Opinion MODERATE ideas for a 'fairer' AFL without the hyperbole of VIC & non-VIC trolls. TROLLS FROM BOTH SIDES PLEASE KEEP OUT

[The_Wookie]

The afl could have negotiated for a certain amount of cash in the deal for all the clubs not just vic clubs.

the fact that it only went to victorian clubs is a double slap in the face.

What cash in the deal? Everything in the deal is going to facilities funding? No club is getting cash - and no government would hand out money for clubs not in the state

 

[kranky al]

What cash in the deal? Everything in the deal is going to facilities funding? No club is getting cash - and no government would hand out money for clubs not in the state

The afl should have got cash to disburse themselves to the clubs.

not negotiated deals for the vic clubs alone.

 

[Carringbush2010]

The afl could have negotiated for a certain amount of cash in the deal for all the clubs not just vic clubs.

the fact that it only went to victorian clubs is a double slap in the face.

That's not what I'm disputing, your argument that the gf was bought up by the vic govt. which it was - disadvantages non vic fans, which it does.

It has to be held somewhere, so fans that do not live where it is held are disadvantaged. So how exactly can you benefit all the fans (have the gf somehow held in each stadium at once)?

 

[kranky al]

That's not what I'm disputing, your argument that the gf was bought up by the vic govt. which it was - disadvantages non vic fans, which it does.

It has to be held somewhere, so fans that do not live where it is held are disadvantaged. So how exactly can you benefit all the fans (have the gf somehow held in each stadium at once)?

A rotation is a good start.

 

[Carringbush2010]

A rotation is a good start.

Ok round and round we go. For starters this is the governments doing, not the AFL.

Even if it was solely HQ's doing:

• The largest market is in vic, so of course they'd place it there.
• The largest stadium is in vic, so of course they'd place it there.
• The broadcasters will obviously have influence on where it is held, for them it is in their best interest to broadcast it there. (see dot point above)
• The MCC will also have influence, for them it is in their best interest to have it there.

The rotation idea is a moderate one, but in reality there's too many hurdles for that even if the deal was still up for grabs. So further the reality is that the gf is at the g until 2057.

So I ask again, how can you possibly benefit all the fans?

 

[kranky al]

Ok round and round we go. For starters this is the governments doing, not the AFL.

Even if it was solely HQ's doing:

• The largest market is in vic, so of course they'd place it there.
• The largest stadium is in vic, so of course they'd place it there.
• The broadcasters will obviously have influence on where it is held, for them it is in their best interest to broadcast it there. (see dot point above)
• The MCC will also have influence, for them it is in their best interest to have it there.

The rotation idea is a moderate one, but in reality there's too many hurdles for that even if the deal was still up for grabs. So further the reality is that the gf is at the g until 2057.

So I ask again, how can you possibly benefit all the fans?

Organising reasonable gouge free flights.

ensuring that they can get a decent amount of tickets for a reasonable price.

 

[GCS in 11]

It was one thing for there to be the original agreement until 2037 for the Grand Final to stay in Victoria, but the $250 million dollar funding deal for a further 20 is insanely stupid and irresponsible by the AFL. Why would you tie up something that lucrative and more importantly, something that goes against competition fairness for 40 years??? It limits flexibility for too long a time

It should be torn up if there’s a force majeure available this year so we’re not stuck with this stupid deal for decades

 

[The_Wookie]

The afl should have got cash to disburse themselves to the clubs.

not negotiated deals for the vic clubs alone.

There was no cash component to be given to any clubs or even the league to spend on anything except facilites in victoria, and even then it was part of a larger package that included facilities funding for other sports including soccer, and rugby league.

 

[The_Wookie]

It was one thing for there to be the original agreement until 2037 for the Grand Final to stay in Victoria, but the $250 million dollar funding deal for a further 20 is insanely stupid and irresponsible by the AFL. Why would you tie up something that lucrative and more importantly, something that goes against competition fairness for 40 years??? It limits flexibility for too long a time

It should be torn up if there’s a force majeure available this year so we’re not stuck with this stupid deal for decades

league needed money for the docklands upgrades now and the vic gov was willing to come to the party on funding now. Everyone should have seen something like this coming years before.

 

[telsor]

The afl should have got cash to disburse themselves to the clubs.

not negotiated deals for the vic clubs alone.

AFL deals with more than clubs. In theory at least it controls the game everywhere, and due to that, puts a lot of money into facilities and development in all states.

This deal means they need to put less money into Vic to achieve the same result.
The money saved through that, gets spent in other states.

So consider the money the AFL puts into WA football every year to be, in part, due to the GF deal with the Vic government.

 

[telsor]

Organising reasonable gouge free flights.

ensuring that they can get a decent amount of tickets for a reasonable price.

Just how do you expect them to do that? Buy an airline?

 

[kranky al]

Just how do you expect them to do that? Buy an airline?

Organise charters

im guessing there might be a couple of planes spare for a few years

 

[GCS in 11]

league needed money for the docklands upgrades now and the vic gov was willing to come to the party on funding now. Everyone should have seen something like this coming years before.

That’s understandable but there was no need for the grand final to be tied to this funding, rarely stadium upgrades are (see Perth $1 Billion, Adelaide Oval etc). Even in Sydney, there were getting a package almost 7 times bigger at $1.5 billion for 25 years.

The AFL deal didn’t just give the Grand Final away for the money as well, the AFL commission almost assuredly had a bias of wanting to keep the game in Victoria just because it’s the “home of football” which impacted the decision, and that part in particular irks me.

And especially now, that $225 million dollars should probably be cut like the ANZ stadium deal has been because of the pandemic since it’s not absolutely essential. It’s a great chance for the AFL to atleast retake control of the match after 2037.

 

[kranky al]

There was no cash component to be given to any clubs or even the league to spend on anything except facilites in victoria, and even then it was part of a larger package that included facilities funding for other sports including soccer, and rugby league.

Yet go back a couple of pages and ive listed some - yes it was facilities - of victorian clubs


A national league would negotiate on behalf of all clubs

 

[telsor]

Organise charters

im guessing there might be a couple of planes spare for a few years

If it's so easy, why don't you do it?

 

[juss]

Ooh yes - great job, two weeks in and as was predicted when they came out with this backwards arse plan of putting a hub in bat aids central we have a positive test for covid.

*slow claps

View attachment 896597
my facebook the day the plan was announced.....

Why am I not surprised thats on your Facebook. How much does Victoria dominate your life? Just enjoy WA, you have better weather.

 

[The_Wookie]

Yet go back a couple of pages and ive listed some - yes it was facilities - of victorian clubs


A national league would negotiate on behalf of all clubs

Im sure WA and SA were going to throw money at a Victorian major stadium upgrade 20-40 years before they could see a return on investment. No really, Im sure that would happen.

Fact remains that by not having to spend money on the upgrades themselves, they have money to spend elsewhere, not least being the $30m a year they give the state leagues which apparently appears by magic, let alone the money being used to keep most of the non victorian teams afloat.

 

[The_Wookie]

That’s understandable but there was no need for the grand final to be tied to this funding, rarely stadium upgrades are (see Perth $1 Billion, Adelaide Oval etc). Even in Sydney, there were getting a package almost 7 times bigger at $1.5 billion for 25 years.

Stadium funding is mostly private in Victoria. The AFL wasnt going to get government funding without caving on the MCG deal.

The AFL deal didn’t just give the Grand Final away for the money as well, the AFL commission almost assuredly had a bias of wanting to keep the game in Victoria just because it’s the “home of football” which impacted the decision, and that part in particular irks me.

Apparently we read minds now. A good number of commissioners arent victorian these days, but there might be some sort of sentimental attachment to an event being held at a venue where its been based since before Federation, being held elsewhere only when the MCG was compulsory acquired by the military during the war, and in 1991 during construction of the Southern Stand. No doubt History plays a part - adding teams to the league doesnt change that - look at the leagues awards - the Brownlow medal (1924), Coleman medal (1981), and the Mclelland Trophy (1951) all predate 1987 expansion.

And especially now, that $225 million dollars should probably be cut like the ANZ stadium deal has been because of the pandemic since it’s not absolutely essential. It’s a great chance for the AFL to atleast retake control of the match after 2037.

I doubt its going to be cut, theres a full on funding deed already signed and in place - funds began to be disbursed from Vic Gov to the AFL last year.

 

[wal]

If it's so easy, why don't you do it?

Freo fans did organise a few charters 2013, cost was about $1300 per person.
If a non Victorian side is in the GF all Victorian ticket sales should have a $50 tax, $50 for every MCC and AFL member to subsidise flights for the competing interstate members

 

[GCS in 11]

Stadium funding is mostly private in Victoria. The AFL wasnt going to get government funding without caving on the MCG deal.

In that case couldn’t they have gone private again for this deal? A main component of this funding is to revitalise the docklands precinct and in turn attract more new developments in the surrounding areas right (I may be wrong about this, honestly not sure)? That sounds like it’s ripe for private funding again.

Apparently we read minds now. A good number of commissioners arent victorian these days, but there might be some sort of sentimental attachment to an event being held at a venue where its been based since before Federation, being held elsewhere only when the MCG was compulsory acquired by the military during the war, and in 1991 during construction of the Southern Stand. No doubt History plays a part - adding teams to the league doesnt change that - look at the leagues awards - the Brownlow medal (1924), Coleman medal (1981), and the Mclelland Trophy (1951) all predate 1987 expansion.

Agree with all of this (except the mind reading part ), the historical nature of the event is something to consider and no doubt there’s a special connection to the MCG for the match. But 37 more years is an incredibly long time to limit yourself like this for the Grand Final when it’s already not fair to 8/18 teams. Our competition will be drastically different at that point just like it was around 40 years ago when we had 0 non-vic teams. And what happens in 15-20 years time when they need more funding for Victorian stadiums? 2077 just becomes the new ‘maybe we’ll let other states host it then’ date?

I doubt its going to be cut, theres a full on funding deed already signed and in place - funds began to be disbursed from Vic Gov to the AFL last year.

Ah ok I wasn’t aware of this, definitely tough to pull now then yeah.

 

[kranky al]

Im sure WA and SA were going to throw money at a Victorian major stadium upgrade 20-40 years before they could see a return on investment. No really, Im sure that would happen.

Fact remains that by not having to spend money on the upgrades themselves, they have money to spend elsewhere, not least being the $30m a year they give the state leagues which apparently appears by magic, let alone the money being used to keep most of the non victorian teams afloat.

You keep going in about keeping the non vic leagues afloat. Yet the afl say that the expansion north drives higher tv deal revenue.

how do you reconcile this?

 

[kranky al]

If it's so easy, why don't you do it?

It isnt easy for a private individual

for a large organisation that has organised charters before however....

what a nonsensical question.

 

[Senor M]

Freo fans did organise a few charters 2013, cost was about $1300 per person.
If a non Victorian side is in the GF all Victorian ticket sales should have a $50 tax, $50 for every MCC and AFL member to subsidise flights for the competing interstate members

How is "I want other people to pay for my airfare" a Moderate idea??

There's only one example in the past decade where an interstate side couldn't sell their full allocation of Grand Final tickets--- and that was GWS. Do you think that more GWS members would've flown to Melbourne if flights were cheaper?? Every other interstate Grand Final team has been able to sell all their tickets, so the genuine difference for teams with this initiative is nothing--- except making a few people happier that they've got cheaper flights.

 

[kranky al]

How is "I want other people to pay for my airfare" a Moderate idea??

There's only one example in the past decade where an interstate side couldn't sell their full allocation of Grand Final tickets--- and that was GWS. Do you think that more GWS members would've flown to Melbourne if flights were cheaper?? Every other interstate Grand Final team has been able to sell all their tickets, so the genuine difference for teams with this initiative is nothing--- except making a few people happier that they've got cheaper flights.

You point to one example when theres been eagles, adelaide, sydney, eagles , sydney, fremantle, sydney in this decade.....

*shakes head

 

[The_Wookie]

You keep going in about keeping the non vic leagues afloat. Yet the afl say that the expansion north drives higher tv deal revenue.

how do you reconcile this?

thats been disputed by anyone with an eye on the ratings for a start, and recent comments in the media.