Tasmania Tasmania Devils, welcome to the AFL. Mens team to enter 2028. Womens team TBA. Other details TBA 3/5 (Part 2)

[Jazny]

I have always been so proud to be Tasmanian, but this is truly embarrassing. People a acting like they will even notice a financial difference in their own lives if the stadium is built or not. I thought we were in trouble ages ago in this thread when even the strongest advocates of a Tassie team were crying over the cost of a roof , but nothing prepared me for how so many people are actively ANTI stadium. Boomers are the worst generation. Tasmanian boomers take that to a whole new level.

No imagination, no joy, just bean counting nerds holding an entire state back. Going right out of their way to do it too. They don't rally for anything positive, never seen boomers rally for homeless people, they only pretend to care about homelessness if they think it will help them stop something.

 

[spike101]

I have always been so proud to be Tasmanian, but this is truly embarrassing. People a acting like they will even notice a financial difference in their own lives if the stadium is built or not. I thought we were in trouble ages ago in this thread when even the strongest advocates of a Tassie team were crying over the cost of a roof , but nothing prepared me for how so many people are actively ANTI stadium. Boomers are the worst generation. Tasmanian boomers take that to a whole new level.

No imagination, no joy, just bean counting nerds holding an entire state back. Going right out of their way to do it too. They don't rally for anything positive, never seen boomers rally for homeless people, they only pretend to care about homelessness if they think it will help them stop something.

I suspect they would argue far too much money is spent on sporting facilities and not enough on more important issues. For example, Sheffield Shield games rarely played at the MCG now so it’s basically empty for most of the summer. I don’t know how much the ground at St Kilda is used but could possibly be under utilised at quite a cost. The Commonwealth Games could be another example in Victoria.

 

[sherb]

I have always been so proud to be Tasmanian, but this is truly embarrassing. People a acting like they will even notice a financial difference in their own lives if the stadium is built or not. I thought we were in trouble ages ago in this thread when even the strongest advocates of a Tassie team were crying over the cost of a roof , but nothing prepared me for how so many people are actively ANTI stadium. Boomers are the worst generation. Tasmanian boomers take that to a whole new level.

No imagination, no joy, just bean counting nerds holding an entire state back. Going right out of their way to do it too. They don't rally for anything positive, never seen boomers rally for homeless people, they only pretend to care about homelessness if they think it will help them stop something.

I feel exactly the same way.

By the way, I'm a boomer. We are not all the same.

 

[The_Wookie]

 

[BobbyMorri]

It is an interesting turn. Could go many different ways. The ideal one for an AFL Team would be him returning as leader of the ALP based on this platform. Highly unlikely I feel

 

[Hodgey 15]

Paraphrasing what O'Byrne said at very end is that if they continue to play politics with stadium, we won't have a stadium, we won't have an AFL team and health & education in Tassie will still be "stuffed".
Spot on.

 

[Jazny]

It is an interesting turn. Could go many different ways. The ideal one for an AFL Team would be him returning as leader of the ALP based on this platform. Highly unlikely I feel

Surely he isn't the only person in the party that feels the same way.

 

[BobbyMorri]

Surely he isn't the only person in the party that feels the same way.

It is Tasmanian Labor,

There are probably 8 different factions all with different positions.

I have never been more disillusioned about this state, ever.

 

[Hodgey 15]

It is Tasmanian Labor,

There are probably 8 different factions all with different positions.

I have never been more disillusioned about this state, ever.

Oh yeah.
It's very bad here in terms of governance atm. Never have we needed strong leadership as we do now.
Gutwein wasn't perfect but he was a strong leader that took no s**t. Rockliff is the utter complete opposite.
Sad and frustrating times in ol' Tassie right now.

 

[Coconut_twirl]

I’m surprised Albo hasn’t put a firm stop to this nonsense from the Tasmanian labor party. Didn’t federal Labor previously flagged they wanted to develop the Macquarie Point precinct?

The health budget has nothing to do with the Sport and recreation budget. Whether Health should get more money is a completely different issue.

This is starting to get a bit ridiculous now. How devastating would this be if the stadium doesn’t go ahead.

 

[TheTassieHawk]

I’m surprised Albo hasn’t put a firm stop to this nonsense from the Tasmanian labor party. Didn’t federal Labor previously flagged they wanted to develop the Macquarie Point precinct?

The health budget has nothing to do with the Sport and recreation budget. Whether Health should get more money is a completely different issue.

This is starting to get a bit ridiculous now. How devastating would this be if the stadium doesn’t go ahead.

My understanding may be wrong but the federal funds committed to development of Mac Point more generally than a specific commitment to funding a stadium.

So if a stadium went pear-shaped but an alternative development proposal was to emerge shortly afterwards then the funding would still exist to contribute that instead, therefore still developing the precinct as per the Federal Government's wishes.

 

[Mr Taswegian]

I’m surprised Albo hasn’t put a firm stop to this nonsense from the Tasmanian labor party. Didn’t federal Labor previously flagged they wanted to develop the Macquarie Point precinct?

The health budget has nothing to do with the Sport and recreation budget. Whether Health should get more money is a completely different issue.

This is starting to get a bit ridiculous now. How devastating would this be if the stadium doesn’t go ahead.

The bigger devastation would be losing the team which will most likely never happen if we don't take it this time.

 

[MightyHawks]

https://www.themercury.com.au/news/tasmania/in-depth/journalist-and-former-mercury-columnist-simon-bevilacqua-opens-up-on-macquarie-point-stadium-tasmanias-afl-team-licence/news-story/787ec2fbb06f25989c661ad1f4c20dd4

Simon Bevilacqua has worked in Tasmania as a journalist for more than 30 years. Currently focused on a private writing project, he was recently approached by The Guardian to write about the Hobart stadium controversy, but the article he submitted was rejected for failing to fit the commissioning brief. This is a reworking of that piece.

Are we to assume that the Guardian rejected the article because it was in favour of the stadium?

 

[BobbyMorri]

Simon Bevilacqua has worked in Tasmania as a journalist for more than 30 years. Currently focused on a private writing project, he was recently approached by The Guardian to write about the Hobart stadium controversy, but the article he submitted was rejected for failing to fit the commissioning brief. This is a reworking of that piece.

Are we to assume that the Guardian rejected the article because it was in favour of the stadium?

it is the Guardian......

That is all you had to say

 

[BobbyMorri]

Tasmania is getting an AFL team and a new stadium. Or maybe not

Tasmania's dream of an AFL team is coming true, but will tying it to the funding of a waterfront stadium kill it? If one dies, the other cannot survive, and nobody wants the blood of a Tasmanian AFL team on their hands, writes Chris Rowbottom.

www.abc.net.au

Good article.
Loved this bit. I think this is happening now. The ALP needs to sort out its position soon. They gotta go anti-process of how this all went down, but not anti-stadium.

There could be just as many people who might refuse to vote ALP if they kill this bid, as Anti Stadium voters. The difference is, the anti-Stadium people will be mostly green voters and not the ALP/Lib voters you should be courting.

Their team was officially under siege, and a social media counter-offensive was launched.

A pro-team and stadium Facebook group has swelled to more than 10,000 members, overtaking a rival "anti" group, with even the most cursory glance of members' posts revealing a swathe of rusted-on Labor people questioning their voting intentions.

"This development needs to come to fruition," says 61-year-old Mark Paton, who hails from Wayatinah in the Central Highlands.

"If Labor and their green bedmates block it, I will as a staunch Labor and union person all my life, be voting Liberal at the next election," he posted on the ABC Facebook page.

 

[MelbourneGWS]

Tasmania is getting an AFL team and a new stadium. Or maybe not

Tasmania's dream of an AFL team is coming true, but will tying it to the funding of a waterfront stadium kill it? If one dies, the other cannot survive, and nobody wants the blood of a Tasmanian AFL team on their hands, writes Chris Rowbottom.

www.abc.net.au

Good article.
Loved this bit. I think this is happening now. The ALP needs to sort out its position soon. They gotta go anti-process of how this all went down, but not anti-stadium.

There could be just as many people who might refuse to vote ALP if they kill this bid, as Anti Stadium voters. The difference is, the anti-Stadium people will be mostly green voters and not the ALP/Lib voters you should be courting.

Will be interesting to see how Tasmanian ALP manages to support the Tasmanian AFL team and yet oppose the stadium that is a precondition for the AFL team!

 

[MightyHawks]

Tasmania is getting an AFL team and a new stadium. Or maybe not

Tasmania's dream of an AFL team is coming true, but will tying it to the funding of a waterfront stadium kill it? If one dies, the other cannot survive, and nobody wants the blood of a Tasmanian AFL team on their hands, writes Chris Rowbottom.

www.abc.net.au

Good article.
Loved this bit. I think this is happening now. The ALP needs to sort out its position soon. They gotta go anti-process of how this all went down, but not anti-stadium.

There could be just as many people who might refuse to vote ALP if they kill this bid, as Anti Stadium voters. The difference is, the anti-Stadium people will be mostly green voters and not the ALP/Lib voters you should be courting.

Agree.

It would be a very dangerous proposition for the ALP to be pushing to kill the stadium at the next election and risk killing Tassie getting a team.

When it comes to it the average voter wants to Tassie to get a team, and if this somehow fails there's absolutely no chance of getting one in future.

 

[Foreverdon]

Sign the E-Petition support the yes stadium yes team
just sign then check your email and confirm easy as that
e-petitions

 

[spike101]

T

Agree.

It would be a very dangerous proposition for the ALP to be pushing to kill the stadium at the next election and risk killing Tassie getting a team.

When it comes to it the average voter wants to Tassie to get a team, and if this somehow fails there's absolutely no chance of getting one in future.

his is the the same argument for the voice, if it doesn’t get through this time it never will. Everything could be tweaked eg the AFL could fund the stadium rather than asking for government assistance. The voice can be tweaked too. Saying never is foolish.

 

[MightyHawks]

T

his is the the same argument for the voice, if it doesn’t get through this time it never will. Everything could be tweaked eg the AFL could fund the stadium rather than asking for government assistance. The voice can be tweaked too. Saying never is foolish.

If the Voice fails, then just like the Republic it'll be off the table for a long period of time.

But doesn't mean a future gov won't give it another go.

With the Tassie team, I just don't see that the AFL would attempt it again. They don't see a Tassie team as being essential.

 

[The_Reaper]

T

his is the the same argument for the voice, if it doesn’t get through this time it never will. Everything could be tweaked eg the AFL could fund the stadium rather than asking for government assistance. The voice can be tweaked too. Saying never is foolish.

Why would the AFL fund the stadium?

 

[The Educator]

T

his is the the same argument for the voice, if it doesn’t get through this time it never will. Everything could be tweaked eg the AFL could fund the stadium rather than asking for government assistance. The voice can be tweaked too. Saying never is foolish.

Everything can't just be "tweaked"

For instance, your brain

Your example is a case in point. The AFL isn't just going to fund a stadium (i.e. public infrastructure) that it previously had been made a condition of getting a license.

The stadium being provided unlocks the deal. Ultimately a "Deal" can be "tweaked" to the extent that it still remains beneficial to both parties. That fact that a deal (essentially including the AFL and two levels of government from two different parties) has already been reached suggests it's landed pretty close to a place where the costs and benefits of the deal are optimally allocated between parties. The AFL isn't going to agree to reneg from Tasmania because the State opposition want's a radically different outcome.

The second reason why use of the word "tweaked" is so dumb is the amount of energy and "political capital" that goes into these things. This process started 5 years ago and has consumed an enormous amount of energy. All other strategic planning from the AFL has had the uncertainty of the Tasmanian AFL team adding complexity. If the Tasmanian deal collapses now because of parochial and opportunistic Tasmanian politics there is no chance the AFL will open this up again.

Likewise, a referendum is years in the making. It requires a political party taking it to an election and enormous political capital and bandwidth to get a referendum up.

 

[The_Wookie]

Everything can't just be "tweaked"

For instance, your brain

Your example is a case in point. The AFL isn't just going to fund a stadium (i.e. public infrastructure) that it previously had been made a condition of getting a license.

The stadium being provided unlocks the deal. Ultimately a "Deal" can be "tweaked" to the extent that it still remains beneficial to both parties. That fact that a deal (essentially including the AFL and two levels of government from two different parties) has already been reached suggests it's landed pretty close to a place where the costs and benefits of the deal are optimally allocated between parties. The AFL isn't going to agree to reneg from Tasmania because the State opposition want's a radically different outcome.

The second reason why use of the word "tweaked" is so dumb is the amount of energy and "political capital" that goes into these things. This process started 5 years ago and has consumed an enormous amount of energy. All other strategic planning from the AFL has had the uncertainty of the Tasmanian AFL team adding complexity. If the Tasmanian deal collapses now because of parochial and opportunistic Tasmanian politics there is no chance the AFL will open this up again.

Likewise, a referendum is years in the making. It requires a political party taking it to an election and enormous political capital and bandwidth to get a referendum up.

yep

AFL has been real clear on this. Its a stadium or bust. The only tweaking now is the stadium design.

 

[Financialpanther]

yep

AFL has been real clear on this. Its a stadium or bust. The only tweaking now is the stadium design.

The only real tweaking that could be done is either redeveloping Bellerive Oval (which won't happen without compulsory acquisition of many homes as well as the multitude of issues with light and noise in a suburban area) or making UTAS Stadium the central hub (with big renovations as well) but good luck securing any happiness in the South if that happens.

That is it - the AFL will rightfully demand a stadium that is keeping with their product - where it is, and what it looks like is up to Tasmania. Effectively none of the solutions on offer will come without a significant cost to the tax payer which completely flies in the argument put forward by those saying no. No matter what, they will still demand funding for health and housing regardless.

 

[Underarm]

Tasmania doing a real good job of explaining why its taken 35 years for them to get a afl licence.