Kangaroos Tasmanian Academy

[The_Wookie]

Next year actually marks 15 years of Hawthorn sizeable involvement and investment in Tasmania...last year we had 8740 members in Tasmania (inc 1/4 support amongst Tasmanian Auskickers)

First the AFL took NZ off us and gave it to St Kilda, now they'll do us in with Tasmania

...Gill can get stuffed

The AFL took NZ off us? When were you supposed to be playing games in Wellington? Has your development - that you guys fund - been canned?

 

[Biggy_Boy]

Next year actually marks 15 years of Hawthorn sizeable involvement and investment in Tasmania...last year we had 8740 members in Tasmania (inc 1/4 support amongst Tasmanian Auskickers)

First the AFL took NZ off us and gave it to St Kilda, now they'll do us in with Tasmania

...Gill can get stuffed

Looks like the AFL actually wants to move a team to Tasmania. So, would you like Hawthorn to move there entirely?

 

[Dan]

Members will not vote in for the move.

Sorry :/

 

[BEEG]

a bit rich coming from a collingwood fan! 1 evening game, Eddie & Co are jumping up and down stamping their feet & demanding for compo

Really has nothing to do with the argument how can the AFL preach equalisation and then have academies where a certain amount of teams can get years of development into kids and draft them on the cheap?

 

[Thrawn]

Am I the only one who thinks about the Police Academy movies when I see "academy" in the title?

 

[Doggy Dan]

I don't understand why these academies need to be team specific? If the AFL want to set up development centre's for an elite pathway in other states, do it, then all the players go into the draft like everyone else.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Yeah okay, he's been put up by the club to say multiple times he wouldn't be playing if it weren't for the academies.

You don't seem to get it.

Nobody has a problem with your academy, it's the ability to cherry pick top end talent regardless of where you finish. A luxury 14 other clubs don't get.

It's not ******* complicated

 

[The_Wookie]

You don't seem to get it.

Nobody has a problem with your academy, it's the ability to cherry pick top end talent regardless of where you finish. A luxury 14 other clubs don't get.

It's not ******* complicated

This was changed to be bid upon the same way father-son is though, wasnt it? In which case, I would support it

 

[aquila]

Members will not vote in for the move.

Sorry :/

What was the North constitution changed to? Is there any wiggle room that they could argue that it wouldn't be a relocation and therefore not need a vote? Hopefully not, and the power to decide remains 100% with the members.

 

[Kummerspeck]

It's not ******* complicated

It clearly is if that's your take on it.

 

[I am Jack]

These academies are unfair, I'm surprised not more is made of them.
We have an academy at the GC, not that we need another leg up.
These academies are purely 100% tied to money, that is the only reason they exist.
This is just another area where business has taken away from equalisation.
How is it fair that some sides are allowed academies - and some aren't?

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

This was changed to be bid upon the same way father-son is though, wasnt it? In which case, I would support it

Yes.

 

[The_Wookie]

Yes.

In which case then how can it be unfair? And if its unfair, scrap father-son as well. How many victorian clubs are running father-son programs? I know Carlton are at least.

 

[SterlingArcher]

Have one secondary market - not two.

Why is having two bad? They can't play games in Ballarat until a stadium is built. Everyone always whinges that the poor clubs need to do more, between a long-term vision in Ballarat but making do with a VFL and community relationship now, and a good two-way relationship in Hobart North were making an effort to grow and maintain.

Edit: not that it's bad that the Doggies got it. Just don't see the problem in say selling two games to Hobart and Ballarat could they have done that in 5 years.

 

[Kummerspeck]

In which case then how can it be unfair? And if its unfair, scrap father-son as well. How many victorian clubs are running father-son programs? I know Carlton are at least.

I think the main argument is "everyone gets access to father-son", which is true enough, unless you're a SA club. I don't deny that the academies do give an advantage, however I think there are serious over-reactions to it, especially with the Swans. We get from the Mid-North coast to Tweed, and eastern Sydney. One area has produced two draftees, and the other three. The screaming about how the Swans can "cherry pick top end talent" is ridiculous.

A senior pathway has been built from scratch by the Swans and QBE, hundreds of kids would have been trained up over the last six years and the pay off thus far has been selecting Heeney at 18, but then paying second and fourth round picks for two players tipped to go in the rookie draft. As the last few drafts have shown, academy players also end up at other clubs. If you were going to cherry pick talent, there would probably be better ways to do it.

 

[Tuco]

Academies are very expensive and time consuming to run with a low rate of return. The real pay off is if new areas are opened for player development for the code. For the AFL to sign off on a F/S 'style' rule applying to clubs with Academies, then the AFL will want these resources to be pumping into regions where there is underdevelopment, or no development at all. You don't want to plonk an Academy somewhere where it just cannibalises existing structures.

Is the state of footy in Tassie now getting so dire they can be seen as similar to NSW and QLD? If so then great. Any grass roots investment can't be a bad thing.

But if the state of footy in Tassie is fine, and this is simply an inducement to get a club to commit to becoming a Tassie team then the reasons behind the decision are pretty suspect at best.

 

[MrFujiMoto]

Yeh, six years of priority access to the highly developed footy strongholds of North Coast NSW and East Sydney has been outstanding for us.

If you don't think it is of any worth, why did the club fight so hard for it? Top 2 pick this year for an end of first round selection and the same to happen again next year apparently. It is a clear advantage, supporters trying to play it down doesn't change that.

 

[Kummerspeck]

If you don't think it is of any worth, why did the club fight so hard for it?

Well, primarily because my opinion has no influence on the machinations of the club. I don't deny it's an advantage, I don't think it's the massive advantage people who have zero clue about it, such as yourself, keep screaming about. This draft Heeney (a player who wouldn't have been in the draft if the academies didn't exist) gets picked up at a discount, and two academy players who were projected as rookie picks took our ND picks in the second and fourth round.

 

[Matchu]

Are people actually surprised by this? It's clearly one of the incentives the AFL will use to get North to move to Tasmania. It'd be a hard one to turn down too. Exclusive access to the entire state of Tasmania and you can set up the academy in any way you like. It'll be a slow burn to try and deceive the North supporters. First step is getting North to agree to take over Hawthorn's Launceston deal which will result in a semi-relocation for the Kangas.

 

[MrFujiMoto]

Well, primarily because my opinion has no influence on the machinations of the club. I don't deny it's an advantage, I don't think it's the massive advantage people who have zero clue about it, such as yourself, keep screaming about. This draft Heeney (a player who wouldn't have been in the draft if the academies didn't exist) gets picked up at a discount, and two academy players who were projected as rookie picks took our ND picks in the second and fourth round.

Picking up a couple of top 5 picks for picks around the late teens is a pretty good advantage and one I would love my club to be able to have, even if it was 1 in every 5 years or so.

I have a pretty good idea on how they work actually, but that's not the point. You pay to develop players and I am not against that at all. It is how many international sporting giants groom players from a young age and it benefits the game. I am against other clubs not being able to do the same thing.

We have no avenue to priority list a player we may spend $$ and time on, as you do with your academy. We have been on record saying we would happily spend $$ setting up an Academy in NSW or QLD to better the game if we had the same access to the players as you guys do.

Jack Hiscock projected as a rookie list? Please... He was in Sheehans list of the top 15 mids in the draft. I know that doesn't mean he would be a top 15 but it certainly means he was more likely to go top 15 than he was to go in the RD.

 

[RUNVS]

Are people actually surprised by this? It's clearly one of the incentives the AFL will use to get North to move to Tasmania. It'd be a hard one to turn down too. Exclusive access to the entire state of Tasmania and you can set up the academy in any way you like. It'll be a slow burn to try and deceive the North supporters. First step is getting North to agree to take over Hawthorn's Launceston deal which will result in a semi-relocation for the Kangas.

Basically it is the putting the frog in the warm water and then turning up the temperature thing. Before North realise what has happened they have been relocated.

 

[Kummerspeck]

You pay to develop players and I am not against that at all. It is how many international sporting giants groom players from a young age and it benefits the game. I am against other clubs not being able to do the same thing.

We have no avenue to priority list a player we may spend $$ and time on, as you do with your academy. We have been on record saying we would happily spend $$ setting up an Academy in NSW or QLD to better the game if we had the same access to the players as you guys do.

Every club had the chance to develop NSW talent for a number of years and put in a half-arsed attempt. The draft cost was even less, a rookie draft pick, but none of the clubs invested any resources in any meaningful fashion. However, I'm all for the Hawks finding a place with the population, size, and participation of Sydney's zone and putting an academy there.

Jack Hiscock projected as a rookie list? Please... He was in Sheehans list of the top 15 mids in the draft. I know that doesn't mean he would be a top 15 but it certainly means he was more likely to go top 15 than he was to go in the RD.

Hiscox was in Sheehans top 40, released after his 3k at draft camp. Show me anything at all that had him highly projected before that.

 

[Modified Dog]

Well actually no Im not happy and no its not enough evidence. Like the article says you guys had also been looking at Ballarat as well as Tasmania, Mclachlans comments merely say you should be focussing on Tasmania instead. You are reading into the article stuff that simply isnt there.

Still nothing about relocation. even if North take over Hawthorns games.

Okay mate, whatever you reckon…

 

[MrFujiMoto]

Every club had the chance to develop NSW talent for a number of years and put in a half-arsed attempt. The draft cost was even less, a rookie draft pick, but none of the clubs invested any resources in any meaningful fashion. However, I'm all for the Hawks finding a place with the population, size, and participation of Sydney's zone and putting an academy there.


Hiscox was in Sheehans top 40, released after his 3k at draft camp. Show me anything at all that had him highly projected before that.

Why does it have to be before that? Draft camp is part of the drafting process and plays a large part in who clubs will pick up often. DC results have changed our drafting twice in the last 4 years. He was in Sheehans top 15 mids, as I said. It was 40 players rated by position.

 

[AliceCat]

The idea of an academy in Tassie is an interesting one. Are they not able to develop their own talent down there??

I know TAS, NSW/ACT, QLD & the NT all played a few games in the TAC cup..wouldn't be a bad idea for Tassie to play the full season instead of a couple token games. Happy to be corrected but the Rams almost played half the TAC cup. Maybe coincidently that NSW/ACT had one of their best years in the draft.