Review Cats defeat Doggies by 22 points.

[Goggin Our Best]

The red flash is back...

Rohan - i think he was top 6-7 pick in the draft for Sydney

He has got every attribute to be a top class footballer - lightning quick - a beautiful accurate and penetrating kick - and a ripper overhead mark - that mark he took against Coll in that big final is as good a contested mark you will see in the past 10 years

I dont know what happened at the Swans - and really his 1st couple of years at Geel - but the last couple of years he is playing the football that his skillset says he could have maybe played right throughout his career

The only difference i can see - last couple of years - is he does look alot more physical stronger - so he might have got into the weights - that is a pure guess

 

[Play it Sam]

Rohan - i think he was top 6-7 pick in the draft for Sydney

He has got every attribute to be a top class footballer - lightning quick - a beautiful accurate and penetrating kick - and a ripper overhead mark - that mark he took against Coll in that big final is as good a contested mark you will see in the past 10 years

I dont know what happened at the Swans - and really his 1st couple of years at Geel - but the last couple of years he is playing the football that his skillset says he could have maybe played right throughout his career

The only difference i can see - last couple of years - is he does look alot more physical stronger - so he might have got into the weights - that is a pure guess

From memory he played on the wing in Sydney, often on the bench, but was squeezed out when their COLA money allowed a few more fast stars.
Great value for us, definitely a muffin who became a cupcake.

 

[cats_09]

Rohan - i think he was top 6-7 pick in the draft for Sydney

He has got every attribute to be a top class footballer - lightning quick - a beautiful accurate and penetrating kick - and a ripper overhead mark - that mark he took against Coll in that big final is as good a contested mark you will see in the past 10 years

I dont know what happened at the Swans - and really his 1st couple of years at Geel - but the last couple of years he is playing the football that his skillset says he could have maybe played right throughout his career

The only difference i can see - last couple of years - is he does look alot more physical stronger - so he might have got into the weights - that is a pure guess

The other thing that's likely helped him the last couple of years is the new guy up forward, Jeremy Cameron

We need to remember that his first couple of years at Geelong, that the tall forwards he was playing alongside were Hawkins & Ratugolea - from an oppositions perspective, Hawkins was the focal point, and there's every chance that Rohan was seen as more of a threat than Ratugolea, so he could easily have been opposed to the oppositions 2nd best defender

Add Cameron to the mix in place of Ratugolea, and suddenly the opposition have 2 quality tall forwards to focus on, and just allows Rohan to play more of his natural game and there's a bit less pressure on him

I just love what Rohan has bought to the team over recent times

 

[Mr Meow]

Fair enough, but there's not much diiff when we're talking -1.5 marks, and Jack only just returned from injury.
It's what you do with them, and how many goals the opposition score from defensive body positioning between a couple of intercept marks. IMO Jack is the more rounded footballer, at home with our defenders, and therefore more trustworthy. 'Important to our system and the way we play"
Sav has been given every chance known to man, and finally looks to have found a niche. Unlike the media and this board, I'm not completely sold as yet on 3.3 and human bowling ball capabilities for all the chaos it causes. He's just not good or super alert when he comes to ground.
Harsh, I know, since all the big men fly........and usually recover.

PS Spoils arent useless, they after all are so common, if an intercept mark is not possible.

Not much difference? It's almost twice as many per game. Sav is 2nd at the club for contested marks behind Hawkins this season and you said he's not that good at marking. Top at the club for spoils, top for intercept marks, 2nd for intercept marks and 2nd of our defenders for coaches votes is a hell of a portfolio.

The rest all sounds really flakey: "my gut feel is Jack gives us more". I like both players and both could fit in the same side - I'm on the fence overall. I'm only responding to people saying Henry clearly offers more on various metrics that aren't based in fact.

There will be a lot of ill advised cause-effect scenarios if opposition efficiency is like the Bulldogs game and not the Richmond one, or if our mids and forwards lift as they did Saturday. It'll be "look how much better the defensive group looks!". The Bulldogs still had 30 shots on goal if you count the out on the fulls.

 

[Mr Meow]

Rohan - i think he was top 6-7 pick in the draft for Sydney

He has got every attribute to be a top class footballer - lightning quick - a beautiful accurate and penetrating kick - and a ripper overhead mark - that mark he took against Coll in that big final is as good a contested mark you will see in the past 10 years

I dont know what happened at the Swans - and really his 1st couple of years at Geel - but the last couple of years he is playing the football that his skillset says he could have maybe played right throughout his career

The only difference i can see - last couple of years - is he does look alot more physical stronger - so he might have got into the weights - that is a pure guess

He started really well at Geelong actually, he's always been a strong contributor for us. The one question mark around finals until that glorious Collingwood game - but a lot of our forwards struggled in finals for a while due to problems further up the field. And not having decent smalls/link players with pace. 2022 we got all the pieces together.

103 goals and 45 goal assists from 78 games for the Cats is a good record when goals are only a slice of what he offers. The tackles, chases, ground and aerial ball pressure liven our forward group up and keep us in the play.

 

[cats_09]

He started really well at Geelong actually, he's always been a strong contributor for us. The one question mark around finals until that glorious Collingwood game - but a lot of our forwards struggled in finals for a while due to problems further up the field. And not having decent smalls/link players with pace. 2022 we got all the pieces together.

103 goals and 45 goal assists from 78 games for the Cats is a good record when goals are only a slice of what he offers. The tackles, chases, ground and aerial ball pressure liven our forward group up and keep us in the play.

He was on track for a good first final for us also - against Collingwood in 2019, he had 3 disposals, 2 marks, 1 goal & 1 tackle before hurting his hamstring which ended his year

Could be interesting if he didn’t hurt his hamstring as he was looking set that night

 

[Play it Sam]

Not much difference? It's almost twice as many per game. Sav is 2nd at the club for contested marks behind Hawkins this season and you said he's not that good at marking. Top at the club for spoils, top for intercept marks, 2nd for intercept marks and 2nd of our defenders for coaches votes is a hell of a portfolio.

The rest all sounds really flakey: "my gut feel is Jack gives us more". I like both players and both could fit in the same side - I'm on the fence overall. I'm only responding to people saying Henry clearly offers more on various metrics that aren't based in fact.

There will be a lot of ill advised cause-effect scenarios if opposition efficiency is like the Bulldogs game and not the Richmond one, or if our mids and forwards lift as they did Saturday. It'll be "look how much better the defensive group looks!". The Bulldogs still had 30 shots on goal if you count the out on the fulls.

Not withstanding the time Jack has spent forward to cause a variance in comparing averages, so it's a moot point. Irrespective it's not many marks to argue over is it? On your figures ONE and a half intercept marks difference, out of 3.3 average. Yes great to get those marks, but what about the rest of his defence?
I might sound flakey with your words in my mouth. My gut has nothing to do with the fact that Jack is the more experienced and astute footballer, especially when the ball hits the ground. Yes, room for both maybe, they haven't stifled Port for nothing, so expect them to give Sav a fair go.
Agree in the euphoria of the win, Bulldogs forward movement and chances were worrying.

 

[Commando]

He was on track for a good first final for us also - against Collingwood in 2019, he had 3 disposals, 2 marks, 1 goal & 1 tackle before hurting his hamstring which ended his year

Could be interesting if he didn’t hurt his hamstring as he was looking set that night

Missed a soda in the first quarter when we couldn’t buy a goal iirc...

 

[Mr Meow]

He was on track for a good first final for us also - against Collingwood in 2019, he had 3 disposals, 2 marks, 1 goal & 1 tackle before hurting his hamstring which ended his year

Could be interesting if he didn’t hurt his hamstring as he was looking set that night

Good point and that was his most potent year. Losing him and then Hawkins for that prelim were fatal blows.

 

[Mr Meow]

Not withstanding the time Jack has spent forward to cause a variance in comparing averages, so it's a moot point. Irrespective it's not many marks to argue over is it? On your figures ONE and a half intercept marks difference, out of 3.3 average. Yes great to get those marks, but what about the rest of his defence?
I might sound flakey with your words in my mouth. My gut has nothing to do with the fact that Jack is the more experienced and astute footballer, especially when the ball hits the ground. Yes, room for both maybe, they haven't stifled Port for nothing, so expect them to give Sav a fair go.
Agree in the euphoria of the win, Bulldogs forward movement and chances were worrying.

No when I brought up averages I used Henry in 2021 and 2022 when his time up forward was very minimal.

The rest of his defence? Well he leads the club for spoils as well. Always against the most difficult forward and usually in a defence missing 2 or 3, with another couple below their best form. Incredibly harsh marker it seems.

For aerial contests he's faced 33 and lost 9 which respectable enough - a ratio matching SDK, slightly better than May and Allir, but below the true elites like Andrews, Sicily and Moore.

For the last time I'm not suggesting Henry should be dropped. Merely putting forward facts about Sav's output. For his first year as a defender at AFL level the upside is huge.

 

[Play it Sam]

No when I brought up averages I used Henry in 2021 and 2022 when his time up forward was very minimal.

The rest of his defence? Well he leads the club for spoils as well. Always against the most difficult forward and usually in a defence missing 2 or 3, with another couple below their best form. Incredibly harsh marker it seems.

For aerial contests he's faced 33 and lost 9 which respectable enough - a ratio matching SDK, slightly better than May and Allir, but below the true elites like Andrews, Sicily and Moore.

For the last time I'm not suggesting Henry should be dropped. Merely putting forward facts about Sav's output. For his first year as a defender at AFL level the upside is huge.

But you left out below average in disposals and kicks, playing in 6 losses. Pretty important on the backline, but maybe stats don't tell the whole story. Anyway the jury is almost universal in that he's found his niche in defence so I retire defeated. Just not at the expense of J Henry, was how this started.

 

[Mr Meow]

But you left out below average in disposals and kicks, playing in 6 losses. Pretty important on the backline, but maybe stats don't tell the whole story. Anyway the jury is almost universal in that he's found his niche in defence so I retire defeated. Just not at the expense of J Henry, was how this started.

Sure we can keep playing this.

He was on track for 13 disposals in the GWS game before injury, which would put his average at 10.72 disposals this season (unless you want to mark him down for that 52% GWS playing time due to injury).

Doing the same for SDK's early injury game puts him at 11.12 disposals per game this season. So he's getting 3.6% less disposals than SDK which I'm sure you'll agree is marginal indeed (given you thought 3.3 was proportionally close to 1.8).

J.Henry averaged 0.1 disposals higher than this last season so you are indeed a harsh marker.

The 6 losses you're indeed already applying the old lazy cause-effect analysis. If the implication is that J.Henry in the first 3 weeks for Sav would've flipped the result...well that's your opinion.

And now I realise at the end you conceded anyway.

My main point is merely Sav's performances stack up with talls who we've rated fine in the past. And we've almost always played 4 tall defenders. So its odd that the microscope is on Ratugolea when in reality it's the smalls that have struggled this season and we are still waiting to see what J.Henry brings in 2023.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Not much difference? It's almost twice as many per game. Sav is 2nd at the club for contested marks behind Hawkins this season and you said he's not that good at marking. Top at the club for spoils, top for intercept marks, 2nd for intercept marks and 2nd of our defenders for coaches votes is a hell of a portfolio.

The rest all sounds really flakey: "my gut feel is Jack gives us more". I like both players and both could fit in the same side - I'm on the fence overall. I'm only responding to people saying Henry clearly offers more on various metrics that aren't based in fact.

There will be a lot of ill advised cause-effect scenarios if opposition efficiency is like the Bulldogs game and not the Richmond one, or if our mids and forwards lift as they did Saturday. It'll be "look how much better the defensive group looks!". The Bulldogs still had 30 shots on goal if you count the out on the fulls.

I wouldnt say henry is clearly better but i would say that savs tendency to kick long up the line all the time is an issue for a side that at times lacks legspeed and can struggle to move the ball out of defence. So i can see the reasons why structurally our ball movement might be better with no sav

 

[Mr Meow]

I wouldnt say henry is clearly better but i would say that savs tendency to kick long up the line all the time is an issue for a side that at times lacks legspeed and can struggle to move the ball out of defence. So i can see the reasons why structurally our ball movement might be better with no sav

This is definitely more of a real answer. With Duncan, Tuohy (in form) and Stewart roaming around you'd think we'd learn to get hand offs and quick chains going. Our structure through absences has been a bit all over the shop but in 2022 a long kick to space or a 1v1 would have the necessary contesters and crumbers to keep things alive. It just hasn't been the case this season but there were some signs on Saturday. Stengle and Rohan in for us is big in that way.

 

[Finknottle]

The win against the Bulldogs was very good and players coming back will help especially Dangerfield. However at this stage it's hard to see any team worrying Collingwood. I've got to admit they are playing a very good brand of football and are great to watch.

 

[GeelongFTW]

The win against the Bulldogs was very good and players coming back will help especially Dangerfield. However at this stage it's hard to see any team worrying Collingwood. I've got to admit they are playing a very good brand of football and are great to watch.

match them in the midfield and I don't think they've completely solved their issues with a second key forward. One of our key forwards could get ahold of them again.

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

match them in the midfield and I don't think they've completely solved their issues with a second key forward. One of our key forwards could get ahold of them again.

Totally agree , match them in the midfield and force turnovers - we did that well last season to be #1 at scoring off opposition turnovers. Replicate that V Pies and we're a real chance.

 

[Sire of Claude]

Two Swans mates of mine used to rag me about Rogan, with some justification to be fair. But Rohan's heroics v the Pies last September arguably won us the premiership. Two glorious marks and 3 clutch goals made him a Geelong hero.

It's strange he can't get more disposals given his ability and athletic gifts, but that's how it is, and he can do huge damage with 10-12 disposals and a couple of tackles.

 

[standupand]

Two Swans mates of mine used to rag me about Rogan, with some justification to be fair. But Rohan's heroics v the Pies last September arguably won us the premiership. Two glorious marks and 3 clutch goals made him a Geelong hero.

It's strange he can't get more disposals given his ability and athletic gifts, but that's how it is, and he can do huge damage with 10-12 disposals and a couple of tackles.

I've always been a fan of Rohan even while he was at the Swans and thought he'd be a good fit for us. Years before he arrived here I used to joke with my Swans supporting friend about a possible trade - never thought it would end up happening.

But I always remember his first game for us in 2019 - it was a tight contest v the pies - and after the full 4 quarters he had enough to will himself for a huge defensive sprint up the field to influence the final contest of the match - see 10:12 in the video. Before that game, my worry was that he might not be that committed as I didn't think he was really that keen on being traded. But that single effort in his first game just squashed any doubt.

 

[Lana]

Its a tough one - but i think Jack Henry is a tad overrated

And what i use as a barometer is the 2011 Geelong Premiership winning team - and in my opinion J Henry would not get in it - and Darren Milburn admittedly at the end of his career - couldnt get in that 11 premiership team .

And Milburn was a better footballer than J Henry . I like backmen who within reason - try to mark the ball where possible not punch it - are attacking players and high possession players - and i dont see that in J Henry - thats why i think he is a bit overrated

He is an ok player - but like i say - i dont think he would push anyone out of the 2011 Premiership team

That is a harsh curve to be graded against,

 

[patmatcat]

Sav is definitely an afl standard key backman. Does he fit in our backline at full strength, don’t think so. Especially if Stanley comes back and floats down back like he did last year.

 

[Finknottle]

Sav is definitely an afl standard key backman. Does he fit in our backline at full strength, don’t think so. Especially if Stanley comes back and floats down back like he did last year.

I'd think Sav will be in our best backline. SDK and Stewart are there. Not sure about the rest. I cannot work out how Stanley fits in, he'll have his hands full trying to nullify the better ruckmen in the comp. Are you suggesting Stanley will address the problem of having an undersized center half back like Kolodjashnij or Jack Henry?

 

[CatRiot]

great win, best of the year.

Biggest observation - until Stanley comes back we need to just suck it up and play blitz in the ruck. Ceglar is not afl standard, we just can’t play him, way too slow. Yes I know we need blitz in the midfield, but that is a gamble we have to take at the moment.

Everyone's forgetting we have Neale on our List, and isn't he back soon now in VFL?
He has all the athletic attributes of Stanley, and is taller. He needs to be fast tracked in the Ruck. Imagine if he has a breakout moment in the back end of the year with the rest all coming back?
Either that, or we can try Esava back in the Ruck again?
Ceglar is okay against the slow rucks in the comp, but not necessarily the better and faster ones.

 

[CatRiot]

I'd think Sav will be in our best backline. SDK and Stewart are there. Not sure about the rest. I cannot work out how Stanley fits in, he'll have his hands full trying to nullify the better ruckmen in the comp. Are you suggesting Stanley will address the problem of having an undersized center half back like Kolodjashnij or Jack Henry?

I don't think Kolo is undersized as a CHB...

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

I'd think Sav will be in our best backline. SDK and Stewart are there. Not sure about the rest. I cannot work out how Stanley fits in, he'll have his hands full trying to nullify the better ruckmen in the comp. Are you suggesting Stanley will address the problem of having an undersized center half back like Kolodjashnij or Jack Henry?

Given we won the flag without Sav the answer is yes.