Who'll be the next club to fall off their cliff?

[Muddiemoose]

Richmond list profile is different to the Pies & your coach is unproven, so this is a huge unknown factor... & the biggest factor on where Tigers place this season.

Last year our list profile wasn’t and had a proven coach
On paper our 2023 list is better than 2022

 

[Percel]

It is a bit surprising how reliant they are on a 36 year old.

No reliance, that's on other guys

Pendles just brings the Cream/After dinner mints/Muscat/cheese platter...

 

[BIGHAWK23]

The same Jeremy Howe that missed half a season with a broken arm last year?

Yes, that same Jeremy Howe who is 33 years old

If you think your side improves with him leaving, all good

So quick to get defensive, im saying the Pies wouldn't drop far

 

[Tarkyn_24]

Yes, that same Jeremy Howe who is 33 years old

If you think your side improves with him leaving, all good

So quick to get defensive, im saying the Pies wouldn't drop far

The clear implication I’m making is that our performances scarcely suffered without him. It indicates there’s capability in reserve to cover his absence, as evidenced by our performances last year when he was out.

That’s just common sense.

 

[BIGHAWK23]

The clear implication I’m making is that our performances scarcely suffered without him. It indicates there’s capability in reserve to cover his absence, as evidenced by our performances last year when he was out.

That’s just common sense.

Is there evidence to show the loss of all 3?

That was the point
Its pretty clear its an unknown

 

[Tarkyn_24]

Is there evidence to show the loss of all 3?

That was the point
Its pretty clear its an unknown

Funnily enough, quite a pivot from your previous response.

Sidebottom and Pendlebury are harder to replace like for like, however in Steele’s position we have capable alternatives like WHE in the near term, and longer term prospects like Ed Allan who will start to see gametime.

Pendlebury has fewer obvious like for like alternatives but that is primarily because he doesn’t have a super defined role.

Overall, I’m not immediately concerned.

 

[VinnieB]

Yes, that same Jeremy Howe who is 33 years old

If you think your side improves with him leaving, all good

So quick to get defensive, im saying the Pies wouldn't drop far

Not saying that. We are just hearing arguments without any real basis.

Pies will obviously drop off at some stage. The great thing about the club is that rarely do we not play finals, so any drop is likely to be a season or 2.

But drop off a cliff in 2024? I think there are the same opposition fans here who probably don’t watch much of the Pies and still think Pendles and Howe are in their prime, and anyone 30 yrs of age is past their best.

No acknowledgement of those between 23-30 who make up most of the team and were instrumental in winning the GF.

Or the fact that these days there are so many options to build and replenish a list and the Pies seem to have a good track record of utilising the mid season draft and bringing on players pre-season.

On top of that, the President has come out and said that we are in a position to be front of cue for any free agent.

The fact is the club has been able to win a premiership while spending about 5% of the cap on Grundy and Treloar.

 

[VinnieB]

Funnily enough, quite a pivot from your previous response.

Sidebottom and Pendlebury are harder to replace like for like, however in Steele’s position we have capable alternatives like WHE in the near term, and longer term prospects like Ed Allan who will start to see gametime.

Pendlebury has fewer obvious like for like alternatives but that is primarily because he doesn’t have a super defined role.

Overall, I’m not immediately concerned.

Why do players need to be replaced ‘like for like’? Thats just old thinking. New players bring new skills. Maybe a player who has speed and can mark may be the way to go?

 

[BIGHAWK23]

Not saying that. We are just hearing arguments without any real basis.

Pies will obviously drop off at some stage. The great thing about the club is that rarely do we not play finals, so any drop is likely to be a season or 2.

But drop off a cliff in 2024? I think there are the same opposition fans here who probably don’t watch much of the Pies and still think Pendles and Howe are in their prime, and anyone 30 yrs of age is past their best.

No acknowledgement of those between 23-30 who make up most of the team and were instrumental in winning the GF.

Or the fact that these days there are so many options to build and replenish a list and the Pies seem to have a good track record of utilising the mid season draft and bringing on players pre-season.

On top of that, the President has come out and said that we are in a position to be front of cue for any free agent.

The fact is the club has been able to win a premiership while spending about 5% of the cap on Grundy and Treloar.

Again, no cliff drop, not even this year, but 2025 ish, maybe a return to the pack

All im saying is, that if any club lost 3 senior leaders

There would be an effect on performance

 

[Seattle Mariners]

Nominating my own club, Melbourne.

Goodwin's run his race.

 

[Orange crush]

Nominating my own club, Melbourne.

Goodwin's run his race.

Egg and spoon

 

[VinnieB]

Again, no cliff drop, not even this year, but 2025 ish, maybe a return to the pack

All im saying is, that if any club lost 3 senior leaders

There would be an effect on performance

I can’t argue with that. Obviously will be a disruption as the new kids get a season or 2 in.

I was challenging the view the Pies will fall off a cliff because ‘their most important players’ are old and they don’t have enough top 10 picks.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Last year our list profile wasn’t and had a proven coach
On paper our 2023 list is better than 2022

Sure, but Hardwick admitted his message was no longer getting through & did the right thing & walked.

 

[Cleansweep17]

Easier draw, I think we also have more games at home early in the season.

A lot went wrong for us last year and at the wrong times so we never got going.

The optimistic case can be made for us. No need to make the pessimistic case since that has been BF's wet dream for the past 15 years.

Take it from experience, injuries aren’t like lighting where it’s unlikely to strike twice. It usually means there is a problem. Your older brigade will be even more exposed to soft tissues injuries this year. It will most likely happen again.

 

[BIGHAWK23]

I can’t argue with that. Obviously will be a disruption as the new kids get a season or 2 in.

I was challenging the view the Pies will fall off a cliff because ‘their most important players’ are old and they don’t have enough top 10 picks.

Not sure i said that

Maybe someone else did

 

[Muddiemoose]

Sure, but Hardwick admitted his message was no longer getting through & did the right thing & walked.

So under Yze assuming the new message translates Richmond will be right in the mix again?

Or due to the loss of Riewoldt and Cotch Richmond’s list profile has shifted to one more prone to inconsistency due to loss of on field experience and leadership?
(The exact thing that some of us are saying will happen to Collingwood over the next 2 - 3 seasons with a very large portion of its best 22 between the ages of 30 and 36)

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

So under Yze assuming the new message translates Richmond will be right in the mix again?

Or due to the loss of Riewoldt and Cotch Richmond’s list profile has shifted to one more prone to inconsistency due to loss of on field experience and leadership?
(The exact thing that some of us are saying will happen to Collingwood over the next 2 - 3 seasons with a very large portion of its best 22 between the ages of 30 and 36)

As I said in my post, a new unknown coach in Yze is the great unknown.

McRae has already shown he is a gun coach & has a great system in place.... we have no idea yet whether Yze will be as good or how long it takes the Richmond players to learn his game plan.

Pies only need to replace 3 decent players over next couple of years, so can't see them falling out of finals with q decent coach.

Richmond have far more holes in their list at the moment.

 

[Pleasedontfail11]

The Good news for the pies is that we have many multi role players who have already played a lot of minutes in roles that our elderly players currently play.

Pendles role is covered by Crisp, Daicos, DeGoey, Mitchell and even Elliott.
Howes role is covered by a switching of the deck chairs with Murphy and Maynard playing a similar role.
Sidebottom missed 6 or so weeks this season and was replaced by McCreery, WHE and Hill.
Cox was covered by Cameron and well covered for 4-5 weeks by Frampton midseason last year.
Mihocek could be covered well by Johnson who played 15 games last year for 20+ goals and he looks fitter this season.
Elliott could be covered by Schultz or the less developed Harvey Harrison.

Like it has been referenced, its not who covers our aging players that is the problem but who covers the role players like McCreery who replace them? The answer to this is that we dont know for sure. We hope our young recent draft prospects can answer this question and that we can also convince free agents and fringe players that Collingwood is a good place to play. Our main concern is that we hope we dont have to replace a large chunk of these players at once. We hope instead that we can slowly replace 1-2 of these players a year with quality, one way or the other, to stay there abouts on the ladder.

 

[FootyLad0]

The Good news for the pies is that we have many multi role players who have already played a lot of minutes in roles that our elderly players currently play.

Pendles role is covered by Crisp, Daicos, DeGoey, Mitchell and even Elliott.
Howes role is covered by a switching of the deck chairs with Murphy and Maynard playing a similar role.
Sidebottom missed 6 or so weeks this season and was replaced by McCreery, WHE and Hill.
Cox was covered by Cameron and well covered for 4-5 weeks by Frampton midseason last year.
Mihocek could be covered well by Johnson who played 15 games last year for 20+ goals and he looks fitter this season.
Elliott could be covered by Schultz or the less developed Harvey Harrison.

Like it has been referenced, its not who covers our aging players that is the problem but who covers the role players like McCreery who replace them? The answer to this is that we dont know for sure. We hope our young recent draft prospects can answer this question and that we can also convince free agents and fringe players that Collingwood is a good place to play. Our main concern is that we hope we dont have to replace a large chunk of these players at once. We hope instead that we can slowly replace 1-2 of these players a year with quality one way or the other to stay there abouts on the ladder.

All it takes is a s**t run of injury and the hardest schedule and s**t can change real quick within a season.

Source: trust me still reeling from 2022 to 2023

 

[Pleasedontfail11]

All it takes is a s**t run of injury and the hardest schedule and s**t can change real quick within a season.

Source: trust me still reeling from 2022 to 2023

For sure. Although I am loving our newish fitness coach, our players have never been this fit or uninjured touch wood.

 

[Partridge]

All it takes is a s**t run of injury and the hardest schedule and s**t can change real quick within a season.

Source: trust me still reeling from 2022 to 2023

Geelong did not have the hardest schedule in 2023.

 

[FootyLad0]

Geelong did not have the hardest schedule in 2023.

Winners and losers: Who really has had the toughest AFL fixture this season?

Forget the pre-season projections. Did your team have the most challenging fixture, or enjoyed an easier ride? We have crunched the numbers for you.

www.theage.com.au

Want me to get more or will the one just do?

 

[YeoShuey]

Collingwood. Geelong are already off their cliff.

 

[FootyLad0]

Collingwood. Geelong are already off their cliff.

Saving the receipts on this

 

[adammania9]

Collingwood. Geelong are already off their cliff.

Keep trying you’ll eventually get a nibble