List Mgmt. 2015 Draft, Trades and Retirements Thread Pt 1

[Superstar swan]

Oh well Jetta didn't play well, nor looked like he even cared. Hopefully we still get a 1st round pick for him.
Wonder if some of the younger players would be thrown up as trade bait, because I think we can do a lot better than BJack, Lloyd and Rohan.

Rohan and lloyd no. Both not in great form but we have seen what they are capable of. Dont think another side would take b jack

 

[The Swans Blog]

Rohan and lloyd no. Both not in great form but we have seen what they are capable of. Dont think another side would take b jack

We've seen what Rohan can do against middle of the road opposition, or those at the tail end of the ladder. He almost always goes missing against good opponents. He's a far cry from Jude Bolton and Jetta is a far cry from his 2012 form.

 

[Superstar swan]

We've seen what Rohan can do against middle of the road opposition, or those at the tail end of the ladder. He almost always goes missing against good opponents. He's a far cry from Jude Bolton and Jetta is a far cry from his 2012 form.

Yes he needs to develop consistancy, but he has missed alot of senior football. His best is very,very good. At the game you notice how hard he chases and pressures kickers , doesnt get recognised enough for that

 

[Jack2Jack]

So it looks likely our draft will be Mills, someone else with the next available pick & Rookie upgrade (Naismith with the new 3 yr deal)? Maybe one other depending on who leaves and obviously then probably 2-3 rookies as well.
Plus we'll be trying to get some trades/free agents in (if we can get this trade penalty lessened) possibly up to 1-3 players. With the Leuenberger rumours, it seems almost certain we're going to try and get a ruck in at the very least. Possibly a KD or a small forward/quick winger but there's been no talk/rumour of that type just yet.
So up to 4-6 ins on the senior list.....so who goes? Jetta, Shaw & maybe Goodes all seem very likely to be gone. Marsh delisted maybe? AJ to rookie list?

I wonder about the fate of someone like Nankervis if we do get a Leuenberger/Z. Smith? Pyke will play on next year likely, with Tippett almost certain to be playing as the 2nd/ruck forward, especially with the lower rotations, it means Mike will probably be fighting it out with that new ruck for the no 1 position with the other waiting in the wings for a form slump or injury. Naismith's new deal means he is seen as the long term option and should be battling it out with Pyke & New guy for that no. 1 position. Derickx, unfortunately, is contracted for another year.
Not even including Tippo, that's 5 ruckman on the main list (I know Toby is more of a ruck/forward) but that seems like an excessive amount (you probably want 3-4 on the main list with 1-2 on the rookie max). List spots may be tight, given a lot of guys are contracted. So where does that leave Nankervis? Trade bait? (not that we'd get anymore than a 3rd rounder...but even that may help with Mills) or if we do see him as a long term, then we might need to just delist Derickx and cop the remaining year in the cap - I'm starting to think we should do that anyway if we can afford too, he'll be 4-5th in line for the ruck position anyway and we know he'll give us sfa ... and if he's actually playing in seniors.... we're in trouble..... the available list spot may be given to someone who can actually help us or someone who can develop (or fail to develop) into someone who might help us long term.

 

[The Swans Blog]

So where does that leave Nankervis? Trade bait? (not that we'd get anymore than a 3rd rounder...but even that may help with Mills) or if we do see him as a long term, then we might need to just delist Derickx and cop the remaining year in the cap - I'm starting to think we should do that anyway if we can afford too, he'll be 4-5th in line for the ruck position anyway and we know he'll give us sfa ... and if he's actually playing in seniors.... we're in trouble..... the available list spot may be given to someone who can actually help us or someone who can develop (or fail to develop) into someone who might help us long term.

If we bring in another ruck, Dericzxzzxzx won't play for us again and it really puts in nail in Nankervis as well, since he didn't really show much as a forward or 2nd ruck option, especially when Tippet was struggling.

Dezza and Pike will be gone by the end of next season and Tippets' contract is up for negotiation next season. If the worst thing happens, it's that we bring in someone and lose 3 and another to long term injury. I think that Nankervis will be kept around for at least another season to see if he can break through.

So up to 4-6 ins on the senior list.....so who goes? Jetta, Shaw & maybe Goodes all seem very likely to be gone. Marsh delisted maybe? AJ to rookie list?

Well, Goodes should retire, but his best is still clearly good enough at AFL level and he's a beast come finals. Shaw already announced his retirement.
I don't really know about any of the rookies or reserve players, so can't really comment, but since Marsh is highly rated, I'd imagine that he would be de-listed and picked up again through the rookie draft. AJ shifted to the rookie list for sure, he's not going to play at all in 2016.

As for outs, Jetta is surely gone. He's not negotiating and he's not signed, and his performances are becoming less convincing as the season goes on. As for other players, Rohan and Cunningham will have value if they were traded, although I'd rather keep Cunningham than Rohan, since he's showed more over about the same amount of games. Sure, Rohan had that really bad injury in 2012, but his form peaks and troughs so frequently, you really have no idea what you're going to get from him.

I really struggle to see a good future for players like Robinson, Lloyd, Nankervis and Naismith. Lloyd is already in the team but unless he really develops himself physically in the off season, he's not going to progress.

Outside of Jetta, Rohan and Cunningham, we really struggle to have players that other clubs value highly enough that could possibly be available for trade. I highly doubt that the 2015 trade period is going to be the same as the 2007 one.

 

[The Swans Blog]

2018 is going to be crunch time for us, especially if we can't bring in the Ruck and KPD we desperately need.
If Goodes sticks around, it'll be Goodes, Pyke and Richards retiring, Grundy nearly on his last legs and McGlynn will be close to it as well, if not retiring.
Grundy, Kennedy and Laidler will be the oldest players on our list, so 2015 really is our last hurrah. At least our young players for the most part are very good or elite, excepting a few.

 

[Lakeside Swan]

We've seen what Rohan can do against middle of the road opposition, or those at the tail end of the ladder. He almost always goes missing against good opponents. He's a far cry from Jude Bolton and Jetta is a far cry from his 2012 form.

I think we need to give Rohan more time. It takes a long time to recover from an injury like his.

 

[The Swans Blog]

I think we need to give Rohan more time. It takes a long time to recover from an injury like his.

He's had best part of 3 years. I don't think that the injury hampers him, I think that he's just not good enough. Even when he first broke on to the scene, he was only able to have an impact on games in certain situations. I would never expect him to tear it to pieces against a good team, like Hawthorn or Fremantle, or really do much, but I'd expect a lot more than what he dished up yesterday. Maybe I'm being unfair because he went in under done, but if he's playing, he's fit enough to play 120 minutes, and that performance was just shit.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

He's had best part of 3 years. I don't think that the injury hampers him, I think that he's just not good enough. Even when he first broke on to the scene, he was only able to have an impact on games in certain situations. I would never expect him to tear it to pieces against a good team, like Hawthorn or Fremantle, or really do much, but I'd expect a lot more than what he dished up yesterday. Maybe I'm being unfair because he went in under done, but if he's playing, he's fit enough to play 120 minutes, and that performance was just shit.

Not sure what your expecting of Rohan mate he will never be a big accumulator he will always be a impact player ~15 disposals 1-2 goals a game along with his forward pressure is about what you can expect from him.

 

[McRobie]

He

Not sure what your expecting of Rohan mate he will never be a big accumulator he will always be a impact player ~15 disposals 1-2 goals a game along with his forward pressure is about what you can expect from him.

He is injured with a bung knee, his game needs pace and with this current injury thats a problem. I put big money that Rohan given fit for the duration will have a really big 2016.

 

[The Swans Blog]

Not sure what your expecting of Rohan mate he will never be a big accumulator he will always be a impact player ~15 disposals 1-2 goals a game along with his forward pressure is about what you can expect from him.

I would certainly expect more than yesterdays game, which was arguably worse than his 2014 grand final. I'd expect him to turn up in finals games and have the intelligence to work to the ball, instead of waiting 90 minutes for it. I'd expect him to play more like Jetta did in 2011/12 than he does now. Maybe its because of the coaches and their directions, but seriously, 1 possession until midway through the 3rd is unacceptable at any level.

 

[Dan87]

List is still a beauty.

A FB and ruck solution will give the list managers something to donduring the draft period. But even if Jetta leaves, we've finally got near 50 games into Cunningham/Lloyd, more experience into B Jack. Towers looks capable of holding down a spot next year. Jones will be into his third pre season. Henney will improve and we need to find a spot for Mills to develop.
We're going to get better IMO

 

[melbournehammer]

He

He is injured with a bung knee, his game needs pace and with this current injury thats a problem. I put big money that Rohan given fit for the duration will have a really big 2016.

I agree with this

Except I worry that he will always be susceptible to the soft tissue tears as he stretches to tackle. The reality is that he works his arse off in defence in the forward half that he is just knackered when the ball comes back in.

I love rohan and think he is an amazing player but people too often want him to be the 30 possessions guy. He just won't be that guy

 

[The Swans Blog]

I agree with this

Except I worry that he will always be susceptible to the soft tissue tears as he stretches to tackle. The reality is that he works his arse off in defence in the forward half that he is just knackered when the ball comes back in.

I love rohan and think he is an amazing player but people too often want him to be the 30 possessions guy. He just won't be that guy

People don't want him to be the 30 possession type of player that's just a cop out. People want him to be involved, to lead and just do something, rather than being absolutely invisible for more than a half of football with zero impact in any contest.

 

[Superstar swan]

Id like shaw to reconsider retirement. He has plenty to offer at this level. What about if he does a shneider where he delists himself and we put him on the rookie list as coverage. With our injuries, he will be in the round 1 team

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Id like shaw to reconsider retirement. He has plenty to offer at this level. What about if he does a shneider where he delists himself and we put him on the rookie list as coverage. With our injuries, he will be in the round 1 team

Barring Franklin none of our injuries are longterm, if we are chasing guys that on they last legs i rather Stokes or Steve Johnson.

 

[Tuco]

Id like shaw to reconsider retirement. He has plenty to offer at this level. What about if he does a shneider where he delists himself and we put him on the rookie list as coverage. With our injuries, he will be in the round 1 team

I think we are about to see something truly special from Shaw, Teddy and Goodsey. We just need to give them a chance. Watching these three, it's like watching Rookies determined to secure their spot. Tremendous hunger.

If we can kick straight and continue to pump oil from these three wells before they run dry anything might happen this month.

 

[Superstar swan]

Barring Franklin none of our injuries are longterm, if we are chasing guys that on they last legs i rather Stokes or Steve Johnson.

Im for both of them, throw in lindsay thomas aswell. Just mentioed shaw as he will be dirt cheap on rookie list and he knows our game

 

[Wayne Swan]

Bet Josh Dunkley is looking forward to being drafted by Richmond, captained by three kick Cotchin Do the smart thing Josh, stick your hand up for F/S, we have leaders who stand up here at Sydney

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Im for both of them, throw in lindsay thomas aswell. Just mentioed shaw as he will be dirt cheap on rookie list and he knows our game

Thomas was rumoured to be coming to us a while ago dunno if anything eventuated maybe waiting for the trade ban?

 

[Superstar swan]

Thomas was rumoured to be coming to us a while ago dunno if anything eventuated maybe waiting for the trade ban?

There was talk of it on the north board. Would fill a need for us

 

[melbournehammer]

People don't want him to be the 30 possession type of player that's just a cop out. People want him to be involved, to lead and just do something, rather than being absolutely invisible for more than a half of football with zero impact in any contest.

The problem is that I wasn't at the game. I don't know what his role was. His role may have been to oscillate between deepest forward and hff. It's one of the things that I get frustrated with and prevents me from judging players appropriately. The swans clearly do their b and f in a more holistic way - which I think makes sense.mhaving spent more time watching football in recent years there is no doubt that the best way of judging a player is not on possessions but on their kpis. A full forward who kicks five goals in a completely dominant performance by their midfield may have not even had a pass mark.

With Gary I have no doubt that his principal kpi is to give Tippett space but to lock the ball in and get the ball in transition 6 times a half or so and to win or halve contests where he is one out. Did he do that ? I can't really remember him being in the play, not just that he didn't touch it but that he wasn't really there much. Was that what was expected ? I doubt it. So i suspect the performance was not what the club wanted. But on the other hand it just didn't seem to go where he was - maybe that was the plan ?

I was more critical of b jack yesterday because I didn't see him at all, whereas I saw from the opening minute that rohans leg was bandaged in a big way. If he was a racehorse his odds would have lengthened massively in the mounting yard.

But I don't know whether b jack met his kpis either. Maybe he was told to spread the freo defence and to drag his man away from every contest. He may have performed his job perfectly.

In short we speculate from the position that involvement in the play, as often measured by possessions, is a kpi. Sometimes the most critical thing is to stop another team from rebounding out of defence. We did seem to do that pretty well on Saturday.

 

[melbournehammer]

Id like shaw to reconsider retirement. He has plenty to offer at this level. What about if he does a shneider where he delists himself and we put him on the rookie list as coverage. With our injuries, he will be in the round 1 team

It is difficult to know who will replace him in any case. We just don't seem to have any defenders prepared to take the game on like he does. He really is the most offensively minded player and I love him for it. He really has been just the most amazing recruit. Whoever did the discussions with him, his management and Collingwood should be given immense credit.

 

[Superstar swan]

It is difficult to know who will replace him in any case. We just don't seem to have any defenders prepared to take the game on like he does. He really is the most offensively minded player and I love him for it. He really has been just the most amazing recruit. Whoever did the discussions with him, his management and Collingwood should be given immense credit.

Agree. Is quite an unsung hero. Only now do we appreciate how good he has bèen now that he finishing up

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Remember a few months ago we couldnt wait to get rid of Shaw and Goodes shouldnt be in the side