Preview Changes v Hawks round 7

[Lampers]

Absolutely staggers me that you can get into the AFL system and not have learned to kick opposite foot. These guys are coached by full time professional coaches in the junior system from U15s/U16s minimum.
How do you not learn this skill?

I’m reasonably involved in junior footy but just at a local club.

My observation is the absolute gun juniors are so good they don’t need to use their opposite foot in a game. They just get the ball with clean skills and burst away from the opposition, but that was probably always the case.

With a team of 25 kids and a couple of coaches only for a non-elite team, they can’t put the time into coaching techniques of individual players. The coaching is general drills. Coaching under 10s and 11s is seriously like herding cats at times. But again, I’m sure that’s not a new phenomenon.

A bit different with the girls as they are behind skills wise, but my daughter was in an U14 league development squad and again there was no one-on-one technique coaching going on. 50 girls in the squad, three or four coaches each week, running general drills. I’d ask “Did you get any specific feedback or direction in your skills?”. “No”. And tonnes of those girls, including mine, can’t kick consistently well on the run with their dominant foot let alone opposite foot.

I don’t have direct experience with elite squads like Oakleigh or Sandringham, perhaps they do specific technique training with individuals on their opposite side.

I’m the only one who does any sort of intensive one-on-one skills coaching with my kids, be it footy or cricket.

I suspect the AFL players who can kick opposite well were encouraged to do so by their father when really young, and then they spend lots of time practising it. There are so many other options competing for kids’ attention these days, whereas when I was growing up it was basically sport, sport and more sport.

I’m atrocious on my left, but I never played at any level below very junior juniors, yet I can still kick pretty well on my right and that’s all down to school yard kick to kick or after school with mates. I remember the better footy players kicking on their left in kick to kick with no adults around telling them. I just stuck to my right.

One final point, I remember when Scott Chisholm was at Melbourne in the late 1990s I went to a training session. He was mid 20s and I watched him off to the side with a coach doing pure left foot only drills for a significant period of time, and they were basic “learn to kick” type drills. So elite level players needing intensive work on the opposite foot is also not new.

 

[Crusty Demon]

I agree it gives them a better shot, but I also remember when Melbourne were rubbish thinking the same sort of thing when the opposition had several outs, and then watching a seven goal pasting instead of the standard 12 goal pasting at the hands of a power club.

The COVID outs plus Salem (and Hibbo) are really just a pretty bog standard list of unavailable players many clubs run with each week.

Like Richmond last week with Martin, Grimes, Lambert, Pickett and some assorted others.

Despite the “But Melbourne have never had any injuries, wait until they finally have some” rhetoric (we’ve had a good run no doubt and had minimal injury to the guns last year) there have been at least three out each week so far in 2022 and they’ve coped just fine.

If the Hawks get up it will be on merit, not because of Melbourne’s outs.

So losing Dogga, Petty, Koz and Sparrow will have zero impact on our side? Interesting take.it helps the Hawks, a fair bit I would have thought. 4 very good young players who each bring something unique to the team. Will be a good win if we get it done..

 

[mrmonkey]

So losing Dogga, Petty, Koz and Sparrow will have zero impact on our side? Interesting take.it helps the Hawks, a fair bit I would have thought. 4 very good young players who each bring something unique to the team. Will be a good win if we get it done..

I think we have the depth to cover the losses, yeah it helps the Hawks but they also have some players out which is harder for them to cover, so I would say If Hawks are good enough to win its on merit.

 

[Lampers]

So losing Dogga, Petty, Koz and Sparrow will have zero impact on our side? Interesting take.it helps the Hawks, a fair bit I would have thought. 4 very good young players who each bring something unique to the team. Will be a good win if we get it done..

Not zero impact, just saying having a list of unavailables of that size and quality is pretty common. It’s not a disaster or unmanageable like the Eagles were in the early part of the year.

Hawthorn are missing Lewis, Jiath, Reeves, McEvoy and Phillips themselves, and are “resting” (despite Granger-Barras being an emergency while rested?!?) another couple. I’d argue Melbourne’s outs are probably better players on balance, but it’s not miles different.

 

[LeverPuller]

The reality is the outs aren’t the end of the world. Koz is a pressure forward, so that’s a downgrade to Bedford, but it’s not a disaster. Sparrow playing well but is a depth mid - Viney is an upgrade, and Dunstan probably a slight downgrade. Petty, well, the backline has been unstable all season and the big three have only played 1 game together.

Jackson is the big one but with Hawthorn only having Lynch it’s not a total disaster, and we know TMac can play that ruck/fwd role.

This isn’t West Coast with WAFL players.

 

[stEdy]

I think we'll see Weid doing the 2nd rucking duties, as he's been groomed in that role down at Casey.

Tmac might take some forward 50 stoppage ruck duties but don't think we'll see him in the centre square.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

I think we'll see Weid doing the 2nd rucking duties, as he's been groomed in that role down at Casey.

Tmac might take some forward 50 stoppage ruck duties but don't think we'll see him in the centre square.

This would please Toump Ass immensely

 

[Toump Ass]

This would please Toump Ass immensely

Nah **** that, throw him in the middle, more excuses to hate that campaigner the better.

 

[Gysberts2Bate]

That hawthorn forward line is bleak. Keep Moore quiet and they should struggle to score. I’d almost be sending May to him

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Nah fu** that, throw him in the middle, more excuses to hate that campaigner the better.

I was being sarcastic, I didnt think you'd like TMac taking Weid's spot in the forward line that hes earned over him the past 3 weeks.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Nice. Love Ickey, mean mother ****er. I'm happy

 

[DemonZombie_001]

I believe the club will be testing all the players again t his morning so if there are more outs

The reality is the outs aren’t the end of the world. Koz is a pressure forward, so that’s a downgrade to Bedford, but it’s not a disaster. Sparrow playing well but is a depth mid - Viney is an upgrade, and Dunstan probably a slight downgrade. Petty, well, the backline has been unstable all season and the big three have only played 1 game together.

Jackson is the big one but with Hawthorn only having Lynch it’s not a total disaster, and we know TMac can play that ruck/fwd role.

This isn’t West Coast with WAFL players.

Yes good post. Jackson is the only big out when it comes to coverage as he is rather unique.

This is a huge opportunity for some players to have a real chance at GF success (should the team make it), specifically Dunstan and Bedford, so if anything we should view these outs as a positive. At least until it is 17 outs due to covid.

 

[LarryDavidNeitz]

I’m reasonably involved in junior footy but just at a local club.

My observation is the absolute gun juniors are so good they don’t need to use their opposite foot in a game. They just get the ball with clean skills and burst away from the opposition, but that was probably always the case.

With a team of 25 kids and a couple of coaches only for a non-elite team, they can’t put the time into coaching techniques of individual players. The coaching is general drills. Coaching under 10s and 11s is seriously like herding cats at times. But again, I’m sure that’s not a new phenomenon.

A bit different with the girls as they are behind skills wise, but my daughter was in an U14 league development squad and again there was no one-on-one technique coaching going on. 50 girls in the squad, three or four coaches each week, running general drills. I’d ask “Did you get any specific feedback or direction in your skills?”. “No”. And tonnes of those girls, including mine, can’t kick consistently well on the run with their dominant foot let alone opposite foot.

I don’t have direct experience with elite squads like Oakleigh or Sandringham, perhaps they do specific technique training with individuals on their opposite side.

I’m the only one who does any sort of intensive one-on-one skills coaching with my kids, be it footy or cricket.

I suspect the AFL players who can kick opposite well were encouraged to do so by their father when really young, and then they spend lots of time practising it. There are so many other options competing for kids’ attention these days, whereas when I was growing up it was basically sport, sport and more sport.

I’m atrocious on my left, but I never played at any level below very junior juniors, yet I can still kick pretty well on my right and that’s all down to school yard kick to kick or after school with mates. I remember the better footy players kicking on their left in kick to kick with no adults around telling them. I just stuck to my right.

One final point, I remember when Scott Chisholm was at Melbourne in the late 1990s I went to a training session. He was mid 20s and I watched him off to the side with a coach doing pure left foot only drills for a significant period of time, and they were basic “learn to kick” type drills. So elite level players needing intensive work on the opposite foot is also not new.

Definitely agree with all that, especially that the top junior players don’t learn to kick opposite foot because they don’t need to at that level.

The fact remains though that 95% of draftees go through state u/15s, 16s, 18s with a host of paid professional coaches. Those coaches aren’t doing their jobs properly if these kids can’t make a 15m pass on their left or snap a goal from 20m out opposite side.

 

[Lampers]

Definitely agree with all that, especially that the top junior players don’t learn to kick opposite foot because they don’t need to at that level.

The fact remains though that 95% of draftees go through state u/15s, 16s, 18s with a host of paid professional coaches. Those coaches aren’t doing their jobs properly if these kids can’t make a 15m pass on their left or snap a goal from 20m out opposite side.

I was frustrated that my daughter got into a development squad, and those coaches (who were professional coaches) spent no time giving her advice on addressing really obvious technique flaws.

She doesn’t really listen to my advice on how to address her flaws, generally ends up in arguments because of course she knows better, so I was hoping she’d listen to professional coaches - but then they didn’t tell her anything.

 

[stEdy]

That hawthorn forward line is bleak. Keep Moore quiet and they should struggle to score. I’d almost be sending May to him

Gunston and Breust are permanent class and have carved us up for as long as I can remember.

Wary of the Hawks. We belted them first up last year but it was a real scrap until 3QTR time and then they drew with us on a second meeting (Breust kicking the goal).

Not sure If I love our matchups. Missing a Hibberd to play on Breust. Hate the Hunt on Breust matchup if it happens. Obviously we've got one of the best defensive systems out there, but some of the 1v1s are a little awkward.

Would like to manipulate the match-ups to get Lever onto Moore or one of their other smalls to get his intercept game going after his slow start to the year. Smith could go to Kozi and use his leap to just spoil everything. May can play on Gunston. Just worried with Smith and Hunt who aren't the smartest footballers and Breust/Gunston/Moore being pretty crafty.

Bout of MFCSS gripping me about this game

 

[LeverPuller]

Gunston and Breust are permanent class and have carved us up for as long as I can remember.

Wary of the Hawks. We belted them first up last year but it was a real scrap until 3QTR time and then they drew with us on a second meeting (Breust kicking the goal).

Not sure If I love our matchups. Missing a Hibberd to play on Breust. Hate the Hunt on Breust matchup if it happens. Obviously we've got one of the best defensive systems out there, but some of the 1v1s are a little awkward.

Would like to manipulate the match-ups to get Lever onto Moore or one of their other smalls to get his intercept game going after his slow start to the year. Smith could go to Kozi and use his leap to just spoil everything. May can play on Gunston. Just worried with Smith and Hunt who aren't the smartest footballers and Breust/Gunston/Moore being pretty crafty.

Bout of MFCSS gripping me about this game

I think Hunt has improved heaps defensively, and he gave Bolton a bath last week. Would be happy to give him a crack at Moore.

 

[Dory_77]

Gunston and Breust are permanent class and have carved us up for as long as I can remember.

Wary of the Hawks. We belted them first up last year but it was a real scrap until 3QTR time and then they drew with us on a second meeting (Breust kicking the goal).

Not sure If I love our matchups. Missing a Hibberd to play on Breust. Hate the Hunt on Breust matchup if it happens. Obviously we've got one of the best defensive systems out there, but some of the 1v1s are a little awkward.

Would like to manipulate the match-ups to get Lever onto Moore or one of their other smalls to get his intercept game going after his slow start to the year. Smith could go to Kozi and use his leap to just spoil everything. May can play on Gunston. Just worried with Smith and Hunt who aren't the smartest footballers and Breust/Gunston/Moore being pretty crafty.

Bout of MFCSS gripping me about this game

Me too, a little. They've started red hot the past couple of weeks too, while we've been wasteful. Even with the changes our defence is very strong but still wary that this might be the week we drop one (especially if we kick for goal like shit again).

 

[TheDarkDwarf]

Nice. Love Ickey, mean mother f***er. I'm happy

On another day he would have been No 1 wouldn't he?

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

On another day he would have been No 1 wouldn't he?

Apparently Doug Peterson wanted the Jags to take him at #1

 

[TheDarkDwarf]

Apparently Doug Peterson wanted the Jags to take him at #1

Not just a great player, but probably one of the most intelligent, very smart lad.

 

[SugarHealey]

Im not sure you can do that mate

Yeah i'm not sure either.
But we are developing youngsters, whenever we can manage it. So I do not think he wll get the 200 games while with us. for sure.

 

[Proper Gander]

I’m getting a kind of not winning this game feeling

 

[Bluelegs]

I’m getting a kind of not winning this game feeling

oh goodness gracious, oh goodness gracious, oh goodness gracious.

 

[SugarHealey]

My observation is the absolute gun juniors are so good they don’t need to use their opposite foot in a game. They just get the ball with clean skills and burst away from the opposition, but that was probably always the case.

This is a problem, get them early to kick both feet. They copy the afl players and if the AFL players are one sided, then thats what we will reap.

With a team of 25 kids and a couple of coaches only for a non-elite team, they can’t put the time into coaching techniques of individual players. The coaching is general drills.

Coaches need to tell - encourage they're players, to practice the opposite-side disposal skills in the kids spare time.

One final point, I remember when Scott Chisholm was at Melbourne in the late 1990s I went to a training session. He was mid 20s and I watched him off to the side with a coach doing pure left foot only drills for a significant period of time, and they were basic “learn to kick” type drills. So elite level players needing intensive work on the opposite foot is also not new.

This is why the AFL club academies (14 Yrs) are a good idea, and are so important for the future of our sport.

Get the kids at junior academy, and teach them the requirements for senior footy, and let them go practice.

Then IMO, senior AFL club academies should start at 16 yrs, and from this group we should be able to rookie the ones who are most advanced, and ready to play early.

Timmy Watson was playing VFL footy at 16 Yrs of age. He was ready. Some kids are more advanced.

Father-Sons should be brought into the senior academy squads. And the clubs should be able to draft a maximum of 3 academy players per year. To be bid on by other clubs, as in the National draft.

 

[SugarHealey]

I’m getting a kind of not winning this game feeling

I felt that after the last match. We were a bit off with some of our players. Maybe they were coming down with Covid?
I thought we looked ready to drop a game.