People are still in the post premiership glow and "expect" that our turn around will come and we will sweep a 6-10 game streak - happy days. I think our whole club thinks this. This is the problem. I think we are in deep trouble with half our squad out of form and no structure.
What has happened since the GF. Why? And what is Simo going to do about it?
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Hutchings, Gaff and Shuey at the centre bounces. Yuk!!!!
Carbine Chaos
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Why Gaff would ever play on ball, still, it's beyond me. He's possibly the best wingman in the competition.
This would be a fair statement if we had lost to the giants and Collingwood , but the manner in which we defeated them suggests that this problem didn't start at the beginning of the year, more that we have succumbed to it over the last few weeks.
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Its because he increased his average contested possessions by a couple last year and everyone started thinking he was some top 5 elite mid. Reality is his inside work is average at best and he should stick to playing outside where he excels.
Tom_Thumb
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Now if I was a math guy I would see an equation in that formulae.
Yep a seams like they are being stubborn about it too
Carbine Chaos
The Gaff-er
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I think naturally it is difficult to back up a Premiership.
Which side does every other club spend most time over the break analysing? The clubs have that many people employed in this field now, it's unbelievable. We came into this season not just hunted, but dissected into little pieces. This is before even mentioning how sides lift to take on the reigning champs.
We're a little stiff with the conditions we've played in. I don't want this to be an excuse, but more an observation. We thrive on clean ball use and the ability to dominate the air and the dewy night games have not suited us at all. We clearly need to become more adaptable.
Naitanui was always going to be missed, but Rioli (and now Barrass) are huge losses. They both would have made us a lot more dangerous in the conditions we've played in thus far and I dare say our record would be sitting better.
The way Simpson has used Gaff (and by extension Sheed) has been disappointing and I hope he 'wakes up' to the way he could use the assets at his disposal a little more effectively. We've also had a young forward line so we shouldn't be surprised when some are inconsistent. I've been disappointed with Kennedy and Darling, though Kennedy gets more of a break because he's often double teamed and didn't have a preseason.
3-3 is okay, especially given the sides we have played and where they sit respectively. It's not panic stations, but hopefully we learn, adapt and come out stronger.
Which side does every other club spend most time over the break analysing? The clubs have that many people employed in this field now, it's unbelievable. We came into this season not just hunted, but dissected into little pieces. This is before even mentioning how sides lift to take on the reigning champs.
We're a little stiff with the conditions we've played in. I don't want this to be an excuse, but more an observation. We thrive on clean ball use and the ability to dominate the air and the dewy night games have not suited us at all. We clearly need to become more adaptable.
Naitanui was always going to be missed, but Rioli (and now Barrass) are huge losses. They both would have made us a lot more dangerous in the conditions we've played in thus far and I dare say our record would be sitting better.
The way Simpson has used Gaff (and by extension Sheed) has been disappointing and I hope he 'wakes up' to the way he could use the assets at his disposal a little more effectively. We've also had a young forward line so we shouldn't be surprised when some are inconsistent. I've been disappointed with Kennedy and Darling, though Kennedy gets more of a break because he's often double teamed and didn't have a preseason.
3-3 is okay, especially given the sides we have played and where they sit respectively. It's not panic stations, but hopefully we learn, adapt and come out stronger.
1. Gaff returning to the side, reducing Sheed's impact, who was arguably our best player in pre season and the first few games.
2. Darling being average at best, when last year he was the most dominant forward in the competition
3. Losing Sam Mitchell as the assistant midfield coach
4. Too many talls.
5. the bottom tier players in the team are struggling
2. Darling being average at best, when last year he was the most dominant forward in the competition
3. Losing Sam Mitchell as the assistant midfield coach
4. Too many talls.
5. the bottom tier players in the team are struggling
The only posititve is that this is happening in round 6 not round 20.
We have time to arrest this downfall.
Clearly a couple of things are not working. That is 3x talls and a resting ruck, and gaff playing in the middle.
This match comitte dont swing the axe on big name players.
We have time to arrest this downfall.
Clearly a couple of things are not working. That is 3x talls and a resting ruck, and gaff playing in the middle.
This match comitte dont swing the axe on big name players.
Few areas I feel we're getting wrong, some already mentioned by others in this thread.
Too tall - For most of the year we had a really crowded forward line with JK, JD, OAllen and Vardy. We ditched Vardy, but we're still crowding the forward 50. The reason 2018 worked was because initially Waterman played as a flanker, so didn't compete for marks with JK and JD, and later Vardy worked because he was playing as a ruck (i.e. typically taking marks outside 50).
No Rioli & LeCras - I feel we really miss them. Both good for not only a couple goals a game each, but they set up a lot of goals. We had JK, JD, Rioli, LeCras, Ryan and Cripps who all on their day can kick a bag. With two of that group out, JD really struggling and Cripps & JK lacking match fitness, where are our goals meant to come from? Only guy who seems on point is Ryan, who looks like he's trying so hard to create opportunities but has no support around him.
Disfunctional midfield - And they're disfunctional for a lot of reasons.
1. Gaff playing out of position. What wrong with the role he has played his whole career?
2. Sheed has no role and looks lost out there.
3. Yeo is a shadow of his 2018 self. His skills are his ability breaks lines with his run & carry as well as his powerful kicking. Both are lacking and I wonder if he's carrying an injury (Osteitis Pubis?)?
4. Masten was a 25-30 possession a game player, now he's a 15 possession a game player. In 2018 he provided an outlet with his constant running and found a lot of the ball as a result. Now he runs a lot, provides an outlet here and there, but wouldn't be missed if he as replaced in the side. I wonder if he's lost a yard of pace with age, would explain why every possession he is under pressure and why he can't be used by the team as an outlet.
Redden and Shuey are not too far off 2018, but 2 players don't make a midfield.
5. Have reverted to the pre-2018 "bomb it long" style. If it was one or two guys, you'd say they're lacking confidence or not sticking to the game plan. When it's the whole midfield group, you have to conclude that they are playing like that on instructions.
No competition for spots/unwillingness to drop poor performers - Apart from MAllen, Rotham and Waterman, the WAFL guys aren't really pushing for selection. We dropped Vardy after 5 games of <5 possession games, but brought in a Venables who did nothing to earn his spot and Brander who the MC doesn't know where to play him.
Masten needs to be dropped.
Cole has been below average all year. Rotham did a lot more to deserve a game than Cole or even Schofield for that matter.
Duggan been poor again. Boy needs to learn how to kick, he shanks kicks like nobody else in the side.
No intensity - We're second to every contest. We have less numbers at every contest. We lose every 50/50. When we turn it over, the opposition runs it into their F50 unopposed, and if not for Gov, Hurn and Shepp intercepting the ball we'd be in even more trouble. Likewise when we win the ball, we can't find anyone free past the centre circle.
We have been figured out - Opposition clubs have figured out how to counter our kick-mark style. Defend in their defensive half of the ground. Doesn't matter how good your skills are, finding targets consistently when there's 18 opposition players choking up the space within 60m of the ball carrier is impossible. There's a reason why we have seen so many kick-mark chains this year go from one side of our D50 to the other and back, and no forward progress is made. We can't find targets!
In effect, clubs are using our own 'web' defense to stop us. Only way around this is to have run & carry, run the ball that 25-30m to allow the kicker to get the ball over the flood of players, the same tactic that clubs used to break down our web.
Too tall - For most of the year we had a really crowded forward line with JK, JD, OAllen and Vardy. We ditched Vardy, but we're still crowding the forward 50. The reason 2018 worked was because initially Waterman played as a flanker, so didn't compete for marks with JK and JD, and later Vardy worked because he was playing as a ruck (i.e. typically taking marks outside 50).
No Rioli & LeCras - I feel we really miss them. Both good for not only a couple goals a game each, but they set up a lot of goals. We had JK, JD, Rioli, LeCras, Ryan and Cripps who all on their day can kick a bag. With two of that group out, JD really struggling and Cripps & JK lacking match fitness, where are our goals meant to come from? Only guy who seems on point is Ryan, who looks like he's trying so hard to create opportunities but has no support around him.
Disfunctional midfield - And they're disfunctional for a lot of reasons.
1. Gaff playing out of position. What wrong with the role he has played his whole career?
2. Sheed has no role and looks lost out there.
3. Yeo is a shadow of his 2018 self. His skills are his ability breaks lines with his run & carry as well as his powerful kicking. Both are lacking and I wonder if he's carrying an injury (Osteitis Pubis?)?
4. Masten was a 25-30 possession a game player, now he's a 15 possession a game player. In 2018 he provided an outlet with his constant running and found a lot of the ball as a result. Now he runs a lot, provides an outlet here and there, but wouldn't be missed if he as replaced in the side. I wonder if he's lost a yard of pace with age, would explain why every possession he is under pressure and why he can't be used by the team as an outlet.
Redden and Shuey are not too far off 2018, but 2 players don't make a midfield.
5. Have reverted to the pre-2018 "bomb it long" style. If it was one or two guys, you'd say they're lacking confidence or not sticking to the game plan. When it's the whole midfield group, you have to conclude that they are playing like that on instructions.
No competition for spots/unwillingness to drop poor performers - Apart from MAllen, Rotham and Waterman, the WAFL guys aren't really pushing for selection. We dropped Vardy after 5 games of <5 possession games, but brought in a Venables who did nothing to earn his spot and Brander who the MC doesn't know where to play him.
Masten needs to be dropped.
Cole has been below average all year. Rotham did a lot more to deserve a game than Cole or even Schofield for that matter.
Duggan been poor again. Boy needs to learn how to kick, he shanks kicks like nobody else in the side.
No intensity - We're second to every contest. We have less numbers at every contest. We lose every 50/50. When we turn it over, the opposition runs it into their F50 unopposed, and if not for Gov, Hurn and Shepp intercepting the ball we'd be in even more trouble. Likewise when we win the ball, we can't find anyone free past the centre circle.
We have been figured out - Opposition clubs have figured out how to counter our kick-mark style. Defend in their defensive half of the ground. Doesn't matter how good your skills are, finding targets consistently when there's 18 opposition players choking up the space within 60m of the ball carrier is impossible. There's a reason why we have seen so many kick-mark chains this year go from one side of our D50 to the other and back, and no forward progress is made. We can't find targets!
In effect, clubs are using our own 'web' defense to stop us. Only way around this is to have run & carry, run the ball that 25-30m to allow the kicker to get the ball over the flood of players, the same tactic that clubs used to break down our web.
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Two games in a row the tone has been set from the first quarter.
Against Brisbane we were rusty but started ok and then they got on top. GWS got a great start against us then we wrestled back control. Collingwood we actually played well, Freo we were ordinary but managed to hold on.
Port and Geelong both started strongly and.... Nothing. No response. 3 more quarters of the same each time. No what is the deeaaal with thaaat?
Against Brisbane we were rusty but started ok and then they got on top. GWS got a great start against us then we wrestled back control. Collingwood we actually played well, Freo we were ordinary but managed to hold on.
Port and Geelong both started strongly and.... Nothing. No response. 3 more quarters of the same each time. No what is the deeaaal with thaaat?
I wonder if Darling is injured. He is a shadow of the player he was. Can't run, can't contest, looks very stiff and heavy. It seems to me that it's more than attitude. He was a real weapon last year and an important component of our success, now he's just a pop gun. I remember he fell flat on his back in one of the early games or the pre-season, he doesn't look right.
This. Our structure and personnel are out of whack and have been for weeks.
Trying to fit in Gaff is a good problem to have but quite frankly they have failed so far. He has been well below his best, Sheed has dropped away, Redden Yeo and Shuey have been meh, plodding along without being great.
I think Oscars great preseason form also caused an unexpected headache and has made us too tall.
Darling is in horrific form, largely due to both lack of supply and the poor quality supply he does get. Complete 180 from 12 months ago.
Small issues in each of the main areas on the pitch which have been building since Round 1.
The control-marking method that won the premiership in 2018 has been negated and exposed.
Opposing sides are moving their forward flankers up the ground to congest stoppages, pressure the clearance and reduce one-on-one marking opportunities.
At the same time, the extra numbers behind the ball allow the opposition defenders to be far more aggressive in their movement and disposal.
The result is we concede possession far more easily, struggle to move the ball forward with any pace, are unable to find a clear marking option when it does get forward and get punished comprehensively upon turning the ball over.
I'm currently putting a piece together that will go through this in detail and how it should be potentially addressed.
Opposing sides are moving their forward flankers up the ground to congest stoppages, pressure the clearance and reduce one-on-one marking opportunities.
At the same time, the extra numbers behind the ball allow the opposition defenders to be far more aggressive in their movement and disposal.
The result is we concede possession far more easily, struggle to move the ball forward with any pace, are unable to find a clear marking option when it does get forward and get punished comprehensively upon turning the ball over.
I'm currently putting a piece together that will go through this in detail and how it should be potentially addressed.
You guys have an excellent patch of games running up to the bye round. Gold Coast, St's, out of sorts Melb in Perth, Adelaide in Adelaide (where you guys always play well), Bulldogs in Perth then Syd in Syd being the only hard game. I think you will win 3 of the 5 and 4 is a real possibility.
Also it is an unbelievable chance to play some players back into form, like Darling (if it is just form and not injury niggles)
I think, you're suffering from a slight premiership hangover but will still be up there come September and your record by round 13 will be solid.
Also it is an unbelievable chance to play some players back into form, like Darling (if it is just form and not injury niggles)
I think, you're suffering from a slight premiership hangover but will still be up there come September and your record by round 13 will be solid.
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We play the Suns, Saints, Dees, Crows and Bulldogs over the next 5 rounds and should only drop 1 of those games.
7 and 4 going into the bye and everyone on here will be booking their GF tickets.
7 and 4 going into the bye and everyone on here will be booking their GF tickets.
TheBeardedEagle
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Chris Scott's press conference told me more about us than Simmo's did of stating that we were outplayed and not being able to win the ball.
https://www.afl.com.au/match-centre/2019/6/geel-v-wce#
SCOTT
"Our ability to deny them those chains, probably led to us keeping the ball"
and
"I suspect they have (WCE us) a few issues at the moment, so we acknowledge that, it's a hard trip... (from WA to GEE) and later on he commented about West Coast not giving them the challenge they were preparing for questions how good they (Geelong) think they are.
My opinion is no different to what most guys are saying on this thread, the midfield strategy is not at the same level it was under Sam Mitchell last year as well as echoing what Simmo says around the other teams successfully hunting us (like dirty ball delivery nullifying the intercept marking) and questioning WC's ability to supply with the forwards being hamstrung by the lack of supply from the mids.
So the mids need a solid direction and you can be sure that Simmo will pull it apart with Rosa for next weeks game.
Geelong exposed our weaknesses tonight and have shown us what level we need to be at, I have always seen them as the team to beat from round 1. Now we can put a plan together to plug this hole in our game plan and look forward to revenge in September.
https://www.afl.com.au/match-centre/2019/6/geel-v-wce#
SCOTT
"Our ability to deny them those chains, probably led to us keeping the ball"
and
"I suspect they have (WCE us) a few issues at the moment, so we acknowledge that, it's a hard trip... (from WA to GEE) and later on he commented about West Coast not giving them the challenge they were preparing for questions how good they (Geelong) think they are.
My opinion is no different to what most guys are saying on this thread, the midfield strategy is not at the same level it was under Sam Mitchell last year as well as echoing what Simmo says around the other teams successfully hunting us (like dirty ball delivery nullifying the intercept marking) and questioning WC's ability to supply with the forwards being hamstrung by the lack of supply from the mids.
So the mids need a solid direction and you can be sure that Simmo will pull it apart with Rosa for next weeks game.
Geelong exposed our weaknesses tonight and have shown us what level we need to be at, I have always seen them as the team to beat from round 1. Now we can put a plan together to plug this hole in our game plan and look forward to revenge in September.
Wouldn't be too quick to think we will win the next few games and get it back on track. Teams have a blue print that is actually very effective and quite easy to copy. Look how Freo played us but play a totaly different plan against other sides.
Simmo has proven to be stubborn and backing the players and game plan in. Has failed to address the issues for thenlast 11 qtrs of footy.
18th in the comp for inside 50s, tackles and ground ball gets.
Simmo has proven to be stubborn and backing the players and game plan in. Has failed to address the issues for thenlast 11 qtrs of footy.
18th in the comp for inside 50s, tackles and ground ball gets.
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