Should all player contracts be made public?

[KOLOKOTRONIS]

I’m not sure if there is a thread on this topic, and if there is my apologies.

This is probably the first time in years I’ve been interested in the off season trade period. It has always been mania and ridiculous speculation which has kept me off social media and forums, however I’m finding the climb back to the top as exciting as the euphoria of the triple.

Re player payments being made public would surely remove all speculation.

Should players enjoy anonymity? What do they have to hide? The payg withholding tax is always remitted by the clubs, so they can’t possibly do anything foolish. They are just players who are involved in the largest sporting industry in the land. Wouldn’t it be great to know what they take home after tax each season?

The argument that the scrutiny is too much I find ridiculous. Just like those who wish to become actors or be involved in a public capacity, the scrutiny comes with the territory. The majority of sports people need to be somewhat alpha in their genetic make up. So wouldn’t the pay packet being made public ensure greater performance?

Furthermore, the accountability to the club and its supporters has to be considered. The members control the club and make it possible for the competition to exist. Our membership provides us weekly stimulation and satisfies our tribal nature as humans. So at the same time we should know who gets what so we can enjoy the discussions and the critical analysis which comes along with it.

Interested in some thoughts?

KOLOKOTRONIS

 

[Gralin]

I don't think so

 

[MacMace]

They could make their caps public by reporting on player payscales e.g. 2 players $1m to 1.5m, 5 players $750k to $1m, etc.

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[eldorado]

It's a right to privacy I would expect for myself, so it would be a double standard for me to expect others to relinquish this right purely for my own satisfaction.

The people who need to know, know. I don't.

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

Agree with MacMase - specifics can be dangerous (and frankly contracts are so complex it is difficult to break down into a single figure especially with game/injury/performance bonuses).

So perhaps listing just total payments made historically each year too. Maybe released as an addendum to financial reports or consolidated from the AFL.

Eg, the AFL release the 2018 salary figures after trade week.

HAWTHORN
1M+ = 0
800k-1M = 1
600k-800k = 4
500k-600k = 3
400k-500k = 4
300k-400k = 12
200k-300k = 8
<200k = 12 (**Including Rookies**)
TOTAL USED = $10,914,362.88 (As audited by AFL)

Undecided if the player names should be in there - I don't think they should, but it would certainly add some venom and vigour to internet message boards and more things for the media to talk about AFL...

Also not sure what happens when the GWS figure is 1.5 million over the salary cap. I do know we can trust the AFL to be open, honest and fair however.

 

[Buzz Hawk]

As long as total payments are under the cap then no, i dont think it’s anybody’s business but the players and the clubs.
I imagine it could cause resentment and anger if all players contracts were made public. Eg, if player X thought he was worth more than player Y whilst player Y was receiving a higher salary.

I also don’t understand why the contract details of RFAs are essentially publicised, ie in the Lynch case where his 7 year, 6.3m deal was common knowledge. Why should his contract detail be public but everyone else’s private?
Surely only the two clubs involved need to know the specifics; the club trying to sign the player and the player’s current club.

So a no from me.

 

[KOLOKOTRONIS]

It's a right to privacy I would expect for myself, so it would be a double standard for me to expect others to relinquish this right purely for my own satisfaction.

The people who need to know, know. I don't.

Good point, of course there should be a right to privacy for non public figures.

However the game is no longer suburban and impacts people’s lives on a weekly level. It has become a billion dollar industry and will only continue to rise in my opinion. It is clearly public.

As a Democrat, I feel our members are being short changed... For example, let’s say player x is on 300k and killing it whilst player y is on 600k and doing * all. Shouldn’t we know? Every clause should be made public. It will spike the interest in the game even further rather than its members and fans being treated like idiots speculating on forums without a clue regarding the true facts.

What would change other than added pressure on players who are compensated substantially anyway, and also chosen this lifestyle from a young age ?

KOLOKOTRONIS

 

[Brishawk]

I think yes. There is too much suspicion of salary cap rorts going on. Also makes clubs more accountable to their members. Executive salary for listed companies are reported publically and these players are earning the same money.

 

[shotgun_blues]

No.

 

[Davo23]

I’m not sure if there is a thread on this topic, and if there is my apologies.

This is probably the first time in years I’ve been interested in the off season trade period. It has always been mania and ridiculous speculation which has kept me off social media and forums, however I’m finding the climb back to the top as exciting as the euphoria of the triple.

Re player payments being made public would surely remove all speculation.

Should players enjoy anonymity? What do they have to hide? The payg withholding tax is always remitted by the clubs, so they can’t possibly do anything foolish. They are just players who are involved in the largest sporting industry in the land. Wouldn’t it be great to know what they take home after tax each season?

The argument that the scrutiny is too much I find ridiculous. Just like those who wish to become actors or be involved in a public capacity, the scrutiny comes with the territory. The majority of sports people need to be somewhat alpha in their genetic make up. So wouldn’t the pay packet being made public ensure greater performance?

Furthermore, the accountability to the club and its supporters has to be considered. The members control the club and make it possible for the competition to exist. Our membership provides us weekly stimulation and satisfies our tribal nature as humans. So at the same time we should know who gets what so we can enjoy the discussions and the critical analysis which comes along with it.

Interested in some thoughts?

KOLOKOTRONIS

Of course not: everyone has the right to privacy.
Just because you play footy, every dork out there has to know what you earn?

Those who disagree are welcome to scan your latest Tax Return and post it on this site!

 

[Buzz Hawk]

Good point, of course there should be a right to privacy for non public figures.

However the game is no longer suburban and impacts people’s lives on a weekly level. It has become a billion dollar industry and will only continue to rise in my opinion. It is clearly public.

As a Democrat, I feel our members are being short changed... For example, let’s say player x is on 300k and killing it whilst player y is on 600k and doing **** all. Shouldn’t we know? Every clause should be made public. It will spike the interest in the game even further rather than its members and fans being treated like idiots speculating on forums without a clue regarding the true facts.

What would change other than added pressure on players who are compensated substantially anyway, and also chosen this lifestyle from a young age ?

KOLOKOTRONIS

If a bloke is not pulling his weight on twice the coin of a bloke who is killing it at half the bucks then i don’t need to know that. The club would be well aware of it and take steps to redress the situation.
By god, imagine the endless, weekly naval gazing if we knew what they were all on.
“Gee that Tommy earnt his 700k this week with his 50 touches but geez Breust, we pay pay 600 clams for 8 touches in a final, come on!”

 

[Brishawk]

Of course not: everyone has the right to privacy.
Just because you play footy, every dork out there has to know what you earn?

Those who disagree are welcome to scan your latest Tax Return and post it on this site!

Not everyone has that right. Executive salary of listed companies and publicly owned companies are public information for transparency and accountability reasons. There is precedence in other sports. Politicians.

 

[KOLOKOTRONIS]

Of course not: everyone has the right to privacy.
Just because you play footy, every dork out there has to know what you earn?

Those who disagree are welcome to scan your latest Tax Return and post it on this site!

The price you pay, knowing you are entering the public arena?

I totally agree with privacy for private individuals, however football is more now. It is part of society. Furthermore the clubs are socialist in nature. Profits are pumped back into the club to improve the conditions and ensure that employees perform at their best for the benefit of the members and the improvement of society.

Football is about bringing people together. It promotes that sense of community. It is dissected, loved, hated, talked about. We are a tolerant society though, very rarely are players attacked. We are not Colombia circa 1994.

KOLOKOTRONIS

 

[KOLOKOTRONIS]

If a bloke is not pulling his weight on twice the coin of a bloke who is killing it at half the bucks then i don’t need to know that. The club would be well aware of it and take steps to redress the situation.
By god, imagine the endless, weekly naval gazing if we knew what they were all on.
“Gee that Tommy earnt his 700k this week with his 50 touches but geez Breust, we pay pay 600 clams for 8 touches in a final, come on!”

Why shouldn’t we know? Accountability? Expectation?

Players will always cop abuse. It is part of the system and it is an element of the game which has existed for decades.

For example, maybe O’Brien wouldn’t cop the heat if we knew he was on 200k whilst vickery was on 500k.

It goes both ways.

Ultimately player payments gives us a better understanding of where players sit in the hierarchy.

Perhaps this will also make us more tolerant with certain individuals.

KOLOKOTRONIS

 

[Buzz Hawk]

Why shouldn’t we know? Accountability? Expectation?

Players will always cop abuse. It is part of the system and it is an element of the game which has existed for decades.

For example, maybe O’Brien wouldn’t cop the heat if we knew he was on 200k whilst vickery was on 500k.

It goes both ways.

Ultimately player payments gives us a better understanding of where players sit in the hierarchy.

Perhaps this will also make us more tolerant with certain individuals.

KOLOKOTRONIS

We will have to agree to disagree. My opinion of any player would not change regardless of what they are on.
I judge them on output on the field, not output on the field relative to their contract.

Also, players are not executives, they are employees. Publicly listed company execs can and should have their remuneration delcared; totally ok with that. I dont need to know what Doris the teller earns at Westpac Marrickville.

 

[KOLOKOTRONIS]

We will have to agree to disagree. My opinion of any player would not change regardless of what they are on.
I judge them on output on the field, not output on the field relative to their contract.

Also, players are not executives, they are employees. Publicly listed company execs can and should have their remuneration delcared; totally ok with that. I dont need to know what Doris the teller earns at Westpac Marrickville.

396 employees who are special, very fortunate, hard working, and disciplined people, are being watched by millions weekly bringing joy, sadness, anger and creating memories forever.

They have an enormous impact on people and their feelings. Football means a lot to a lot of people. The Doris comparison whilst hilarious is nowhere near accurate.

Knowing the payments adds so much more to the experience and the accountability to the members who invest so much mental energy in this game.

The players mean a lot.

Dipper quoting Jeans, “we need you Bucky, WE CANNOT WIN WITHOUT YOU BUCK”.

They are not just employees to the fans and members.

KOLOKOTRONIS

 

[KOLOKOTRONIS]

We will have to agree to disagree. My opinion of any player would not change regardless of what they are on.
I judge them on output on the field, not output on the field relative to their contract.

Also, players are not executives, they are employees. Publicly listed company execs can and should have their remuneration delcared; totally ok with that. I dont need to know what Doris the teller earns at Westpac Marrickville.

I agree with you that the opinion of the player shouldn’t change. Kudos to him for negotiating a smart deal. However those responsible who signed off on the deal need scrutiny.

Members are expected to just pay, watch and accept what is going on?

KOLOKOTRONIS

 

[Buzz Hawk]

396 employees who are special, very fortunate, hard working, and disciplined people, are being watched by millions weekly bringing joy, sadness, anger and creating memories forever.

They have an enormous impact on people and their feelings. Football means a lot to a lot of people. The Doris comparison whilst hilarious is nowhere near accurate.

Knowing the payments adds so much more to the experience and the accountability to the members who invest so much mental energy in this game.

The players mean a lot.

Dipper quoting Jeans, “we need you Bucky, WE CANNOT WIN WITHOUT YOU BUCK”.

They are not just employees to the fans and members.

KOLOKOTRONIS

Will concede the Doris the teller comparison was not quite a just comparison.
How about Barry the mid level exec at Westpac George St HO, I don’t need to know his salary (and i am a Westpac shareholder btw).

 

[Philhawk]

100000% yes.

Having spent the last few years Stateside being exposed to the NFL, it truly is an invaluable equalization method.

Wouldn’t be against Clubs being provided with tools like the “Franchise tag” either ...

 

[Davo23]

No everyone has that right. Executive salary of listed companies and publicly owned companies are public information for transparency and accountability reasons. There is precedence in other sports. Politicians.

Officials of public companies and government officials are responsible to the general public.
It’s only right that we know what they earn.

I don’t see how this is relevant to footballers.

 

[Buzz Hawk]

100000% yes.

Having spent the last few years Stateside being exposed to the NFL, it truly is an invaluable equalization method.

Wouldn’t be against Clubs being provided with tools like the “Franchise tag” either ...

How is it an equalisation method if the NFL has a salary cap, which I’m pretty sure the NFL does?

 

[A Cut Above]

EVERYTHING in this stinking corrupt league should be made public.

 

[HR Roughnstuf]

With the introduction of Free Agency undoubtedly yes.

AFL use it as a means on manipulation, like most things.

A bit of transparency wouldn’t go astray.

 

[eldorado]

Officials of public companies and government officials are responsible to the general public.
It’s only right that we know what they earn.

I don’t see how this is relevant to footballers.

And board members of private corporations are accountable to shareholders, and as their sole reason for existence is to maximise shareholder PROFIT, their salaries are directly part of the full disclosure process.

As you said, neither of these provisos applies to footballers.

The people to whom they are accountable know. We just WANT to know, we don't need to.

 

[MacMace]

And board members of private corporations are accountable to shareholders, and as their sole reason for existence is to maximise shareholder PROFIT, their salaries are directly part of the full disclosure process.

As you said, neither of these provisos applies to footballers.

The people to whom they are accountable know. We just WANT to know, we don't need to.

I think members are in the same league as shareholders, they pay their membership to buy into the club. I absolutely believe that the club has an obligation to be open and transparent with members.

I don't buy into providing names of players along with their salaries, but a breakdown if the cap as suggested here along with a breakdown of footy department and other spending is reasonable. I'm on a small NGO board and we provide our members with similar info that is audited.

There needs to be much higher level of transparency in the AFL.

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