god help us

[Jars458]

Originally posted by Yassar Arafat
It is not a racist policy.

These people are not true refugees.

If htey were they would abandon Afghanistan and head for Pakistan the closest Islamic country where there are many Afghans at the moment.

But no, they figure they can get in anywhere they want so they stop off at a number of countries and then head for Australia. Forget the poor bastards who go throught he right processes, we have money and we can do what we want and you should od wnat we wnat as well.

My parents went through the proper process when they eventually came here on a refugee passport after being in a refugee camp for two years in Greece.

Let them apply off shore, if they qualify let them in regardless of race creed or culture

How is that racist? It is easy to tar somone with the "racist brush" but it really is a load of crap.

Well you are wrong

Many of the people on the boat that sank (the first one) were actually refeguees who had been approved by the UN to be repatriated.

However no country would take them

Their kids are not allowed to go to school in Indonesia

What sort of future is that?

If these people were white or great atheletes they wold be allowed in

In mv view - it is racism. Obviously I can't prove that as no one will admit to it, however I am entitled to that view.

Given the situation of your parents I would have thought you would have more compassion for such people.

 

[Chilli Afterglow]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by mantis


Yes I noticed the sudden switch you made when I attacked you for your comments saying people on $70,000 should get more benefits than someone on $30,000, suddenly you brought in a wife and kids, that wasn't in your original post, you were talking about single people going to Uni as opposed to those that didn't, so people who don't have money or an opportunity of an education, deserve to live in poverty.

Take the previous election for example. Labor's offering to ease the tax plight was to screw the rich and cut some slack to the poor. By there scheme, someone on $35,000 per year would get the best breaks while someone on $70,000 would get basically nothing.

Thing is that middle Australia are either the ones on $70,000 pa or the ones who are aspiring to get to that point. The majority of people who have come out of University and are working professionally would fit into this group.

Middle Australia does cover a significant portion of the Australian population but is one group that Labor has failed to win over, mainly because it has been lumped in with the rich with Beazley's thoughless mantra.

On reflection, I withdraw my apology. I reread my intial post and it seems to make perfect sense.

My initial post actually was to the point that Beazely didn't win over middle Australia, Got nothing really to do with single or married folk or whatever. Just is to the point that middle Australia also get a vote and that Beazley ignored it.

Too bad for him.

 

[Shinboners]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by mantis
Shinners I hope you never have to try & survive on $25,000 a year, electricity, gas, phone, food, clothes, all with GST. good luck would you like to swap with me for a month.

Thanks for your concern, but you haven't answered my question. It is this. How do you reconcile your pro-S11 view of globalisation that leads to jobs (mainly unskilled labour) being sucked out of Australia and into Asia with your view that the middle classes (or at least those singles on $70,000 per annum) are getting greedy despite the spending of the middle classes leads to spending that results in jobs (like those skilled labour jobs in car factories) being created in Australia? After all, it is the middle class that has the spending power in the country to keep people in work.

I'm not trying to prove that one view is right or wrong, I just want to know how you reconcile these two seemingly contradictory views.

 

[1AD]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by Shinboners


Thanks for your concern, but you haven't answered my question. It is this. How do you reconcile your pro-S11 view of globalisation that leads to jobs (mainly unskilled labour) being sucked out of Australia and into Asia with your view that the middle classes (or at least those singles on $70,000 per annum) are getting greedy despite the spending of the middle classes leads to spending that results in jobs (like those skilled labour jobs in car factories) being created in Australia? After all, it is the middle class that has the spending power in the country to keep people in work.

I'm not trying to prove that one view is right or wrong, I just want to know how you reconcile these two seemingly contradictory views.

If I earn't $70,000 per year and single I want a BMW!!!!

 

[Shinboners]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by 1AD


If I earn't $70,000 per year and single I want a BMW!!!!

Me too!

Which one would you get? I kinda like that Z3 myself....hmmm...which leads me to think, maybe forget the BMW and get a MG.....

 

[Frodo]

Originally posted by Jars458



Well you are wrong

Many of the people on the boat that sank (the first one) were actually refeguees who had been approved by the UN to be repatriated.

Of course that statement relies on your perception of the authority and fairness of the UN.

Like the USA on Kyoto, who said that they were big enough to make their own decisions on emmissions so do I believe that the authority to decide the status of refugees wanting to come to Australia rests with the Australian people and not the UN.

You have to consider the reality that the UN is a funded beaurocracy and that beaurocracies tend to be infested with greenies, left wing socialists, dissidents and hangers on. The chances of getting a fair and reasonable policy coming out of that institute is very remote indeed.

We are big enough to decide who we want in our country. The UN can get stuffed.

 

[Jars458]

Originally posted by Frodo


Of course that statement relies on your perception of the authority and fairness of the UN.

Like the USA on Kyoto, who said that they were big enough to make their own decisions on emmissions so do I believe that the authority to decide the status of refugees wanting to come to Australia rests with the Australian people and not the UN.

You have to consider the reality that the UN is a funded beaurocracy and that beaurocracies tend to be infested with greenies, left wing socialists, dissidents and hangers on. The chances of getting a fair and reasonable policy coming out of that institute is very remote indeed.

We are big enough to decide who we want in our country. The UN can get stuffed.

You really are an angry right wing troglodyte.

never mind havng a neutral umpire.

Why would beauracricies be full of left wing people?

oh wait - people who want to make a difference to the world in a postion of service.

you are a joke

 

[Frodo]

Originally posted by Jars458


You really are an angry right wing troglodyte.

never mind havng a neutral umpire.

Why would beauracricies be full of left wing people?

oh wait - people who want to make a difference to the world in a postion of service.

you are a joke

If the only way you can handle debate is to resort to personal insult you are better keeping your mouth SHUT

 

[eastaugh36]

Originally posted by magpie_joffa
When i go to bed tonight i will say a simple prayer and it will go along the lines as this,

God help the refugees
and the working class
and the poor
and the needy, and our sick
and the unfortunate

God help us all.

We had our chance and we blew it, we had a chance to install a caring government to govern for all classes of people and not just the rich...we blew it and let me give you all a tip, an uncaring society is like cancer it will get worse before it gets better.

What have we all become ?

god help us.

well the majority of aussies voted liberal and the majority of aussies are working class, so that is just your perception that liberal dont do anything for the working class. I am very happy because the australians voted for a party with stability and one that has handled issues such as the boat people and the terrorist attacks in the right way. The majority of aussies think howard handled it in the right way ! You are in a minority, we cant just let any bloody one in our country, especially the ones who cheat the system ! Good onya john ! Also you are forgetting how hawke and keating totally stuffed up the country when they last had a chance to lead australia !

 

[Santos L Helper]

Originally posted by Frodo


Of course that statement relies on your perception of the authority and fairness of the UN.

Like the USA on Kyoto, who said that they were big enough to make their own decisions on emmissions so do I believe that the authority to decide the status of refugees wanting to come to Australia rests with the Australian people and not the UN.

You have to consider the reality that the UN is a funded beaurocracy and that beaurocracies tend to be infested with greenies, left wing socialists, dissidents and hangers on. The chances of getting a fair and reasonable policy coming out of that institute is very remote indeed.

We are big enough to decide who we want in our country. The UN can get stuffed.

These greenies and left-wing socialists must be the ones you hate for trying to implement policies that will protect our environment. I forgot that because the USA thinks it won't sign the kyoto protocol, then we have to follow suit. Bugger the planet, we'll pump more emissions into the atmosphere and screw up more ecosystems because the USA says the protocol can't work.
Yeah the chances of getting fair and reasonable policy are remote because countries like ours like to hide behind the bigger bullies. Just where Johnnie likes it................with his head planted firmly up the USA's arse.

 

[London Dave]

Afraid not, Frodo.

The consistent use of an accepted spelling is not the same as spelling incorrectly. If you want to make the point, make the point. You may disagree it's an accepted spelling, fair enough, use the version you are comfortable with. Plenty of other people feel comfortable with the US version, so let em use it. Personally, I don't give a fig which you use, as long as you are consistent. It's neither right or wrong to use color or colour, just adopt a consistent use of whichever. In the US, use the US, in UK, use the UK, in Australia, both have been acceptable for a long time in my experience.

Sorry I didnt pick up on your sense of humour Frodo, must be the first time you've had any sense at all in your posts!!!!!

 

[Jars458]

Originally posted by Frodo



If the only way you can handle debate is to resort to personal insult you are better keeping your mouth SHUT

Oh the personal insult line

well sorry - in relation to people I have no respect for, I find it hard other than to tell the truth as I see it

YOU were the one calling me a communist and saying I was full of hate etc etc so don't come the moral high ground

I have nothing more to say to you.

Have a nice life.

 

[Frodo]

Originally posted by London Dave
Afraid not, Frodo.

The consistent use of an accepted spelling is not the same as spelling incorrectly. If you want to make the point, make the point. You may disagree it's an accepted spelling, fair enough, use the version you are comfortable with. Plenty of other people feel comfortable with the US version, so let em use it. Personally, I don't give a fig which you use, as long as you are consistent. It's neither right or wrong to use color or colour, just adopt a consistent use of whichever. In the US, use the US, in UK, use the UK, in Australia, both have been acceptable for a long time in my experience.

Fair enough. This issue was raised as an attack on my spelling of Labour. I have defended that usage. I don't mind how others spell or mis-spell it as long as I understand which party they are referring too. Many words are spelled differing ways nowdays (color/colour for one) and whulst I find that undesireable it doesn't worry me at all.

In fact the correct and common spelling for the Labour party is probably SCUMBAGS

 

[Dippers Donuts]

Originally posted by Frodo


Fair enough. This issue was raised as an attack on my spelling of Labour. I have defended that usage. I don't mind how others spell or mis-spell it as long as I understand which party they are referring too. Many words are spelled differing ways nowdays (color/colour for one) and whulst I find that undesireable it doesn't worry me at all.

In fact the correct and common spelling for the Labour party is probably SCUMBAGS

Well if it isn't my part aboriginal friend frodo!!

Only an uninformed person like yourself wouldn't realise that when referring to Labor one is referring to the Australian Labor Party.

And going by your childish logic we can now start referring to the liberal party as CLOWNS can we?

 

[1AD]

Originally posted by Dippers Donuts


And going by your childish logic we can now start referring to the liberal party as CLOWNS can we?

Come on!! Any Government that spends $300,000,000 to keep 3400 refugees out(since August) when it would cost half that in Australia. Also $3,000,000 per day to keep three frigates, two orions and a support ship when one phone call from Christmas island to tell us a ship has arrived. $20,000,00 to PNG to keep 1000 refugees at bay,. $?? to all the other tinpot island nations.

CLOWNS is too soft a word...Fuking Clowns is more apt.

Betcha a boatload of white Zimbabwan farmers would get straight in though

 

[magpie_joffa]

Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by eastaugh36


well the majority of aussies voted liberal and the majority of aussies are working class, so that is just your perception that liberal dont do anything for the working class. I am very happy because the australians voted for a party with stability and one that has handled issues such as the boat people and the terrorist attacks in the right way. The majority of aussies think howard handled it in the right way ! You are in a minority, we cant just let any bloody one in our country, especially the ones who cheat the system ! Good onya john ! Also you are forgetting how hawke and keating totally stuffed up the country when they last had a chance to lead australia !

Good i give thanks to god that i was a part of that minority !!!

 

[BUBBALOUIS]

Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by magpie_joffa



Good i give thanks to god that i was a part of that minority !!!

Dont despair Joff, 49% of Australians didnt vote with the redkneck oops i mean Coalition parties, that still is a hell of a lot of Australians ......... It might take a year or two but Australians will realise what a racist , fear campaign was run by the coalition, the last ads on TV werent about the economy/education/jobs, but a quote from Howard 'we will decide who we let into the country' ...... this on top of a suggestion on the last day that boat people delibarately set fire to their boat, which since the election hasnt been confirmed? Yes we are a democracy and have the right to vote whoever we please into office ...... doesnt make them right, doesnt mean we should be proud of the way they were elected...... 3AW (a very right wing radio station) let it slip that some coalition backbenchers were secretly embarrassed by the way the election was fought. ...... unfortunately elections arent won by good guys with high morals, but guys with deep pockets who run the best scare campaigns

 

[eastaugh36]

Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by BUBBALOUIS


Dont despair Joff, 49% of Australians didnt vote with the redkneck oops i mean Coalition parties, that still is a hell of a lot of Australians ......... It might take a year or two but Australians will realise what a racist , fear campaign was run by the coalition, the last ads on TV werent about the economy/education/jobs, but a quote from Howard 'we will decide who we let into the country' ...... this on top of a suggestion on the last day that boat people delibarately set fire to their boat, which since the election hasnt been confirmed? Yes we are a democracy and have the right to vote whoever we please into office ...... doesnt make them right, doesnt mean we should be proud of the way they were elected...... 3AW (a very right wing radio station) let it slip that some coalition backbenchers were secretly embarrassed by the way the election was fought. ...... unfortunately elections arent won by good guys with high morals, but guys with deep pockets who run the best scare campaigns

racist ??? Yeah sure, just because we dont let people who shouldnt be here in the country doesnt mean we are racist, face the facts that the good guys did win !

 

[BUBBALOUIS]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by eastaugh36


racist ??? Yeah sure, just because we dont let people who shouldnt be here in the country doesnt mean we are racist, face the facts that the good guys did win !

Yes the good guys easty, i can now sleep easy because we spent 20 million sending 200 people to Nauru to be processed instead of Christmas Island ...... mind you im in trouble if i send my kids to public schools, or expect good public hospitals, or my grandparents are looking for aged care beds ... lol ,..... but yes we did stop those pesky boat people .........

 

[magpie_joffa]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by eastaugh36


racist ??? Yeah sure, just because we dont let people who shouldnt be here in the country doesnt mean we are racist, face the facts that the good guys did win !

I dont believe your a cold uncaring p.r.i.c.k as you claim to be if you are its a waste of time replying to you, but i will leave you some words that u hope you might find inspiring, its from a song and i have changed the word america to Australia.

Far we been travellin far
Without a home
but not without a star
Free only wanna be free
We huddle close
hang on to a dream

On the boats and on the planes
there comming to Australia
Never looking back again
there comming to Australia

Home but it seems so far away
but we are travelling light today
in the eye of a storm...in the eye of a storm

Home to a new and a shining place
make our bed and we'll say our grace
Freedom's like burning warm

Every where around the world
there comming to Australia
every time that flag's unfurled
there comming to Australia

Got a dream to take them there
there comming to Australia

Got a dream they come to share
there comming to Australia

There comming to Austarlia today.

 

[TigerTank]

Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by BUBBALOUIS


... 3AW (a very right wing radio station) ...

You're JOKING aren't you???

Do the names Steve Price and Paul Barber ring any bells?

And Neil Mitchell is the absolute pin-up boy for the "ban all fire-arms even though we know nothing about them" fraternity.

Bubba, 3AW is about as right wing as you are.

 

[BJ]

Both Labor and Liberal are a bunch of ********s anyway. They will both just end up doing the same ****e. How immaure are Beazley and Howard, its like too little school boys arguing. They both take pleasure in waiting for the other to slip up and say something the wrong way so they can then go on to make it sound worse than it actually was in the original context.

Hey Frodo did you say that 'we' dont have any poor people?

"and the poor [define poor. Like in India maybe...we haven't got any poor]"

Just correct be if I'm wrong, but are you actually saying that we dont have any poor people in Australia? Surely your not are you? Because that would just be the comment of someone totally ignorant. We have people in Australia living in third world conditions. Perhaps I just read your comment the wrong way because surely noone would say that Australia does not have any poor people.


I have to agree with Brisgal.......Not all people who send their children to private schools are rich. I agree it is all about priorities. Alot of kids at private schools dont even pay fees. There is a difference between the elite and the average religous based private schools.
I also have to say that not all private schools are rich. Some private schools have more money than some public schools, some public schools have more money than some private schools.

Also, Mantis, these days you dont have to be rich to go to uni. Noone that I know of actualy pays their uni fees upfront, and noone I know of has their parents pay their uni fees. Most people these days just pay through HECS. That is that once they start working, a part of their pay goes to paying off the uni. If you never get a job that pays over a certain amount then you never have to repay the uni fees, if you move overseas you never have to repay the uni fees.
Maybe it was different in past years. But I know people who have come from poor families (poor as in they would get an orange for their christmas present and they would think it was the best thing eva) and have gone on to a tertiary education, and this is going years back.

Also their is nothing wrong with being rich, I mean anyone given the opportunity except perhaps Mother Teresa would accept a $100 000 a year salary. Some people have got money some people dont, personally I dont think its that big of a deal as long as you've got enough food on your table, you have somewhere to live that is hygenic and aslong as you have enough to stay healthy, then who cares. Of course I realise that not everyone is lucky enough to have all this, but I reakon it would be a pretty fair bet to say everyone who posts on bigfooty is lucky enough to have all those things. If you dont, then I suggest that you take your computer to Cashies and go buy yourself some pukka tucker.

I probably got off the subject there. Just sometimes people bag rich people. If you had the opportunity to be rich you would take it. Many rich people have worked very hard to earn their money. Many people work very hard just to earn enough to feed their kids. Nothing is going to be able to change that. I mean money isnt everything, although i know some people here think it is.

But I do think that its pretty stupid to be complaining that you arent getting any benefits when you are on $70 000 a year, I mean comme on...you dont need benefits! You r already benefited! Just give the money to the people who arent coping financially, is it that hard to understand?

I would just like to ask you guys, when you vote....do you vote for the party who is going to be the best for you or do you vote for the party who is going to be the best overall.

BJ

 

[BUBBALOUIS]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: god help us

Originally posted by TigerTank


You're JOKING aren't you???

Do the names Steve Price and Paul Barber ring any bells?

And Neil Mitchell is the absolute pin-up boy for the "ban all fire-arms even though we know nothing about them" fraternity.

Bubba, 3AW is about as right wing as you are.

ok TT, depends on which bias is tuned in when listening, Paul Barber no longer works at 3AW, but yes he was left of centre no doubt, Steve Price apart from his stance on boat people is very much right of centre IMHO, and Neil Mitchell stand on fire arms is left of centre, but on most issues he does discriminate to the right, thats why Peter Costello loves appearing on 3AW, he knows hes going to get some half volley questions ..... Anyway i reckon we could both listen to a programme from 3AW, and i would swear it was anti Labor, you woud swear it was anti coalition .... lol ..... Lets agree to disagree on 3AW political leanings ... oh and have you heard of a fella called Andrew Bolt? who comes on in the mornings

 

[Pessimistic]

I heard from a good source that A Bolt has a 'lot' of help writing his column.

 

[Pessimistic]

Originally posted by BJ
Both Labor and Liberal are a bunch of ********s anyway. They will both just end up doing the same ****e. How immaure are Beazley and Howard, its like too little school boys arguing. They both take pleasure in waiting for the other to slip up and say something the wrong way so they can then go on to make it sound worse than it actually was in the original context.

Hey Frodo did you say that 'we' dont have any poor people?

"and the poor [define poor. Like in India maybe...we haven't got any poor]"

Just correct be if I'm wrong, but are you actually saying that we dont have any poor people in Australia? Surely your not are you? Because that would just be the comment of someone totally ignorant. We have people in Australia living in third world conditions. Perhaps I just read your comment the wrong way because surely noone would say that Australia does not have any poor people.


I have to agree with Brisgal.......Not all people who send their children to private schools are rich. I agree it is all about priorities. Alot of kids at private schools dont even pay fees. There is a difference between the elite and the average religous based private schools.
I also have to say that not all private schools are rich. Some private schools have more money than some public schools, some public schools have more money than some private schools.

Also, Mantis, these days you dont have to be rich to go to uni. Noone that I know of actualy pays their uni fees upfront, and noone I know of has their parents pay their uni fees. Most people these days just pay through HECS. That is that once they start working, a part of their pay goes to paying off the uni. If you never get a job that pays over a certain amount then you never have to repay the uni fees, if you move overseas you never have to repay the uni fees.
Maybe it was different in past years. But I know people who have come from poor families (poor as in they would get an orange for their christmas present and they would think it was the best thing eva) and have gone on to a tertiary education, and this is going years back.

Also their is nothing wrong with being rich, I mean anyone given the opportunity except perhaps Mother Teresa would accept a $100 000 a year salary. Some people have got money some people dont, personally I dont think its that big of a deal as long as you've got enough food on your table, you have somewhere to live that is hygenic and aslong as you have enough to stay healthy, then who cares. Of course I realise that not everyone is lucky enough to have all this, but I reakon it would be a pretty fair bet to say everyone who posts on bigfooty is lucky enough to have all those things. If you dont, then I suggest that you take your computer to Cashies and go buy yourself some pukka tucker.

I probably got off the subject there. Just sometimes people bag rich people. If you had the opportunity to be rich you would take it. Many rich people have worked very hard to earn their money. Many people work very hard just to earn enough to feed their kids. Nothing is going to be able to change that. I mean money isnt everything, although i know some people here think it is.

But I do think that its pretty stupid to be complaining that you arent getting any benefits when you are on $70 000 a year, I mean comme on...you dont need benefits! You r already benefited! Just give the money to the people who arent coping financially, is it that hard to understand?

I would just like to ask you guys, when you vote....do you vote for the party who is going to be the best for you or do you vote for the party who is going to be the best overall.

BJ

Some of these independent schools are crying the poor tale but building new sports halls etc all the time. One near where I live has bought a aged care facility as an annex. Do they really need the help ?