Mega Thread The Mark Neeld Mega-Thread

[Bosk]

I thought that was the sentiment when Neeld took over the position. Now he will probably never get another chance to coach again. That is an important point too.

Choosing a quality coach isn't an exact science, as a Richmond supporter you'd understand that only too well. Dean Bailey wasn't the man to take Melbourne forward, not least due to his involvement in the tanking saga. I saw him as a "youth development" specialist but hardly the kind of bloke you'd want coaching an experienced side in a prelim for example.

They did the right thing replacing him but have ended up with someone who hasn't worked out. It's a very common tale in footy.
For all we know Neeld might well have proven himself a good coach at a different club in different circumstances. He might've done alright taking over from Bomber Thompson at Geelong or at Freo replacing Harvey. I think we've got to cut the bloke some slack because he's had a bloody tough job and he's been under the pump right from the word go.

 

[Forever North]

It's just one bad screw up after another there. Getting rid of heart and soul type players, really bad drafting, getting caught 'tanking', sacking coaches, the Dank link, internal politics......
A D's mate of mine in his early 50's, as fanatical as they come told me in all seriousness that he's wasted his whole life supporting Melbourne, he's totally fed up with them and has stopped going. I'm too scared to mention footy to him nowdays.
Neeld should do the decent thing an resign. they are going massively backwards, no positive signs whatsoever.

 

[JackOutback]

While there's no doubt Melbourne appears worse off than before Neeld started, to borrow a bad cliche, sometimes it's darkest before the dawn. Neeld inherited an absolute rabble, who then went about putting in pathetic performances in a giant sook over being told to toughen up. He needs to clear out the deadwood before we can see what he really can do.

I'm not sure bringing in another coach to 'toughen them up and put some steel in their spines' will work. That's what they said about Neeld.

A lot of players need to go, but that can;t be done in one draft.

 

[dmc333]

After hearing Moneyball crap from him, then seeing what he brought in

Strange guy.

 

[LeverPuller]

While there's no doubt Melbourne appears worse off than before Neeld started, to borrow a bad cliche, sometimes it's darkest before the dawn. Neeld inherited an absolute rabble, who then went about putting in pathetic performances in a giant sook over being told to toughen up. He needs to clear out the deadwood before we can see what he really can do.

You're right. That is a bad cliche.

 

[SurreyBlue]

Dead man walking.

 

[TBoyleSuperstar]

No point sacking him. Stick with him till the end of the season at least. Changing now does nothing at all, just gives a few pea hearts another second chance (for some their 4th).

 

[Tippett2Goal]

It at least gives us - the punters showing up, the punters who are right now losing our passion for everything involving the club - some sort of indication of hope.

Right now, what hope do I, as a supporter, have? And be serious, don't patronise me with a 'you have to have hope' thing. It's a real question that I don't have the answer to.

I get that side of it, but lets say you sack him this week, and then lose the 4 matches by a combined 600 points, you'll like be feeling the same as you do now, but with a caretaker coach.

To salvage something from this year there must be long term benefits to the club, the difference between Neeld and a caretaker (unless you think your assisstant coaches are blameless) is negligible in terms of getting out of current situation. (some may argue caretaker would be worse due to paying out of Neeld leaving you with less cash to chase his replacement)

 

[LordLucifer]

Havent weighed up the options, but FWIW, for the whole team to lay 32 tackles when being smashed in possesions is not an indightment on the coach, its players effort. Slam me if you want, if neeld is sacked the lazy culture that the dees have surpasses any discipline that neeld or anyone else tries to bring into the club. The players are not hating losing, which is a player driven thing. Whipping them on the track will cause more resentment amongst the group for the coach, which will make things worse. If i was coach today, i would have made the players stand in the race after the game and cop all the abuse from the fans. They have to learn to start hating losing which will make so much more angry and driven to win. If they are driven to win and are still losing, then look at the coaching position.

Pretty good idea actually and most would suggest that it would have a positive effect too !!!

 

[kenneje]

He inherited a shithouse list where the players had an 'it's okay to lose' mentality. When do I think he'll be sacked? Before the seasons end. I hope for Melbournes sake is isn't though. The only way for things to properly change is to do a complete clean-out of the staff. Sacking one guy who is basically just a figurehead won't do a thing. That needs to be done in the off season, and even then I'd hang onto Neeld.

 

[fusion]

Hmmm...not sure how to approach this one. I guess the first thing I think is that Neeld should be sacked. He took over and under-performing club and now it's worse. I remember at the end of 2010 my team, North, beat Melbourne in a fantastic game where only 9th place was at stake by a couple of goals and I thought how these two teams would have many more great duels as they develop in the next few years. Now don't get me wrong, North haven't stormed ahead in leaps and bounds, but how Melbourne have fallen away staggers me. That game was James McDonald's last as a Melbourne player and it's incredulous that such a player was shuffled aside, arguably prematurely, for a supposed "new era" for the MFC.

I think I can recall threads between the respective supporter groups after that 2009 game on who has the brighter future out of North and Melbourne. Totally agree that North is still far from a flag, but the drop off from Melbourne has been spectacular.

Listening to the interim CEO Peter Jackson before the game - he sounds like the ideal person to lead Melbourne, and hopefully the AFL can help entice a Paul Roos/Leigh Matthews type coach to help them out. Strong leadership is needed during difficult times - at least start off field, and then try to build the same on field.

 

[LeverPuller]

I get that side of it, but lets say you sack him this week, and then lose the 4 matches by a combined 600 points, you'll like be feeling the same as you do now, but with a caretaker coach.

To salvage something from this year there must be long term benefits to the club, the difference between Neeld and a caretaker (unless you think your assisstant coaches are blameless) is negligible in terms of getting out of current situation. (some may argue caretaker would be worse due to paying out of Neeld leaving you with less cash to chase his replacement)

Yeah, I get that. I don't know if you listen to SEN, but tonight was damming. People who have been Melbourne supporters for longer than I've been alive calling up, saying that they've lost all their passion for the club. People compare it to the Titanic, but it feels more like how I'd imagine a directionless raft simply floating would be. You're totally lost due to a lack of power, you're constantly fearing that one storm could take you out and desperately fighting for survival.

I think sacking Neeld at least gives a direction of some sort. It truly says this is unacceptable, and while we can't change it immediately, we can at least get our message across. And it truly gives supporters a focus of next year for the first time. It's too early to start talking the 'hope' of the draft, with U18 Championships not happening yet. It means that there is something of a line drawn and a start afresh. Sure, we're all going to be pessimistic and bitter, but it's something at least.

 

[LeverPuller]

He inherited a shithouse list where the players had an 'it's okay to lose' mentality. When do I think he'll be sacked? Before the seasons end. I hope for Melbournes sake is isn't though. The only way for things to properly change is to do a complete clean-out of the staff. Sacking one guy who is basically just a figurehead won't do a thing. That needs to be done in the off season, and even then I'd hang onto Neeld.

The 'shithouse list' got more wins in the year before Neeld was appointed than he's had in his entire coaching career.

 

[Dont be a lemon]

They won't sack him until they've found a proven replacement and the replacement is ready to start.

So September 2nd.

 

[underthestars]

I reckon the Dees have just figured out a better way to tank.

 

[JackOutback]

The 'shithouse list' got more wins in the year before Neeld was appointed than he's had in his entire coaching career.

True, but add in the fact that the shithouse list started playing like a bunch of peahearts because they didn't like being told to harden up. There are players who need to go from that list long before Neeld does.

 

[Jaeger]

He has to go. They simply can't afford for this shit to go on any longer.

In a way I feel sorry for Neeld, because he wants them to win more than the players do at the moment. But he's clearly lost the playing group, and isn't able to motivate them to the level that's required. He either isn't right for this group, or he's not up to it at all.

That performance this afternoon from the playing group was disgraceful. They should all be hauled to the beach at 5am tomorrow for an effort like that. It's not that they lost to the Suns. They had a few key players out and many thought they would lose. But to go down without a whimper in the manner that they did was utterly pathetic. They just weren't up for the fight and it was obvious from the start. And they are a lot better than what they displayed today.

They are a rabble with a losing culture. First thing they have to address is the feel around the club. The board, administration and coaching staff needs to be cleared out. It sounds drastic but it is what's needed. Maybe they hang onto Mission but that's it.

On field, they probably have around 6 or so players that wouldn't get a game at another club, but that's always the case at bottom sides.

The other problems with the playing list are from bad decisions made by Bailey, Neeld and their recruitment team. Player development has been woeful.

Drastic changes have to be made now. There's no point waiting till the end of the year. They can't. They need to make changes across the board, and begin focussing on 2014 and beyond, starting tomorrow.

What a mess.

 

[LordLucifer]

It at least gives us - the punters showing up, the punters who are right now losing our passion for everything involving the club - some sort of indication of hope.

Right now, what hope do I, as a supporter, have? And be serious, don't patronise me with a 'you have to have hope' thing. It's a real question that I don't have the answer to.

You, the same punters who have kept voting in the same muppets for your board ??

Thing is, you reap what you sow and if your membership weren't so "hooray-henry" about things over the past 5-6 years, then maybe you wouldn't be down this low.

Also, you have to hit rock-bottom before you can start to head back up and I'm not sure you are completely there yet.

I acknowledge that you & your grand old flag brethren have been going to games etc but in the end, you are all in it together. By that I mean as a club, the complete spectrum of it, are in this rather deep sh!t together.

How you get out of it is up to you and collective group. There is no sooking up to the AFL for help, you've already had all that with your quality draft picks and you've squandered a lot of them.

Time for the Demons collective to man-up, harden up and stand tall together and work a way out of this mire together. There is no magic wand or secret potion, it's going to take time & effort, nothing less !!

 

[PeaTea]

I reckon the Dees have just figured out a better way to tank.

Amazing post

 

[tropicaltiger]

If he survives the week he should give thought to, with a few exceptions, just swapping the reserves with the firsts. Desperate yes but at least they might have a crack.

i agree 5 or 6 players had no tackles and 5 or 6 had 1 only, surely theres 8 changes minimum there, add sylvia (6 tackles - the irony) who will be rubbed out. good luch dees ya gunna need it.

 

[The Goon]

Well how the hell did you do it? I don't know why Richmond supporters continued to put up with it.

Once you know it's another rebuild it's surprisingly easy. It's the bit beforehand when you still think you're going somewhere that's the tough bit. Round 1 2009 sponges to mind.

 

[RUNVS]

Exactly. He never got this bounce and now his career looks like it might be at an end. Will take a strong character to shake things up, but the changes need to go much, much deeper.

I think Malthouse would rehire him as an assistant coach.

 

[kenneje]

The 'shithouse list' got more wins in the year before Neeld was appointed than he's had in his entire coaching career.

Was that the year before GWS entered the comp? Bloody hell, didn't know that stat. Doesn't exactly paint Neeld in the brightest light. I still think the list wasn't very good, and often people have to go backwards to go forwards. I just don't think sacking him mid-year will do you guys any good.

 

[bleeding red and white]

Couldn't disagree more for those calling for Neeld's head.

This debacle goes way beyond the coach, the current structure of the club is where the major cracks are appearing. Current senior players aren't doing enough to show strong leadership on and off the field which makes an impact on the younger group, Neeld can only do so much to give these guys a fair dinkum kick in the ass!

He will probably go because sacking the coach apparently fixes everything these days.....

 

[LeverPuller]

Was that the year before GWS entered the comp? Bloody hell, didn't know that stat. Doesn't exactly paint Neeld in the brightest light. I still think the list wasn't very good, and often people have to go backwards to go forwards. I just don't think sacking him mid-year will do you guys any good.

Yup, that was 2011.

Interestingly, what North are running looks fairly similar to Melbourne under Bailey.