Another Academy Thread!

[Ichabod Noodle]

CLUB 1

Hopper is from St Pats and it goes on and on.”

No, he's from Leeton. He joined the academy as a thirteen year old and continued doing academy stuff right through his 2 years at St Pats. His father is also on record as saying that the decision to send him to St Pats had nothing to do with Football and everything to do with the educational, and more importantly the spiritual/religious values of the school.
= Fail

Oh and Setterfield (and the school coaches) are in regular contact with the head academy coach Jason Saddington and he still does some academy stuff when he's not at school.

CLUB 2

“They (GWS) can get up to nine players (out of NSW) this year, which may be the equivalent to WA and SA’s draft talent combined.

Do they not teach maths in school any more? Seriously? 9 players. We don't have the list space or the points to take 9 players in a draft. And you know what that means? It means your club, or any other club for that matter, can get the kids for themselves.
=Fail

CLUB 3

“It’s a joke, it it’s embarrassing and very frustrating. They’ve got about 10 kids they (GWS) will get and there might be only six kids coming out of South Australia this year.

So 9 has become 10 and you argument looks even more stupid than it did with "club 2"
=Fail

CLUB 4

“They have heaps this year — and they’re guns. A few of them are A-graders, too — first-rounders.

“Macreadie, Setterfield ... they’re in a very, very good position. The depth of talent, geez.”

There are a couple of good ones, but they're hardly all top 10, in fact they're hardly all even first rounders. Hopper went 7 last year, none of them are as good as him, and certainly not all of them. You overestimate because it suits you to do so. Saw one draft watch list the other week that had only 2 of our kids in the top 30.
=Fail

CLUB 5

“The Giants have just rubbed it in everyone’s faces by doing so little work, putting in so little effort and then taking all the rewards.

650 kids across a dozen different centres with three full time and 50 part time coaches, fitness and support staff. Fortnightly training and skills sessions, injury rehab and recovery programs, etc. etc. Nowhere even close to "so little effort" that your post is becoming more pathetic by the "club"
=Fail

CLUB 6

“(Todd) Marshall was overseas playing cricket, comes home, starts playing footy, looks like an absolute star and they can just get him for nothing. It’s ridiculous.

Marshall hasn't spent enough time in the Academy to qualify. We don't have access to him through the system. He's in the open draft. We don't get him for nothing - we don't even get him for market rates. It's not just about geography, it's about development. Learn the facts before opening your mouth.
=Fail

CLUB 7

“They’re not putting enough into those kids because they know they’re natural football kids.

“All they have to do now is show development plans for them and in the past they didn’t even have to talk to them until their draft year.”

Just a pale rehash of "Club 5". And an ill informed one at that - most of these kids have been in the academy since they were 13 - hardly waiting to draft year to talk to them. And they don't just have to show development plans they have to implement them. And as for the past, there is ample evidence of development plans and constant contact even before it was all formalised into the rules. The rules have been updated to reflect the reality of what has happened for the past five years.
=Fail



So basically your post is rubbish - 0 from 7 - swing and a miss.

 

[Garlic muncher]

I think people do not realise just how big the Riverina actually is

How can a part of NSW that is almost in the middle of the state be considered too close to the Victorian border.

The problem is that if you leave the Southern part of the Riverina out of GWS's zone, it would probably return to producing the odd player here and there like over the last 15 years rather than what we have seen over the past 2 or 3.

ATM you would probably have to say that the game has never had a bigger profile around Wagga, GWS and the academies have probably had the most to do with this.

 

[Ichabod Noodle]

The problem is that if you leave the Southern part of the Riverina out of GWS's zone, it would probably return to producing the odd player here and there like over the last 15 years rather than what we have seen over the past 2 or 3.

ATM you would probably have to say that the game has never had a bigger profile around Wagga, GWS and the academies have probably had the most to do with this.

This.

Well said.

 

[Olian]

In fairness I don't think people have any problem at all with academies. Just the priority access the northern clubs have to the players that come out of them. Or more specifically the discount they get as well.

Northern states have to use their own money for the academies hence there is a discount for drafting a player. Happy for the discount to be removed if the AFL picks up the tab for the academies.

 

[Blackas87]

Northern states have to use their own money for the academies hence there is a discount for drafting a player. Happy for the discount to be removed if the AFL picks up the tab for the academies.

Is the money the clubs pay for these accadamies counted under the football department cap?

 

[Olian]

Is the money the clubs pay for these accadamies counted under the football department cap?

Don't know but can't imagine it would be. Why would the clubs bother if they had to include an extra $$$ in their cap that 14 other clubs don't have to?

 

[Blackas87]

Don't know but can't imagine it would be. Why would the clubs bother if they had to include an extra $$$ in their cap that 14 other clubs don't have to?

The other clubs don't have access to players they have developed in the draft.

They have to spend money developing their drafted players under the football department salary cap

 

[LoungeLizard]

No, he's from Leeton. He joined the academy as a thirteen year old and continued doing academy stuff right through his 2 years at St Pats. His father is also on record as saying that the decision to send him to St Pats had nothing to do with Football and everything to do with the educational, and more importantly the spiritual/religious values of the school.
= Fail

Oh and Setterfield (and the school coaches) are in regular contact with the head academy coach Jason Saddington and he still does some academy stuff when he's not at school.




Do they not teach maths in school any more? Seriously? 9 players. We don't have the list space or the points to take 9 players in a draft. And you know what that means? It means your club, or any other club for that matter, can get the kids for themselves.
=Fail




So 9 has become 10 and you argument looks even more stupid than it did with "club 2"
=Fail




There are a couple of good ones, but they're hardly all top 10, in fact they're hardly all even first rounders. Hopper went 7 last year, none of them are as good as him, and certainly not all of them. You overestimate because it suits you to do so. Saw one draft watch list the other week that had only 2 of our kids in the top 30.
=Fail




650 kids across a dozen different centres with three full time and 50 part time coaches, fitness and support staff. Fortnightly training and skills sessions, injury rehab and recovery programs, etc. etc. Nowhere even close to "so little effort" that your post is becoming more pathetic by the "club"
=Fail




Marshall hasn't spent enough time in the Academy to qualify. We don't have access to him through the system. He's in the open draft. We don't get him for nothing - we don't even get him for market rates. It's not just about geography, it's about development. Learn the facts before opening your mouth.
=Fail




Just a pale rehash of "Club 5". And an ill informed one at that - most of these kids have been in the academy since they were 13 - hardly waiting to draft year to talk to them. And they don't just have to show development plans they have to implement them. And as for the past, there is ample evidence of development plans and constant contact even before it was all formalised into the rules. The rules have been updated to reflect the reality of what has happened for the past five years.
=Fail



So basically your post is rubbish - 0 from 7 - swing and a miss.

They are all quotes from recruiters, not from me.
so if you want to quote me, have a look what i was quoting.
You are the fail.

 

[Ichabod Noodle]

They are all quotes from recruiters, not from me.
so if you want to quote me, have a look what i was quoting.
You are the fail.

Doesn't matter who said it. You or someone else. And you quoting without commenting yourself appears to be endorsement of what is said. But the point remains they're either wrong or have no idea what they're talking about.

And 0 from 7 is still rubbish and still a Fail.

And there's no need to get personal.

 

[LoungeLizard]

Doesn't matter who said it. You or someone else. And you quoting without commenting yourself appears to be endorsement of what is said. But the point remains they're either wrong or have no idea what they're talking about.

And 0 from 7 is still rubbish and still a Fail.

And there's no need to get personal.

Lmfao, you said i failed, now you don't like it when i say you failed, get a grip mate.
My post was nothing more than to show that 7 recruiters agreed with Eddie.
Try get some comprehension skills.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

I have always laughed at how Eddie was only so vocal about this the minute they got Darcy Moore on the cheap!

 

[moses]

Disappointed the thread isn't about this academy.

 

[Ichabod Noodle]

Lmfao, you said i failed, now you don't like it when i say you failed, get a grip mate.
My post was nothing more than to show that 7 recruiters agreed with Eddie.
Try get some comprehension skills.

As I said, doesn't matter if seven recruiters agree with Eddie or not. If they're wrong or ill informed then they're wrong or ill informed. Each quote was a fail. Did I call you a fail? No. I called the rubbish in the quotes a fail. Try to get some comprehension skills.

 

[LoungeLizard]

As I said, doesn't matter if seven recruiters agree with Eddie or not. If they're wrong or ill informed then they're wrong or ill informed. Each quote was a fail. Did I call you a fail? No. I called the rubbish in the quotes a fail. Try to get some comprehension skills.

Lmao, you still don't get it.
I couldn't give a rats about the academies or what people think about them.
At least 7 recruiters agree with Eddie, right or wrong matters f**k all.
So post away all you like, but you are on a different track to what i am talking about.

 

[Mat Mann]

Marshall hasn't spent enough time in the Academy to qualify. We don't have access to him through the system. He's in the open draft. We don't get him for nothing - we don't even get him for market rates. It's not just about geography, it's about development. Learn the facts before opening your mouth.
=Fail
So basically your post is rubbish - 0 from 7 - swing and a miss.

Not really a fail, publicly noted how little GWS had to do with Marshall,but yet you tried to get him anyway.
from back in May
"A frustrated GWS believed it had obeyed AFL rules and should have retained priority access to Marshall."
"The 198cm Deniliquin key forward kicked four goals for NSW on Sunday, but only recently registered with GWS after spending the past two winters bowling off-spin in England."
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...e/news-story/345b9787a2d0a1f2764d831020212f7d

The problem is that if you leave the Southern part of the Riverina out of GWS's zone, it would probably return to producing the odd player here and there like over the last 15 years rather than what we have seen over the past 2 or 3.

ATM you would probably have to say that the game has never had a bigger profile around Wagga, GWS and the academies have probably had the most to do with this.

thats irrelevant, it was neglected because Vic clubs had no way of doing "academies". If you put the same opportunities in front of kids throughout the mallee region you would find just as many. I was playing against teams from Wakool and Hay 20+ years ago, The Deniliquin Football club was founded in 1933, The Riverina football league started in 1982.............. how are these even considered academy territory? the definition of academy used to be non AFL playing regions, Wentworth, Balranald (strong AFL region) have been AFL regions for my lifetime (40+ yrs now), just because they haven't produced many players is irrelevant, there has simply been no pathway to these regions to provide the resources needed. They're not NEW AFL regions, and therefore should not be part of an academy system, should the AFL do more in these regions, certainly, but it shouldn't be through a club affiliated academy.

Northern states have to use their own money for the academies hence there is a discount for drafting a player. Happy for the discount to be removed if the AFL picks up the tab for the academies.

the money is irrelevant to the argument, give the access and any club will find the money. surely the access to the kid is enough, the discount is just rubbing it in.

Im not opposed to academies, they are a good idea, but surely it has to be uniform across the system ( as the Vic, SA, WA clubs have limitations of who can enter our systems). the Free kick that the GWS zone provides is just over the top and grossly unfair.

from the AFL website

from the SA/WA announcement.......
Under the rules, for a club to be eligible to access a prospect at draft age, the player must have fully participated in the club's academy program for a minimum of three years before being drafted.

Players of Asian or African heritage (who were born in an Asian or African country or have at least one parent born in an Asian or African country) will be automatically able to join a club under bidding rules.

"It is important to note that hubs have been established on the basis of multicultural populations in each state," the AFL's football operations manager Mark Evans said.

"While boys and girls from all backgrounds will participate in the academies, clubs will only receive draft concessions for players who are under-represented in the AFL."

from the VIC announcement.......
"If clubs can help attract and develop some talent that would be under-represented and not normally find its way into the AFL pathway then they will have the ability to receive some incentive for that similar to the bidding system used for the northern academies."

If a club develops a young Australian from an Asian or African background and wants to draft them, then they will receive a discount on a basis similar to the current bidding system. Clubs will be able to apply for draft discounts on other youngsters from non-English speaking backgrounds if they develop the player in a similar manner.

For indigenous players from under-represented areas such as the Pilbara, incentives will also exist for clubs to develop and nurture talent in those areas.

 

[Ichabod Noodle]

Lmao, you still don't get it.
I couldn't give a rats about the academies or what people think about them.
At least 7 recruiters agree with Eddie, right or wrong matters f**k all.
So post away all you like, but you are on a different track to what i am talking about.

Then why bother posting rubbish quotes? You posted the quotes, I picked them to pieces, and now you're disavowing them - oh it's not me, it's all these other people. I'm talking about something completely different. I'm on a different track. Track seems pretty clear mate, you're in an academy thread posting rubbish about the academies. How exactly are you talking about something different?

Little tip, don't complain, backpedal and run away when the facts wipe the rubbish you post out.

 

[LoungeLizard]

Then why bother posting rubbish quotes? You posted the quotes, I picked them to pieces, and now you're disavowing them - oh it's not me, it's all these other people. I'm talking about something completely different. I'm on a different track. Track seems pretty clear mate, you're in an academy thread posting rubbish about the academies. How exactly are you talking about something different?

Little tip, don't complain, backpedal and run away when the facts wipe the rubbish you post out.

Mate, i will type a bit slower for you.
My post was nothing more than to show that at least 7 recruiters agree with Eddie.
Now right or wrong, does in no way change the fact that they agree with Eddie.
Go on all you like about academies, i couldn't give a rats about them.

 

[Blackas87]

I have always laughed at how Eddie was only so vocal about this the minute they got Darcy Moore on the cheap!

Isn't that because the father son rule is in for every club?

Hasnt Eddie just been arguing for the same rules for every club? If some clubs can have accadamies then why can't all clubs? Or if some some clubs can't have them then all club shouldn't.

Now who's asking for different rules to the rest of the competition?

 

[Suma Magic]

I have always laughed at how Eddie was only so vocal about this the minute they got Darcy Moore on the cheap!

He would have cost less under the current system.

 

[hawkman]

I think academies are a good idea. The entire issue with the concept is getting discounts and access to first round picks. I think discounts should be removed for first round picks or at least top 5 or top 10 picks anyway. If they fixed this up there would be much less complaints. I would be OK with them doing the same for father son if required too.

The point system is really not too bad and is pretty close to the mark in terms of fairness if not for the issues with discounts for the top rated prospects that other clubs don't even have access to. I can live with the access part but not the discounts on top.

Agree with this. Make them pay fair value for the top end talent. You could increase the discounts a bit for the lower end talent to make up for it.

 

[Mat Mann]

He would have cost less under the current system.

some F/S picks went for way way under on the old system because it was almost guaranteed that they would get to the club, therefore no-one bid because it was pointless. There is way more benefit in the current system for a club to drive up the F/S price because of the points system.

 

[Kwality]

Interesting to see a relative unknown won the Norm Smith for the Bullies in GF2016, & he'd be an academy boy under the rules as they now stand. Great example of how footy in the heartland states operates, pulling in kids & feeding them into the draft pool.
WHY would any AFL club have first dibs on Jason Johannisen, the Bullies took the risk after junior development had done what it does.

Jason Johannisen:

• After arriving in Perth aged eight with his parents Eldrick and Sonja, Johannisen played rugby union for the Bull Creek-based Southern Lions before wandering into Willetton three years later to fill in for a game in his cousin’s team. Soon after, he came under the tutelage of coach Murray Glaskin, who played a pivotal role in developing his raw AFL talent. The young speedster fell in love with Australia’s indigenous game
• Born in South Africa, raised in Perth, speculated on in Footscray, unable to get a game for two years
• A 10-minute kick-around with a WA football great on East Fremantle Oval late in 2009 was the event that set him on a path to the MCG.
• Overlooked by his zone club South Fremantle, largely because of his diminutive size, and only faintly on neighbouring East Fremantle’s recruiting radar, Johannisen needed precious little time to convince Steve Malaxos that he had pace and talent to burn. Malaxos, then East Fremantle’s colts coach, recalled seeing Johannisen’s name as a district junior best-and-fairest and wondered why he was not on his squad list. Encouraged by fellow coach Lance Lennon, a phone call was made that lured the South African-born teenager to Shark Park for the fateful football session that set his path in the game.
• “It was one mid-morning. I liked the look of him,” Malaxos, West Coast’s inaugural club champion and 1984 Sandover medallist, said. “Just the way he handled the ball, he was a good kick and the way he moved with his athletics background.
  “I don’t know how much of it is subconscious or subliminal, but there were a couple of things about him and we gelled.
• Speaking before the grand final, Johannisen said it was the faith Malaxos put in him to take the next step in East Fremantle’s 2010 colts premiership that gave his career impetus . He was then chosen by the Bulldogs with pick No.39 in the 2011 AFL rookie draft.

Don't even know if Freo or West Coast would have pre emptive rights, but no one should, the old system at work . Into the draft pool, courtesy of heartland footy, very different to the developing states, as it should be. Produce good kids at East Freo and these kids go Australia wide.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/s...ohannisens-incredible-football-journey/#page1