MCG tenants on Grand Final day

[blue harvest]

I guess you didnt read my post properly....

Freo had ZERO games at the MCG in the regular season.

Also.... you Claimed Hawks game at Subi in 1991 or 1992 was a final. Wrong. Lets look how the hawks fared in WA vs West coast between 1987-1992.

AFL Tables - Hawthorn All Games - By Team

afltables.com

Hawks had the eagles at Subi on August 2nd 1987, Hawks Lost by a point.

Hawks had eagles at subi on May 22nd 1988, Hawks won by 53 points.

Hawks had eagles at subi on 4th of june 1989, Hawks won by 5 points

Hawks had eagles in the WACA on 15th of june 1990, Hawks lost by 23 points

Hawks had eagles in subi on 18th of August 1991, hawks lost by 24 points

Hawks had eagles in subi on september 8th of 1991, Hawks won by 23 points

Hawks had eagles in Subi on 6th of september 1992, eagles won by 13 points.

?? I think you misunderstood my post.

You said in 2010 Freo had zero games at the G during the season then had to play an away final there.

I said in 1992 the Hawks had zero games at Subi during the season and then had to play an away final there.

These things happen.

 

[Freomaniac]

?? I think you misunderstood my post.

You said in 2010 Freo had zero games at the G during the season then had to play an away final there.

I said in 1992 the Hawks had zero games at Subi during the season and then had to play an away final there.

These things happen.

But your team has won many grand finals at the MCG since 1961, with the exception of 1991.

 

[Freomaniac]

Are you saying Hawks had a "home advantage" when they had to fly, sleep in hotel beds, have normal routine disrupted and not play in front of their home fans?

Sunday at the G is blockbuster slot now, well it is when Collingwood play.

Perhaps it isnt the slot, but the club.

So if your Magpies takes on North on a 4pm sunday dead slot, 100,000 magpie fans will rock up?

 

[doppleganger]

So if your Magpies takes on North on a 4pm sunday dead slot, 100,000 magpie fans will rock up?

I am saying time slots have nothing to do with blockbusters, the teams do.

And good that you seemingly agree that you can still have a "home advantage" when travelling.

 

[blue harvest]

Freo always had the hawks in Tassie almost every year. Its like facing the cats in Geelong.

Any non victorian side that Travels to Geelong, its basically an instant defeat. Hawks in tassie under the Clarkson years of 2007-18, Hawks rarely lost.

You can Partially thank freo that All Non Victorian sides get at least one game at the MCG every season, even if its that sunday Dead slot. Gotta love the AFLs being the generous souls that they are.

If I was an interstate side I would prefer to play the Hawks in Tassie because it means the Hawks also have to stuff around flying down there and staying at hotels and there won't be tens of thousands of their fans in a cauldron like environment.

Freo got to play us at the G early in 2014 as the 'GF Rematch' in front of 40 something thousand and we won by 10 goals.

 

[kranky al]

?? I think you misunderstood my post.

You said in 2010 Freo had zero games at the G during the season then had to play an away final there.

I said in 1992 the Hawks had zero games at Subi during the season and then had to play an away final there.

These things happen.

Theres a very low chance the hawks will have to play an elimination final at subi / optus each year if they make it to a grand final.

Theres a 100% chance an interstate team will have to play a gf at the mcg if they make it to a gf.

So its a really lame point you are making - especially when you add it to the fact that if you do travel to play an interstate team its because you rank lower than them where as we can be forced to play a gf interstate having finished first… against eighth….

 

[Freomaniac]

?? I think you misunderstood my post.

You said in 2010 Freo had zero games at the G during the season then had to play an away final there.

I said in 1992 the Hawks had zero games at Subi during the season and then had to play an away final there.

These things happen.

Apple and Oranges mate.

You realise Fremantles 2010 side was not a Finals Hardened side.

Dockers from 1995-2009 only made finals in 2003 and 2006.

Hawks 1992 side Had Made finals every year since 1982. Made grand finals from 1983-1989. Made another Grand final in 1991 and won that too.

Its Like Comparing the Current Suns side that has Been in the comp since 2011 and still hasnt played finals and comparing them to the Current Cats Side from 2007-22 that has only missed out on finals once and that was in 2015.

 

[kranky al]

If I was an interstate side I would prefer to play the Hawks in Tassie because it means the Hawks also have to stuff around flying down there and staying at hotels and there won't be tens of thousands of their fans in a cauldron like environment.

Freo got to play us at the G early in 2014 as the 'GF Rematch' in front of 40 something thousand and we won by 10 goals.

Tassie doesnt agree with us warm blooded types

 

[Freomaniac]

If I was an interstate side I would prefer to play the Hawks in Tassie because it means the Hawks also have to stuff around flying down there and staying at hotels and there won't be tens of thousands of their fans in a cauldron like environment.

Freo got to play us at the G early in 2014 as the 'GF Rematch' in front of 40 something thousand and we won by 10 goals.

outside of 2021, Freo never beat the hawks in tassie. To most non vic sides, its an instant defeat there.

Its like me telling you its better for freo to take on the tigers in docklands because tigers hate playing there.

 

[blue harvest]

outside of 2021, Freo never beat the hawks in tassie. To most non vic sides, its an instant defeat there.

Its like me telling you its better for freo to take on the tigers in docklands because tigers hate playing there.

And you've never beaten us at the G.

We had a good record down there because we were a good team and tended to play the crap sides there.

 

[kranky al]

And you've never beaten us at the G.

We had a good record down there because we were a good team and tended to play the crap sides there.

Norf has a good record there too

 

[Freomaniac]

And you've never beaten us at the G.

We had a good record down there because we were a good team and tended to play the crap sides there.

And I dont think I ever will see the dockers beat the hawks in the MCG in my life time.

Had the chance to win in 2011 when freo were up by 24 points at 3 quarter time.

Of course you have a good record at Tassie. Freo are an easy target.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

this thread is dumb

over the last 10 years (20 & 21 not counting) an MCG tenanted club has only won 6 times. 5 of these wins coming from 2 x teams who have gone back to back IE dynasty periods showing they weren't one off wins on GF day. (they're just ******* good consistent football clubs)

2010 - COLLINGWOOD vs ST KILDA x 2 (C'WOOD finished minor premiers)
2011 - GEELONG vs COLLINGWOOD (GLONG finished 2nd on ladder)
2012 - HAWTHORN vs SYDNEY (SYD finished 3rd on ladder)
2013 - HAWTHORN vs FREMANTLE (Hawks finished minor premiers)
2014 - SYDNEY VS HAWTHORN (Hawks finished 2nd on ladder)
2015 - HAWTHORN vs WEST COAST (Hawks finished 3rd on ladder)
2016 - BULLDOGS vs SYDNEY (dogs finished 7th on ladder)
2017 - RICHMOND vs ADELAIDE (tigers finished 3rd on ladder)
2018 - WEST COAST vs COLLINGWOOD (W'cost finished 2nd on ladder)
2019 - RICHMOND vs GWS (tigers finished minor premiers)
2020 - DOESNT COUNT
2021 - DOESNT COUNT
2022 - GEELONG vs SYDNEY (geelong finished minor premiers)

There is far more of a link to where a club finishes on the ladder to wining a GF than who plays at the MCG as a tenant.

Literally apart from 1 year (2016) every premier has finished no later than 3rd after the H&A season ladder.

recent stats show doesn't matter if you are a tenanted club or not. if you are not finishing 3rd or higher, you aint winning the GF.

 

[kranky al]

this thread is dumb

over the last 10 years (20 & 21 not counting) an MCG tenanted club has only won 6 times. 5 of these wins coming from 2 x teams who have gone back to back IE dynasty periods showing they weren't one off wins on GF day. (they're just ******* good consistent football clubs)

2010 - COLLINGWOOD vs ST KILDA x 2 (C'WOOD finished minor premiers)
2011 - GEELONG vs COLLINGWOOD (GLONG finished 2nd on ladder)
2012 - HAWTHORN vs SYDNEY (SYD finished 3rd on ladder)
2013 - HAWTHORN vs FREMANTLE (Hawks finished minor premiers)
2014 - SYDNEY VS HAWTHORN (Hawks finished 2nd on ladder)
2015 - HAWTHORN vs WEST COAST (Hawks finished 3rd on ladder)
2016 - BULLDOGS vs SYDNEY (dogs finished 7th on ladder)
2017 - RICHMOND vs ADELAIDE (tigers finished 3rd on ladder)
2018 - WEST COAST vs COLLINGWOOD (W'cost finished 2nd on ladder)
2019 - RICHMOND vs GWS (tigers finished minor premiers)
2020 - DOESNT COUNT
2021 - DOESNT COUNT
2022 - GEELONG vs SYDNEY (geelong finished minor premiers)

There is far more of a link to where a club finishes on the ladder to wining a GF than who plays at the MCG as a tenant.

Literally apart from 1 year (2016) every premier has finished no later than 3rd after the H&A season ladder.

recent stats show doesn't matter if you are a tenanted club or not. if you are not finishing 3rd or higher, you aint winning the GF.

Every gf since 1990 with games played at the gf venue excluding 2020/2021.



winner listed first - i count 14-7 in favour of teams whove played 3 or more games more than the opposition at the gf venue



1990 - coll 3 Ess 4

1991 - haw 10 Wc 3

1992 - wc 3 Gee 5

1993 - ess 13 Car 7

1994 - wc 5 Gee 4

1995 - car 8 Gee 5

1996 - nm 14 Syd 2

1997 - ad 2 St k 3

1998 - ad 3 Nm 12

1999 - nm 13 Car 9

2000 - ess 9 mel 10

2001 - bri 2 Ess 9

2002 - bri 1 Coll 12

2003 - bri 2 Coll 11

2004 - pa 3 bri 2

2005 - syd 2 Wc 4

2006 - wc 2 Syd 2

2007 - gee 2 port 3

2008 - haw 10 gee 4

2009 - gee 5 st k 1

2010 - coll 14 St k 2

2011 - gee 6 Coll 14

2012 - syd 1 Haw 13

2013 - haw 9 fre 2

2014 - haw 11 Syd 3

2015 - haw 9 Syd 1

2016 - wb 2 Syd 2

2017 - rich 11 Ade 3

2018 - wc 2 Coll 15

2019 - rich 13 Gia 3

2022 - gee 5 Syd 2

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Every gf since 1990 with games played at the gf venue excluding 2020/2021.



winner listed first - i count 14-7 in favour of teams whove played 3 or more games more than the opposition at the gf venue



1990 - coll 3 Ess 4

1991 - haw 10 Wc 3

1992 - wc 3 Gee 5

1993 - ess 13 Car 7

1994 - wc 5 Gee 4

1995 - car 8 Gee 5

1996 - nm 14 Syd 2

1997 - ad 2 St k 3

1998 - ad 3 Nm 12

1999 - nm 13 Car 9

2000 - ess 9 mel 10

2001 - bri 2 Ess 9

2002 - bri 1 Coll 12

2003 - bri 2 Coll 11

2004 - pa 3 bri 2

2005 - syd 2 Wc 4

2006 - wc 2 Syd 2

2007 - gee 2 port 3

2008 - haw 10 gee 4

2009 - gee 5 st k 1

2010 - coll 14 St k 2

2011 - gee 6 Coll 14

2012 - syd 1 Haw 13

2013 - haw 9 fre 2

2014 - haw 11 Syd 3

2015 - haw 9 Syd 1

2016 - wb 2 Syd 2

2017 - rich 11 Ade 3

2018 - wc 2 Coll 15

2019 - rich 13 Gia 3

2022 - gee 5 Syd 2

you need to consider recent means of equalisation that has been brought into the game.

i would match rather review data from the last 10 years, than the last 20.

I think you will find the further you go back in time, the more the ratio of MCG tenants winning is greater. This just proves the point its becoming more and more redundant in the current game.

 

[kranky al]

you need to consider recent means of equalisation that has been brought into the game.

i would match rather review data from the last 10 years, than the last 20.

I think you will find the further you go back in time, the more the ratio of MCG tenants winning is greater. This just proves the point its becoming more and more redundant in the current game.

If you use the last ten years its 6-3 so again 2:1 on teams that have played on the mcg 3 or more games more than their opposition with 1 gf a neutral venue.

(Excluding the two covid years 2020/21)

 

[HirdsTheWord]

If you use the last ten years its 6-3 so again 2:1 on teams that have played on the mcg 3 or more games more than their opposition with 1 gf a neutral venue.

(Excluding the two covid years 2020/21)

5 of those 6 wins are from 2 teams…going back to back…

I’m not sure you can say teams with dynasty type years count toward MCG a fairness or not..

They were just bloody good teams that finished within the top 3 each season.

 

[kranky al]

5 of those 6 wins are from 2 teams…going back to back…

I’m not sure you can say teams with dynasty type years count toward MCG a fairness or not..

They were just bloody good teams that finished within the top 3 each season.

I guess if you keep enacting enough exclusions you will get the results you want….

 

[HirdsTheWord]

I guess if you keep enacting enough exclusions you will get the results you want….

Yeah if you just keep looking at 20 year old stats you’ll get yours.

 

[kranky al]

Yeah if you just keep looking at 20 year old stats you’ll get yours.

I looked at 30 year old stats and got two to one

At your suggestion i looked at ten year old stats and i still got two to one


Then your next move of the goalposts was to eliminate dynasty teams because???

What???

A team that wins three in a row on its home ground would definately win all three away ?

Is that your logic?


Cool story bro

 

[HirdsTheWord]

I looked at 30 year old stats and got two to one

At your suggestion i looked at ten year old stats and i still got two to one


Then your next move of the goalposts was to eliminate dynasty teams because???

What???

A team that wins three in a row on its home ground would definately win all three away ?

Is that your logic?


Cool story broView attachment 1520860

no, i'm saying a team that's winning back to back shows they are just a bloody good teams. its not a black and white numbers game as your trying to make it out to be.

You'd probably have a more solid argument about interstate teams having to travel to Melbourne, as opposed to the MCG itself being an advantage for a tenanted team. I would agree it certainly is a disadvantage to have to travel before the GF, but it is what it is. Its not going to change.

Out of the last 11 years GF's (excluding 20 & 21) 9 of them have had an interstate team in it. If an interstate team makes the GF they have have won a Prelim at their home ground, then have to pack up and get on the road disrupting their travel. if they win the first round final it means they may not have traveled for a month before the GF.

If the MCG was this big bad ugly advantage for tenanted clubs your making it why are Richmond, Collingwood, Melbourne, Essendon etc not winning every single time they play there? Most of these teams outside the last 4-5 years have had terrible seasons, playing alot of games at the MCG.

 

[bh90210fan]

If you’re a Non Victorian team if you want to take home the cup the cold hard facts are you need to finish top 2 and hope you don’t run into a MCG tenant in the big dance.

 

[kranky al]

no, i'm saying a team that's winning back to back shows they are just a bloody good teams. its not a black and white numbers game as your trying to make it out to be.

You'd probably have a more solid argument about interstate teams having to travel to Melbourne, as opposed to the MCG itself being an advantage for a tenanted team. I would agree it certainly is a disadvantage to have to travel before the GF, but it is what it is. Its not going to change.

Out of the last 11 years GF's (excluding 20 & 21) 9 of them have had an interstate team in it. If an interstate team makes the GF they have have won a Prelim at their home ground, then have to pack up and get on the road disrupting their travel. if they win the first round final it means they may not have traveled for a month before the GF.

If the MCG was this big bad ugly advantage for tenanted clubs your making it why are Richmond, Collingwood, Melbourne, Essendon etc not winning every single time they play there? Most of these teams outside the last 4-5 years have had terrible seasons, playing alot of games at the MCG.

Prior to 2018 west coasts win ratio at the g was in the high 30’s despite a decade of playing lots of average teams there.

You can say what ever you like but, at the end of the day, 30 years of stats show a team that’s played more on the g meets s team that plays a lot less there is twice as likely to win a gf.

In sport we try to make things as fair as possible and if one team gets an advantage over the other - its an earned advantage rather than one just handed to them.

Theres a reason why every major sport in the world has a method for accounting for hga….

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Prior to 2018 west coasts win ratio at the g was in the high 30’s despite a decade of playing lots of average teams there.

You can say what ever you like but, at the end of the day, 30 years of stats show a team that’s played more on the g meets s team that plays a lot less there is twice as likely to win a gf.

In sport we try to make things as fair as possible and if one team gets an advantage over the other - its an earned advantage rather than one just handed to them.

Theres a reason why every major sport in the world has a method for accounting for hga….

Most other major sports have equal sized stadiums in different parts of the country to cater for it.

No other ground in Australia comes anywhere near the MCG. Until they do, the game will remain at the MCG.

 

[kranky al]

Most other major sports have equal sized stadiums in different parts of the country to cater for it.

No other ground in Australia comes anywhere near the MCG. Until they do, the game will remain at the MCG.

So now its retreat to authority?

What a pile of poop.

The us has nfl stadiums bigger than the mcg and still holds the superbowl in stadiums far far smaller than their biggest.

That’s how a national sport is run, not just for the benefits of the fans in a single state.