USA Is the USA the worst nation to exist since classical times?

[ferball]

Seriously? Have you ever heard of the british empire?

The same British empire that didn't dominate Russia, central Europe or central Asia the way the US has?

The British and others dominated sections of the world but not all of it.

 

[ferball]

Going by that logic, no other nation will oppose us on our journey to just waltz in and declare ourselves as the dominant global policeman.

I'd stop digging now if I were you.

If you can't tell the difference between the flippant comments and the serious ones maybe go to bed and reread this in the morning.

 

[Carringbush2010]

The same British empire that didn't dominate Russia, central Europe or central Asia the way the US has?

The British and others dominated sections of the world but not all of it.

That's because globalization (read all corners of the globe are much easier to reach now then they ever have been) has enabled the states to be the dominant power since the end of wwII.

Previous to that the british empire was the dominant power, for like over a century, probably more. Had major influence all over europe.

So tell us all again, how do you propose that we become that dominant policeman, even given we're just a middle power.

Or, even more mind boggling in your utopian thinking

Tell us all how you propose that we don't have a global policeman at all, a free for all if you will. There'll be no conflict there.

This should be good.

 

[Carringbush2010]

If you can't tell the difference between the flippant comments and the serious ones maybe go to bed and reread this in the morning.

Going by your posts on this topic, I'd say stop being flippant and maybe contribute to the discussion.

 

[Blue1980]

Imagine if this guy was a Russian or Chinese criticizing communism, he'd be dead.

Criticisng doesn't make one a fan of Russia or China by default.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Criticisng doesn't make one a fan of Russia or China by default.

Never suggested or alluded as much.

 

[Blue1980]

Never suggested or alluded as much.

You were aluding that US at least a lesser evil than Russia and China.

My view? They all act in their own self interest in terms of foreign policy. Better to live in America than the other 2 overall I would think, though that has been on a downward trend.

 

[ferball]

That's because globalization (read all corners of the globe are much easier to reach now then they ever have been) has enabled the states to be the dominant power since the end of wwII.

Previous to that the british empire was the dominant power, for like over a century, probably more. Had major influence all over europe.

So tell us all again, how do you propose that we become that dominant policeman, even given we're just a middle power.

Or, even more mind boggling in your utopian thinking

Tell us all how you propose that we don't have a global policeman at all, a free for all if you will. There'll be no conflict there.

This should be good.

Moving goalposts.gif

The British were a dominant power, one of several and were not the world's policeman.

You said this:

Seeing how there'll always be a dominant global policeman, what would be your preferred alternative?

I don't think there will always be a dominant world policeman now the New World Order is over.

And in case you missed it, history is made out of violence* (that's why a bunch of idiots in the US were claiming the fall of the USSR was the end of history.) So yes, there will be conflict as history keeps being made.


*not my line btw.

 

[ferball]

You were aluding that US at least a lesser evil than Russia and China.

My view? They all act in their own self interest in terms of foreign policy. Better to live in America than the other 2 overall I would think, though that has been on a downward trend.

In America maybe, not somewhere they're interested in tho.

 

[Carringbush2010]

You were aluding that US at least a lesser evil than Russia and China.

My view? They all act in their own self interest in terms of foreign policy. Better to live in America than the other 2 overall I would think, though that has been on a downward trend.

So you admit that it'd be better to live in the US than China or Russia, that would be an allusion that the US is a lesser evil than China or Russia, would it not?

And yes I was also alluding that the US is a lesser evil. Would be confident in that.

Guilty as charged, send me to the gulags, or better still, have me strung and quartered.

 

[Carringbush2010]

I don't think there will always be a dominant world policeman now the New World Order is over.

Are you being flippant or are you being serious? This is utopian thinking at minimal, at worst invites anarchy because there is no global order.

Let's say the US has an internal collapse and is no longer the world policeman, you think Xi or Vlad won't be keen to take the mantle?

Again, you can save face by deleting this, up to you.

 

[ferball]

Are you being flippant or are you being serious? This is utopian thinking at minimal, at worst invites anarchy because there is no global order.

There's never been a global order. Countries build empires then do what they want. The US tried to impose one over the last 35 years cos it was a dominant power for about 15 or 20 of them. But it was basically them doing what they wanted. If the US was the global policeman it was more Roger Rogerson than .... I dunno of any legit cops.

Let's say the US has an internal collapse and is no longer the world policeman, you think Xi or Vlad won't be keen to take the mantle?

Again, you can save face by deleting this, up to you.

So which one attacks the other first?

 

[Carringbush2010]

There's never been a global order.

Oh dear, we've got a live one here.

 

[barreness]

So you admit that it'd be better to live in the US than China or Russia, that would be an allusion that the US is a lesser evil than China or Russia, would it not?

In the imperial core perhaps, for the upper classes yes. Better for the rest of the world is a different discussion

And yes I was also alluding that the US is a lesser evil. Would be confident in that.

A multipolar world allows smaller nations somewhat of a choice. Unipolar has meant it's do the US's neoliberal capitalism or get wrecked

Guilty as charged, send me to the gulags, or better still, have me strung and quartered.

Irony being US holds a quarter of the worlds prisoners and is less than 5% of the population.

Gulags pops also dropped radically under the USSR

 

[Carringbush2010]

In the imperial core perhaps, for the upper classes yes. Better for the rest of the world is a different discussion

Upper class? How do you think our middle class is doing under the big bad evil should be banished US?

A multipolar world allows smaller nations somewhat of a choice. Unipolar has meant it's do the US's neoliberal capitalism or get wrecked

So smaller nations, like ourselves are slaves to the US and have no freedom of choice, the US makes all our decisions for us, no ifs buts or maybes. Ok, got it.

Irony being US holds a quarter of the worlds prisoners and is less than 5% of the population.

Gulags pops also dropped radically under the USSR

And what is the point of this?

 

[owen87]

Yet another example of the shitshow that the US is these days

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/02/20/us/alabama-embryo-law-ruling-supreme-court/index.html

 

[barreness]

Upper class? How do you think our middle class is doing under the big bad evil should be banished US?

Declining? Has received progressively less of the wealth of the land since neoliberal policies were introduced, while becoming progressively more productive

So smaller nations, like ourselves are slaves to the US and have no freedom of choice, the US makes all our decisions for us, no ifs buts or maybes. Ok, got it.

Pretty much, got a counter example? when have we gone against the US

And what is the point of this?

US proclaims it's all about freedom whilst running an internal police state and bombing any external state they please

 

[Carringbush2010]

Pretty much, got a counter example? when have we gone against the US

If you seriously believe that all of our national / state / local decisions are decided by the US and we have no say in it then you can't be taken seriously.

Have a nice day, you're going on ignore.

 

[barreness]

If you seriously believe that all of our national / state / local decisions are decided by the US and we have no say in it then you can't be taken seriously.

Have a nice day, you're going on ignore.

Cool, good example of defying the US. Run away peasant

I mean US policy for geopolitical and national decisions is clearly dictated or at least "the implication". They got pretty antsy when Gough was in charge

Local/state is a bit harder to pinpoint. We obviously follow a similar political economic model so most of it is unquestioned

Deputy sheriff indeed

 

[Blue1980]

So you admit that it'd be better to live in the US than China or Russia, that would be an allusion that the US is a lesser evil than China or Russia, would it not?

And yes I was also alluding that the US is a lesser evil. Would be confident in that.

Guilty as charged, send me to the gulags, or better still, have me strung and quartered.

Not lesser evil in terms of foreign policy no.

To live in yes, I agree.

Though if trump/maga gets in again, that could begin to change.

 

[Blue1980]

Are you being flippant or are you being serious? This is utopian thinking at minimal, at worst invites anarchy because there is no global order.

Let's say the US has an internal collapse and is no longer the world policeman, you think Xi or Vlad won't be keen to take the mantle?

Again, you can save face by deleting this, up to you.

Well I don’t think there has to be one world power above all else.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Not lesser evil in terms of foreign policy no.

To live in yes, I agree.

Though if trump/maga gets in again, that could begin to change.

If Trump gets, he'll likely attempt the isolationist path, 'maga and phuq everyone else'

Alienatethe US from everyone else

That'll likely weaken the US position as the global policeman. And likely strengthen liberal democracy alliances. Regardless of the US poor foreign policy at least this policeman is a liberal democracy (may change) and not a dictatorship (yet)

 

[Carringbush2010]

Well I don’t think there has to be one world power above all else.

Never alluded as such, but there'll always be a one nation or group of. Otherwise no world order

 

[Blue1980]

Never alluded as such, but there'll always be a one nation or group of. Otherwise no world order

It’s not some official ranking system.

Ideally you don’t have one who can run over the top of everyone else.

The US do to a fair extent and then try to paint all their actions as part of some moral crusade.

 

[Blue1980]

If Trump gets, he'll likely attempt the isolationist path, 'maga and phuq everyone else'

Alienatethe US from everyone else

That'll likely weaken the US position as the global policeman. And likely strengthen liberal democracy alliances. Regardless of the US poor foreign policy at least this policeman is a liberal democracy (may change) and not a dictatorship (yet)

I was thinking more internally in the US, may not be such a free place to live if Trump/MAGA have their way.

They’d still do s**t internationally to help their position but also become more isolationist, but not necessarily in a good way, considering Trump being in Putins pocket.