Review Winners and Losers in the Draft

[gillo94]

Neither because our biggest needs by far is midfield hence why we need to keep both, our midfield needs to grow and develop together.

Trading either of them for the likes of Gibbs/Hanley who are both good players but not unique players makes no sense from a Melbourne POV.

I think Demons snared two monsters, I recorded the draft and after few times watching my impression was that top 3

Paddy, Christian & Angus are three monsters, big units who will all debut in 2015, absolutely no doubt. Angus bigger than Paul Roos

I hope editions like Vince & Lamumba can be those rebounding defenders and Harretier to break the lines as do like what Angus & Christian will bring to the table

I was going to suggest Docherty who I really do rate and think will be a very good player and pick 19 for either Angus or Christian but you hinted no. My opinion is win-win but maybe you don't share that thought

 

[master bate]

I think Demons snared two monsters, I recorded the draft and after few times watching my impression was that top 3

Paddy, Christian & Angus are three monsters, big units who will all debut in 2015, absolutely no doubt. Angus bigger than Paul Roos

I hope editions like Vince & Lamumba can be those rebounding defenders and Harretier to break the lines as do like what Angus & Christian will bring to the table

I was going to suggest Docherty who I really do rate and think will be a very good player and pick 19 for either Angus or Christian but you hinted no. My opinion is win-win but maybe you don't share that thought

I would've done pick 3 for Bryce Gibbs in a second. As would Paul Roos. Gibbs is unfairly maligned, he's quietly turned himself in to that borderline top end midfielder, not quite top of the top but similar level to Jones. But there's a big difference between him and Kreuzer.

Docherty and 19. No thanks. Docherty would fill a need. But he's yet to establish himself with 3 years in the system and signs were good last year from a limited prep, he can certainly kick and has a dip, but we aren't giving up a blue chip pick for 2 speculative things in 19 and Docherty.

Last year's pick 2 needed to be traded for immediate improvement, but was traded (in conjunction with pick 20) for pick 9 (which is usually a surer thing than pick 19) and a former pick 3 in Dom Tyson who hadn't set the world on fire but hadn't done much to damage his value either. There weren't any black flags to suggest from his time at GWS that he wasn't going to be clearly above average and I'm hoping he's a few classes above that!

 

[Trav 20]

I would've done pick 3 for Bryce Gibbs in a second. As would Paul Roos.

Not me and you can't speak for Roos.

I would expect a better player for pick 3 than Gibbs. Granted you may not get one, but I'd back the draft and my club to get a player better than Gibbs.

He definitely had a break out year in 2014 and I admit I was surprised at how well he played, but I'll always back a top 3 player in the draft over a B grader. And if you think he's A grade we won't agree.

It takes more than one year that was borderline A grade to be a bone fide A grader. Murphy had an A grade year in 2011, but hasn't backed it up.

 

[The Bomb]

Surely I didn't just read Docherty and pick #19 for Petracca.
No way in hell I would accept that.

 

[gillo94]

Surely I didn't just read Docherty and pick #19 for Petracca.
No way in hell I would accept that.

Yes you did. Blues paid up 2nd round pick for Doc last year that we received for Hampson, excellent return. You need to watch Docherty play, his a joy to watch with beautiful kicking skills.

Mick has said next year will play Amdrew Walker forward and reason no doubt has confidence that Doc can step up again in from defense and continue breaking the lines.

Pick 19 doesn't have to be BB, Demons can draft Goddard for example or Laverde, whoever

This is that we assume Christisn or Angus are going to be stars, keep in mind hard work still needs to occur, at least Doc is now a gauranteed starter

 

[master bate]

Not me and you can't speak for Roos.

I would expect a better player for pick 3 than Gibbs. Granted you may not get one, but I'd back the draft and my club to get a player better than Gibbs.

He definitely had a break out year in 2014 and I admit I was surprised at how well he played, but I'll always back a top 3 player in the draft over a B grader. And if you think he's A grade we won't agree.

It takes more than one year that was borderline A grade to be a bone fide A grader. Murphy had an A grade year in 2011, but hasn't backed it up.

He had a pretty solid 2013 as well. A B+ year in 2013, then an A grade year last year. He doesn't get huge disposal numbers but uses them well enough and kicks goals which elevates him and he lays tackles. He's also the right build and athleticism to carry on successfully unlike the small and injury prone Murphy.

You wont get genuine A graders in any trade, well not that you can bank on. And I'll back Melbourne to sign a big fish free agent when it happens not before.

Every chance of pick 3 turning in to another Watts, Sylvia or Morton or being injury prone like McLean, Trengove or Morabito. Or just ordinary like Sam Day or Chris Masten. The benefit of high draft picks comes from bringing in young talent together and for the shot at the super star. Considering where Melbourne is at on the road back to competency I'm very confident we would've done Gibbs for pick 3.

Anyway it was never an option. Plus it's hijacking the thread. Picks 2 and 3 were on the table in trade week. If Carlton came with Bryce Gibbs it would've been seriously considered. If they came with Docherty and pick 19 it wouldn't have.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Surely I didn't just read Docherty and pick #19 for Petracca.
No way in hell I would accept that.

And rightly so ....

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Yes you did. I paid up 2nd round pick for Doc last year that we received for Hampson, excellent return. You need to watch Docherty play, his a joy to watch with beautiful kicking skills.

Mick has said next year will play Amdrew Walker forward and reason no doubt has confidence that Doc can step up again in from defense and continue breaking the lines.

Pick 19 doesn't have to be BB, Demons can draft Goddard for example or Laverde, whoever

This is that we assume Christisn or Angus are going to be stars

The same Docherty who's crap skills cost his side two close games?

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

The same Docherty who's crap skills cost his side two close games?

He didn't cost us anything. There are multiple reasons why a team loses a close game. You don't single out one. He had a good year and that is what we know him for, not someone's selective memory.

 

[Moist Biscuit]

He didn't cost us anything. There are multiple reasons why a team loses a close game. You don't single out one. He had a good year and that is what we know him for, not someone's selective memory.

It can be singled out in a close game though, hasn't shown that he is capable of dealing with immense game pressure.

 

[gillo94]

It can be singled out in a close game though, hasn't shown that he is capable of dealing with immense game pressure.

Docherty I'm telling you will be an AA next few years. His still young so will make mistakes here and there, old saying which I believe in, "you learn more from a loss that what you do in a win"

His an Origional first round pick and we got him for 2nd round, massive unders considering what he was able to produce. Classy player with beautuful kicking. Every top8 side has elite run and carry from their defense and class act line breakers that take the ball from one end of field to other, if Demons want make next step need address this issue

Gettjng off-topic here, my point is that he would be beneficial to Demons squad considering what he can bring to the table. I feel ashamed now even putting his name up for trade, but if it means potentially developing next big midfield in Petracca or Brayshaw then yes, would have to explore the option

Sad reality is that Football is a business

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Docherty I'm telling you will be an AA next few years. His still young so will make mistakes here and there, old saying which I believe in, "you learn more from a loss that what you do in a win"

His an Origional first round pick and we got him for 2nd round, massive unders considering what he was able to produce. Classy player with beautuful kicking. Every top8 side has elite run and carry from their defense and class act line breakers that take the ball from one end of field to other, if Demons want make next step need address this issue

Gettjng off-topic here, my point is that he would be beneficial to Demons squad considering what he can bring to the table. I feel ashamed now even putting his name up for trade, but if it means potentially developing next big midfield in Petracca or Brayshaw then yes, would have to explore the option

Sad reality is that Football is a business

However not even Mark Neeld or Michael Voss would trade Petracca/Brayshaw for Docherty + 19

 

[LC40]

Really liked what St Kilda, Gold Coast and Geelong did in the both the draft and rookie draft.

I thought those 1st three picks of St Kilda were spot on and just what they needed.Two KPP who in a couple of years will flourish and anchor their spine and an excellent runner and kick in McKenzie.

Gold Coast got a steal in Wright, elite pace with Garlett, Miller and Josh Glenn to fall to the rookie draft was a crime. A gun in the SANFL last year who never wasted a kick all year. Really nice pick ups the lot of them.

Geelong just picked talented players. Cockatoo is a question mark but the upside with him is greater than anyone in the draft. Really like Cory Gregson elite leg, great decision maker and so balanced while Gore is hard at it and a kid with so much potential. Their rookie draft selection in Read was another first class pick, good size, agile for a big man and he came on in leaps and bounds.

On paper this was an excellent draft for all teams, the talent went deep and I didn't see any real loser.

 

[gutsroy]

Am a bit late to the party and it's too early to make informed judgment given that all these kids have no top flight exposed form. That said, my 'winners':
Melbourne: Chose the 2 available players remaining of what seemed to be a clear top 3, and Neal-Bullen and young Stretch, e.g., seem good pickups
Essendon: Drove a hard bargain in trading to get themselves higher up in the pecking order, grabbed two kids with big potential upside, by all reports.
Brisbane: Got good value out of the academy bidding system, could have a real steal in McGrath if he stays injury-free, and two good kids from Tassie.

The 'maybe not winners':
Not that big a fan of St Kilda's draft (McCartin as a KPP and with the diabetes potentially presenting difficulties now he'll be stepping up to full-time footy).
GWS seemed to be looking at picking up players with a bit of something different about them, if it works out, they'll be laughing, but the risk is there.
The Bullies went for a few small players, whereas to an outsider, some bigger bodies wouldn't have hurt, but part of that was probably draft position.

 

[Trav 20]

He had a pretty solid 2013 as well. A B+ year in 2013, then an A grade year last year. He doesn't get huge disposal numbers but uses them well enough and kicks goals which elevates him and he lays tackles. He's also the right build and athleticism to carry on successfully unlike the small and injury prone Murphy.

You wont get genuine A graders in any trade, well not that you can bank on. And I'll back Melbourne to sign a big fish free agent when it happens not before.

Every chance of pick 3 turning in to another Watts, Sylvia or Morton or being injury prone like McLean, Trengove or Morabito. Or just ordinary like Sam Day or Chris Masten. The benefit of high draft picks comes from bringing in young talent together and for the shot at the super star. Considering where Melbourne is at on the road back to competency I'm very confident we would've done Gibbs for pick 3.

Anyway it was never an option. Plus it's hijacking the thread. Picks 2 and 3 were on the table in trade week. If Carlton came with Bryce Gibbs it would've been seriously considered. If they came with Docherty and pick 19 it wouldn't have.

I accept there are no guarantees with pick 3, but I'll always back the club to get it right over trading it for a B-grader.

Yes, there are the 'Mortons' and Col 'Sylvias' of this world, but there's also Judd, Pavlich, Franklin, and Pendlebury. We haven't won a flag in 50 years. I'd rather back our eye and draft players that may become a superstar than tread water with a safer option. Stars give you a chance at a flag, which is all that matters to me.

Also, pick 3 was on the table, but despite popular opinion picks 2 and 3 as a package never were.

 

[markm106]

Absolutely no way I would trade Brayshaw or Petracca for Docherty and 19.
If Carlton offered Gibbs for pick 3 I think we would have likely taken it.

 

[Monkey King]

It can be singled out in a close game though, hasn't shown that he is capable of dealing with immense game pressure.

He kicked the ball OOF on the wing. Didn't cost the game. To judge a player on that one act is just foolishness and nothing more. I suspect the other game you refer to was when that free was given against Geelong, that everyone, including umps bosses said was an error; in other words, Docherty actually laid a bloody good legal spoil under immense pressure. That's to go along with the plenty of other times he's shown capable of dealing with pressure. The opinion your putting out there relies on ignoring everything for focus on one kick. Minimal scope resulting in a minimal opinion.

 

[gillo94]

He kicked the ball OOF on the wing. Didn't cost the game. To judge a player on that one act is just foolishness and nothing more. I suspect the other game you refer to was when that free was given against Geelong, that everyone, including umps bosses said was an error; in other words, Docherty actually laid a bloody good legal spoil under immense pressure. That's to go along with the plenty of other times he's shown capable of dealing with pressure. The opinion your putting out there relies on ignoring everything for focus on one kick. Minimal scope resulting in a minimal opinion.

Docherty will continue to go from strength to strength, had a solid year IMO

I this day and age to get something special you have to give up something special;
If Demons offered say Doc & Boekhorst (19) or whomever they wish eg. Goddard, Laverde
for either one of Petracca & Brayshaw meaning still get to keep one, I'm sure they would request time to think about it

Docherty predicting big 2015

 

[TN25]

Docherty will continue to go from strength to strength, had a solid year IMO

I this day and age to get something special you have to give up something special;
If Demons offered say Doc & Boekhorst (19) or whomever they wish eg. Goddard, Laverde
for either one of Petracca & Brayshaw meaning still get to keep one, I'm sure they would request time to think about it

Docherty predicting big 2015

There is no way Melbourne would do Doc and Boekhorst for Petracca/Brayshaw

 

[gillo94]

There is no way Melbourne would do Doc and Boekhorst for Petracca/Brayshaw

Agree think they are excited with who they got and they should be

I think Demons will address issues and work towards it throughout the season. I still say a player/players out of defense who can break the lines is essential. All top 4 teams have them, so vital to have guys who can use the ball efficiently out of defense

Atm Blues have Walker, Docherty & Yarran hence why I suggested it

 

[Moist Biscuit]

He kicked the ball OOF on the wing. Didn't cost the game. To judge a player on that one act is just foolishness and nothing more. I suspect the other game you refer to was when that free was given against Geelong, that everyone, including umps bosses said was an error; in other words, Docherty actually laid a bloody good legal spoil under immense pressure. That's to go along with the plenty of other times he's shown capable of dealing with pressure. The opinion your putting out there relies on ignoring everything for focus on one kick. Minimal scope resulting in a minimal opinion.

I don't rate him, makes too many mistakes at critical situations. I was responding to a stupid comment about him and pick 19 being worth a top 3 pick, which is a joke.

 

[gillo94]

I don't rate him, makes too many mistakes at critical situations. I was responding to a stupid comment about him and pick 19 being worth a top 3 pick, which is a joke.

Just drop the suggestion then, personally don't think its stupid but if it's seen by neutral fans then best drop the subject from my end

Before you deem it stupid, you should see reasoning behind it

 

[Andy_Mac]

Agree think they are excited with who they got and they should be

I think Demons will address issues and work towards it throughout the season. I still say a player/players out of defense who can break the lines is essential. All top 4 teams have them, so vital to have guys who can use the ball efficiently out of defense

Atm Blues have Walker, Docherty & Yarran hence why I suggested it

Lamumba > Walker, Docherty or Yarren

 

[Moist Biscuit]

Just drop the suggestion then, personally don't think its stupid but if it's seen by neutral fans then best drop the subject from my end

Before you deem it stupid, you should see reasoning behind it

Doesn't matter about the reasoning, Docherty is nowhere near worth a 16 pick upgrade. Hasn't proved anything at AFL level as of yet. Has only played 29 games and was only worth pick 33 this time last year. His value has not skyrocketed in the 16 games he has played at Carlton, therefore making it a crap suggestion

 

[doona]

Doesn't matter about the reasoning, Docherty is nowhere near worth a 16 pick upgrade. Hasn't proved anything at AFL level as of yet. Has only played 29 games and was only worth pick 33 this time last year. His value has not skyrocketed in the 16 games he has played at Carlton, therefore making it a crap suggestion

Agree with this. I think Docherty is going to be a good AFL player, but the proposed trade would never happen and Melbourne would be getting royally screwed.