie Whitfield Greater Western Sydney no premierships top 25 player 2013Tom Boyd Greater Western Sydney 1 Premiership 1 great year - retired early 2014Paddy McCartin St Kilda no premierships delisted. injury prone back and playing well , top 100 player 2015Jacob Weitering Carlton no premierships no 1 defender in the league 2016Andrew McGrath Essendon no premierships upmarket list clogger 2017Cameron Rayner Brisbane Lions no premierships upmarket list clogger 2018Sam Walsh Carlton no premierships potential best midfielder 2019Matthew Rowell Gold Coast no premierships jurys out. showing top 25 promise 2020Jamarra Ugle-Hagan Western Bulldogs no premierships jury out 2021Jason Horne-Francis North Melbourne no premierships jury out
98 - HeadlandCorrect me if I am wrong, but only one Number 1 draft pick has played in a team that won a flag?
Hodge?
The OP stated from 2000 and Boyd did not win a flag with the Club that drafted him.98 - Headland
13 - Boyd