Player Watch Jordan De Goey

[MarkT2]

We won in '10 in spite of a team half full of shitbags, not because of it.

Absolute baseless nonesense. We won in 2010 because we had the best side playing the best game plan with high motivation levels. We came second in 2011 with much the same list dominating the H&A season like no Collingwood team has ever done before with the possible exception of the 1929 side which was undefeated in an 18 game season and lost the semi. We made a prelim in 2012 again with much the same side under Buckley after a worse injury run than we have had since yet we have used injuries as an excuse for poor results ever since.

We had some less than squeaky clean players for sure as does Hawthorn, as did Geelong and Brisbane before them and as did we in 1990. I'd suggest the 1990 side was more wayward than the 2010 side.

We ddin't win in spite of anything. We won because we were good and we were united.

 

[MarkT2]

.......but the white anting of Bucks started in 2011......that is fact.

White anting - that's conjecture. Nevertheless, assume it is fact. The fact that the club ignored the talk and what they observed internally and that history proved concerns to be justified is where the blame for our slide into medicrity lays.

2012 the prima donna syndrome increased by the usual suspects (Swan, Thomas, Shaw........etc) but they still had a s**t load of ability in that team even with the 5 season ending injuries as you highlighted.

I can't accept the contradiction inherant in that. A group of very good footballers quite possibly would have at least made the GF had it not been for J Mac's funeral. If the coach was being white anted there is simply no way that would be the case. It fell apart in 2013 and the balme lies with the coach not the players. The wrong reign was pulled. The culture shift, Leading Teams, the relationship management with players etc all blew us up. If a talented group of players don't want the coach then the coach has to go. At the very least they have to be taken seriously. If the coach can't coach the players then he can't coach.

There is no more stark contrast than us v The Dog's. Their reaction to Griffin & co v Collingwood's (more to the point Eddie's) reaction to our suituation.

Prima donnas nothing more nothing less..........lucky they can kick a football (exhibit A - De Goey)

Prima donna they may be but nothing more? How about the best group of players we have had at least since 1990 and possibly 1930? Players that could have won another flag like Geelong did post 2010 when they were written off as cooked? How about just maybe good judges of a coach? So far results point to the players being right and the coach and board being wrong.

Lists like we had maybe come around once in a generation. Coaches like Buckley grow on trees but many never get the chance to prove it let alone keep getting that chance regardless of results. The only reason Buckley is still Collingwood coach is because the president and all the president appointed board and CEO etc can't and wont make the hard call. Eddie made it with Shaw who is an almost identical example but he didn't appoint Shaw let alone to replace a premiership and immediately runner-up coach.

 

[CFC2010]

White anting - that's conjecture. Nevertheless, assume it is fact. The fact that the club ignored the talk and what they observed internally and that history proved concerns to be justified is where the blame for our slide into medicrity lays.
I can't accept the contradiction inherant in that. A group of very good footballers quite possibly would have at least made the GF had it not been for J Mac's funeral. If the coach was being white anted there is simply no way that would be the case. It fell apart in 2013 and the balme lies with the coach not the players. The wrong reign was pulled. The culture shifty, Leading Teams, the relationsghip management with players etc all blew us up. If a talented group of players don't want the coach then the coach has to go. If the coach can't coach the players then he can't coach.

There is no more stark example than us v The Dog's. Their reaction to Griffin & co v Collinwgood's (more to the point Eddie's) reaction to our suituation.
Prima donna they may be but nothing more? How about the ebst gorup of players we have had at least since 1990 and possibly 1930? Players that could have won another flag like Geelong did post 2010 when they were written off as cooked?

Lists like we had maybe come around once in a generation. Coaches like Buckley gerown on trees but many never get the chance to prove it let alone keep getting that chance regardless of results. The only reason Buckley is stioll collingwodo coach is because the president and all the president appointed board and CEO etc can't and wont make the hard call. Eddie made it with Shaw who is an almost identical example but he didn't appoint Shaw let alone to replace a premiership and immediately runner-up coach.

I agree with most of your post...............I understand why we went on the Culture revolution but again I agree it has been an abject failure.

We failed and I think if the powers at be had their time over again they would do things differently.

I hope I get to feel what I felt in 2011........I went to the footy expecting and confident of winning every game.

Collingwood definitely knows how to shoot itself in the foot ill give you that.

 

[MarkT2]

CFC, it's just a cop out to blame the players that aren't there any more. They are gone and we are mediocre in spite of trading a few out and rebuilding. Evidence strongly suggests we don't run a good football operation any more. It's hardly surprising when there isn't any real accountability from the top down. That of itself is hardly surprising when the president who is supposed to be an elected board appiontment appoints the board members. He's not supposed to appoint and remove the coaches or appoint the CEOs for that matter. That's 1980s Carlton.

 

[TheSierBear]

Happened to be reading big footy on a mate's mobile - where of course I don't have TG blocked - not surprised to see that he is still riding the same old hobby horse and not surprised - but VERY annoyed - he feels he can quote my post.

Typical, no wonder I blocked him

We won in '10 in spite of a team half full of shitbags, not because of it.

You are probably right. But in reality we don't know these s**t-bags. They are different personalities with a different energy, certainly in Heaters case. Dane Swan seems like a pretty decent human when you watch him on that stupid show on channel 10 don't know what it's called.

 

[CFC2010]

CFC, it's just a cop out to blame the players that aren't there any more. They are gone and we are mediocre in spite of trading a few out and rebuilding. Evidence strongly suggests we don't run a good football operation any more. It's hardly surprising when there isn't any real accountability from the top down. That of itself is hardly surprising when the president who is supposed to be an elected board appiontment appoints the board members. He's not supposed to appoint and remove the coaches or appoint the CEOs for that matter. That's 1980s Carlton.

I didn't blame the players..........I called them prima donnas and white antr's.

I blame the whole box and dice at our Club. You are right it starts at the top.

I get what they tried to do but they failed..........whether we learn from it is another matter.

 

[Nice n Crispy]

Agree 100% on the mentor part...........Johno or Tarrant would be perfect.......I think they both still work for the Club.

Its the Gen Zer's mentality that I find hard to accept. My boys are playing in the same under 9's Football Team this year and they do not have scoring (even though all the kids score) WHY?? Kids need to learn early that their can only be one winner (excluding draw) and a loser.
Losing builds character just like being told some home truths sometimes!!!

This generation is soft IMO but I tell you what they sure have an answer for anything you throw at them.

Totally agree, however I think its been in the last ten years where this has happened more and you can't totally blame the kids when they get drilled into them (primarily at school) that everyone is a winner. The difference between when I started at school in '05, and my cousin who started last year, is astounding. If we were to play a game, I learnt to let them "win" (kills me to do it too), because they have been raised in a mindset where participation is rewarded and anything more than mild competitiveness is discouraged more often than not. So much depends on teachers and school curriculum as well.

(Not addressing your kids in any way btw, and obviously not all kids are like this- my other cousin (the same age) is the complete opposite. Just what I've noticed more and more).

Edit: spelling and grammar

 

[jonbe54]

It's a public forum. If you don't want certain people quoting your posts the only way to do that is not post.

Apex he's blocked and he knows he's blocked so it's just another cheap shot from a cheap shot merchant.

 

[jonbe54]

Absolute baseless nonesense. We won in 2010 because we had the best side playing the best game plan with high motivation levels. We came second in 2011 with much the same list dominating the H&A season like no Collingwood team has ever done before with the possible exception of the 1929 side which was undefeated in an 18 game season and lost the semi. We made a prelim in 2012 again with much the same side under Buckley after a worse injury run than we have had since yet we have used injuries as an excuse for poor results ever since.

We had some less than squeaky clean players for sure as does Hawthorn, as did Geelong and Brisbane before them and as did we in 1990. I'd suggest the 1990 side was more wayward than the 2010 side.

We ddin't win in spite of anything. We won because we were good and we were united.

We agree to disagree Mark.

 

[Scodog10]

Easy to criticize but I don’t see how things could have been handled differently without the same outcome.
JdG breaks his hand and conjures a story. How long you reckon could CollingwoodFC keep it quiet that JdG broke his hand. How much longer could the club keep a position that they're still 'investigating' what happened. That already shows a breakdown of trust between player and club. It raises questions what could have happened as the club doesn’t release any information.

How many 'kids' well beyond the age of maturity and with years of media training need hand holding ( the good one that is ) before they get the message that Collingwood is a fishbowl.

Bucks deserves kudos for backing his player and going with the story. Next time someone screws up, they know a) what they say will be in the news papers and b) truth comes out regardless and c) they will be in deep if they are not honest from the start.

There is always one that thinks they are indestructible and Murphys law doesn’t apply to them. Their sacrifice serves as warning for others.
A brutal reality but it is a brutal world out there.

Unless he becomes a model citizen and works his @ss off, he is out the door.
And if the right offer would come along, still be tempted to move him on.

Your post has nothing to do with my comments on how they've handled the past 24 hours internally so I don't know why you quoted me? The only comment I can really reply with is that the club made it easy to criticise because of how they handled it.

Overall the issue was put to bed 36 hours ago anyway so I have no interest in getting back into that side of the discussion.

 

[PicaBoo]

Your post has nothing to do with my comments on how they've handled the past 24 hours internally so I don't know why you quoted me? The only comment I can really reply with is that the club made it easy to criticise because of how they handled it.

Overall the issue was put to bed 36 hours ago anyway so I have no interest in getting back into that side of the discussion.

I could point to a number of items that I quoted but I will let it rest.
Past 24 hrs are not that interesting nor are the next 4 weeks. When he is able to get back and play VFL we will have a better idea of where his future lies.

 

[Seedsfan]

Dustin Martin copped a lot of flak last year. Yes he was drunk, and apparently threatened someone with chopsticks (if you believe the story).

DeGoey was drunk and actually physically assaulted another person (unless he punched a brick wall).

I wonder which was the more serious event?

No excuse really. If anything, a sign of a guy who is fairly weak. A flawed character and unfortunately the club missed it before reading out his name.

Disappointing to say the least. Those who speculated previously on BigFooty about his commitment and character have been vindicated.

He is going to need to show something extraordinary.

Lol talk about throwing the baby out with the bath water

 

[Kappa]

Swap De Goey for Martin throw in some picks.

Once Richmond realise they need another rebuild they'll go looking for younger players

 

[THATSGOLD]

Happened to be reading big footy on a mate's mobile - where of course I don't have TG blocked - not surprised to see that he is still riding the same old hobby horse and not surprised - but VERY annoyed - he feels he can quote my post.

Typical, no wonder I blocked him

We won in '10 in spite of a team half full of shitbags, not because of it.

How did you ever survive, thanks for pointing it out publicly though.

 

[MarkT2]

We agree to disagree Mark.

Fair enough.
Let's hope we can disagree in the near future about what brought about our success from here.

 

[Rorzza]

I assume this has been posted already, if not here you go.

Foxfooty.com.au:
http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/dan...s/news-story/ae1c23eb903c15b36dedd00ab5bb6997

 

[jonbe54]

Fair enough.
Let's hope we can disagree in the near future about what brought about our success from here.

Certainly agree to that

 

[Anzacday]

I assume this has been posted already, if not here you go.

Foxfooty.com.au:
http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/dan...s/news-story/ae1c23eb903c15b36dedd00ab5bb6997

Now that one's believable not like the fiction the other day.

 

[gothedons]

So what's the earliest he will be back?

 

[surfer1]

So much moralising. Hope no one lives in glass houses.

 

[Maggie5]

Mathew Lloyd just said that DeGoey was given lots of opportunity in front of Walsh, Burns and Bucks to make sure the story was true and even gave the Shaw Didak example and he didn't budge.
Only since Greenwood and Howe rang him saying they had heard rumours and to come clean.
He then rang Walsh and changed his story.

 

[Peter Sidorkiewicz]

Mathew Lloyd just said that DeGoey was given lots of opportunity in front of Walsh, Burns and Bucks to make sure the story was true and even gave the Shaw Didak example and he didn't budge.
Only since Greenwood and Howe rang him saying they had heard rumours and to come clean.
He then rang Walsh and changed his story.

Obviously it doesn't look well on DeGoey but you have to question why is the relationship between a young player and it coaches so poor that it requires two senior player to coerce DeGoey to finally tell the truth.

 

[Rorzza]

What is that phrase...young, dumb and full of............!!! Alcohol?

 

[Maggie5]

Obviously it doesn't look well on DeGoey but you have to question why is the relationship between a young player and it coaches so poor that it requires two senior player to coerce DeGoey to finally tell the truth.

Don't think it has anything to do with relationship between coaches.
Have you never lied to your parents or close family members, that is a much closer relationship and I daresay it happens all the time.
Just a silly young man who I hope learns his lesson.

 

[Rorzza]

I told my wife the other day I couldn't take my daughter to a Sunday afternoon birthday party because I had to do work. My wife took my little girl, I ended up turning fox sport on and flicking between the footy and the cricket. I feel terrible but if I had my time again I'd probably make the same decision!