List Mgmt. 'Play hardball': Mitch Robinson urges the Suns to re-draft Jack Martin

Should Gold Coast make a stand and re-draft Jack Martin?


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Hawk_francais

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Sep 20, 2015
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Some interesting comments from Mitch Robinson. I agree, Gold Coast should make a stand otherwise they will continue to be pilferred.


I don't really understand why they didn't trade him and move on. It would be quite cynical to re-draft him given he was playing in the NEAFL. Poor guy is just a skeleton in the noose right now, warning Lukosius et al not to think about asking for a trade. There are better ways to build culture.
 

amc11

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I don't really understand why they didn't trade him and move on. It would be quite cynical to re-draft him given he was playing in the NEAFL. Poor guy is just a skeleton in the noose right now, warning Lukosius et al not to think about asking for a trade. There are better ways to build culture.
I thought they were open to trading Martin but not to being screwed over by Carlton.
 

1970crow

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I don't really understand why they didn't trade him and move on. It would be quite cynical to re-draft him given he was playing in the NEAFL. Poor guy is just a skeleton in the noose right now, warning Lukosius et al not to think about asking for a trade. There are better ways to build culture.
He should have selected a club that was prepared to pay a fair price for him. He’s responsible for where he finds himself and I hope the Suns re-draft him.
 

iBeng

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Sort of stuck in the worst spot here. They refused to trade him for what they considered under his value, but now they will lose him for nothing unless they redraft him, which he can name his own price(Can someone confirm?)
 

BJK#5

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I think setting the right culture and wanting players to be at the Suns would be more important that 'making a stand' or whatever the media want to claim they need to do.

They were not happy with the compensation Carlton offered? Fine, send him to the Draft and he ends up where he ends up. You didn't fold and just let him get to his club of choice but you are done with him and moving on. Forcing a player to come back who clearly does not want to be at the club would be awful for the culture of the club and if i was a young draftee i would not be happy being drafted to them if i saw them redraft Martin.
 

iBeng

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I think setting the right culture and wanting players to be at the Suns would be more important that 'making a stand' or whatever the media want to claim they need to do.

They were not happy with the compensation Carlton offered? Fine, send him to the Draft and he ends up where he ends up. You didn't fold and just let him get to his club of choice but you are done with him and moving on. Forcing a player to come back who clearly does not want to be at the club would be awful for the culture of the club and if i was a young draftee i would not be happy being drafted to them if i saw them redraft Martin.
Of course you run the risk of other clubs just offering pathetic trade deals for players they know they'll have a good chance the Suns will just drop into the draft because they dont get the returns they wanted.

Thats probably the fear behind the Suns not accepting the offer from Carlton. Doesnt help when the player wants to deal with ONE club. If there were, say, three clubs putting up offers and Martin was happy to go to any of them and THEN the Suns said NO, go to the Draft, THEN they would be the daft ones in that situation.
 

BJK#5

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Of course you run the risk of other clubs just offering pathetic trade deals for players they know they'll have a good chance the Suns will just drop into the draft because they dont get the returns they wanted.

Thats probably the fear behind the Suns not accepting the offer from Carlton. Doesnt help when the player wants to deal with ONE club. If there were, say, three clubs putting up offers and Martin was happy to go to any of them and THEN the Suns said NO, go to the Draft, THEN they would be the daft ones in that situation.
I think the AFL is at a point where it is too professional to be seeing that happen, it is so very rare that we ever see an out of contract player not get traded when he wants to.

In this case clearly Carlton and the Suns just had different idea on the value of Martin and that is fine. I have no issue with the Suns deciding to let him go to the Draft and say you end up where you end up we don't care, i do have a bit of an issue with a club redrafting a player that clearly doesn't want to be at the club. He gave 6 years of service it isn't like he is a rookie trying to demand his way out.
 

iBeng

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I think the AFL is at a point where it is too professional to be seeing that happen, it is so very rare that we ever see an out of contract player not get traded when he wants to.

In this case clearly Carlton and the Suns just had different idea on the value of Martin and that is fine. I have no issue with the Suns deciding to let him go to the Draft and say you end up where you end up we don't care, i do have a bit of an issue with a club redrafting a player that clearly doesn't want to be at the club. He gave 6 years of service it isn't like he is a rookie trying to demand his way out.
Thats true as well, probably the best comparison is to the Lions in the Go Home 5 season...we could have easily said no to half those trades and just redrafted them.

Afterwards articles came out saying we had no backbone letting those kids walk, but what sort of culture would we have if we forced young adults to remain at a club they requested to leave?
 

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Hawk_francais

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He should have selected a club that was prepared to pay a fair price for him. He’s responsible for where he finds himself and I hope the Suns re-draft him.
A first round pick is a fair price for a 24 year-old player playing reserves?

Why would you hope they re-draft him? To serve him right for requesting a trade when he's not in the best 22 and he's out of contract?
 

HTPunter

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Thats true as well, probably the best comparison is to the Lions in the Go Home 5 season...we could have easily said no to half those trades and just redrafted them.

Afterwards articles came out saying we had no backbone letting those kids walk, but what sort of culture would we have if we forced young adults to remain at a club they requested to leave?
Part of the solution was getting rid of the senior players who from an outsiders perspective, contributed to these young guys wanting to leave.

Jack Martin is at risk of being one of those senior players in my opinion.
 

La Dispute

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A first round pick is a fair price for a 24 year-old player playing reserves?

Why would you hope they re-draft him? To serve him right for requesting a trade when he's not in the best 22 and he's out of contract?
Correct.

As I’ve mentioned in the countless other threads on this same topic, this isn’t a Suns-specific issue.

Martin is uncontracted, out of form, still coasting on potential in his mid 20’s and had already nominated a club, so the Gold Coast had no leverage in their negotiations.

The next argument becomes “Gold Coast have no need for a 2nd and 3rd round picks next year, they have enough young talent.” So trade them. Do the obvious thing and flick those picks for established players or trade into the following draft. These are future picks, and a decision doesn’t need to be made on them until next year.
 

btdg

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This is a bizarre and stupid situation by both clubs.

First, on Carlton’s side, agonising over what he’s worth is stupid. You get a decent player just entering his prime, convince him that your (bottom 3) team is the place he wants to be... then quibble over the price? Sure, we were holding out for Papley and keeping some assets in reserve but it’s just poor form. Get the deal done, bring the guy in and get him settled and focusing on preseason and playing good footy in a new environment. Instead, we are stuck in some stupid game of emotional blackmail, hoping GC don’t exercise their right to redraft him (which would be perfectly legit of them) AND that Melbourne for some reason choose not to draft a bloke who would totally fit their needs. Absolute idiocy.

On GC side, geez. They had years to sort out his contract and an extension beyond this year. They didn’t. Too bad - you’ve had 7 years with the bloke, he’s given solid service at a basket case of a club, and now wants something different. You’ve traded out other guys in his age bracket who wanted to go, and this is the stand you are making, over 10 or so spots of draft position when you are loaded with (freebie) draft assets gifted to you by the league? This is your stand? To what end? Keep Martin for 1 miserable year until free agency and then he can go anyone? Try again to persuade him to stay (8th time is a charm, right?)? If it’s a question of price, again, figure out something you want and get it sorted rather than having this mess that the whole playing group is absolutely watching... Absolute idiocy.

There’s a reason why both teams are in the bottom 3 IMO. Richmond gave up pick 6 for Prestia, traded a second round pick for Caddy; even packaged up two picks to get a first rounder for Chris Yarran, a trade that didn’t pan out. In the end - they got good players into their footy club and have won premierships. Does anyone see Hawthorn or Geelong ballsing this up from either direction? Hawthorn let Buddy Franklin go for pick 19 when he wanted out, traded a heap to get Jaeger O’Meara. Their ‘rebuild’ included a top 4 home and away season last year. The AFL should have stepped in on this one and forced a mediation (and still should rather than letting the dick-swinging contest turn the draft into a shambles).
 

Elmer_Judd

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Mitch Robinson is a moron with the IQ of a bag of Twisties, and obviously still bitter we gave him the flick after years of disgraceful off-field drunken antics (don't think many of his former teammates at Carlton respect him either, ie Michael Jamison)

I have no problems at all with Gold Coast re-drafting Martin, but no one should take Robbo seriously, he is one of the most stupid, selfish and self-absorbed flogs who ever played for the Carlton Footy club, and I hope he never plays in a flag (got nothing against Brisbane btw, just the bitter hatred for Robinson is real and pure as it gets)
 

1970crow

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Thats true as well, probably the best comparison is to the Lions in the Go Home 5 season...we could have easily said no to half those trades and just redrafted them.

Afterwards articles came out saying we had no backbone letting those kids walk, but what sort of culture would we have if we forced young adults to remain at a club they requested to leave?
The same as Geelong. Contracted or uncontracted, there is no difference between Geelong forcing Kelly to stay against his wishes. Or Carlton and Gibbs. Players will still put in because they’re protecting their contract value. Nobody is sitting out the year sulking or mailing in their performances. A culture that values the other guys on the list enough to ensure they’re appropriately compensated when players leave is not unimportant. I don’t think getting reamed at the trade table on top of losing a player is quite the culture builder that some seem to think it is.
 

PumpyChowdown

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BJK#5

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The same as Geelong. Contracted or uncontracted, there is no difference between Geelong forcing Kelly to stay against his wishes. Or Carlton and Gibbs. Players will still put in because they’re protecting their contract value. Nobody is sitting out the year sulking or mailing in their performances. A culture that values the other guys on the list enough to ensure they’re appropriately compensated when players leave is not unimportant. I don’t think getting reamed at the trade table on top of losing a player is quite the culture builder that some seem to think it is.
There absolutely is a difference... If you are contracted you have committed to playing for that club for 'x' period of time. Martin has given his years of service and now has every right to move on to where he wishes to play.

Literally not at all comparable situations.
 

1970crow

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A first round pick is a fair price for a 24 year-old player playing reserves?

Why would you hope they re-draft him? To serve him right for requesting a trade when he's not in the best 22 and he's out of contract?
yep, him and Carlton or any club that isn’t prepared to pay up. Obviously the Suns didn’t think the offer was fair considering they’re prepared to risk getting nothing on principle. What difference does out of contract make, the buying club still needs to offer something the seller will accept. Carlton clearly didn’t do that. The Suns leverage comes in the form of having first crack at him in the PSD. I hope they use it. Will be funny reading all the bleeding hearts crying for poor little Jack having to play another year up North. Likely would be the same people who supported Geelong and their tough stance on Kelly last year. Where were the bleeding hearts then?
 

Toump Ass

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Gold Coast are a pile of shit and should fold for the benefit of the entire competition.

They've clearly been tanking for years, have been rewarded them with excessive priority picks and concessions... and yet they're still unwilling to trade players who don't want to be there and improve their list.

All this only a year or two after they refused to trade Gary Ablett which was pathetic given the circumstances.

The Suns are garbage.

That said, they should definitely "TAKE A STAND!!" and re-draft Martin because I don't want Melbourne to take him and it would be hilarious if Carlton missed out.
 

juss

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If the Suns re-draft Martin and he really doesn’t want to be there then he doesn’t have to sign the contract. Sure it means a year out of football but he can take a stand too.
Realistically he won't though. No one's going to advise him to sit out and miss 800k, and he'd be unbelievably stupid to do that at this stage of his career (where he has achieved nothing of note).

Remember Martin is not exactly young in football terms. He turns 25 in January 2020, and has done SFA. This is the defining moment of his career, because what happens with this contract probably defines how the rest of it pans out.
 

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