Toast Proud of our Club

[dusty1234!]

How could you possibly know how Aboriginal players at RFC will think or vote. What a racist horrible statement.

Do you really believe that if the Indigenous players, staff and officials at the club were against the Voice, the club would have taken this position publically?

I know this is hard for city based people of the left to understand but Aboriginal people are just as capable to make decisions independently as any other Australian of any race. Aboriginal people do not just all think alike.

Again, you are reaching for a political point here. Another throwaway line, "city based people of the left." How many times does it have to be repeated, this is not a left and right issue. Ken Wyatt, former Liberal Minister is supporting the voice. Is he an example of said 'inner city lefty?'

No one is saying that Aboriginal people are incapable of independent critical thinking, nor is anyone saying that they all think alike.
Maybe that is why the Voice doesn't consist of just 1 person? Because there are a variety of opinions that need representation?

All this is so ugly and just highlights again that RFC must have nothing to do with the voice.

This is just an unhinged rant.

 

[dusty1234!]

The Voice is ultimately not about giving Aboriginal people representation, but about removing representation from all Australians

Do please share how the Voice is removing representation from all Australians? Explain to me how I, as a non-Indigenous Australian, will have my representation removed? Or even name 1 negative impact it will have on me?

The Voice is ultimately not about giving Aboriginal people representation, but about removing representation from all Australians and more besides, although no grass-roots supporters know this. Only in the highest echelons is it known.

This sounds like a conspiracy theory unfortunatley. Either that, or you are accusing everyone who is leading the Yes campaign of being corrupt, or you are insulting the intelligence of everyone who supports this.

The people ultimately responsible for pushing it are not Aboriginal. Nor are they Australians. They have no morality whatsoever and Australian politicians of whatever ilk are merely puppets.

What on earth do you mean? The people who developed the Uluru Statement from the Heart, in which the Voice is a part of its recommendation are Aboriginial are they not? To accuse them of abject immorality is yet another personal and political attack, completely unhelpful for any debate.

"Puppets" of what exactly by the way? Some great conspiracy?

Their care for Aboriginal communities, especially remote ones, is entirely pretence.

Extraordinary accusation to make, especially when some of the people who have been on the Yes campaign come from remote communities, and still have family back home? Quite frankly insulting to those like Ken Wyatt and Patrick Dobson who have served in the national parliament, and have been lifelong campaigners for Indigenous Reconciliation.

The same-sex marriage plebiscite was also a Trojan horse, on the road to ultimately normalising paedophilia for the same people in the shadows of politics (on both sides).

For the record, I know far more about paedophiles than anyone likely to comment here, because I was the victim of one, as was my wife.

If anyone wishes to criticise a child sex abuse victim who was later threatened with death for infiltrating an organised paedophile network in the shadows of politics, law, healthcare, religion (including Atheism) and much else as well at the very highest levels and has lived with PTSD as an unheard whistleblower for nearly half a century, well, go ahead.

This is digressing to a debate on SSM. Whilst I don't want to entertain it, I must say that is frankly a ridiculous and outrageous claim to make.
Whilst I am sure no one doubts your personal traumas, and no one believes for one moment that it is acceptable, I strongly beleive that it is not accurate to say that SSM is a Trojan horse for normalising paedophilia.

You would need no reminding that there have been more than just a few instances of child sexual abuse in the Catholic Church, of same sex nature, and long before the plebiscite was even considered.

Child sexual abuse has been happening for a very long time, both of heterosexual and homosexual nature, with no consideration of the SSM vote.

And how on earth is the SSM vote a Trojan horse to normalising paedophilia? Would I be wrong to infer from this statement that you believe most if not all homosexuals are paedophiles?

And I don't think anyone sees paedophilia as 'normal' now, years on from the vote?

Again I emphasise that this is not a personal attack on you. I do not doubt your lived experiences, or your ongoing struggles as a result of them. I recognise that unimagineble hurt that that traumatic experience has left. I am not criticising you, rather fundamentally disagreeing with your statements.

 

[tigerisland]

Firstly I appreciate your compliment about my ability to make decisions for myself. Secondly, I am really not sure you understand what being racist is. Thirdly, whilst I value your point about Aboriginal people thinking for themselves you seem to have very little understanding of the mob and clan system where a council of elders or a significant elder would give advice to the community and the rest would most likely follow out of respect for their wisdom. If Aunty Miriam gives the nod at Daly all will follow, if old lady Wilson says yes at Peppi, yes it will be. The elders I meet with regularly represent around 50,000 people and I can tell you the majority of that 50’000 will all be voting YES. The reason I know how the Aboriginal players are thinking is that I know for a fact the Richmond Football Club consulted them during the process.
Fourthly sorry to disappoint you but I am not a city based person of the left. I am a proud outback Aboriginal man (Stolen Generation), you know, one of the ones who never saw his family again so I do have a vested interest in this. I want what is best for Aboriginal people.

RFC have been so brave regarding truth telling on the stolen generation please watch Shane Edwards and his Aboriginal grandmother explain to him the stolen generation up to 1.36. The stolen generation narrative has done so much damage.
We all want to improve the lives of aboriginal people. I am of the view that all school kids must learn about aboriginal culture and particularly their local mob. Welcome to country ceremonies are symptomatic of how aboriginal people are treated. Ask anyone who attends a function where there is a welcome country. They have no idea what it means who the local mob are the different skin groups etc. They will not take the time out to learn. But they feel they are making a difference and in their minds that is all that matters. It is all so disingenuous.
All the voice will do is further enrich an aboriginal elite and further encourage aboriginal people to view themselves as victims. A victim mentality is totally debilitating.
Instead we need to push for tangible results. I have family members teaching in the NT and they can only work 3 days a week as what they encounter is too confronting. The voice will change none of that. But inner city elites will feel good about themselves. Plus they will have created a Trojan horse to usurp democracy.
It is all highly political and the club needs to be apolitical.

 

[Thrasher97]

RFC have been so brave regarding truth telling on the stolen generation please watch Shane Edwards and his Aboriginal grandmother explain to him the stolen generation up to 1.36. The stolen generation narrative has done so much damage.
We all want to improve the lives of aboriginal people. I am of the view that all school kids must learn about aboriginal culture and particularly their local mob. Welcome to country ceremonies are symptomatic of how aboriginal people are treated. Ask anyone who attends a function where there is a welcome country. They have no idea what it means who the local mob are the different skin groups etc. They will not take the time out to learn. But they feel they are making a difference and in their minds that is all that matters. It is all so disingenuous.
All the voice will do is further enrich an aboriginal elite and further encourage aboriginal people to view themselves as victims. A victim mentality is totally debilitating.
Instead we need to push for tangible results. I have family members teaching in the NT and they can only work 3 days a week as what they encounter is too confronting. The voice will change none of that. But inner city elites will feel good about themselves. Plus they will have created a Trojan horse to usurp democracy.
It is all highly political and the club needs to be apolitical.

Have you ever thought that the Yes vote may grease the wheels to address some of these issues?
You're entitled to your opinion, but you are just parroting Peter Dutton's ridiculous points.

Also to assume that only inner city people support this is ridiculous, I live two hours away from the city and see this for what it is representation of FNP.

 

[richard parker]

The colonial and Australian governments attempted genocide on indigenous Australians. That is quite clear in the historical records. Their lands were stolen, their people murdered, their culture decimated. They are still reeling. I think that is important context here. Obviously, the Voice will not be perfect but I think it’s an important step towards recovery and healing. The only “no” voters I’m interested in hearing from really are indigenous ones.

 

[tiger_tough]

I don't know much about it, mainly because I'm an ignorant bastard. But if the brothers @ Richmond, the elders and the wider indigenous community believe this is a step in the right direction then I'm all for it.

 

[JAKLAUGHING]

I don't know much about it, mainly because I'm an ignorant bastard. But if the brothers @ Richmond, the elders and the wider indigenous community believe this is a step in the right direction then I'm all for it.

Same here...as far as I can understand the issue...it's not about you, me...left wing, right wing of politics...the colour of one's skin cos we all have skin in this great country...it's about coming together, not forcing divisive issues...it's about healing for one and all...country, fauna, environment, inhabitants, gender tribes...inclusive not exclusive...The Voice, all voices...has my Yes vote!

 

[Siberiantiger]

Do please share how the Voice is removing representation from all Australians? Explain to me how I, as a non-Indigenous Australian, will have my representation removed? Or even name 1 negative impact it will have on me?


This sounds like a conspiracy theory unfortunatley. Either that, or you are accusing everyone who is leading the Yes campaign of being corrupt, or you are insulting the intelligence of everyone who supports this.


What on earth do you mean? The people who developed the Uluru Statement from the Heart, in which the Voice is a part of its recommendation are Aboriginial are they not? To accuse them of abject immorality is yet another personal and political attack, completely unhelpful for any debate.

"Puppets" of what exactly by the way? Some great conspiracy?


Extraordinary accusation to make, especially when some of the people who have been on the Yes campaign come from remote communities, and still have family back home? Quite frankly insulting to those like Ken Wyatt and Patrick Dobson who have served in the national parliament, and have been lifelong campaigners for Indigenous Reconciliation.


This is digressing to a debate on SSM. Whilst I don't want to entertain it, I must say that is frankly a ridiculous and outrageous claim to make.
Whilst I am sure no one doubts your personal traumas, and no one believes for one moment that it is acceptable, I strongly beleive that it is not accurate to say that SSM is a Trojan horse for normalising paedophilia.

You would need no reminding that there have been more than just a few instances of child sexual abuse in the Catholic Church, of same sex nature, and long before the plebiscite was even considered.

Child sexual abuse has been happening for a very long time, both of heterosexual and homosexual nature, with no consideration of the SSM vote.

And how on earth is the SSM vote a Trojan horse to normalising paedophilia? Would I be wrong to infer from this statement that you believe most if not all homosexuals are paedophiles?

And I don't think anyone sees paedophilia as 'normal' now, years on from the vote?

Again I emphasise that this is not a personal attack on you. I do not doubt your lived experiences, or your ongoing struggles as a result of them. I recognise that unimagineble hurt that that traumatic experience has left. I am not criticising you, rather fundamentally disagreeing with your statements.

You clearly know next to nothing about paedophilia. It hides behind alternative sexualities because it is using them to become normalised. Using them. Right now.

Grow up and become an adult. Paedophiles run the world. Increasingly, they are coming out of the shadows, yet the naïve like you do not see it or want to see it.

Your last paragraph is virtual signalling. You are not disagreeing with me as much as totally rejecting what I say without even attempting to understand a bit of it.

Aboriginal people are being used. Homosexual people are being used. Like all those who are used, they shall be discarded when they're no longer useful. That's not respect. That's not tolerance. It is the opposite of that. But that's the world we live in.

As for bringing up the Catholic Church as you did, that's run by paedophiles. So, no, I don't need reminding, but you did it anyway. Thanks for your sanctimonious attitude, but I'm not Catholic in any case.

I don't expect others to understand. My experiences are beyond the understanding of those too in love with their own virtue.

Virtue signalling is not virtuous. It's pretence for the naïve. True courage requires far, far more than that can give.

You gave a reply which was just what I was expecting. We are marching into totalitarianism and you're cheering the jackboots without even realising it, while thinking others are doing it instead and possibly awarding yourself a medal for bravery in the process.

If you wish to reply again, go ahead. Others shall read it and the similarly naïve shall be impressed, but don't insult me by expecting me to bother reading it. I could literally write your stuff for you. There is not one chance in Hell you could ever write mine. That's the difference.

You can't educate me. Neither can I educate you, but for different reasons. The former is because I have had experiences beyond normal understanding and so have surpassed your education on the matter. The latter is because you clearly think you know more than you actually do.

You could educate yourself how paedophilia is being normalised, but that takes more courage than you appear to have.

The internet is made for people like you. It is also made for totalitarianism. It is not made for I, for I upset both conspiracy theorists (I'm an actual witness to an actual conspiracy, not a theorist) and the woke.

I don't expect you to understand any of this. But you could at least try. That would be the grown-up thing to do. Because I'm right.

I would very much like to be wrong. In fact, I'd be overjoyed.

Do you have the courage to find out you're very, very wrong?

No. Of course not. Your reply tells me that.

 

[dusty1234!]

The internet is made for people like you. It is also made for totalitarianism. It is not made for I, for I upset both conspiracy theorists (I'm an actual witness to an actual conspiracy, not a theorist) and the woke.

I don't expect you to understand any of this. But you could at least try. That would be the grown-up thing to do. Because I'm right.

Unfortunatley friend, these 2 sentences indicate to me that there is no use in continuing this conversation in this thread. This thread is about the Voice to parliament, not paedophilia. I take responsiblity in allowing this thread to digress too.

Although I am happy to discuss further privatley, I think this has run its course when your argument is abject poetry, personal attacks and "because I'm right," whilst simultaneously ignoring my individual responses to every point you have made.

I wish you the very best with everything.

Go tigers.

 

[tigerisland]

The RFC board needs to reflect on tonight’s referendum. Must keep out of politics and never do this to its members ever again.

 

[Feraligatr]

Hawthorn also put out the same statement so I think every club might have done one.

 

[Underarm]

The RFC board needs to reflect on tonight’s referendum. Must keep out of politics and never do this to its members ever again.

The Club stands for the things it believes and should speak up for those beliefs - popular or not.

If it doesn't, the club should fold.

 

[Bird Man]

The Club stands for the things it believes and should speak up for those beliefs - popular or not.

If it doesn't, the club should fold.

Ehh I agree and do not. The club, Corporations, and Universities care more about the bottom line $$$. If a majority of Victorians were against the LGBT Pride agenda then most if not ALL clubs would not be posting rainbow content or having a pride round stating "let's respect all opinions" and "not mixing politics and beliefs in the club"

Backing the voice which I voted yes in today was a safe bet for the club.

What is not safe is posting content about the Israel and Palestinian conflict.

Clubs are its members and that is diverse, especially a club as big as ours. Respect all beliefs and world views and just stick to football unless ALL of the members agree on the topic.

 

[richoplzbreed]

Can someone please banish this thread. Would be nice to have a break from the fu@ken voice now it's all over.

 

[tigerisland]

Can someone please banish this thread. Would be nice to have a break from the fu@ken voice now it's all over.

Exactly it should never been discussed here. Blame the board

 

[TheDyerLegacy]

You clearly know next to nothing about paedophilia. It hides behind alternative sexualities because it is using them to become normalised. Using them. Right now.

Grow up and become an adult. Paedophiles run the world. Increasingly, they are coming out of the shadows, yet the naïve like you do not see it or want to see it.

Your last paragraph is virtual signalling. You are not disagreeing with me as much as totally rejecting what I say without even attempting to understand a bit of it.

Aboriginal people are being used. Homosexual people are being used. Like all those who are used, they shall be discarded when they're no longer useful. That's not respect. That's not tolerance. It is the opposite of that. But that's the world we live in.

As for bringing up the Catholic Church as you did, that's run by paedophiles. So, no, I don't need reminding, but you did it anyway. Thanks for your sanctimonious attitude, but I'm not Catholic in any case.

I don't expect others to understand. My experiences are beyond the understanding of those too in love with their own virtue.

Virtue signalling is not virtuous. It's pretence for the naïve. True courage requires far, far more than that can give.

You gave a reply which was just what I was expecting. We are marching into totalitarianism and you're cheering the jackboots without even realising it, while thinking others are doing it instead and possibly awarding yourself a medal for bravery in the process.

If you wish to reply again, go ahead. Others shall read it and the similarly naïve shall be impressed, but don't insult me by expecting me to bother reading it. I could literally write your stuff for you. There is not one chance in Hell you could ever write mine. That's the difference.

You can't educate me. Neither can I educate you, but for different reasons. The former is because I have had experiences beyond normal understanding and so have surpassed your education on the matter. The latter is because you clearly think you know more than you actually do.

You could educate yourself how paedophilia is being normalised, but that takes more courage than you appear to have.

The internet is made for people like you. It is also made for totalitarianism. It is not made for I, for I upset both conspiracy theorists (I'm an actual witness to an actual conspiracy, not a theorist) and the woke.

I don't expect you to understand any of this. But you could at least try. That would be the grown-up thing to do. Because I'm right.

I would very much like to be wrong. In fact, I'd be overjoyed.

Do you have the courage to find out you're very, very wrong?

No. Of course not. Your reply tells me that.

What did I just read?

 

[Spluff]

The RFC board needs to reflect on tonight’s referendum. Must keep out of politics and never do this to its members ever again.

I am proud to barrack for a club that supports the Aboriginal people of Australia, both within its doors and more broadly.

 

[tiggywigs]

What did I just read?

I would say it was a 'rabbit-holer' explaining why you have to be special to be able to use 'rabbit-holes'.
And why skeptics are not special.
Apparently.

 

[RockJobster0312]

The RFC board needs to reflect on tonight’s referendum. Must keep out of politics and never do this to its members ever again.

Nope. Cannot and will not agree with this stance.

We as fans have to accept that the days of politics and sport being separate are long gone. They are and will be forever interlinked. As they have been for decades before us. If you want to escape politics, find it in another outlet. The very sport itself originated from a game indigenous Australians established. The club - the AFL in general - employs hundreds of indigenous Australians. We are what we are because of our history. To not support those who came before us is frankly not ‘strong and bold’.

You don’t like it; don’t be a member.

The RFC board; in fact all AFL teams’ board; the AFL in general and any professional sporting code in Australia needs to keep providing support to its First Nations people who are a massive historical and current influence on sports, and will continue to be.

I for one am proud to support a club that openly supports First Nations people. Indigenous Australians have helped mould the club into what it is today, and will help mould it into the club it is into the future.

Support a club that stands for something. Proud to call myself a Richmond member tonight. Proud to say I support - with all my energy - a club that stands for something.

 

[tastiger]

Why do football clubs and the AFL need to push things? Love the club to death but this is not why I like football.

Save the politics for later and just let football be football.

On VOG-L09 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[tigerisland]

I am proud to barrack for a club that supports the Aboriginal people of Australia, both within its doors and more broadly.

And here is the problem. Barely a majority of Aboriginal people supported it. Club and all the “No” supporters need to actually listen to Aboriginal people. Not just presume to know what aboriginal people want based on what the heads of the aboriginal industry have to say. All the highest Aboriginal seats voted a resounding “No”.

 

[LewisHall]

And here is the problem. Barely a majority of Aboriginal people supported it. Club and all the “No” supporters need to actually listen to Aboriginal people. Not just presume to know what aboriginal people want based on what the heads of the aboriginal industry have to say. All the highest Aboriginal seats voted a resounding “No”.

I heard 80% but I've not bothered to do much fact checking.

Personally I am a bit unsure of the club trying to tell people what political views to have.

Celtic (Scotland) hardcore fans (pro Palestine) vs the board being pro Israel / comes to mind.

 

[LewisHall]

What did I just read?

There is a lot of truth to it.

Truth hurts as they say

 

[tigerisland]

Nope. Cannot and will not agree with this stance.

We as fans have to accept that the days of politics and sport being separate are long gone. They are and will be forever interlinked. As they have been for decades before us. If you want to escape politics, find it in another outlet. The very sport itself originated from a game indigenous Australians established. The club - the AFL in general - employs hundreds of indigenous Australians. We are what we are because of our history. To not support those who came before us is frankly not ‘strong and bold’.

You don’t like it; don’t be a member.

The RFC board; in fact all AFL teams’ board; the AFL in general and any professional sporting code in Australia needs to keep providing support to its First Nations people who are a massive historical and current influence on sports, and will continue to be.

I for one am proud to support a club that openly supports First Nations people. Indigenous Australians have helped mould the club into what it is today, and will help mould it into the club it is into the future.

Support a club that stands for something. Proud to call myself a Richmond member tonight. Proud to say I support - with all my energy - a club that stands for something.

This post shows all the hubris and arrogance of the No vote. Aboriginal people never wanted this thing and that was born out last night. Club needs to listen to aboriginal people not the aboriginal industry.
The board needs to apologise to its members.

 

[LewisHall]

This post shows all the hubris and arrogance of the No vote. Aboriginal people never wanted this thing and that was born out last night. Club needs to listen to aboriginal people not the aboriginal industry.
The board needs to apologise to its members.

Did you do a survey ? At least offer a decent source.

My understanding is at least the majority wanted a yes vote