Player Watch Mark Keane (Retired 2022)

[The Royal Sampler]

The club appear to rate Keane pretty highly. My current opinion is a good deal better than what he showed on debut, but I’m still not on board the hype train just yet.

 

[Kappa]

The club appear to rate Keane pretty highly. My current opinion is a good deal better than what he showed on debut, but I’m still not on board the hype train just yet.

I was on the hype train, until his debut.

Hopefully he puts those mental demons to bed quickly, big mistake to play him that early.

 

[jackcass]

Good move by the club to re-sign. Surprised they didn’t do the same to Tohill. Hope it doesn’t mean we’re letting him go.

 

[PIEWITHSAUCE]

Happy to see them persist with him if they see the potential...........looked like a fish out of water at AFL level but even Josh Daicos took quite some time to adjust/come on.

 

[Markfs]

The Josh Daicos

7

Josh Daicos

Age

25

Ht

178cm

Wt

77kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.6

4star

K

8.3

3star

HB

7.3

5star

M

3.3

3star

T

3.6

5star

CL

1.3

3star

D

16.2

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

7.0

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

3.5

4star

CL

1.5

4star

D

13.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

6.2

4star

M

3.2

4star

T

4.2

5star

CL

1.2

4star

turnaround shows you can give up on a guy too early.....and keane is tall and will take some time. But i dont see the point of the irish blank canvas experiment. I'd see more point if the irish were super athletic overall. If we were picking out prospective players from a race of supermen, but obviously that isnt the case I just dont see the overall philosophy of the program. In the end you might end up with a reasonable footballer who needs to be very well rewarded to stay in the country.

 

[domus]

What am I missing in regard to Keane? They seem to have a very high opinion of him yet the one game I saw did nothing to make me think he was a future permanent fixture in our best 22. I'm not silly enough to wipe someone on one bad performance against top opposition, but I was looking for a glimpse of something, a dash of electric pace, an athletic leap, a prodigious kick...but I didn't see anything but an overawed, poorly skilled, poor decision maker on that day. Could someone who has followed him closely please tell me about his attributes and whether they believe he is the future?

 

[Markfs]

What am I missing in regard to Keane? They seem to have a very high opinion of him yet the one game I saw did nothing to make me think he was a future permanent fixture in our best 22. I'm not silly enough to wipe someone on one bad performance against top opposition, but I was looking for a glimpse of something, a dash of electric pace, an athletic leap, a prodigious kick...but I didn't see anything but an overawed, poorly skilled, poor decision maker on that day. Could someone who has followed him closely please tell me about his attributes and whether they believe he is the future?

It was a good question professor. I felt the same. We can only trust the experts at the club..... and more importantly BF.

 

[Soups]

Asked and answered Domus all by yourself.

Soups and I have followed him through the VFL. He has all the tools to be a good player.

Who doesn’t like a bit of mongrel in their key defender? He’ll win people over.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

"Ïn the one game I saw"

That comment says a lot....sadly its a bit of a common theme around here.

Free swing to re-sign a player on our list who has upside. We dont have enough of them as too many list spots were wasted this year on veterans and/or chronically injured players. No-brainer to put some faith in Keane and see how he develops. And as a key defender, theres a spot there for him in the future if hes good enough... we're not exactly blessed with depth!

 

[Markfs]

Who doesn’t like a bit of mongrel in their key defender? He’ll win people over.

ah..yes his mongrel....well that's one thing about the irish boys. they have mongrel. I wonder if the trainers slip em something in the drink bottles

 

[domus]

Asked and answered Domus all by yourself.

Soups and I have followed him through the VFL. He has all the tools to be a good player.

What a weird response. I explain that I haven't seen enough of him to make a final judgement and then you tell me I answered the question. How? I mentioned the tools he appears to be lacking.

 

[domus]

"Ïn the one game I saw"

That comment says a lot....sadly its a bit of a common theme around here.

Free swing to re-sign a player on our list who has upside. We dont have enough of them as too many list spots were wasted this year on veterans and/or chronically injured players. No-brainer to put some faith in Keane and see how he develops. And as a key defender, theres a spot there for him in the future if hes good enough... we're not exactly blessed with depth!

What is your problem? A common theme? What theme are you referring to? Posters who ask those who have seen more of a player to give them some insight into his strengths because they don't want to make a judgement based upon one poor game? My question was-"What is his upside?" I still haven't received an answer from those who claim to have followed him closely.

 

[manicpie]

What is your problem? A common theme? What theme are you referring to? Posters who ask those who have seen more of a player to give them some insight into his strengths because they don't want to make a judgement based upon one poor game? My question was-"What is his upside?" I still haven't received an answer from those who claim to have followed him closely.

I've seen him play quite a few times. His is a very good spoiler and a decent mark. Can be outbodied easily at times but that will come with time. Reminds me of Carlton's full back, can't think of his name, definitely worth a 2 year contract, he is very athletic and a pretty good kick

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

What a weird response. I explain that I haven't seen enough of him to make a final judgement and then you tell me I answered the question. How? I mentioned the tools he appears to be lacking.

Off a sample set of one game.

 

[domus]

Off a sample set of one game.

Oh dear lord. I have only seen him play one game! Is there a law saying you cannot make an observation about a player's skill set after watching him play one game? If he'd kicked ten goals at full forward in his one game would you have dared to make some comments about his potential? Yet I didn't use my one game sample to make a final judgement-I made that very clear. That is why I was asking for others who have seen more to inform me and all I've read since is puerile rubbish about my post.

If I'd made my mind up based upon one game, you might have a point, but I didn't, so you don't.

 

[domus]

I've seen him play quite a few times. His is a very good spoiler and a decent mark. Can be outbodied easily at times but that will come with time. Reminds me of Carlton's full back, can't think of his name, definitely worth a 2 year contract, he is very athletic and a pretty good kick

Thank you for a sensible, coherent response to my post-just what I was looking for.

 

[ClaytonM]

What am I missing in regard to Keane? They seem to have a very high opinion of him yet the one game I saw did nothing to make me think he was a future permanent fixture in our best 22. I'm not silly enough to wipe someone on one bad performance against top opposition, but I was looking for a glimpse of something, a dash of electric pace, an athletic leap, a prodigious kick...but I didn't see anything but an overawed, poorly skilled, poor decision maker on that day. Could someone who has followed him closely please tell me about his attributes and whether they believe he is the future?

So you say you are not silly enough to wipe someone after one game then basically wipe him in your comments.

If I recall correctly Johnathon Brown didn’t get a touch in his first game. From another sport Graham Goochngot a pair on debut.

The kid is a good size, has some mongrel, and moves well. Others seem to be a little down on his skills but I am not that concerned at the moment. Don’t know if he will ever be a KPD, but more third tall. If they play him as a KPD early on he will struggle, but if he plays the role Langdon filled then I think his transition to AFL will be smoother.

 

[Markfs]

"Ïn the one game I saw"

That comment says a lot....sadly its a bit of a common theme around here.

Free swing to re-sign a player on our list who has upside. We dont have enough of them as too many list spots were wasted this year on veterans and/or chronically injured players. No-brainer to put some faith in Keane and see how he develops. And as a key defender, theres a spot there for him in the future if hes good enough... we're not exactly blessed with depth!

As I said, I dont agree with the Irish thing, but you make the point that its a free swing... and I can see your point. However, a lot of the support going into him isnt free and when you're sacking coaches to save money, you have to question whether recruiting from the other side of the world is practical.

of course, the thing that is also important - as you said - is his size and i agree with keeping him solely because we dont have many over 192cm.

But he didnt show much in that one game.....so i'm on the fence

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

As I said, I dont agree with the Irish thing, but you make the point that its a free swing... and I can see your point. However, a lot of the support going into him isnt free and when you're sacking coaches to save money, you have to question whether recruiting from the other side of the world is practical.

of course, the thing that is also important - as you said - is his size and i agree with keeping him solely because we dont have many over 192cm.

But he didnt show much in that one game.....so i'm on the fence

The coaching budget comes out of a completely separate cap, so the argument about money spent on supporting an Irishman instead of retaining an assistant coach really doesnt make any sense.

Secondly, we have already done the recruiting bit. Thats all a sunk cost. The only question now is how much upside he has. Many seem to be happy to say he has none...based on one game they have seen. I'm sure the club's analysis is a bit more in depth than that!!

 

[domus]

So you say you are not silly enough to wipe someone after one game then basically wipe him in your comments.

If I recall correctly Johnathon Brown didn’t get a touch in his first game. From another sport Graham Goochngot a pair on debut.

The kid is a good size, has some mongrel, and moves well. Others seem to be a little down on his skills but I am not that concerned at the moment. Don’t know if he will ever be a KPD, but more third tall. If they play him as a KPD early on he will struggle, but if he plays the role Langdon filled then I think his transition to AFL will be smoother.

Wrong. I did not wipe him. I presented my view of his performance in the one game I saw him play and rather than wipe him, I asked others who had seen a larger sample of his wares to give me a more comprehensive summary of what his strengths may be. If I had wiped him why would I be asking others to tell me more about his strengths? I would have written: "Keane is a spud. Delist him!" That's how you wipe a player. Your second paragraph was all that was required rather than the silly opening comment.

If Gooch was out LBW in both of his first two innings it would be fair for those with some experience in cricket to suggest he may have a bad habit of shuffling across in front of his stumps at the point of delivery which leaves him vulnerable to a ball that cuts back. They wouldn't be wiping him off, just commenting on what they saw from a small sample. Everyone does it in all sports. As the sample size gets bigger our observations will become even more informed, but there is no law against making judgments on a player's first performance at the highest level. It would be fair to say a number of test cricketers and footballers have been judged as not good enough for the level after one bad performance. Fair or not, it has happened many times.

 

[Markfs]

The coaching budget comes out of a completely separate cap, so the argument about money spent on supporting an Irishman instead of retaining an assistant coach really doesnt make any sense.

Secondly, we have already done the recruiting bit. Thats all a sunk cost. The only question now is how much upside he has. Many seem to be happy to say he has none...based on one game they have seen. I'm sure the club's analysis is a bit more in depth than that!!

well as i said before, he's the right size and considering he's here and had a couple of years to learn the ropes, it would be silly to tell him to go home.

I didnt realise that about the budget. I knew that the salary and football budget were separate, but I thought that football budget covered the coaches salaries, right down to the oranges after training. Where do you find out about this information?

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

well as i said before, he's the right size and considering he's here and had a couple of years to learn the ropes, it would be silly to tell him to go home.

I didnt realise that about the budget. I knew that the salary and football budget were separate, but I thought that football budget covered the coaches salaries, right down to the oranges after training. Where do you find out about this information?

Pretty sure the salary cap for the players is a totally different budget and set of rules to the cap for the coaching budget....and no trade-offs permitted between the two. I might be mistaken or too simplistic.

 

[ClaytonM]

well as i said before, he's the right size and considering he's here and had a couple of years to learn the ropes, it would be silly to tell him to go home.

I didnt realise that about the budget. I knew that the salary and football budget were separate, but I thought that football budget covered the coaches salaries, right down to the oranges after training. Where do you find out about this information?

I suspect the players association wouldn’t take kindly to clubs paying coaches out of the player salary cap.
Having said that, not sure where rookies, and particularly Cat B, salaries sit in the overall budget limits. So your original point may be valid.

Still think he is worth persevering with for a few more years. There is plenty to work with.

 

[Markfs]

Pretty sure the salary cap for the players is a totally different budget and set of rules to the cap for the coaching budget....and no trade-offs permitted between the two. I might be mistaken or too simplistic.

well thats what I thought. I was wasn't talking about the salaries for the irish guys. I was talking about the extra coaching that they might be getting ....and all the beer money. Having known some irish guys, they wont do anything until you get them pissed.

 

[Markfs]

I suspect the players association wouldn’t take kindly to clubs paying coaches out of the player salary cap.
Having said that, not sure where rookies, and particularly Cat B, salaries sit in the overall budget limits. So your original point may be valid.

Still think he is worth persevering with for a few more years. There is plenty to work with.

well it's hardly worth stopping the experiment now. He can almost speak english. I'm sure his game will improve when his team-mates can understand him