Is Buckley A Good Coach?

[jathanas]

The senior coach is an important club figure and a legitimate topic of discussion. It's fair to do so and everyone has a right to express their view.

The mod team observed that the thread was dominated by a few protagonists and their points were repeated i.e. 8 years of regression vs marked improvement in 17,18 etc Pretty much everyone with a strong opinion has already expressed it here.

What further degraded discussion was the simplistic "sack FIGJAM" or "he's a legend" type posts.

This thread will remain open. If your view has slightly shifted or you have new thoughts please share. In an effort to encourage quality discussion repetitive statements and circular arguments will from now on be deleted as will silly posts suggesting that we sack a coach on match-day.

FYI Gone Critical Anzacday Maggie5

 

[Roverjg]

So using that theory the 2010 GF and dominant 2011, heralded Collingwoods famous forward press. Bucks was the forward coach.

Bucks was forward coach... so?. Scott Watters was outed as being the architect of the Pies famous forward press

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[Carringbush2010]

You’re splitting hairs - evidenced by the vitriol and abuse in the posts of so many.

Probably coz they're pissed off, so ask yourself why are they pissed off? Do I need to give clues? I would hope not.

 

[jmac70]

Bucks was forward coach... so?. Scott Watters was outed as being the architect of the Pies famous forward press

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Should we get Watters to coach us next year?

 

[Matrix10]

2011 Mick left Reid who couldnt run on Hawkins. Podsially was off ground inj. Why didnt Mick put Tarrant onto him after Pod was done. Hawkins was a spud at that stage. The fact he could burn Reid, with Stevie J on field coaching at top of his voice, and Hawkins kicked 4.

Why didnt Mick make the changes?

Ed thought he was doing the right thing with succession plan. Get Mick to mentor Bucks much like Sydney had done with Roos to bring Longmire up to speed.
Mick rightly felt jipped, wanted to keep coaching, and Ed Bucks should of given Mick 2012.

So yes was a tragedy. The boys played for Mick and they could do as they pleased as long as they played.
Bucks was different, more on the prep, set good standards etc improve the culture.
Biggest mistake was not offering Leon Davis the $450k contract he wanted after first AA and instead were like $250 to $300k on veterans list.
We struggled all year to kick out.
The media the siupporters, the internal dynamics, the team harmony out of whack.
Attitude creeping in. Moved on the ratpack except Swanny. Jolly was difficult to work with.
Rebuild time.

5yrs later GF.

Yeah was hard but thats footy. Some things you try and they dont work.
The clubs been bitching about it since.

So you not happy that Bucks nearly (did win/robbed) GF?
So not happy we added Beams (upto Rnd 11) and Stevo gambling (Rnd 12) meant the 9 wins outta 12 at start of 2019 momentum was lost.


But Mick leaving Reid on field inj and Cats belted us in half of footy in 2011 is Buckleys fault?

Micks fault?

If was 2019 vs GWS we laid down under shitty Bucks apparently? 4pts margin.

What was 2011 margin? (they beat us 3 times that year) 38pts or so in GF. They laid down too?

Bucks has always suffered from following in great mans shoes. A much loved figure in the club in Mick.

But Bucks cant coach? He got robbed first frrkn GF.
Compare that to Mick 2011 - nah peeps dont.

We were not robbed in GF against West Coke, had they kicked straight , would have put us away by 5 to 6 goals

 

[Doc1763]

Should we get Watters to coach us next year?

St Kilda will give him a glowing reference!!!

 

[No SPIN]

Probably coz they're pissed off, so ask yourself why are they pissed off? Do I need to give clues? I would hope not.

are you retracting your assertion that no one HATES Bucks?

 

[OniAu]

2011 Mick left Reid who couldnt run on Hawkins. Podsially was off ground inj. Why didnt Mick put Tarrant onto him after Pod was done. Hawkins was a spud at that stage. The fact he could burn Reid, with Stevie J on field coaching at top of his voice, and Hawkins kicked 4.

Why didnt Mick make the changes?

Ed thought he was doing the right thing with succession plan. Get Mick to mentor Bucks much like Sydney had done with Roos to bring Longmire up to speed.
Mick rightly felt jipped, wanted to keep coaching, and Ed Bucks should of given Mick 2012.

So yes was a tragedy. The boys played for Mick and they could do as they pleased as long as they played.
Bucks was different, more on the prep, set good standards etc improve the culture.
Biggest mistake was not offering Leon Davis the $450k contract he wanted after first AA and instead were like $250 to $300k on veterans list.
We struggled all year to kick out.
The media the siupporters, the internal dynamics, the team harmony out of whack.
Attitude creeping in. Moved on the ratpack except Swanny. Jolly was difficult to work with.
Rebuild time.

5yrs later GF.

Yeah was hard but thats footy. Some things you try and they dont work.
The clubs been bitching about it since.

So you not happy that Bucks nearly (did win/robbed) GF?
So not happy we added Beams (upto Rnd 11) and Stevo gambling (Rnd 12) meant the 9 wins outta 12 at start of 2019 momentum was lost.


But Mick leaving Reid on field inj and Cats belted us in half of footy in 2011 is Buckleys fault?

Micks fault?

If was 2019 vs GWS we laid down under shitty Bucks apparently? 4pts margin.

What was 2011 margin? (they beat us 3 times that year) 38pts or so in GF. They laid down too?

Bucks has always suffered from following in great mans shoes. A much loved figure in the club in Mick.

But Bucks cant coach? He got robbed first frrkn GF.
Compare that to Mick 2011 - nah peeps dont.

Dude you are so off tangent it isnt funny. Plus you dont bother to answer any questions after i answered yours.

 

[HFF]

There's nothing logical that says he can stay here a further 2-3 years....
He has had 10 years already.....i can't believe the noise coming out of the media to double down on him and back him etc.
How is this even justified to the members and fans? If we are going to rebuild, it cant be him again....he has already had 2. cracks it.
It's time for change.

 

[jmac70]

There's nothing logical that says he can stay here a further 2-3 years....
He has had 10 years already.....i can't believe the noise coming out of the media to double down on him and back him etc.
How is this even justified to the members and fans? If we are going to rebuild, it cant be him again....he has already had 2. cracks it.
It's time for change.

That’s your opinion. Mine is different. I’d give him another year to continue the rebuild. Then assess.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Bux says he wants to coach on.
Well a million a year, I’d want to coach on as well. Who wouldn’t?
But that just shows it’s all about the Buckley train, and not CFC.
He is hurting his legacy as a player every year he refuses to accept that he is damaging us, and our reputation.

No coach in history has ever said they don’t want to coach. Unless they actually don’t want to. He’s being completely pragmatic and is open and honest about his future. It’s not him making the choice.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

There's nothing logical that says he can stay here a further 2-3 years....
He has had 10 years already.....i can't believe the noise coming out of the media to double down on him and back him etc.
How is this even justified to the members and fans? If we are going to rebuild, it cant be him again....he has already had 2. cracks it.
It's time for change.

Malthouse got a flag in his eleventh year so long tenures are not unheard of.

 

[Doc1763]

Just saw on the news that not only does Bucks want to coach next season, he wants to coach Collingwood next season.

This is the best news we could possibly have hoped for.

With the rebuild that we're not calling a rebuild (yet) now in full swing, I don't think there is any point waiting until the second half of the season. Bucks should be extended by 3 years NOW. He should have the opportunity to see the rebuild that we're not calling a rebuild (yet) through to its fruition.

This would take pressure off everyone at the Club. At the moment, the players are under pressure thinking they are playing for Bucks' future - its stifling them.

After Bucks was re-signed at the end of 2017, look what happened!!!

Korda should stamp the beginning of his tenure as President by making the courageous call and extend Bucks now.

#letsbackbucks

 

[HFF]

That’s your opinion. Mine is different. I’d give him another year to continue the rebuild. Then assess.

Another year?
That's treading water yet again.
It serves no purpose for him personally or the club. That's not a plan.
That's amateur hour which is a theme at this club.
If you're giving him one you may as well give him two or three.

However, there's no case IMO that can be made to justify him staying here on another contract.

 

[OniAu]

Malthouse got a flag in his eleventh year so long tenures are not unheard of.

Malthouse years are far ahead of what Buckley has produced

 

[HFF]

Malthouse got a flag in his eleventh year so long tenures are not unheard of.

We had a super team though compared to this one and landed Ball and Jolly in the same off season.
This isnt the same---this is a full blown rebuild-- not a have a crack and go for it one last time for 2years as was the case for Mick.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Malthouse years are far ahead of what Buckley has produced

That’s true and I agree maybe his time is up.....but many here measure on flags alone and the difference in results between the two boils down to two single incidents.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

We had a super team though compared to this one and landed Ball and Jolly in the same off season.
This isnt the same---this is a full blown rebuild-- not a have a crack and go for it one last time for 2years as was the case for Mick.

Whether the decision to enter this immediate and severe rebuild is a Buckley directive or due to a salary cap debacle that is entirely the responsibility of people other than the senior coach ...... is highly debatable.

 

[Roverjg]

Should we get Watters to coach us next year?

No thankyou.

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[No SPIN]

Well I am glad you are concerned. Dejavu. I have been concerned since the start of 2012 when he was given the below team (numbers in brackets are my rating out of 10 for the player at the time) and we know what he did with this team...

B: C.Tarrant (9) N.Brown (8) N.Maxwell (8)
HB: H.Shaw(9) B.Reid (9) H.O'Brien (8)
C: S.Sidebottom (8) S.Pendlebury (10) D.Beams (8)
HF: A.Didak (9) T.Cloke (8) D.Thomas (8)
F: L.Davis (8) C.Dawes (8) A.Krakouer (8)
R: D.Jolly (8) D.Swan (9) L.Ball (8)
INT: S.Wellingham (7) B.Johnson (7) T.Goldsack (7) L.Brown (7)
Emerg: J.Blair (7) A.Toovey (7) B.Macaffer (7)

how many were cooked and retired imminently?
How many failed at a new club?
Cull your list accordingly and then let’s see the true picture.

 

[HeathySure]

14th to GF is a regress? 17wins?
16wins? In 2019 won 9 out of first 12.

Nothing to so with Beams last game and Stevo missing 10 games?

yes regressed 9 of the 10 years. look at the facts not your propaganda

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

how many were cooked and retired imminently?
How many failed at a new club?
Cull your list accordingly and then let’s see the true picture.

Only Shaw went on to success at other clubs. And we got Adams for him.

 

[Cata_Pendles]

Does anyone value Matt Rendell’s opinion or simply view him as a disgruntled former employee? Initially valued his opinion but can’t help but think he is a disgruntled former employee who hasn’t been able to grasp that his role wasn’t deemed necessary.


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[No SPIN]

I thought someone here mentioned that Whately had said Buckley should be sacked mid season.
If any one heard what was said could they please summarize with some context - because that type of directness is not Whateleys style

 

[HFF]

Whether the decision to enter this immediate and severe rebuild is a Buckley directive or due to a salary cap debacle that is entirely the responsibility of people other than the senior coach ...... is highly debatable.

Why are we blaming the salary cap debacle in regards to assessing Nathan?
He wanted Treloar back in 2015
He wanted Daniel Wells
He wanted Lynden Dunn
He wanted Chris Mayne
He wanted James Aish
He wanted Dayne Beams

He was given everything to challenge.
We made it to the GF and came up short and have been in decline since.

He has had this chance--twice.

Salary cap has happened at the end of this tenure---not during.

 

[jmac70]

Another year?
That's treading water yet again.
It serves no purpose for him personally or the club. That's not a plan.
That's amateur hour which is a theme at this club.
If you're giving him one you may as well give him two or three.

However, there's no case IMO that can be made to justify him staying here on another contract.

It’s not treading water at all. We are currently blooding youngsters and developing the list for a future challenge. The plan is to contend for a flag. Another year under Bucks will help us achieve that because he is currently the best option as a coach.
Going for a completely untried coach is a greater risk.