Autopsy Swans vs Geelong SF 2017 [READ OP BEFORE POSTING]

[kickthething]

A fit Goldstein would be a winner for us. Preuss however might be a better Norfman to chase and cheaper too.

Could to a straight swap w Tippett....however Goldys salary is more than Tippos!

 

[MK38]

Since 1987 (the entry of the Brisbane Bears and West Coast Eagles into the league) interstate teams have won 11 of the 30 premierships.

They have won 11 grand finals and lost 10 (and several of the GFs featured 2 interstate teams, so 1 had to lose). 4 of those 10 losses were the Swans. Interstate teams have hardly been under-represented.

I never said it was impossible but IMO it is harder for interstate teams. That is exactly why I personally rate the Lions three-peat more than I do Hawthorn's.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Making a SF from 0-6 is incredible, I think since round 6 Swans were 14-2 and 150%+? That's just insane.

Maintaining that effort was always going to be hard.

 

[Vin Rogue]

Could to a straight swap w Tippett....however Goldys salary is more than Tippos!

Mmmm situation where, if Norf are willing to talk, then we do not want Goldy as they have given up on him in preference for a younger ruckman, but if they don't want to talk trades, then we chase him. Go figure.

 

[Vin Rogue]

The more I think about the game the more I feel Horse is right. The whole team was fatigued from the start- lacked energy as though they played only a few days before. First time this had happened in the whole season

But they didnt play a few days before. They had a 6 day break. After a game you have muscle soreness on days 2-3 after a game. Day 4 the soreness starts to go and by day 5 is completely gone. Why then were they sore and fatigued 6 days after a game in which they put the cue in the rack just after half time as they did against essendon? Shouldn't happen. Didn't happen all year either.

I'm going to speculate here. I have my suspicions that they trained too hard on the Wesnesday. It was the mid week training so close to the game that caused the fatigue and soreness. I suspect the training session was too hard and caused the fatigue/ soreness as though they'd played. Its the explanation that seems most feasible and probably explains why Horse offered the energy excuse in the presser which he has never done before. Usually it's "we weren't hard enough for long enough at the ball". So why would he suddenly offer that excuse????

Answer: because he knew he trained them too hard and caused the fatigue!!!!! It is only speculation but given the whole team had the physical edge off their game.....possible even likely

I have slight doubts about Horses judgement and his ability to coach beyond the one trick. I was very sad when Roos left so suddenly. At that point I really thought we'ed go backwards, but we never did. We have, however, now notched another finals failure when once again we were the best list and team. I'd love to get Roos back. It's the one thing holding our team back now- coaching leadership.....cutting edge and that counters other teams success at deconstructing our plan

What you say has a believable edge to it. Pity Horse didn't have the cahunas to say that the Wednesday session might have overcooked them. I would have hoped that many of them should be a personally managed fitness maintenance regime. That way you don't cook everyone at the same time. The headspace can also fatigue a team. Is Kirky still offering up his yoga as a de stressor? It's clear that the boys can drop their bundle in a big hurry. This can be addressed and Kirky's method could be part of the solution.

 

[MickyG]

The more I think about the game the more I feel Horse is right. The whole team was fatigued from the start- lacked energy as though they played only a few days before. First time this had happened in the whole season

...I'm going to speculate here. I have my suspicions that they trained too hard on the Wednesday. ....

I thought the same thing on Saturday. It implies a lack of respect for Geelong in assuming they could win.

They should have been down in Melbourne on Wednesday training in wet conditions too.

 

[The Swans Blog]

Making a SF from 0-6 is incredible, I think since round 6 Swans were 14-2 and 150%+? That's just insane.

Maintaining that effort was always going to be hard.

Pretty much. Just ran out of puff in the end. Probably had enough left to give the semi a real shake, but probably not enough mentally to execute.

 

[legend166]

The more I think about it the more I think the decision not to play Melican was just really, really stupid.

I get he was forced out with injury initially, but why were we messing around with the makeup of the stingiest defence in the comp? All for the sake of Harry Cunningham?

It might not have done much but we were dying for some flexibility in the back line. And no, Sam Reid isn't flexibility in the back line.

I hope they realise now Rampe is at his best when he's playing third tall and can zone off his opponent.

 

[momentbymoment]

The more I think about it the more I think the decision not to play Melican was just really, really stupid.

I get he was forced out with injury initially, but why were we messing around with the makeup of the stingiest defence in the comp? All for the sake of Harry Cunningham?

It might not have done much but we were dying for some flexibility in the back line. And no, Sam Reid isn't flexibility in the back line.

I hope they realise now Rampe is at his best when he's playing third tall and can zone off his opponent.

I have been screaming this all year. Just because Rampe CAN play tall, doesn't mean he SHOULD play tall.

 

[GotTheGoodes]

I have been screaming this all year. Just because Rampe CAN play tall, doesn't mean he SHOULD play tall.

I agree WITH you mate.

 

[Turnsole]

After that 0-6 start, not making the 8 would have been a blessing IMO. It would have given everyone; club, players, and SUPPORTERS, the kick up the arse they clearly need.

Just because we think they're the best doesn't mean they are. Premierships aren't doled out by the AFL just because it's Buggin's turn. We've had two in (fairly) recent memory. That's pretty bloody good when compared to some others out there.

If this generation can mange another one, i'd be a very happy man. But mental scars are very hard to overcome.

 

[cinderella man]

After that 0-6 start, not making the 8 would have been a blessing IMO. It would have given everyone; club, players, and SUPPORTERS, the kick up the arse they clearly need.

Just because we think they're the best doesn't mean they are. Premierships aren't doled out by the AFL just because it's Buggin's turn. We've had two in (fairly) recent memory. That's pretty bloody good when compared to some others out there.

If this generation can mange another one, i'd be a very happy man. But mental scars are very hard to overcome.

No they're not if Individuals who have them steel themselves as a collective. The kick up the arse you talk of is still required. They should of won the flag last year
( Blame umpires if you like but don't forget our Houdini men who once again went missing at the G in a big game ) and should have finished on top of the ladder this year if they managed to win even 3 of the first 6 which was far from an insurmountable task. Even 1 out of the 6 would of meant top 4 and a double chance. Injuries were a handicap but not the major excuse for the start. A pathetic start from our Top End was the major catalyst. They have not got even close to redemption after 2014 and it is a serious flaw given they have put themselves in a position to do so. It's on them nobody else. Having said that Players can only do there bit and the Club have to acknowledge we have wasted opportunities and start being proactive in making change that assures the talent that is on this list is not wasted. Tom Harley saying Tippett is not up for trade says that is unlikely. That to me says the only proactive change that may occur is signing Blokes like Foote and Robinson to long term contracts.

 

[Tedeski]

I was irate with the umps in the first half of Q1. Diver Selwood copped a ludicrous free that ended with Danger's first. Danger's second showed he has learned at the feet of the master - Diver Selwood. Thereafter the Umps were not a factor. The Cats were far too good for us.

Did you like the 50 against Buddy?

 

[MC Bad Genius]

Did you like the 50 against Buddy?

There were some crap decisions, but that wasn't one of them. I would've paid that every day of the week.

 

[Voice of the G]

There were some crap decisions, but that wasn't one of them. I would've paid that every day of the week.

Crap,no way 50.

 

[The King!]

No they're not if Individuals who have them steel themselves as a collective. The kick up the arse you talk of is still required. They should of won the flag last year
( Blame umpires if you like but don't forget our Houdini men who once again went missing at the G in a big game ) and should have finished on top of the ladder this year if they managed to win even 3 of the first 6 which was far from an insurmountable task. Even 1 out of the 6 would of meant top 4 and a double chance. Injuries were a handicap but not the major excuse for the start. A pathetic start from our Top End was the major catalyst. They have not got even close to redemption after 2014 and it is a serious flaw given they have put themselves in a position to do so. It's on them nobody else. Having said that Players can only do there bit and the Club have to acknowledge we have wasted opportunities and start being proactive in making change that assures the talent that is on this list is not wasted. Tom Harley saying Tippett is not up for trade says that is unlikely. That to me says the only proactive change that may occur is signing Blokes like Foote and Robinson to long term contracts.

As long as they make finals enough will be satisfied

 

[J_Moore]

Tonight's On The Couch had a very thorough and (I thought) even-handed dissection of what went wrong on Friday. A good 20 minutes worth.

As usual with OtC, there's some good value behind-the-goals vision where you can really see how things unfolded/broke down.

Definitely worth a watch - not sure if grimlock will get a chance to put it up on YouTube. Probably not gonna get the Swans media department treatment this week.

Executive Summary:
1) the Swans players were badly out of sorts. Just making constant handling errors that denied them the chance to get any fluidity in play.
2) Longmire took far too long to address the loose man.
3) Longmire eventually made moves, but the players were so subpar they had no impact.
4) Geelong actually played very well.

 

[plastic_swan]

Geelong played well. We couldn't catch a cold. This is what happens sadly when you don't hit your targets.

 

[grimlock]

 

[J_Moore]

Cheers mate!

 

[cinderella man]

Geelong played well. We couldn't catch a cold. This is what happens sadly when you don't hit your targets.

With due respect there was a lot more than missing targets.

Lack of intensity with tackling was deplorable. Their players were bursting through our tackles like they were shrugging off Auskickers.
Blokes losing their feet continually in one on one contests.
Shambolic set ups at stoppages. Who was the receiver ? Who was the Blocker ? Who was the distributer if the possession was won ? Kennedy being held continually as he is most weeks was at an all time high.
As you mentioned failure to hit targets derived out of poor skill execution from poor decision making from a lack of composure under what was always going to be high intensity pressure. Naismith handballing fair and square into Hanners head set the tone for this and was probably at the top of the list to underline this.
Terrible defensive structure caused by confusion and miscommunication which was also the result of terrible midfield pressure. Duncan running into the open goal at the Punt Road end in the 2nd qtr was a blight on every midfielder in the side and should be embarrassing to them and the usual standards they set. If you sit down and think about it with a rational head which I now have after stopping the angry ranting you could go on and on as to why we turned in that shocker. All of these things happened early and spread through the side like a cancer to which there was no recovery. Yes Geelong played well and Their coaching staff done a great job but make no mistake we were the major contributors to our own demise. Regardless of what people on here think we were also let down by the usual suspects who seem to lack the mental fortitude to have the impact in a Big Game at the G that would be in line with what they are truly capable of. Not worth mentioning the names because we know who they are and I'm sure they are more disappointed than supporters like me or anyone else is. Having said that it needs to be addressed.

Like I said You could go on and on but it is an opportunity lost again and Longmire as much as the 22 were the only ones to blame. I am not going to get into arguments on here with people who see it differently and have the opinion that Premierships are hard to win and we had a great year all things being equal. Everybody has different opinions but I am sure all of us are as disappointed as each other. I'm a very much a here and now person and just hope the club put plans in place to go all way the next year what ever it takes be it extensive reviews that result in tough decisions or trades or game plan resets as long as we start getting maximum reward for the talent on our list and for the level of excellence that we perform at for the majority of every season. Yes we have a lot to be grateful for as Swans supporters but as a supporter what makes me happy and is my great expectation for the boys is to get that ultimate reward again for themselves. Just seeing them do it for themselves is what should makes us supporters happy because they truly deserve it.

 

[Old Kenny]

With due respect there was a lot more than missing targets.

Lack of intensity with tackling was deplorable. Their players were bursting through our tackles like they were shrugging off Auskickers.
Blokes losing their feet continually in one on one contests.
Shambolic set ups at stoppages. Who was the receiver ? Who was the Blocker ? Who was the distributer if the possession was won ? Kennedy being held continually as he is most weeks was at an all time high.
As you mentioned failure to hit targets derived out of poor skill execution from poor decision making from a lack of composure under what was always going to be high intensity pressure. Naismith handballing fair and square into Hanners head set the tone for this and was probably at the top of the list to underline this.
Terrible defensive structure caused by confusion and miscommunication which was also the result of terrible midfield pressure. Duncan running into the open goal at the Punt Road end in the 2nd qtr was a blight on every midfielder in the side and should be embarrassing to them and the usual standards they set. If you sit down and think about it with a rational head which I now have after stopping the angry ranting you could go on and on as to why we turned in that shocker. All of these things happened early and spread through the side like a cancer to which there was no recovery. Yes Geelong played well and Their coaching staff done a great job but make no mistake we were the major contributors to our own demise. Regardless of what people on here think we were also let down by the usual suspects who seem to lack the mental fortitude to have the impact in a Big Game at the G that would be in line with what they are truly capable of. Not worth mentioning the names because we know who they are and I'm sure they are more disappointed than supporters like me or anyone else is. Having said that it needs to be addressed.

Like I said You could go on and on but it is an opportunity lost again and Longmire as much as the 22 were the only ones to blame. I am not going to get into arguments on here with people who see it differently and have the opinion that Premierships are hard to win and we had a great year all things being equal. Everybody has different opinions but I am sure all of us are as disappointed as each other. I'm a very much a here and now person and just hope the club put plans in place to go all way the next year what ever it takes be it extensive reviews that result in tough decisions or trades or game plan resets as long as we start getting maximum reward for the talent on our list and for the level of excellence that we perform at for the majority of every season. Yes we have a lot to be grateful for as Swans supporters but as a supporter what makes me happy and is my great expectation for the boys is to get that ultimate reward again for themselves. Just seeing them do it for themselves is what should makes us supporters happy because they truly deserve it.

Oh yeah this is the way I feel about the debacle. Spot on cindy. I just feel crook in the guts at how it ended and wondering when that feeling will subside. Maybe when trade week fires up and we can go a tiny bit towards improving our list. Hoping horse can finally see that we need to be more flexible during games. Sometimes as a passionate supporter I just want to see him try something other than our standard fare.

 

[Tuco]

With due respect there was a lot more than missing targets.

Lack of intensity with tackling was deplorable. Their players were bursting through our tackles like they were shrugging off Auskickers.
Blokes losing their feet continually in one on one contests.
Shambolic set ups at stoppages. Who was the receiver ? Who was the Blocker ? Who was the distributer if the possession was won ? Kennedy being held continually as he is most weeks was at an all time high.
As you mentioned failure to hit targets derived out of poor skill execution from poor decision making from a lack of composure under what was always going to be high intensity pressure. Naismith handballing fair and square into Hanners head set the tone for this and was probably at the top of the list to underline this.
Terrible defensive structure caused by confusion and miscommunication which was also the result of terrible midfield pressure. Duncan running into the open goal at the Punt Road end in the 2nd qtr was a blight on every midfielder in the side and should be embarrassing to them and the usual standards they set. If you sit down and think about it with a rational head which I now have after stopping the angry ranting you could go on and on as to why we turned in that shocker. All of these things happened early and spread through the side like a cancer to which there was no recovery. Yes Geelong played well and Their coaching staff done a great job but make no mistake we were the major contributors to our own demise. Regardless of what people on here think we were also let down by the usual suspects who seem to lack the mental fortitude to have the impact in a Big Game at the G that would be in line with what they are truly capable of. Not worth mentioning the names because we know who they are and I'm sure they are more disappointed than supporters like me or anyone else is. Having said that it needs to be addressed.

Like I said You could go on and on but it is an opportunity lost again and Longmire as much as the 22 were the only ones to blame. I am not going to get into arguments on here with people who see it differently and have the opinion that Premierships are hard to win and we had a great year all things being equal. Everybody has different opinions but I am sure all of us are as disappointed as each other. I'm a very much a here and now person and just hope the club put plans in place to go all way the next year what ever it takes be it extensive reviews that result in tough decisions or trades or game plan resets as long as we start getting maximum reward for the talent on our list and for the level of excellence that we perform at for the majority of every season. Yes we have a lot to be grateful for as Swans supporters but as a supporter what makes me happy and is my great expectation for the boys is to get that ultimate reward again for themselves. Just seeing them do it for themselves is what should makes us supporters happy because they truly deserve it.

(Shudder)

Your post was like reliving the game. Yeesh.

 

[kickthething]

Pretty much. Just ran out of puff in the end. Probably had enough left to give the semi a real shake, but probably not enough mentally to execute.

Pretty much, although it would appear when we get done, largely it's because our midfield is not known for its two way running and teams expose it...whether we are fatigued or not. The lack of defensive running when a team is chipping it around really gets exposed and Geelong exposed it masterfully

 

[MC Bad Genius]

With due respect there was a lot more than missing targets.

Lack of intensity with tackling was deplorable. Their players were bursting through our tackles like they were shrugging off Auskickers.
Blokes losing their feet continually in one on one contests.
Shambolic set ups at stoppages. Who was the receiver ? Who was the Blocker ? Who was the distributer if the possession was won ? Kennedy being held continually as he is most weeks was at an all time high.
As you mentioned failure to hit targets derived out of poor skill execution from poor decision making from a lack of composure under what was always going to be high intensity pressure. Naismith handballing fair and square into Hanners head set the tone for this and was probably at the top of the list to underline this.
Terrible defensive structure caused by confusion and miscommunication which was also the result of terrible midfield pressure. Duncan running into the open goal at the Punt Road end in the 2nd qtr was a blight on every midfielder in the side and should be embarrassing to them and the usual standards they set. If you sit down and think about it with a rational head which I now have after stopping the angry ranting you could go on and on as to why we turned in that shocker. All of these things happened early and spread through the side like a cancer to which there was no recovery. Yes Geelong played well and Their coaching staff done a great job but make no mistake we were the major contributors to our own demise. Regardless of what people on here think we were also let down by the usual suspects who seem to lack the mental fortitude to have the impact in a Big Game at the G that would be in line with what they are truly capable of. Not worth mentioning the names because we know who they are and I'm sure they are more disappointed than supporters like me or anyone else is. Having said that it needs to be addressed.

Like I said You could go on and on but it is an opportunity lost again and Longmire as much as the 22 were the only ones to blame. I am not going to get into arguments on here with people who see it differently and have the opinion that Premierships are hard to win and we had a great year all things being equal. Everybody has different opinions but I am sure all of us are as disappointed as each other. I'm a very much a here and now person and just hope the club put plans in place to go all way the next year what ever it takes be it extensive reviews that result in tough decisions or trades or game plan resets as long as we start getting maximum reward for the talent on our list and for the level of excellence that we perform at for the majority of every season. Yes we have a lot to be grateful for as Swans supporters but as a supporter what makes me happy and is my great expectation for the boys is to get that ultimate reward again for themselves. Just seeing them do it for themselves is what should makes us supporters happy because they truly deserve it.

To be fair to Naismith, he was handballing to the guy behind Hannebery, but Hanners just walked right into the path of it and copped one on the noggin.